Jump to content

christian forums

Worthy Christian Forums - Christian Forums

Welcome to Worthy Christian Forums
Register now to gain access to all of our features. Once registered and logged in, you will be able to create topics, post replies to existing threads, give reputation to your fellow members, get your own private messenger, post status updates, manage your profile and so much more. If you already have an account, login here - otherwise create an account for free today!
Photo

Evaluation of the Doctrine of Unconditional Eternal Security or OSAS

* * * * * 1 votes once saved always saved eternal security

This topic has been archived. This means that you cannot reply to this topic.
137 replies to this topic

#121
Sanh

Sanh

    Junior Member

  • Banned
  • PipPip
  • 125 posts

 

God has already given us this answer, so we are not "playing God" in this case, only agreeing with His words.

Revelation 21:1-8


Now I saw a new heaven and a new earth, for the first heaven and the first earth had passed away. Also there was no more sea. Then I, John, saw the holy city, New Jerusalem, coming down out of heaven from God, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband. And I heard a loud voice from heaven saying, “Behold, the tabernacle of God is with men, and He will dwell with them, and they shall be His people. God Himself will be with them and be their God. And God will wipe away every tear from their eyes; there shall be no more death, nor sorrow, nor crying. There shall be no more pain, for the former things have passed away.”

Then He who sat on the throne said, “Behold, I make all things new.” And He said to me, “Write, for these words are true and faithful.”

And He said to me, “It is done! I am the Alpha and the Omega, the Beginning and the End. I will give of the fountain of the water of life freely to him who thirsts. He who overcomes shall inherit all things, and I will be his God and he shall be My son. But the cowardly, unbelieving, abominable, murderers, sexually immoral, sorcerers, idolaters, and all liars shall have their part in the lake which burns with fire and brimstone, which is the second death.”


We cannot be afraid to stand on His words. Satan likes to cause us to refrain from standing firm on scripture by getting us to believe we are playing God when we are only agreeing with what God wrote. On the other hand, when there is nothing in scripture to compare to, then that is playing God and we should refrain from this.

 

 

By "playing to be God," to me,  simply means answering hypothetical questions which only belongs to God, no more, no less.  If I may ask you, when did God give you the answer to what you are saying, what is that "what?"


Edited by Sanh, 18 August 2013 - 08:43 PM.


#122
OneLight

OneLight

    Royal Member

  • Servant
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 26,438 posts

 

 

God has already given us this answer, so we are not "playing God" in this case, only agreeing with His words.

Revelation 21:1-8


Now I saw a new heaven and a new earth, for the first heaven and the first earth had passed away. Also there was no more sea. Then I, John, saw the holy city, New Jerusalem, coming down out of heaven from God, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband. And I heard a loud voice from heaven saying, “Behold, the tabernacle of God is with men, and He will dwell with them, and they shall be His people. God Himself will be with them and be their God. And God will wipe away every tear from their eyes; there shall be no more death, nor sorrow, nor crying. There shall be no more pain, for the former things have passed away.”

Then He who sat on the throne said, “Behold, I make all things new.” And He said to me, “Write, for these words are true and faithful.”

And He said to me, “It is done! I am the Alpha and the Omega, the Beginning and the End. I will give of the fountain of the water of life freely to him who thirsts. He who overcomes shall inherit all things, and I will be his God and he shall be My son. But the cowardly, unbelieving, abominable, murderers, sexually immoral, sorcerers, idolaters, and all liars shall have their part in the lake which burns with fire and brimstone, which is the second death.”


We cannot be afraid to stand on His words. Satan likes to cause us to refrain from standing firm on scripture by getting us to believe we are playing God when we are only agreeing with what God wrote. On the other hand, when there is nothing in scripture to compare to, then that is playing God and we should refrain from this.

 

 

By "playing to be God," to me,  simply means answering hypothetical questions which only belongs to God, no more, no less.  If I may ask you, when did God give you the answer to what you are saying, what is that "what?"

 

 

I'm sorry ... your question makes no sense to me.  Can you reword your question? I don't know what you mean when you ask "If I may ask you, when did God give you the answer to what you are saying, what is that "what?""

