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Is it ever OK to lie?

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#1
Ervin

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What if for instance you are an innocent person but telling the truth would get you killed? What if you are hiding inocent people from criminals and you are doing so by lying? What if you are in a war, isn't all war deception in it self(I read this somwhete), hoe can you not lie(maybe if you refuse to fight).

So my question is: When is it ok to lie?

Thanks

#2
nebula

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The Bible has three accounts of people lying in order to save the lives of other people.

Something to consider the 9th commandment is: "Thou shalt not bear false witness against your neighbor."

That isn't saying, "Don't lie," as a blanket statement. It is specific to that which causes harm.

#3
bobby0

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I think nebula is right.

And what about surprise birthdays? Sometimes lying can be good.

And if you think you did it and it was wrong, just pray and you will be forgiven.

#4
OldShep

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What if for instance you are an innocent person but telling the truth would get you killed? What if you are hiding inocent people from criminals and you are doing so by lying? What if you are in a war, isn't all war deception in it self(I read this somwhete), hoe can you not lie(maybe if you refuse to fight).

So my question is: When is it ok to lie?

Thanks



Not ever question has to be answered. Plus some could be answered with a simple Yes or No. There by avoiding telling someone a lie or the truth that could hurt them.

Plus if you did lie to save a persons life, My Lord Jesus, who has forgiven ALL of my Sins, is big enough to see through the narrow minded thoughts of those who dare tell you that you would go to hell for doing so.

ICL~~~Dennis

#5
FresnoJoe

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What if for instance you are an innocent person but telling the truth would get you killed? What if you are hiding innocent people from criminals and you are doing so by lying? What if you are in a war, isn't all war deception in itself (I read this somewhere), how can you not lie (maybe if you refuse to fight).

So my question is: When is it OK to lie....

Not every question has to be answered. Plus some could be answered with a simple Yes or No. There by avoiding telling someone a lie or the truth that could hurt them.

Plus if you did lie to save a persons life, My Lord Jesus, who has forgiven ALL of my Sins, is big enough to see through the narrow minded thoughts of those who dare tell you that you would go to hell for doing so.

ICL~~~Dennis

:thumbsup:

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#6
Larry 2

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Psalms 116:11 ". . All men are liars."

Praise God that He sees us in Jesus.

#7
Guest_AndrewCothran_*

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What if for instance you are an innocent person but telling the truth would get you killed? What if you are hiding inocent people from criminals and you are doing so by lying? What if you are in a war, isn't all war deception in it self(I read this somwhete), hoe can you not lie(maybe if you refuse to fight).

So my question is: When is it ok to lie?

Thanks


While as a general rule lying is wrong we do find ourselves in situations where it must be done ..

#8
Guest_AndrewCothran_*

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What if for instance you are an innocent person but telling the truth would get you killed? What if you are hiding inocent people from criminals and you are doing so by lying? What if you are in a war, isn't all war deception in it self(I read this somwhete), hoe can you not lie(maybe if you refuse to fight).

So my question is: When is it ok to lie?

Thanks


I believe all lies are straight from the pit of hell Ervin and NO liars will enter the kingdom of GOD; " But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and fornicators, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burns with fire and brimstone: which is the second death" Rev21:8
" It is NEVER OK to lie " Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it." John8:44

No offense intended but you are not only twisting scriptures to fit your own beliefs but you are ignoring a few important facts .. A. we live in a very imperfect world with imperfect people and far from perfect circumstances ,, B. God is not evil .. he is not one of us .. We as humans would condemn someone because they were compelled to transgress ,, but would God ? God is Just correct ? God is love correct ? Is God this tyranical monster just waiting to damn us on a technicality ? Really ? Listen i have doubts about his existence but if that is the God that exists ..then i have no hope and neither do any of us ..And how on earth could you begin to love and serve a God like that ? Now as to lying when it comes down to life and death situations you are not really left with much of a choice .. Yes you could choose to die but in most cases dying is not the best choice now is it ?

#9
FresnoJoe

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What if for instance you are an innocent person but telling the truth would get you killed? What if you are hiding inocent people from criminals and you are doing so by lying? What if you are in a war, isn't all war deception in it self(I read this somwhete), hoe can you not lie(maybe if you refuse to fight).

So my question is: When is it ok to lie?

