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III. Legalism: You May Have Legalism(And Not Even Know It)In Your Life


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This is not the OP. Here’s all 7 threads relating to Legalism I’ve started…

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This is the OP and subject/topic of this thread.

I was brainstorming with my wife last night about legalistic views/ideas and legalism. This was after someone I know pointed out that one might be legalistic and not even know it. Here's what we came up with.

Which of these hit home the most? Your thoughts? Anything to add to the list?

God bless,

GE

You May Have Legalism (And Not Even Know It) In Your Life…

galatians-51.png

1. If you believe God’s love for you depends on your efforts or what you do.

2. If you believe God’s love for you depends on how much you have done for Him lately and the love you have shown him recently.

3. If you fall short because in your mind you need to be a better person, you haven’t prayed enough, or you don’t have enough faith.

4. If you believe God is predisposed to be angry with you because you are a sinner and let’s face it He knows you can do better.

5. If you know God’s law but don’t have a personal relationship with Him.

6. If you focus more on your fellow Christians church attendance, tithing, version of the Bible, outward appearance rather than getting to know others and accepting them where they’re at in their walk with the Lord.

7. If you have grown accustomed to living by the expectations of others, especially those in positions of authority or those in your local church, as this is essential to your life.

8. If your sense of worth is based on the opinions of a Christian leader, your reputation, your church membership, or a group’s opinion of you rather than a personal relationship with Jesus Christ.

9. If you are more concerned with your reputation than with heart change in your life conforming to Christ.

10. If you tell your children not to do something at church or around other Christian families that you allow in your home or elsewhere.

11. If you believe that what people wear, skirt length, swimsuit type, tattoos, piercings, hairstyle, length of hair, etc. is a clear indication of a person’s spiritual maturity and character.

12. You look at people’s lives and instinctively judge them rather than see them through God’s eyes – a work in progress for those who Believe and potential children of God for those who do not.

13. You believe you’re standards somehow make you superior to others.

14. When you miss a service or program at your church, even with a legitimate reason, you feel guilty.

15. You’re so loyal to man-made tradition you don’t think any significant change could possibly be from God.

16. You believe you’re church/denomination is the only group really focused on teaching God’s Word.

17. You believe that those who have been divorced are less valuable in the eyes of God and you feel superior to them.

18. You believe that how your kids turn out is solely your responsibility and the measurement of your success or lack there-of as a Christian parent.

19. You believe that even associating much less discussing ideas with those different than you is sinful compromise.

20. If you believe that the expression of spiritual gifts (provided by the Holy Spirit) is evidence of one’s personal walk with God.

Edit: For clarification the working definition for legalism on this thread is taken from here:

What is legalism?

http://dictionary.re...se/legalism?s=t

noun

1. strict adherence, or the principle of strict adherence, to law or prescription, especially to the letter rather than the spirit.

2. Theology .

a. the doctrine that salvation is gained through good works.

b. the judging of conduct in terms of adherence to precise laws.

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It's A War Zone

This I say then, Walk in the Spirit, and ye shall not fulfill the lust of the flesh.

For the flesh lusteth against the Spirit, and the Spirit against the flesh: and these are contrary the one to the other: so that ye cannot do the things that ye would.

But if ye be led of the Spirit, ye are not under the law. Galatians 5:16-18

So I Turn To The LORD Of Armies Alone For The Victory

Now unto him that is able to keep you from falling, and to present you faultless before the presence of his glory with exceeding joy, To the only wise God our Saviour, be glory and majesty, dominion and power, both now and ever. Amen. Jude 1:24-25

And I Rejoice~!

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6. If you focus more on your fellow Christians church attendance, tithing, version of the Bible, outward appearance rather than getting to know others and accepting them where they’re at in their walk with the Lord.

When I think of legalistic people, the spirit of this point seems to be the key I notice - being more concerned with the other people following your measure of holiness rather than "eating and drinking with the tax collectors and sinners."

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1. If you believe God’s love for you depends on your efforts or what you do.

(All are ESV References)

Eph 2:8-9

For by grace you have been saved through faith. And this is not your own doing; it is the gift of God, not a result of works, so that no one may boast.

John 5:24

Truly, truly, I say to you, whoever hears my word and believes him who sent me has eternal life. He does not come into judgment, but has passed from death to life.