 

If you mean the words that are underline above, they are found in scripture, Revelation 21:6-8.  I copied and pasted the verses.



#123
Sanh

Sanh

    Junior Member

  • Banned
  • PipPip
  • 125 posts

 

 

 

I'm sorry ... your question makes no sense to me.  Can you reword your question? I don't know what you mean when you ask "If I may ask you, when did God give you the answer to what you are saying, what is that "what?""

 

If you mean the words that are underline above, they are found in scripture, Revelation 21:6-8.  I copied and pasted the verses.

 

 

So, Revelation 21:6-8 are verses found in the book of the bible and God did not give it to you/us personally as an answer, do you/we now agree? About playing to be God, I do hope it is now clear to you that it plainly refers to whatever answer that anyone will dare respond to the question previously posted.


Edited by Sanh, 18 August 2013 - 10:15 PM.


#124
MarkNigro

MarkNigro

    Veteran Member

  • Advanced Member
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 567 posts

 

 

 

 

I'm sorry ... your question makes no sense to me.  Can you reword your question? I don't know what you mean when you ask "If I may ask you, when did God give you the answer to what you are saying, what is that "what?""

 

If you mean the words that are underline above, they are found in scripture, Revelation 21:6-8.  I copied and pasted the verses.

 

 

So, Revelation 21:6-8 are verses found in the book of the bible and God did not give it to you/us personally as an answer, do you/we now agree? About playing to be God, I do hope it is now clear to you that it plainly refers to whatever answer that anyone will dare respond to the question previously posted.

 

Here is the passage you refer to:

 

Revelation 21:6-8

 

And he said unto me, It is done. I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end. I will give unto him that is athirst of the fountain of the water of life freely.

He that overcometh shall inherit all things; and I will be his God, and he shall be my son.

But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death.

 

Notice in verse 8 it mentions "unbelieving." That is because this does not refer to anyone that has believed the gospel of the Lord jesus Christ and trusted in His blood payment for their sins. 

 

The saved have their sins paid for and forgiven by the blood of Jesus Christ.

 

 

Paul, the apostle of the Gentiles, wrote the following. From verse 16, all who believe the gospel of Jesus Christ have salvation. It would not be salvation if there were any possibility of damnation after the moment of salvation.  

 

Romans 1:15-17

15 So, as much as in me is, I am ready to preach the gospel to you that are at Rome also.

16 For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek.

17 For therein is the righteousness of God revealed from faith to faith: as it is written, The just shall live by faith.

 

From verse 25 of the passage below, all those that are saved have all their sins paid for by the blood of Jesus Christ.

 

Romans 3:21-26

21 But now the righteousness of God without the law is manifested, being witnessed by the law and the prophets;

22 Even the righteousness of God which is by faith of Jesus Christ unto all and upon all them that believe: for there is no difference:

23 For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God;

24 Being justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus:

25 Whom God hath set forth to be a propitiation through faith in his blood, to declare his righteousness for the remission of sins that are past, through the forbearance of God;

26 To declare, I say, at this time his righteousness: that he might be just, and the justifier of him which believeth in Jesus.

 

They have all their sins forgiven.

 

Colossians 1:14

In whom we have redemption through his blood, even the forgiveness of sins:

 

Ephesians 1:7

In whom we have redemption through his blood, the forgiveness of sins, according to the riches of his grace;

 

Those that are saved are not under the law of sin unto damnation.

 

Romans 6:14

For sin shall not have dominion over you: for ye are not under the law, but under grace.



#125
OneLight

OneLight

    Royal Member

  • Servant
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 26,438 posts

I'm sorry ... your question makes no sense to me.  Can you reword your question? I don't know what you mean when you ask "If I may ask you, when did God give you the answer to what you are saying, what is that "what?""
 
If you mean the words that are underline above, they are found in scripture, Revelation 21:6-8.  I copied and pasted the verses.

 
So, Revelation 21:6-8 are verses found in the book of the bible and God did not give it to you/us personally as an answer, do you/we now agree? About playing to be God, I do hope it is now clear to you that it plainly refers to whatever answer that anyone will dare respond to the question previously posted.


