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Russia Considering Passing Nationwide Anti-Gay Law

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32 replies to this topic

#1
Steve_S

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MOSCOW (AP) — Kissing his boyfriend during a protest in front of Russia's parliament earned Pavel Samburov 30 hours of detention and the equivalent of a $16 fine on a charge of "hooliganism." But if a bill that comes up for a first vote later this month becomes law, such a public kiss could be defined as illegal "homosexual propaganda" and bring a fine of up to $16,000.

The legislation being pushed by the Kremlin and the Russian Orthodox Church would make it illegal nationwide to provide minors with information that is defined as "propaganda of sodomy, lesbianism, bisexuality and transgenderism." It includes a ban on holding public events that promote gay rights. St. Petersburg and a number of other Russian cities already have similar laws on their books.


http://news.yahoo.co...-125825051.html

#2
joi

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Sounds as if the USA & the UN could take some lessons from Russia!

#3
enoob57

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When Sodoms doors are just outside mine... shall I not sit in the sorrows of coming destruction-> so
the why of tribulation and the pre-tribulational rapture! Love, Steven

#4
other one

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Hummmm...... is it possible that it's safer to be a Christian in Russia than it is in the USA???

#5
*Zion*

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Nope, they'll get anyone that doesn't conform to state image.

#6
MorningGlory

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Sounds as if the USA & the UN could take some lessons from Russia!


Think about that for a minute, joi. Sure homosexuality is an abomination to the Lord but.......would you really want the state making YOUR personal life illegal? Suppose you wanted to become a Christian (I know you already are!) but that was illegal? Or you wanted to join an activist group and that was illegal? I'm not seeing Russia as a bastion of freedom. And their ban on homosexuality is not to preserve Christian values. It's all about the state.

#7
Fez

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Sounds as if the USA & the UN could take some lessons from Russia!


Think about that for a minute, joi. Sure homosexuality is an abomination to the Lord but.......would you really want the state making YOUR personal life illegal? Suppose you wanted to become a Christian (I know you already are!) but that was illegal? Or you wanted to join an activist group and that was illegal? I'm not seeing Russia as a bastion of freedom. And their ban on homosexuality is not to preserve Christian values. It's all about the state.

Agreed. What's next, a complete ban on alcohol? That was tried somewhere and didn't work :cool2: .

I agree that it is a sin yes, but just imagine if states started legislating against every sin?

#8
amor

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Sounds as if the USA & the UN could take some lessons from Russia!


So you favour taking away people's freedoms do you. What happens when they move on to take away yours?

Remember Martin Niemoller's words

:First they came for the communists, and I did not speak out - because I was not a communist;
Then they came for the socialists, and I did not speak out - because I was not a socialist;
Then they came for the trade unionists, and I did not speak out - because I was not a trade unionist;
Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out - because I was not a Jew;
Then they came for me - and there was no one left to speak out for me.

#9
amor

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FEZ:

I agree that it is a sin yes, but just imagine if states started legislating against every sin?


We do have laws like theft, and committing Murder. Child Porn laws. Those don't prevent people from committing these crimes but they are laws against sin. Is not prosecuting people caught in this unnatural act not also a sin? Is it any worse than theft? Paul said Flee fornication, so it seems that it's a pretty bad sin, and should have laws to punish those that commit this crime.

So coming out of the closet means your fitted with handcuff's.

Mike.


Except the other examples you states refer to crimes that hurt and restrict the freedom of others. Why should we criminalise activities that have no victims.

#10
joi

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Without having some of you put words in my post (so to speak), I was referring to the USA not making legal gay marriage.

#11
*Zion*

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This is the whole thing! God is actually the one who originate these laws (see 10 commandments) BUT He didn't take away our freewill. He didn't want human robots, but Human hearts CHOOSING to do right and to love Him. As humans without Him, we see only one piece of the puzzle at best, and try to fit everything else around that one piece. They may be trying to get their country men to do right, but they totally missed the point. God - Father, Son and Holy Spirit - is the point. Sadly, it's not just Russia, but the whole world over with different initiatives to make things better, but they will only get worse unless all of human kind repents - which won't happen. That is why the end must come. I've said this before somewhere else... I guess it all boils down to the same old thing.

God bless you!

