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Does Hell have literal fire?

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#61
BlessedByTheBest

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Excellent topic!!! The bible, or should I even say "Christ" told a story about a burning hell. Christ told many stories btw, to help people understand things that were heavenly. But there are several of things to take in consideration. First of all, the KJ version of the translation of the bible that was written by King James who had the mind set of "Eternal fire" hell. Tho he did not change much of the meaning of the words in translation, He used the word "Hell" which we as English speaking people, define as an eternal forever fire. (type in a search engine "how did the story of hell began?") The word used in Greek was "Sho'el" meaning "Grave" (it's actually a Jewish word but the new testament was written in Greek) It really does pay to study a little about the translation of the bible from Greek, and or Hebrew (Old testament) to English. This is how I have to look at this topic too. First of all, being a Christian, I don't worry about going to Hell, but another thing is, If God is such a wonderful loving God that he "Loves the world", then why would he send people who just are "Ignorant" to Him and His love, to some horrible forever burning place like that? Sounds more like something the devil would devise up. Most people who believe in a terrible place like that are Christians out of fear and don't have the proper "fear" which is also a misused word in the bible, as respect for God. I began to understand that in the book of Revelation, the "eternal" fire, which I've learned that Sodom and Gamora were destroyed by, is a fire that will "Forever" purify the earth. (Sodom and Gamora were destroyed so that nothing else grows there again to this day.) The Lord will rid the earth of all impurity, "Sin". The "New Earth" will not contain any sin at all. Those who have had their faith in Christ, the Messiah, (in the old testament) will live in the New Jerusalem which is purified by God for them and we will all eat of the tree of life again! As originally planned from creation. I know that the devil and his followers, "the fallen Angels" will suffer greatly as a result of how they have deceived man. Exactly how that will happen I don't know. So I am not a firm believer on a forever burning hell that people who were deceived by the devil, will suffer forever and forever! I am a bit upset at religions that teach that if we are not saved we will "Go to Hell". It's one of the reasons why Atheists exist. There's allot of study to do on allot of our cultures beliefs that have somewhat deceived us by old cultural beliefs set in our minds from the time of Constantine. But note this most important part, "Salvation, following the Holy Spirit" will be the teacher to help us not to be ignorant of Gods laws that will be written in our hearts! I highly suggest that one takes a bible easy to read, (CEV version for eg.) and then using as well the "KJV" to line it up and study the book of revelation. It's one heck of a study and I don't think anyone will come out of it "Knowing it all", but you will see things in a different light if we also study more about the Hebrew and Greek words and how they were written and translated. It takes a little time, but it's well worth it. That's what I used the internet for.


Hi Luanne, grace and peace to you.

no one is ignorant of God and His love.
the spirit within every one of us testifies to the existence of our Creator, and each man/woman will be judged by the choices they have made according to that light given unto them.

also, you either believe the Scripture or you don't. concordances are great and all, but I believe God left us a perfectly understandable English version of His Holy Word within the KJV. Heathens, hillbillies, and "ignorant people" have been reading it for over 400 years now. that's a never-ending discussion though.

i don't tend to twist the Word to any of my preconceived notions.
whether it be Sheol or Gehenna, there will be an eternal death. eternal punishment, whichever way you want to look at it.
Sodom and Gomorrah were left in ashes, but now we are speaking carnally concerning spiritual things.
another never-ending discussion, but i am willing to expound on it if you are.


Mat 10:26 Fear them not therefore: for there is nothing covered, that shall not be revealed; and hid, that shall not be known.
Mat 10:27 What I tell you in darkness, that speak ye in light: and what ye hear in the ear, that preach ye upon the housetops.
Mat 10:28 And fear not them which kill the body, but are not able to kill the soul: but rather fear him which is able to destroy both soul and body in hell.



Pro 1:7 The fear of the LORD is the beginning of knowledge: but fools despise wisdom and instruction.


also, a common indoctrinated misconception is that Satan reigns from his throne in Hell, but that is a lie. and a lie often told by people who should know better. Satan is not there.


Isa 14:12 How art thou fallen from heaven, O Lucifer, son of the morning! how art thou cut down to the ground, which didst weaken the nations!

Job 1:6 Now there was a day when the sons of God came to present themselves before the LORD, and Satan came also among them.
Job 1:7 And the LORD said unto Satan, Whence comest thou? Then Satan answered the LORD, and said, From going to and fro in the earth, and from walking up and down in it.

Luk 4:5 And the devil, taking him up into an high mountain, shewed unto him all the kingdoms of the world in a moment of time.
Luk 4:6 And the devil said unto him, All this power will I give thee, and the glory of them: for that is delivered unto me; and to whomsoever I will I give it.

