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    • I see both!  It's like a couple years ago when I was complaining to a brother about the shape of the church - so many divisions and poor things happening, a low level of Christ's life being manifested, legalism and dead letter is the order of the day, etc.  He then said to me, "The church is wonderful in God's eyes! Do you think He didn't know what He was getting into when he said, 'I will build my church'?! Yes, outwardly (by sight) it's pretty much an impossible mess!  Man's flesh has run rampant with much of it . . .  Only two of the seven ekklesias in Revelation go without a rebuke (because He loves them and wants to promote correction).  The only way to reconcile these two things is by faith - faith that He is able and He will present a glorious gathering to Himself without any of the mess we humans have created with it.
    • Thankyou @other one . I've split Debp's video to a new thread and let it stay up as it does serve a purpose other than mockery. I have heard a Christian speaker who converted from Islam tell how he gets death threats from Moslems for preaching that Islam is not a religion of peace . . . enough said.
    • Hi Ad Hoc, God`s word tells us that the church, the Body of Christ is a `spiritual body.`  `For by one Spirit we were all baptised into one body ...` (1 Cor. 12: 13) The different denominations or non-denominations are a result of man encamping around a truth that the Holy Spirit had revealed to them. God is NOT concerned about the outward scaffolding of man`s denominations but of the inward, man`s heart. And that is what is growing more like the Lord by His Holy Spirit. Not all believers will come to understand all the truths the Holy Spirit has revealed over the years. However, if they are standing for a truth of Christ, then they are part of the Body that will be caught away to glory. 
    • Obviously some in the Sanhedrin weren't happy about it.
    • The Lord would disagree with you. And it was the Pharisees who were made to look silly. Matthew 21: 23 Now when He came into the temple, the chief priests and the elders of the people confronted Him as He was teaching, and said, “By what authority are You doing these things? And who gave You this authority?” 24 But Jesus answered and said to them, “I also will ask you one thing, which if you tell Me, I likewise will tell you by what authority I do these things:  25 The baptism of John—where was it from? From heaven or from men?” And they reasoned among themselves, saying, “If we say, ‘From heaven,’ He will say to us, ‘Why then did you not believe him?’  26 But if we say, ‘From men,’ we fear the multitude, for all count John as a prophet.”  27 So they answered Jesus and said, “We do not know.” And He said to them, “Neither will I tell you by what authority I do these things. The scribes and Pharisees contradict your notion that John's baptism was cultural and common to the time, or related to the Law of Moses. In fact, their belief was that if John was baptizing, he must either be Elijah, that prophet or Christ Himself.  His baptism was ordained by the words of the prophets, not Moses. John 1: 19 Now this is the testimony of John, when the Jews sent priests and Levites from Jerusalem to ask him, “Who are you?” 20 He confessed, and did not deny, but confessed, “I am not the Christ.” 21 And they asked him, “What then? Are you Elijah?” He said, “I am not.” “Are you the Prophet?” And he answered, “No.” 22 Then they said to him, “Who are you, that we may give an answer to those who sent us? What do you say about yourself?” 23 He said: “I am ‘The voice of one crying in the wilderness: “Make straight the way of the Lord,” ’ as the prophet Isaiah said.” 24 Now those who were sent were from the Pharisees. 25 And they asked him, saying, “Why then do you baptize if you are not the Christ, nor Elijah, nor the Prophet?” 26 John answered them, saying, “I baptize with water, but there stands One among you whom you do not know.  27 It is He who, coming after me, is preferred before me, whose sandal strap I am not worthy to loose.” 28 These things were done in Bethabara beyond the Jordan, where John was baptizing.
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