I will not agree that we cannot use scripture as the truth. If you want to ignore His words or are to afraid to stand firm on them, that is you choice. When scripture tells us the sexually immoral people will be cast in to the lake of fire I will echo that message. God gives warnings to us all through His words. IF you choose not to pass on these warnings to those who are in sin, where is your love for your neighbor?

When you witness to people, what truth do you stand on if you refuse to stand on scripture?

#126
OneLight

OneLight

    Royal Member

  • Servant
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 26,438 posts

Here is the passage you refer to:
 
Revelation 21:6-8
 
And he said unto me, It is done. I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end. I will give unto him that is athirst of the fountain of the water of life freely.
He that overcometh shall inherit all things; and I will be his God, and he shall be my son.
But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death.
 
Notice in verse 8 it mentions "unbelieving." That is because this does not refer to anyone that has believed the gospel of the Lord jesus Christ and trusted in His blood payment for their sins. 
 
The saved have their sins paid for and forgiven by the blood of Jesus Christ.


When studying the above scripture the unbelieving is just one factor of many, separated by a comma and the words "and the". The list is as follows:
  • fearful
  • unbelieving
  • abominable
  • murders
  • sexually immoral
  • sorcerers
  • idolaters
  • all liars
One does not have to more than one of these to be cast into the lake of fire. The unbelieving is just one in the list.

What do you say this verse is telling us?

Matthew 7:14
Because narrow is the gate and difficult is the way which leads to life, and there are few who find it.

#127
MarkNigro

MarkNigro

    Veteran Member

  • Advanced Member
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 567 posts

Jesus said:

 

Matthew 7:14

Because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it.

 

Notice the way is narrow, no room for works. Jesus is the way, not the way shower. It ends with find it, not persevere on a path.



#128
OneLight

OneLight

    Royal Member

  • Servant
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 26,438 posts

Jesus said:
 
Matthew 7:14
Because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it.[/size]
 
Notice the way is narrow, no room for works. Jesus is the way, not the way shower. It ends with find it, not persevere on a path.[/size]

You add "no room for works" because that is what you believe. Scripture never said that. In fact, those who do not do the will of the Father nor follow what Christ commanded are those who take the wide path, as many do. BE careful, my friend. Don't be trapped into thinking that what you do or do not do does not matter.

#129
Sanh

Sanh

    Junior Member

  • Banned
  • PipPip
  • 125 posts

When you witness to people, what truth do you stand on if you refuse to stand on scripture?

 

 

The truth that I stand on in witnessing to people is the truth that I learned and received from the Lord Jesus Christ in His own way of existence and living. The Lord commanded me to tell the people to come to and call on in Him (God) in order that the people may learn and hear from God himself and know God through Himself being the Lord God of all ages and in that respect, people may not be led astray of the way leading to the kingdom of God and their own salvation.


Edited by Sanh, 19 August 2013 - 08:54 AM.


#130
MarkNigro

MarkNigro

    Veteran Member

  • Advanced Member
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 567 posts

 


When you witness to people, what truth do you stand on if you refuse to stand on scripture?

 

 

The truth that I stand on in witnessing to people is the truth that I learned and received from the Lord Jesus Christ in His own way of existence and living. The Lord commanded me to tell the people to come to and call on in Him (God) in order that the people may learn and hear from God himself and know God through Himself being the Lord God of all ages and in that respect, people may not be led astray of the way leading to the kingdom of God and their own salvation.

 

How did the Lord command you to tell people?



#131
Sanh

Sanh

    Junior Member

  • Banned
  • PipPip
  • 125 posts

 

How did the Lord command you to tell people?

 

 

I have told you already the means that the Lord used in talking to us, just go back to those posts.


Edited by Sanh, 19 August 2013 - 10:59 AM.


#132
MarkNigro

MarkNigro

    Veteran Member

  • Advanced Member
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 567 posts

 

 

How did the Lord command you to tell people?

 

 

I have told you already the means that the Lord used in talking to us, just go back to those posts.