1 John 1:9

If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.

Romans 5:1

Therefore, since we have been justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ.

Romans 8:37-39

No, in all these things we are more than conquerors through him who loved us. For I am sure that neither death nor life, nor angels nor rulers, nor things present nor things to come, nor powers, nor height nor depth, nor anything else in all creation, will be able to separate us from the love of God in Christ Jesus our Lord.

1 John 4:18

There is no fear in love, but perfect love casts out fear. For fear has to do with punishment, and whoever fears has not been perfected in love.

What other passages come to mind to refute this idea #1?

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A few things resonate with me as far as the "legalistic" tag goes, so I'll list them:

6. If you focus more on your fellow Christians church attendance, tithing, version of the Bible, outward appearance rather than getting to know others and accepting them where they’re at in their walk with the Lord.

I agree with what Neb said for this one. She hit the nail on the head. I'll also add that I have seen more Christlike love and acceptance shown at a 12 Step recovery meeting to someone returning after a relapse (they got drunk or high) than in some churches I have visited or attended. They would be judged and condemned in many of those churches. They would be asked to leave in at least one that I remember. How cold is that?

11. If you believe that what people wear, skirt length, swimsuit type, tattoos, piercings, hairstyle, length of hair, etc. is a clear indication of a person’s spiritual maturity and character.

Same as what Neb said for #6. I believe that as we grow in Christ some of those listed in this one will probably change with time. I know my behavior has changed as I have grown in Christ. Everything listed in #11 is behavior and behavior comes from the heart. Only Christ can change a heart, and as He does the behavior will change.

There is a good use for this one though. Show up at a new church in (clean!) blue jeans and a t-shirt on Sunday morning and see how you get treated. You'll know whether #11 is a problem in that church in less than 10 minutes, maybe as long as 20. If they freak out, you have time to go to the next church on your list and not miss the next service. Saves time finding a new church. :)

19. You believe that even associating much less discussing ideas with those different than you is sinful compromise.

This is another one where I've learned things from recovery meetings. They are one of the few places where folks from all walks of life, religions (or no religion), lifestyle, etc. will actually talk to each other about their common problem, usually drug or alcohol addiction. All the screaming, politics, etc. gets left outside in the parking lot during a meeting. Kinda how church is supposed to be, huh?

20. If you believe that the expression of spiritual gifts (provided by the Holy Spirit) is evidence of one’s personal walk with God.

I've long since lost count of the number of times sincere people have looked me in the eye and told me I wasn't saved because I haven't spoken in tounges. :laugh: They completely overlooked the other gifts operating in their own church at the time!

I could go on, but this is long enough. :laugh:

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6. If you focus more on your fellow Christians church attendance, tithing, version of the Bible, outward appearance rather than getting to know others and accepting them where they’re at in their walk with the Lord.

When I think of legalistic people, the spirit of this point seems to be the key I notice - being more concerned with the other people following your measure of holiness rather than "eating and drinking with the tax collectors and sinners."

I agree Nebula. I think it's an attitude and heart issue. :thumbsup:

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A few things resonate with me as far as the "legalistic" tag goes, so I'll list them:

6. If you focus more on your fellow Christians church attendance, tithing, version of the Bible, outward appearance rather than getting to know others and accepting them where they’re at in their walk with the Lord.

I agree with what Neb said for this one. She hit the nail on the head. I'll also add that I have seen more Christlike love and acceptance shown at a 12 Step recovery meeting to someone returning after a relapse (they got drunk or high) than in some churches I have visited or attended. They would be judged and condemned in many of those churches. They would be asked to leave in at least one that I remember. How cold is that?

I read this yesterday… “The real miracle that happens in a spirit filled church is not healing or speaking in tongues or prophesying, it’s people loving each other.”

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On a more personal note:

1. If you believe God’s love for you depends on your efforts or what you do.

2. If you believe God’s love for you depends on how much you have done for Him lately and the love you have shown him recently.

3. If you fall short because in your mind you need to be a better person, you haven’t prayed enough, or you don’t have enough faith.

4. If you believe God is predisposed to be angry with you because you are a sinner and let’s face it He knows you can do better.

