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Russia Considering Passing Nationwide Anti-Gay Law

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32 replies to this topic

#21
nebula

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FEZ:

I agree that it is a sin yes, but just imagine if states started legislating against every sin?


We do have laws like theft, and committing Murder. Child Porn laws. Those don't prevent people from committing these crimes but they are laws against sin. Is not prosecuting people caught in this unnatural act not also a sin? Is it any worse than theft? Paul said Flee fornication, so it seems that it's a pretty bad sin, and should have laws to punish those that commit this crime.

So coming out of the closet means your fitted with handcuff's.

Mike.


Except the other examples you states refer to crimes that hurt and restrict the freedom of others. Why should we criminalise activities that have no victims.


OK. Seat belt and helmet laws.

#22
nebula

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Government cannot legislate morality, it has to come from the heart. That is what the New Testament told us. The old testament is ineffective in legislating morality in a population with no God in their hearts.


True, but I think Russia has realized that homosexuality destroys a society.

#23
enoob57

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Government cannot legislate morality, it has to come from the heart. That is what the New Testament told us. The old testament is ineffective in legislating morality in a population with no God in their hearts.


True, but I think Russia has realized that homosexuality destroys a society.

Exactly :thumbsup:

#24
franciskelsey

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Yes indeed. I kind of liked the old military position. Don't ask, don't tell policy. It does amaze me how the gay movement has twisted the word of God so much yet have no problems singing praises to Jesus as though they are clean before Him.

http://www.gaychrist....html#placename

This site seems to have an "answer" for everything. I guess it is about what each of us do with the truth of God.

Should there be law against being gay? How would Jesus feel about that? I know of nothing that indicated He supported bad behavior.

Born gay? From my own studies, though there have been exceptions, most people who are gay have had been molested or focused on sexually from a young age by the same sex. Also some felt rejected or did not feel sufficient to fulfill the perceived role as male or female. Feelings of emotions play a huge role as well. If one can cater to your feelings for the need of love, sometimes physical attraction follows right behind, more so when that other person wants you in that way.

Certainly, if nothing more, to support gar marriage is a slap in Gods face. The gay condition is rooted in the flesh. Even if one were to claim they were born gay does not make it right. Just like sex outside of marriage between male and female. Jailed and fined? Well, maybe not, but than again, the Jewish knew how damaging sex was outside of marriage and any one with eyes can clear see that in the world today.

At the very least, we need to stop encouraging sin and making it all sound as though it is ok or natural even if it is true. Following our flesh leads to destruction. We should have at least expectations of what we expect, ones of moral actions that build countries rather than destroy them. When we do not, we put the hammer down on our own heads. Not all were Christian 50 years ago either but certain things were expected and not to be messed with.

#25
bopeep1909

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Homosexuality, being sinful, is certainly harmful, as all sins are harmful, correct? I'm not advocating one way or the other here, but I am saying that homosexuality is not a victimless crime, so the "it doesn't harm anyone" argument is an abject failure. It's self victimization, but victimization nonetheless. If the government can pass laws that prevent you from harming yourself, accidentally or intentionally, what's the difference here?


Do you really think that by passing a law against something that people would turn from what they set their heart to do? Try passing laws against fornication, it wouldn't change much. People would do what they want. The law would only increase cost of government to enforce it if they try.

I think passing this law would just force people to go underground but not fix the problem. Government cannot legislate morality, it has to come from the heart. That is what the New Testament told us. The old testament is ineffective in legislating morality in a population with no God in their hearts.


At least it would stop the public display of affection between a man and a man and a woman and a woman.It is gross to watch two men kissing. :hmmm:

#26
JTC

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I think Russia is right in doing this. Enforcing it may have problems of it's own. But at least they are trying to do the right things Compare them to us. We pass laws that make sin legal. And not just on Homosexuality.

I once thought abortion wasn't so terrible, until I saw how it;'s done The Docs literally rip the baby in into pieces to get it out of the womb. I think unborn babies have feelings. So that must really hurt. And some women use abortion as a form of Birth control.

America needs to take a long hard look at what we have done.

#27
*Zion*

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Genesis 6

5 Then the Lord[b] saw that the wickedness of man was great in the earth, and that every intent of the thoughts of his heart was only evil continually. 6 And the Lord was sorry that He had made man on the earth, and He was grieved in His heart.



It isn't just Russia, it's all of humankind.

#28
Cobalt1959

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Yes indeed. I kind of liked the old military position. Don't ask, don't tell policy. It does amaze me how the gay movement has twisted the word of God so much yet have no problems singing praises to Jesus as though they are clean before Him.

This site seems to have an "answer" for everything. I guess it is about what each of us do with the truth of God.


And a well-grounded Christian who has a good working knowledge of the Bible can easily punch holes in their "answers" big enough to drive a truck through. That is why their "answers" are always in places and on pages which they control and they do not have to dialogue with anyone about them or defend them to detractors who know the actual truth.

Should there be law against being gay? How would Jesus feel about that? I know of nothing that indicated He supported bad behavior.

Born gay? From my own studies, though there have been exceptions, most people who are gay have had been molested or focused on sexually from a young age by the same sex. Also some felt rejected or did not feel sufficient to fulfill the perceived role as male or female. Feelings of emotions play a huge role as well. If one can cater to your feelings for the need of love, sometimes physical attraction follows right behind, more so when that other person wants you in that way.

Certainly, if nothing more, to support gar marriage is a slap in Gods face. The gay condition is rooted in the flesh. Even if one were to claim they were born gay does not make it right. Just like sex outside of marriage between male and female. Jailed and fined? Well, maybe not, but than again, the Jewish knew how damaging sex was outside of marriage and any one with eyes can clear see that in the world today.