Luk 4:7 If thou therefore wilt worship me, all shall be thine.
Luk 4:8 And Jesus answered and said unto him, Get thee behind me, Satan: for it is written, Thou shalt worship the Lord thy God, and him only shalt thou serve.


did Jesus call him a liar? no, because it is true. his authority lies upon the face of this earth. he and his fallen angels are actually confined here. not Hell.

God rules Hell.


Mat 13:47 Again, the kingdom of heaven is like unto a net, that was cast into the sea, and gathered of every kind:
Mat 13:48 Which, when it was full, they drew to shore, and sat down, and gathered the good into vessels, but cast the bad away.
Mat 13:49 So shall it be at the end of the world: the angels shall come forth, and sever the wicked from among the just,
Mat 13:50 And shall cast them into the furnace of fire: there shall be wailing and gnashing of teeth.


Looks like angels tossing the wicked into flames.
God sends souls to Hell.


Mar 9:42 And whosoever shall offend one of these little ones that believe in me, it is better for him that a millstone were hanged about his neck, and he were cast into the sea.
Mar 9:43 And if thy hand offend thee, cut it off: it is better for thee to enter into life maimed, than having two hands to go into hell, into the fire that never shall be quenched:
Mar 9:44 Where their worm dieth not, and the fire is not quenched.
Mar 9:45 And if thy foot offend thee, cut it off: it is better for thee to enter halt into life, than having two feet to be cast into hell, into the fire that never shall be quenched:
Mar 9:46 Where their worm dieth not, and the fire is not quenched.
Mar 9:47 And if thine eye offend thee, pluck it out: it is better for thee to enter into the kingdom of God with one eye, than having two eyes to be cast into hell fire:
Mar 9:48 Where their worm dieth not, and the fire is not quenched.


all those new age bible versions like to omit these verses that associate our Holy Loving Father with terror and eternal anguish.
the CEV is similar to the Satanic NIV.
another never-ending discussion.

ultimately, people need to realize a certain reverence in dealing with the God of the Universe.
there is love, but there should be a reverential fear for the Being who knows your thoughts and will RIGHTEOUSLY JUDGE all at the end of times.

2 Peter Chapter 2.
People need to get right with God. Hell should be motivation, not a fantasy that is brushed off symbolically.


" The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance. " That any should "Perish". Great scripture, Perish usually means, "destroy, end, get rid of"


i love that quote too, it's actually in my signature. :)

the thing is though, there will come a time when prophecy will come to fulfillment and his mercy and compassion will have come to an end for the wicked.


Rev 14:9 And the third angel followed them, saying with a loud voice, If any man worship the beast and his image, and receive his mark in his forehead, or in his hand,
Rev 14:10 The same shall drink of the wine of the wrath of God, which is poured out without mixture into the cup of his indignation; and he shall be tormented with fire and brimstone in the presence of the holy angels, and in the presence of the Lamb:
Rev 14:11 And the smoke of their torment ascendeth up for ever and ever: and they have no rest day nor night, who worship the beast and his image, and whosoever receiveth the mark of his name.


love to you and God bless.

Edited by BlessedByTheBest, 12 January 2013 - 11:03 AM.


#62
Sevenseas

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Luanne:


It really does pay to study a little about the translation of the bible from Greek, and or Hebrew (Old testament) to English.



some people study alot...I know some people here on these boards actually study alot


If God is such a wonderful loving God that he "Loves the world", then why would he send people who just are "Ignorant" to Him and His love, to some horrible forever burning place like that? Sounds more like something the devil would devise up.


What do you mean by if? There is no if in the equation...The Bible states that God IS love..He is not just loving, He, is actually love and not only that,
but HOLY in that love...which is far removed from anything we can compare to on this globe.

Actually scripture does not state that God sends the ignorant anywhere...He does send the sinner though. People in willful rebellion against their Creator
are not ignorant.....the Bible indicates that there is no ignorance of God, in that there is no excuse:

The wrath of God is being revealed from heaven against all the godlessness and wickedness of men who suppress the truth by their wickedness, 19since what may be known about God is plain to them, because God has made it plain to them. 20For since the creation of the world God’s invisible qualities—his eternal power and divine nature—have been clearly seen, being understood from what has been made, so that men are without excuse. Romans 1:18-20


Most people who believe in a terrible place like that are Christians out of fear and don't have the proper "fear" which is also a misused word in the bible, as respect for God.


Well what do you think of the wrath of God who IS love ? How do you see that? Is there a word for wrath that you substitute?

Perhaps the Christians who believe that God does in fact punish rebellious humanity have studied just a little more ... in the original language.
Let's face it, the KJV is not the only Bible we have and the internet is not necessarily the most scholarly place for learning unless one already
has understanding as the conflicting ideas and teaching on the net are a smorgasbord of intelligent and well studied people as well as ignorant,
stupid and vain people. So, it would be easy to be led astray if one uses the www as their base of knowledge not understanding that anyone
at all can post anything at all and call it anything at all.