Thanks


I believe all lies are straight from the pit of hell Ervin and NO liars will enter the kingdom of GOD; " But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and fornicators, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burns with fire and brimstone: which is the second death" Rev21:8
" It is NEVER OK to lie " Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it." John8:44

It is according to what nebula says.

All moral laws are trumped by the moral law to preserve innocent life.

That means you will be guilty of innocent blood if you do not lie when necessary to preserve their life.

And we find examples of that in Scripture, such as Rahab, the harlot, who is commended in the NT for doing so.


Is it a SIN to lie ? a simple yes or no will suffice. Is there always a penalty for sin ? Was Rahab a harlot and not one of GODs people ? and did she find favour with GOD by her sin (lie) or by her faith ? Was her sin one of hiding the spys ? or was it by protecting GODs people ?

I believe that Christ JESUS would NEVER have us to lie or that would make Him a hypocrite and deny Himself....


Never

These six things doth the LORD hate: yea, seven are an abomination unto him:
A proud look, a lying tongue, and hands that shed innocent blood,
An heart that deviseth wicked imaginations, feet that be swift in running to mischief,
A false witness that speaketh lies, and he that soweth discord among brethren.
Proverbs 6:16-19

Always

Remembering mine affliction and my misery, the wormwood and the gall.
My soul hath them still in remembrance, and is humbled in me.
This I recall to my mind, therefore have I hope.

It is of the LORD's mercies that we are not consumed, because his compassions fail not.
They are new every morning: great is thy faithfulness.
The LORD is my portion, saith my soul; therefore will I hope in him.
Lamentations 3:19-24

#10
gdemoss

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Does it matter if you only deceive using your behavior?

1Sa 21:13 And he changed his behaviour before them, and feigned himself mad in their hands, and scrabbled on the doors of the gate, and let his spittle fall down upon his beard.

Was this sin? Not by Gods standard.

1Ki 15:5 Because David did [that which was] right in the eyes of the LORD, and turned not aside from any [thing] that he commanded him all the days of his life, save only in the matter of Uriah the Hittite

The only thing David did that God rebuked him for was Uriah.

Lying as in bearing false witness for personal gain is an abomination in the eyes of the Lord. All liars shall have their part in the lake of fire. Although pretending to be something that you are not, such as David did, is not considered under the same definition.

Blessed be the name of our Lord, may we not be found false witness of him.

Gary

#11
OneLight

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I actually says in Revelation 22:15 "...and whoever loves and practices a lie."

This is far different then saving someones life by deceiving the one who wishes to do harm to them.

#12
JohnDB

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What if for instance you are an innocent person but telling the truth would get you killed? What if you are hiding inocent people from criminals and you are doing so by lying? What if you are in a war, isn't all war deception in it self(I read this somwhete), hoe can you not lie(maybe if you refuse to fight).

So my question is: When is it ok to lie?

Thanks


Is lying ever not a sin? That's the real question isn't it?

Nope. Always a sin. But we do not live in heaven do we?

Will we at times be prompted to withhold truth? <--- Another way of saying a lie.

If you read the books of Hebrews and James and the Epistles of John you will have more questions about sin (lying is mentioned among them) than you will have answers.

"These things are written that you sin not"
"If anyone willfully sins after he has known the truth (about salvation in Christ) no sacrifice for sins is left."
"There is a sin that is unto death, I do not suggest you pray about it. There is a sin not to death."

HUH?

Read Romans 3-8 (and pay close attention to chapter 7). And remember God orchestrates all things (the good and the evil) to achieve his purposes.

Is lying the unpardonable sin? No. Remember that when you come across texts like all liars will be assigned a place in the lake of fire... (in the over all context of the entire Bible we understand that means those who are not redeemed from death and cleansed by the blood of Christ) so the unsaved liars will be assigned a place in the lake of fire...



#13
~candice~

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TheTruthLivesForever - what do you do with Jehu using deception to gather and then kill the prophets of Baal? God later rewarded him for it.

#14
~candice~

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If you want to JUSTIFY man and yourself then you go right ahead. The question was " When is it ok to lie " my answer was NEVER and i backed it up with Scripture. If it is OK for you to lie then go right ahead and JUSTIFY it all you like......


Do you realise you are talking to a seeker? Posted Image

Did you think using mockery / sarcasm was going to edify?