At the very least, we need to stop encouraging sin and making it all sound as though it is ok or natural even if it is true. Following our flesh leads to destruction. We should have at least expectations of what we expect, ones of moral actions that build countries rather than destroy them. When we do not, we put the hammer down on our own heads. Not all were Christian 50 years ago either but certain things were expected and not to be messed with.


And I know of nowhere where Jesus advocated attempting to change a man's sinful heart by passing a law. A law is not going to change a person's heart. Only the Gospel of Christ will do that. The only reason I speak out against gay marriage in this country is:

A. It is morally wrong and always will be, no matter what they legalize.

B. We already have a clear definition of what marriage, in this country, constitutes and that should not be changed simply because an extremely small percentage (1 to 2 %) of the population, but one that is extremely militant and vocal wants it changed.

Prohibition laws did not stop the consumption of alcohol. Murder and theft laws have not stopped those crimes. The never-ending war on drugs has had absolutely no affect on drug use in this country. Purely moral behavior laws such as laws against alcohol, drugs and sexual practices do not stop those things. They may act as a deterrent to some extent with some people, but they will never eradicate the behavior, because a law does not actually address the root problem, it only applies a consequence for performing the forbidden action. The only way to address the root problem is to address the problem of sin in a man's heart.

#29
*Zion*

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The purpose of the Law is is to expose the sin. Once sin is exposed it can be dealt with through repentance (Isaiah 69v1-2).

#30
Butero

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Sounds as if the USA & the UN could take some lessons from Russia!

I agree. :thumbsup:

#31
GoldenEagle

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MOSCOW (AP) — Kissing his boyfriend during a protest in front of Russia's parliament earned Pavel Samburov 30 hours of detention and the equivalent of a $16 fine on a charge of "hooliganism." But if a bill that comes up for a first vote later this month becomes law, such a public kiss could be defined as illegal "homosexual propaganda" and bring a fine of up to $16,000.
The legislation being pushed by the Kremlin and the Russian Orthodox Church would make it illegal nationwide to provide minors with information that is defined as "propaganda of sodomy, lesbianism, bisexuality and transgenderism." It includes a ban on holding public events that promote gay rights. St. Petersburg and a number of other Russian cities already have similar laws on their books.

http://news.yahoo.co...-125825051.html


I thought this was really interesting:

But in this case, the move has been met mostly with either indifference or open enthusiasm by average Russians. Levada polls conducted last year show that almost two thirds of Russians find homosexuality "morally unacceptable and worth condemning." About half are against gay rallies and same-sex marriage; almost a third think homosexuality is the result of "a sickness or a psychological trauma," the Levada surveys show.



Orthodox, atheist, social Russia has higher morals than "Christian" Western developed nations? Wow. Who would've thought?

#32
JTC

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Well yes, it appears this is true. I've said this before, but homosexuality used to be considered a form of mental illness in America and probably Europe too. But then what happened? I'm not sure. I know one thing that happened was what we called the sexual revolution. When I was really young and knew next to nothing about God, I thought it was cool because it made it easier to get some girls in bed. It also made porn easy to get. And as I said, I was a dumb teen with little to no knowledge of God.

But we were wrong. America was wrong. The old moral values from 100 and more years ago were right. And now we can see why. We have almost no family values left in this country.

So now the homosexuals in America and Europe are going to try and convince Russia we're right. I hope we lose. May God support Russia.

#33
rjp34652

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Sounds as if the USA & the UN could take some lessons from Russia!


As Winston Churchill once suggested Russia is a mystery wrapped inside an enigma. On the one hand a severe return to traditional moral values is being impressed upon society and on the other totalitarian regulation is being enforced. The Russian people have never had a love for personal liberty and have always embraced a government of regulation. They don't really want freedom, they just want a reasonably efficient bureaucracy. So do Americans, apparently.

Vladimir Putin appears to be the engineer of this transformation, but he is not without supporters even among the general population. Many long for the return of the soviets and some even wish for the return of Stalinism, albeit in a pasteurized form.

In all the changes in all the world watch for changes in culture. Culture is the model, not the economy.

It seems that every commentary and every political move in every nation is focused upon the economy; local economy, national economy & global economy. But the culture drives the economy and the economy in turn drives the culture. It's a catch 22. But what starts the cultural ball rolling and what determines its direction? Leadership will do that. Religious leadership. Strong political leadership. In the absence of the strong influence of the church, which has disappeared like smoke in the wind, there is no influence except that of self-serving politics and the international financial cartel.

Without knowing or really understanding the direction Putin & company have chosen for the Russian people, the rest of the world can watch. What do we see? The Russian military capacity has been rebuilt and is growing in new technical directions - the more to oppose American technical expertise on the battlefield. Russia has felt itself threatened by the rapid expansionism of Islam, but has been trying to moderate the effect. Will they succeed?

Putin seems to be trying the tactic of reinforcing traditional Russian cultural values so as to rebuild the military industrial complex and to use the same cultural values to defend the country from Muslim culture - specifically Sharia law. He appears to be holding his ground.

America, on the other hand, is concerned about little more of cultural value than the opportunity to swill gallons of beer while watching as many ball games as humanly possible. Sexual aberrations and extremes of hedonism are acceptable in the west, but not everywhere else. Watch the culture!

Culture is the pivot of history and every culture on the planet is in violent play as of this writing. Putin is investing in traditional Russian culture, which excludes homosexuals and to a greater extent the Muslim influence.

but that's just me, hollering from the choir loft...

Edited by rjp34652, 10 February 2013 - 09:39 AM.





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