As far as the devil devising anything, he does not even have that capacity. The last time he devised something, it was a disaster and he failed
utterly. The devil does not create...he can only destroy. The devil does not judge who goes where and neither do Christians. That, is the domain
of God.

I know that the devil and his followers, "the fallen Angels" will suffer greatly as a result of how they have deceived man.


Actually, it would be the rebellion in heaven led by lucifer that causes their fate. Deception comes when we listen to the wrong spirit. Like Eve did. However,we do not have to listen to that spirit, we have the Holy Spirit who guides us into all truth. Believers, are now filled with the Holy Spirit and as part of the Body of Christ,
we have each other to keep each other from being led astray, being deceived and falling pray to the teaching of men (and women) who are themselves
seduced by lying spirits and who, in turn, teach these lies as though they were the truth.


I am a bit upset at religions that teach that if we are not saved we will "Go to Hell". It's one of the reasons why Atheists exist.


Really? You are a bit upset by religions that teach that if we are not saved we will go to hell? Well then, how many religions are there that teach this?
How many religions are there that teach eternal damnation and salvation through Jesus Christ, the only begotten Son of God? God is not making things up
as He goes along. He always knew what He was doing.

I find it uncharacteristic that a Christian would refer to Christianity as one of many religions...have I misunderstood you here?

​ Atheists exist because Christians tell them they are going to hell? Well I have one friend that is a flaming atheist and I have never told her she
is going to hell...she is in very dark and deep rebellion against God because of personal issues and that is usually the case for those who
do not believe in God...or say they do not believe. They believe....they just can't stand the thought of bending the knee. See, I am going to
go by what the ACTUAL Bible states...and that tells me that people are in rebellion against God, like their master the devil.

"Salvation, following the Holy Spirit" will be the teacher to help us not to be ignorant of Gods laws that will be written in our hearts! I highly suggest that one takes a bible easy to read, (CEV version for eg.) and then using as well the "KJV" to line it up and study the book of revelation


The Contemporary English Bible is hardly noteworthy even for a read unless one simply wants to read. It is actually written for those at a 4th grade reading level....alot of things have been changed in that Bible to read differently and it does not have the original meanings...in fact, here's a quote regarding that Bible:

The character of the CEV is largely determined by its attempt to put the Bible into words "widely used in everyday speech" by modern readers who are "unfamiliar with typical church language" (Creating and Crafting, pp. 26, 27). This inevitably leads to a great deal of interpretation being worked into the text and some problems of inaccuracy, because the books of the Bible were not written for modern children or for adults who are uninitiated.



I don't know, but I do not care to read anything that is purposely inaccurate so as to go down easier and assure people that sin is just a bad habit and God has no intention of punishing their sin because He loves them. Why read the scary King James after the fact?

Are you a fan of Rob Bell by the way? You seem to espouse some of his ideas in a very similar way.......


#63
theMadJW

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Hell, in Hebrew AND Greek, literally means "the Grave"- and THAT is what it truly is.
Contrary to Churchianity, the dead are REALLY DEAD. NOT LIVING. And a Day of resurrection & judgment is coming.

The sickening dogma is to SCARE people to church.

#64
FresnoJoe

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Hell, in Hebrew AND Greek, literally means "the Grave"- and THAT is what it truly is.
Contrary to Churchianity, the dead are REALLY DEAD. NOT LIVING. And a Day of resurrection & judgment is coming.

The sickening dogma is to SCARE people to church.


Most Will Just Yawn And Lick Their Fangs

Enter ye in at the strait gate: for wide is the gate, and broad is the way, that leadeth to destruction, and many there be which go in thereat:
Because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it.
Beware of false prophets, which come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves.
Matthew 7:13-15

Snapping At The Truth

The Father loveth the Son, and hath given all things into his hand.
He that believeth on the Son hath everlasting life: and he that believeth not the Son shall not see life; but the wrath of God abideth on him.
John 3:35-36

And Still He

I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end, the first and the last.
Blessed are they that do his commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city.
For without are dogs, and sorcerers, and whoremongers, and murderers, and idolaters, and whosoever loveth and maketh a lie.
Revelation 22:13-15

Calls

I Jesus have sent mine angel to testify unto you these things in the churches. I am the root and the offspring of David, and the bright and morning star.
And the Spirit and the bride say, Come. And let him that heareth say, Come. And let him that is athirst come. And whosoever will, let him take the water of life freely.
Revelation 22:16-17

Believe

For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life. John 3:16

And Be Blessed Beloved

Love, Joe




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