7. If you have grown accustomed to living by the expectations of others, especially those in positions of authority or those in your local church, as this is essential to your life.

8. If your sense of worth is based on the opinions of a Christian leader, your reputation, your church membership, or a group’s opinion of you rather than a personal relationship with Jesus Christ.

I still struggle with some variation of these.

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I read this yesterday… “The real miracle that happens in a spirit filled church is not healing or speaking in tongues or prophesying, it’s people loving each other.”

Amen!

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Wow! I feel like God really led me to this today, I really want to thank you for putting this up!

Yesterday I found out that a friend of mine had passed away (possible suicide), I was very heartbroken because I don't think she was saved. I have shared the Gospel with her before but she said she had tried out Jesus before and it didn't work for her. Anyways, after her death I have been questioning my own salvation. I wanted to start a thread about it, but I felt ashamed a bit. Yesterday I told my fiance that I realized that even though I had been born again I wasn't saved. I told him I knew this because God desires obedience, and I don't feel like I have the fruit of the spirit as much as a TRUE christian should....mostly because I get stressed out with my kids and have unholy wrath....and a food idol. He kept trying to assure me that I was saved and quoted scripture. I know WORKS don't get us into heaven alone, but at the same time I know that if someone doesn't have any works (good fruit) they probably aren't saved, that is where I got my conclusion from. And I also think that only a small amount of christians are going to Heaven so I feel like I would be less qualified next to the others.

Some of the points hit home with me, ecspecially the first few about wanting to please God, I think about that alot, I really really want to please God. And also, I tend to think that if a woman is dressed like a hooker she probably isn't saved, or if they are cussing, doing drugs, obese, or drinking all the time then they probably aren't saved. Tattoos don't bother me because I was so close to getting a christian tattoo when I first became born again. Yah, I have a tendancy to compare myself to other people, and to boast as well, I have been trying to work on these.

I feel like God has an abundance of Grace, but that if I keep messing up all the time that maybe I'm not saved to begin with. I wish there was an obvious way to just know if you are saved.

Shalom

Natalie

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11. If you believe that what people wear, skirt length, swimsuit type, tattoos, piercings, hairstyle, length of hair, etc. is a clear indication of a person’s spiritual maturity and character.

Same as what Neb said for #6. I believe that as we grow in Christ some of those listed in this one will probably change with time. I know my behavior has changed as I have grown in Christ. Everything listed in #11 is behavior and behavior comes from the heart. Only Christ can change a heart, and as He does the behavior will change.

I agree that our behavior changes as we grow closer to Christ. However, I don’t believe that any of these reflect the quality of someone’s relationship with Christ. I agree it’s all about the heart change. :thumbsup:

There is a good use for this one though. Show up at a new church in (clean!) blue jeans and a t-shirt on Sunday morning and see how you get treated. You'll know whether #11 is a problem in that church in less than 10 minutes, maybe as long as 20. If they freak out, you have time to go to the next church on your list and not miss the next service. Saves time finding a new church.

This is a great experiment. I’ve always wanted to do this. A speaker came to preach at our church once. He dressed himself like a homeless person and put on special odor deodorant so he smelled like cow manure. A few people did approach him and even offered to help him out with food/a shower. He put on the act for a while before the service (during Sunday School) and you could tell certain people were very uncomfortable. Eventually he cleaned up and came to the service to preach. It was a challenging message of how you view the lost and those who are in difficult situations financially.

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2. If you believe God’s love for you depends on how much you have done for Him lately and the love you have shown him recently.

3. If you fall short because in your mind you need to be a better person, you haven’t prayed enough, or you don’t have enough faith.

4. If you believe God is predisposed to be angry with you because you are a sinner and let’s face it He knows you can do better.

14. When you miss a service or program at your church, even with a legitimate reason, you feel guilty.

Many times I have been guilty of these. :12:

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19. You believe that even associating much less discussing ideas with those different than you is sinful compromise.

This is another one where I've learned things from recovery meetings. They are one of the few places where folks from all walks of life, religions (or no religion), lifestyle, etc. will actually talk to each other about their common problem, usually drug or alcohol addiction. All the screaming, politics, etc. gets left outside in the parking lot during a meeting. Kinda how church is supposed to be, huh?