 

Well I am sure someone else will have a different story to tell from their encounter with Jesus Christ. Does not work though.

Use the proven word of God.



#133
shiloh357

shiloh357

    Royal Member

  • Royal Member
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 32,715 posts

 

 

Mark,

I notice that you are refusing to discuss what you disagree with. You claim Matthew 7:21 is often misunderstood and that it does refute salvation by merit or works. Let's look at the whole passage you provided so we are not taking anything our of context.

Matthew 7:21-23

"Not everyone who says to Me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ shall enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father in heaven. Many will say to Me in that day, ‘Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in Your name, cast out demons in Your name, and done many wonders in Your name?’ And then I will declare to them, ‘I never knew you; depart from Me, you who practice lawlessness!’"

Let go with your premise, that all one need to do is believe in Christ to be saved forever. Those who do the above in His name have to believe in Him in order to do these things: prophesied in His name, cast out demons in His name, done many wonders in His name. Yet, Jesus claims He never knew them. Jesus then continues to explain what he means in the follow verses.

 

 

The fact that they are appealing to their works and not to the grace of God, shows that they were not believers at all, coupled with the fact that Jesus said that He never (at any time) knew them.   So these were not people who were doing anything in Jesus' Name, despite their claim.  

 

 

That does not negate the fact that they believed that they were following the Lord or believed in the Lord.  They just refused to follow the Lord as the Lord set forth by following the commandments of the Lord.  They probably believed that were all set because they could use His name to cast out demons and prophesy.  Continue in Matthew 7, verses 24-27, and see how Christ explains the difference of hearing and obeying and hearing and not obeying.

 

Salvation is by grace through faith and not of works, but that is not the end all of our walk in Christ, but only the beginning.  We have a partnership with God in allowing Him to change us to be like Christ, or not and remain in the flesh.  That is our choice and if we choose to remain in the flesh, it is like the seed that fell on the wayside or among the thorns.  Neither bear fruit and a tree that does not bear fruit gets cut down and burned.

 

You are reading way more into that than is warranted.  Jesus calls them false prophets.  They were not believers regardless of what they thought they were.  There are many religionists who think that they are believers because they got to church or because they were baptized as a child.

 

The difference between the man who built his house on the rock and the man who built his house on the sand was faith.  The wise man heard and obeyed the Lord.  He was not saved because he obeyed.  He was already saved and his faith produced corresponding action.  

 

Salvation is not a partnership with God.  We are not his partners. He is the one who does the changing.  It is His work from start to finish.  If salvation depends on us at all, we are doomed.   The New Covenant isn't between God and man.  It is between the Father and Jesus.  They are the guarantors of the covenant and you can't break their covenant.  Salvation is God holding on to us, not us holding on to Him.

 

Oh and BTW, the Bible uses the anceint blood covenant as the model for understanding how the New Covenant works.  If a person EVER loses their salvation, because this is a blood covenant, they wouldn't get it back.  If the covenant is broken, it is broken permanently, requiring yet another covenant to be cut in order for salvation to made available again and Jesus isn't coming back to die for us again.

 

The whole dog and pony show of getting saved, getting lost and getting saved again is not biblical and has no support anywhere from Scripture.



#134
FresnoJoe

FresnoJoe

    Royal Member

  • Worthy Watchman
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 42,801 posts

Oh and BTW, the Bible uses the ancient blood covenant as the model for understanding how the New Covenant works.  If a person EVER loses their salvation, because this is a blood covenant, they wouldn't get it back.  If the covenant is broken, it is broken permanently, requiring yet another covenant to be cut in order for salvation to made available again and Jesus isn't coming back to die for us again.

 

The whole dog and pony show of getting saved, getting lost and getting saved again is not biblical and has no support anywhere from Scripture.