#12
Tinky

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Some restrictions on freedom are justified. Such as you don't have the freedom to yell "fire" in a crowded movie theater. ;)

#13
OneLight

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We are to speak the truth and let God work it out in their lives. Was it not one of the seven angles who had the seven bowls filled with the seven last plagues say in Revelation 22:10b-11 “Do not seal the words of the prophecy of this book, for the time is at hand. He who is unjust, let him be unjust still; he who is filthy, let him be filthy still; he who is righteous, let him be righteous still; he who is holy, let him be holy still.”

#14
bopeep1909

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Sounds as if the USA & the UN could take some lessons from Russia!


I think that is a true statement. :emot-nod:

#15
damo1

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well they have their own bible you are told not to speak the truth Councilors who refuse to offer their services can find them selves in trouble even pastors who refuse to marry a gay couple can find them selves in trouble


i know off several pastors hear were i live who refused and found them selves in trouble

they mock what we stand for and laugh in our faces to were if you speak nothing but the truth you are told to your face you have some issues that you need to deal with like homophobia

#16
Cobalt1959

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So you favour taking away people's freedoms do you. What happens when they move on to take away yours?

Remember Martin Niemoller's words

:First they came for the communists, and I did not speak out - because I was not a communist;
Then they came for the socialists, and I did not speak out - because I was not a socialist;
Then they came for the trade unionists, and I did not speak out - because I was not a trade unionist;
Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out - because I was not a Jew;
Then they came for me - and there was no one left to speak out for me.


You mean like the Muslims do?

#17
enoob57

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Some restrictions on freedom are justified. Such as you don't have the freedom to yell "fire" in a crowded movie theater. ;)

:happyhappy: :33: :taped: :33: Posted Image

#18
Steve_S

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FEZ:

I agree that it is a sin yes, but just imagine if states started legislating against every sin?


We do have laws like theft, and committing Murder. Child Porn laws. Those don't prevent people from committing these crimes but they are laws against sin. Is not prosecuting people caught in this unnatural act not also a sin? Is it any worse than theft? Paul said Flee fornication, so it seems that it's a pretty bad sin, and should have laws to punish those that commit this crime.

So coming out of the closet means your fitted with handcuff's.

Mike.


Except the other examples you states refer to crimes that hurt and restrict the freedom of others. Why should we criminalise activities that have no victims.


There are certainly examples of western nations criminalizing activities that personally harm the individual doing them. Not wearing a seatbelt is illegal in most of the united states. Personal drug use is illegal, primarily because it is harmful to the person doing it. In many states there are laws requiring you to wear a helmet when you ride a motorcycle.

Homosexuality, being sinful, is certainly harmful, as all sins are harmful, correct? I'm not advocating one way or the other here, but I am saying that homosexuality is not a victimless crime, so the "it doesn't harm anyone" argument is an abject failure. It's self victimization, but victimization nonetheless. If the government can pass laws that prevent you from harming yourself, accidentally or intentionally, what's the difference here?

#19
udx

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Homosexuality, being sinful, is certainly harmful, as all sins are harmful, correct? I'm not advocating one way or the other here, but I am saying that homosexuality is not a victimless crime, so the "it doesn't harm anyone" argument is an abject failure. It's self victimization, but victimization nonetheless. If the government can pass laws that prevent you from harming yourself, accidentally or intentionally, what's the difference here?


Do you really think that by passing a law against something that people would turn from what they set their heart to do? Try passing laws against fornication, it wouldn't change much. People would do what they want. The law would only increase cost of government to enforce it if they try.

I think passing this law would just force people to go underground but not fix the problem. Government cannot legislate morality, it has to come from the heart. That is what the New Testament told us. The old testament is ineffective in legislating morality in a population with no God in their hearts.

#20
*Zion*

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Homosexuality, being sinful, is certainly harmful, as all sins are harmful, correct? I'm not advocating one way or the other here, but I am saying that homosexuality is not a victimless crime, so the "it doesn't harm anyone" argument is an abject failure. It's self victimization, but victimization nonetheless. If the government can pass laws that prevent you from harming yourself, accidentally or intentionally, what's the difference here?


Do you really think that by passing a law against something that people would turn from what they set their heart to do? Try passing laws against fornication, it wouldn't change much. People would do what they want. The law would only increase cost of government to enforce it if they try.

I think passing this law would just force people to go underground but not fix the problem. Government cannot legislate morality, it has to come from the heart. That is what the New Testament told us. The old testament is ineffective in legislating morality in a population with no God in their hearts.


While i agree with you that laws don't actually stop people doing wrong with their given free will, their presence is still important as a basic deterrant - there are a lot of murderers out there, but i'm glad that there's a law and penalty against murder and that justice is attempted to be visited upon who commit it.




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