Yes, a bit sobering no pun intended. The church should be the place people come to find the truth, be accepted, and be loved. Sometimes I think we expect lost people to “act saved” and behave a certain way (even though they may have had little or no instruction of “proper behavior” in church settings) when they enter the church doors.

See:

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20. If you believe that the expression of spiritual gifts (provided by the Holy Spirit) is evidence of one’s personal walk with God.

I've long since lost count of the number of times sincere people have looked me in the eye and told me I wasn't saved because I haven't spoken in tounges. They completely overlooked the other gifts operating in their own church at the time!

I could go on, but this is long enough.

Funny thing is about #20 is that they are gifts OF THE HOLY SPIRIT. Meaning if anyone has any of these they’re for edification of the Church (universal) and not something people earned or makes people special.

The gifts are for God’s glory to supplement the Church’s (universal) needs. Sometime people get a little too proud of whatever God has gifted them freely. My opinion of course. :thumbsup:

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On a more personal note:

1. If you believe God’s love for you depends on your efforts or what you do.

2. If you believe God’s love for you depends on how much you have done for Him lately and the love you have shown him recently.

3. If you fall short because in your mind you need to be a better person, you haven’t prayed enough, or you don’t have enough faith.

4. If you believe God is predisposed to be angry with you because you are a sinner and let’s face it He knows you can do better.

7. If you have grown accustomed to living by the expectations of others, especially those in positions of authority or those in your local church, as this is essential to your life.

8. If your sense of worth is based on the opinions of a Christian leader, your reputation, your church membership, or a group’s opinion of you rather than a personal relationship with Jesus Christ.

I still struggle with some variation of these.

Thanks for sharing and being vulnerable Neb. :thumbsup:

I guess to some extent all of us struggle with these (or a combination of the things listed in the OP) in some form or fashion.

God is good to heal our hearts and minds. :)

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A few things resonate with me as far as the "legalistic" tag goes, so I'll list them:

6. If you focus more on your fellow Christians church attendance, tithing, version of the Bible, outward appearance rather than getting to know others and accepting them where they’re at in their walk with the Lord.

I agree with what Neb said for this one. She hit the nail on the head. I'll also add that I have seen more Christlike love and acceptance shown at a 12 Step recovery meeting to someone returning after a relapse (they got drunk or high) than in some churches I have visited or attended. They would be judged and condemned in many of those churches. They would be asked to leave in at least one that I remember. How cold is that?

I read this yesterday… “The real miracle that happens in a spirit filled church is not healing or speaking in tongues or prophesying, it’s people loving each other.”

I can certainly agree with that. :thumbsup:

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20. If you believe that the expression of spiritual gifts (provided by the Holy Spirit) is evidence of one’s personal walk with God.

I've long since lost count of the number of times sincere people have looked me in the eye and told me I wasn't saved because I haven't spoken in tounges. They completely overlooked the other gifts operating in their own church at the time!

I could go on, but this is long enough.

Funny thing is about #20 is that they are gifts OF THE HOLY SPIRIT. Meaning if anyone has any of these they’re for edification of the Church (universal) and not something people earned or makes people special.

The gifts are for God’s glory to supplement the Church’s (universal) needs. Sometime people get a little too proud of whatever God has gifted them freely. My opinion of course. :thumbsup:

Yep. :thumbsup: Something else those folks forget: the Holy Spirit determines who gets what spiritual gift, not us.

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 Wow! I feel like God really led me to this today, I really want to thank you for putting this up!

<snip>

Some of the points hit home with me, especially the first few about wanting to please God, I think about that a lot, I really want to please God. And also, I tend to think that if a woman is dressed like a hooker she probably isn't saved, or if they are cussing, doing drugs, obese, or drinking all the time then they probably aren't saved. Tattoos don't bother me because I was so close to getting a Christian tattoo when I first became born again. Yah, I have a tendency to compare myself to other people, and to boast as well, I have been trying to work on these.

I feel like God has an abundance of Grace, but that if I keep messing up all the time that maybe I'm not saved to begin with. I wish there was an obvious way to just know if you are saved.