 

:thumbsup:

 

~

 

It Scares My Silly

 

For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: Not of works, lest any man should boast. Ephesians 2:8-9

 

To Think Someone Would Dance Into

 

And if ye call on the Father, who without respect of persons judgeth according to every man's work, pass the time of your sojourning here in fear: Forasmuch as ye know that ye were not redeemed with corruptible things, as silver and gold, from your vain conversation received by tradition from your fathers; But with the precious blood of Christ, as of a lamb without blemish and without spot: 1 Peter 1:17-19

 

And Out Of The Precious Blood Of The Lamb Of God

 

For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted of the heavenly gift, and were made partakers of the Holy Ghost, And have tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the world to come, If they shall fall away, to renew them again unto repentance; seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and put him to an open shame. Hebrews 6:4-6

 

For They Could Bring Down An Eternal Curse

 

Thus saith the LORD; Cursed be the man that trusteth in man, and maketh flesh his arm, and whose heart departeth from the LORD. Jeremiah 17:5

 

And Leave Jesus

 

Blessed is the man that trusteth in the LORD, and whose hope the LORD is. Jeremiah 17:7

 

Forever

 

Take heed, brethren, lest there be in any of you an evil heart of unbelief, in departing from the living God. Hebrews 3:12

 

And If You Think You've Done So

 

And it shall come to pass, that whosoever shall call on the name of the Lord shall be saved. Acts 2:21

 

Cry Out

 

For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved. Romans 10:13

 

And Be Blessed Beloved

 

The LORD bless thee, and keep thee:
The LORD make his face shine upon thee, and be gracious unto thee:
The LORD lift up his countenance upon thee, and give thee peace.

And they shall put my name upon the children of Israel; and I will bless them. Numbers 6:24-27

 

Love, Joe



#135
FresnoJoe

FresnoJoe

    Royal Member

  • Worthy Watchman
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 42,801 posts
When you witness to people, what truth do you stand on if you refuse to stand on scripture?

 

The truth that I stand on in witnessing to people is the truth that I learned and received from the Lord Jesus Christ in His own way of existence and living. The Lord commanded me to tell the people to come to and call on in Him (God) in order that the people may learn and hear from God himself and know God through Himself being the Lord God of all ages and in that respect, people may not be led astray of the way leading to the kingdom of God and their own salvation.

 

~

 

The

 

Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me. John 14:6

 

Only Truth

 

Who is a liar but he that denieth that Jesus is the Christ? He is antichrist, that denieth the Father and the Son.

 

Whosoever denieth the Son, the same hath not the Father: (but) he that acknowledgeth the Son hath the Father also.

 

Let that therefore abide in you, which ye have heard from the beginning. If that which ye have heard from the beginning shall remain in you, ye also shall continue in the Son, and in the Father. And this is the promise that he hath promised us, even eternal life.

 

These things have I written unto you concerning them that seduce you. 1 John 2:22-26

 

Is Trust In Jesus And Thou Shall Be Saved

 

And this is the record, that God hath given to us eternal life, and this life is in his Son.

 

He that hath the Son hath life; and he that hath not the Son of God hath not life.

 

These things have I written unto you that believe on the name of the Son of God; that ye may know that ye have eternal life, and that ye may believe on the name of the Son of God. 1 John 5:11-13

 

Beloved

 

The Father loveth the Son, and hath given all things into his hand. He that believeth on the Son hath everlasting life: and he that believeth not the Son shall not see life; but the wrath of God abideth on him. John 3:35-36

 

Love, Joe



#136
OneLight

OneLight

    Royal Member

  • Servant
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 26,438 posts

When you witness to people, what truth do you stand on if you refuse to stand on scripture?

 
The truth that I stand on in witnessing to people is the truth that I learned and received from the Lord Jesus Christ in His own way of existence and living. The Lord commanded me to tell the people to come to and call on in Him (God) in order that the people may learn and hear from God himself and know God through Himself being the Lord God of all ages and in that respect, people may not be led astray of the way leading to the kingdom of God and their own salvation.


This is interesting. What knowledge of the life of Christ do you have outside of scripture, or other books? In scripture Jesus told us that the Holy Spirit will teach us in all truth, what He has heard HE will teach. The Holy Spirit will not teach anything that goes against scripture since He moved the writers when they penned scripture.