#15
taylor30

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What if for instance you are an innocent person but telling the truth would get you killed? What if you are hiding inocent people from criminals and you are doing so by lying? What if you are in a war, isn't all war deception in it self(I read this somwhete), hoe can you not lie(maybe if you refuse to fight).

So my question is: When is it ok to lie?

Thanks


I believe all lies are straight from the pit of hell Ervin and NO liars will enter the kingdom of GOD; " But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and fornicators, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burns with fire and brimstone: which is the second death" Rev21:8
" It is NEVER OK to lie " Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it." John8:44

I used to believe as you do, so I don't say anything bad about your comment. However I no longer believe this way, and here is why.

#1. Rahab's lie protected the lives of 2 Israelites, and God actually rewarded her for it. #2. Moses's mother technically lied by hiding him from the authorities, which saved his life.
#3. Abraham's lie protected his life. #4. Even the apostles technically lied when they went on the run instead of turning themselves in to the authorities.

There are many times in scripture where a lie is NOT actually condemned, and in fact some of the greatest miracles or stories in scripture involved lies that were almost necesarry.

#16
enoob57

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TheTruthLivesForever - what do you do with Jehu using deception to gather and then kill the prophets of Baal? God later rewarded him for it.

Worse when God Himself seeks a deceiving and blesses that spirit to prosper! 1 Kings 22:19-23

#17
~candice~

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This has nothing to do with the Old Covenant and you cannot dismiss the entire old testament as if none of it's passages accurately describe God for us in these days. The fact that Jesus permanently fulfils the sacrifice and steps in as our High Priest in no way changes the nature of God. He is one and the same... so no you cannot dismiss the entire old testament the way you are to prove your point.

#18
~candice~

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If you want to JUSTIFY man and yourself then you go right ahead. The question was " When is it ok to lie " my answer was NEVER and i backed it up with Scripture. If it is OK for you to lie then go right ahead and JUSTIFY it all you like......


Do you realise you are talking to a seeker? Posted Image

Did you think using mockery / sarcasm was going to edify?


If he is an unbeliever then why is he here ?

If he listens to the TRUTH and hears that it is NOT ok to lie then it might make him free.


Seekers come here all the time and are absolutely welcome. And no, we aren't encouraging people to lie as a habit, but there were rare occasions in the bible where a lie / deception was part of God's plan or was blessed by God.

#19
FresnoJoe

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.... If he is an unbeliever then why is he here....

:thumbsup:

Because He Is Loved

But God commendeth his love toward us, in that, while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us. Romans 5:8

And Loved

For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life. John 3:16

And Loved

Looking unto Jesus the author and finisher of our faith; who for the joy that was set before him endured the cross, despising the shame, and is set down at the right hand of the throne of God. Hebrews 12:2


#20
~candice~

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This has nothing to do with the Old Covenant and you cannot dismiss the entire old testament as if none of it's passages accurately describe God for us in these days. The fact that Jesus permanently fulfils the sacrifice and steps in as our High Priest in no way changes the nature of God. He is one and the same... so no you cannot dismiss the entire old testament the way you are to prove your point.


You did not answer my questions to you Candice as per usual........


Well I don't think you have answered mine either, in that you haven't explained why you reject the God of the Old Testament by calling it all "old covenant".

I haven't answered your question because it really misrepresents my position. I am not suggesting we lie all we like, I'm just saying there are rare cases in which it is necessary and has been blessed by the Lord.





If you want to JUSTIFY man and yourself then you go right ahead. The question was " When is it ok to lie " my answer was NEVER and i backed it up with Scripture. If it is OK for you to lie then go right ahead and JUSTIFY it all you like......


Do you realise you are talking to a seeker? Posted Image

Did you think using mockery / sarcasm was going to edify?


If he is an unbeliever then why is he here ?

If he listens to the TRUTH and hears that it is NOT ok to lie then it might make him free.


Seekers come here all the time and are absolutely welcome. And no, we aren't encouraging people to lie as a habit, but there were rare occasions in the bible where a lie / deception was part of God's plan or was blessed by God.


If he is a "seeker" are you not guilty of creating a stumblingblock to Him by saying it is ok to lie and use a couple of instances where GOD used subtilty and a lying spirit to destroy his enemies an do His Will ?


No I don't think I have put a stumbling block in front of him :). If a young child was hidden in my house, and a man knocked on my door wanting to know the whereabouts of the child to kill him, I'd lie through my teeth 6 days a week and twice on Sunday.




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