So, since you never mentioned scripture in your reply, let me ask you straight out. Do you read and study the bible with the guidance of the Holy Spirit, or is what you are referring to some sort of special revelation where you don't read scripture, claiming the Holy Spirit, or Jesus, talks to you personally? I honestly cannot tell by your answer.

#137
asper

asper

    Advanced Member

  • Advanced Member
  • PipPipPip
  • 353 posts

When God saves his elect it isn’t just from the punishment of sin it is also from sin itself.

 

Salvation is not of works but works are a result of salvation.

 

 Tit 1:10  For there are many unruly and vain talkers and deceivers, specially they of the circumcision:

11  Whose mouths must be stopped, who subvert whole houses, teaching things which they ought not, for filthy lucre’s sake.

12  One of themselves, even a prophet of their own, said, The Cretians are alway liars, evil beasts, slow bellies.

13  This witness is true. Wherefore rebuke them sharply, that they may be sound in the faith;

14  Not giving heed to Jewish fables, and commandments of men, that turn from the truth.

 

15  Unto the pure all things are pure: but unto them that are defiled and unbelieving is nothing pure; but even their mind and conscience is defiled.

 

16  They profess that they know God; but in works they deny him, being abominable, and disobedient, and unto every good work reprobate.

 

--The above shows the difference between the truly saved and the false professors of faith.--

 

 

Col 3:1  If ye then be risen with Christ, seek those things which are above, where Christ sitteth on the right hand of God.

2  Set your affection on things above, not on things on the earth.

 

For ye are dead, and your life is hid with Christ in God.

4  When Christ, who is our life, shall appear, then shall ye also appear with him in glory.

5 ¶  Mortify therefore your members which are upon the earth; fornication, uncleanness, inordinate affection, evil concupiscence, and covetousness, which is idolatry:

 

6  For which things’ sake the wrath of God cometh on the children of disobedience:

 

7  In the which ye also walked some time, when ye lived in them.

 

8 ¶  But now ye also put off all these; anger, wrath, malice, blasphemy, filthy communication out of your mouth.

 

9  Lie not one to another, seeing that ye have put off the old man with his deeds;

 

10  And have put on the new man, which is renewed in knowledge after the image of him that created him:

 

1Co 6:9  Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind,

10  Nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners, shall inherit the kingdom of God.

 

11  And such were some of you: but ye are washed, but ye are sanctified, but ye are justified in the name of the Lord Jesus, and by the Spirit of our God.

 

-- the above shows  the changed life--

 

Ro 4:6  Even as David also describeth the blessedness of the man, unto whom God imputeth righteousness without works,

 

Ro 11:6  And if by grace, then is it no more of works: otherwise grace is no more grace. But if it be of works, then is it no more grace: otherwise work is no more work.

 

--the above shows that righteousness comes without works--

 

Ro 9:11  (For the children being not yet born, neither having done any good or evil, that the purpose of God according to election might stand, not of works, but of him that calleth;)

 

1Co 1:26  For ye see your calling, brethren, how that not many wise men after the flesh, not many mighty, not many noble, are called:

27  But God hath chosen the foolish things of the world to confound the wise; and God hath chosen the weak things of the world to confound the things which are mighty;

28  And base things of the world, and things which are despised, hath God chosen, yea, and things which are not, to bring to nought things that are:

29  That no flesh should glory in his presence.

30  But of him are ye in Christ Jesus, who of God is made unto us wisdom, and righteousness, and sanctification, and redemption:

31  That, according as it is written, He that glorieth, let him glory in the Lord.

 

 

--the above shows that you cannot glorify in God’s presence because of your works or for your decision or whatever term you may use--

 

God bless,

Tony

 

 



#138
MarkNigro

MarkNigro

    Veteran Member

  • Advanced Member
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 567 posts

Eternal Security or Once Saved Always Saved is Absolutely True. The Holy Bible has many verses or passages that prove this. Here are just a few. There are many more.

 

Jesus Christ who is God said:

 

John 6:47

Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that believeth on me hath everlasting life.

 

If someone has everlasting life, then they could never be damned. If not, they did not have everlasting life but potentially had everlasting life. The verse would say, “might have everlasting life.” Jesus Christ, who is God, would not lie especially with the double verily.

 

Jesus also said:

 

John 3:14-18

14 And as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, even so must the Son of man be lifted up:

15 That whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have eternal life.

16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

17 For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved.

18 He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.

 

Verse 15 and 16 say the same thing and by the same logic prove eternal security. Both also emphatically claim, “should not perish” which again proves eternal security. In verse 18, Jesus Christ says that they are not condemned. All again prove eternal security.

 

Jesus Christ also said:

 

John 11:25-26

25 Jesus said unto her, I am the resurrection, and the life: he that believeth in me, though he were dead, yet shall he live:

26 And whosoever liveth and believeth in me shall never die. Believest thou this?

 

In verse 26, Jesus Christ said that they shall never die. Surely you believe God.

 

Paul, the apostle of the Gentiles, wrote:

 

Ephesians 4:30

And grieve not the Holy Spirit of God, whereby ye are sealed unto the day of redemption.

 

If your sealed till the day of redemption, you could not be damned.

 

In the following verse, Jesus says He is with the saved and will never leave them. How could they ever go to hell?

 

Hebrews 13:5

Let your conversation be without covetousness; and be content with such things as ye have: for he hath said, I will never leave thee, nor forsake thee.

 

Jesus Christ the Lord also said:

 

John 10:28-30

28 And I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand.

29 My Father, which gave them me, is greater than all; and no man is able to pluck them out of my Father's hand.

30 I and my Father are one.

 

If someone has “eternal life,” then they could never be damned. If not, they did not have eternal life but potentially had eternal life. Jesus Christ, who is God, would not lie. Again Jesus Christ is emphatic that “they shall never perish.” Obviously no man can pluck them out of Jesus’ hand or His Father’s hand.

 

The apostle John wrote the following. How can you know that you have eternal life if it is only a maybe?

 

1 John 5:13

These things have I written unto you that believe on the name of the Son of God; that ye may know that ye have eternal life, and that ye may believe on the name of the Son of God.

 

The next passage, written by Paul, the apostle of the Gentiles, says, “are saved,” not might be saved.

 

Ephesians 2:8-9

8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:

9 Not of works, lest any man should boast.

 

Potentially damned could not be salvation as written by Paul in the following passage.

 

Romans 1:16

For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek.

 

The following words spoken by Jesus Christ again prove once saved always saved.

 

John 5:24

Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life.

 

Before the rapture, for those that are saved by the blood of the Lord Jesus Christ, there are only 2 possibilities and only one outcome. If they die before the rapture, they get a glorified body and are forever with the Lord. If they are alive at the rapture, they get a glorified body and are forever with the Lord.

 

2 Corinthians 5:8

We are confident, I say, and willing rather to be absent from the body, and to be present with the Lord.

 

1 Thessalonians 4:15-17

15 For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep.

16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:

17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.

 

The above sampling absolutely proves that eternal security (once saved always saved) is absolutely true. They are emphatic and quite clear. Since the Holy Bible has no contradictions, anything that you think shows otherwise is just your mistaken interpretation. Many people assume a passage is talking about salvation/damnation when it is not. This is usually done by taking the verse out of context, assuming meanings of words with false definitions and doctrines, ignoring what salvation really means, or by not rightly dividing the word of truth (see 2 Timothy 2:15) They may be confusing statements made to a different people, for a different time, about a different subject. They may even be using a new Bible version with a corrupt reading.

 

From the above, we are assured by God Almighty the Saviour that if you believe in the Lord Jesus Christ, you are saved forever. Those that are saved through faith in the Lord Jesus Christ and His shed blood have all their sins paid for by that blood. They have all their sins forgiven by faith in His atoning blood. God will not remember their sins. Therefore, no passage of damnation or condemnation applies to those saved by faith in the Lord Jesus Christ.

 

Those that have not believed by faith alone are not saved. None of their sins are paid for, forgiven, or forgotten.  Every passage of damnation or condemnation applies to them. Many of these quote the very passages that condemn themselves.






Worthy Christian Forums - Christian Message Boards - 1999-2014 part of the Worthy Network