Shalom

Natalie 


Natalie,

Thanks for sharing from your heart. I haven’t had a time to sit down to properly respond to this. I’ve split your post to a separate thread here for better discussion:

Of our own strength we can’t please God. At least I know I can’t. It’s God’s Holy Spirit inside me that guides me to do things according to God’s will. I think it’s great that you’re trying to not allow pride and boasting to be a habitual tendency. :thumbsup:

Regarding messing up though… On my own I’d probably mess up every time. And if fact I still do. Just because I accept Christ as Lord/Savior doesn’t mean I won’t sin or mess anymore. However, when I do sin I can go confidently to God and ask Him forgiveness. God forgives me because of Jesus Christ. Now this isn’t license to sin but when it does happen I know I’m still saved.

It reminds me of an Audio Adrenaline song “Get Down”:

Lavishly our lives are wasted

Humbleness is left untasted

You can't live your life to please yourself, yeah

That's a tip from my mistakes

Exactly what it doesn't take

To win you've got to come in last place

To live your life you've got to lose it

And all the losers get a crown

CHORUS:

I get down and He lifts me up

I get down and He lifts me up

I get down and He lifts me up

I get down

All I need's another day

Where I can't seem to get away

From the many things that drag me down, yeah

I'm sure you've had a day like me

Where nothing seems to set you free

From the burdens you can't carry all alone

In your weakness He is stronger

In Your darkness He shines through

When you're crying He's your comfort

When your all alone, He's carrying you

CHORUS

This valley is so deep

I can barely see the sun

I cry out for mercy, Lord

You lift me up again

CHOURS

Every time I'm down the Lord ifts me up

Yeah

God bless,

GE

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GE, I did a thread like this sometime ago, to show that nearly everyone is legalistic to one extent or another, even those who attack legalism. I was just in a thread with someone who always attacks legalism, yet showed herself legalistic by trying to turn something the Bible doesn't say is sinful into a sin. We all are legalistic to one degree or another. Before I address the individual things you mentioned, I want to adress the picture of the person in handcuffs, and the comment that goes with it. I don't believe Jesus came to give us freedom to do things. Who needs freedom to do what they want and wear what they want? Sinners do that already. We need freedom from sin. It is the bondage of sin Jesus came to set us free from, not legalism. Jesus said that he didn't come to do away with the law, but to fulfil it.

You May Have Legalism (And Not Even Know It) In Your Life…

galatians-51.png

1. If you believe God’s love for you depends on your efforts or what you do.

I don't believe that.

2. If you believe God’s love for you depends on how much you have done for Him lately and the love you have shown him recently.

I don't believe that.

3. If you fall short because in your mind you need to be a better person, you haven’t prayed enough, or you don’t have enough faith.

I do believe that. We should all strive to do better. That is not the same as saying a person isn't saved because they aren't where they should be. It is just to say most of us can do better.

4. If you believe God is predisposed to be angry with you because you are a sinner and let’s face it He knows you can do better.

I believe he becomes angry with us when we wilfully choose to sin, but not that he is predisposed to be angry simply because of human failures. None of us can live up to God's standard of holiness, but we do anger him when we simply choose to rebel.

5. If you know God’s law but don’t have a personal relationship with Him.

Not the case.

6. If you focus more on your fellow Christians church attendance, tithing, version of the Bible, outward appearance rather than getting to know others and accepting them where they’re at in their walk with the Lord.

Regarding Bible attendace, we are just told not to forsake the assembling of ourselves together, so I don't make judgements based on that. While I believe in tithing, I don't go around trying to figure out who pays tithes? I also recognize there are valid questions over the purpose of tithing, so I don't make judgments on that. My only concern with Bible translations is that those using new translations are going to be led astray by changes or ommissions to the text. I would avoid a church that uses new translations, but I don't assume someone is less saved because of their Bible translation. With regard to outward appearance, it all depends. Some new Christians don't know what the Bible says about our appearance, and I fully get that, but I do look at those who promote things like women in pants, women with short hair, men with long hair, tattoos, and the like, as doing the devil's work in not only setting a bad example, but in leading others into the ditch with them. A person that has been saved for any length of time should know better.

7. If you have grown accustomed to living by the expectations of others, especially those in positions of authority or those in your local church, as this is essential to your life.

I used to, but no more. I lost confidence in church leaders when I saw them go from teaching strict holiness to the phony freedom in Christ message to get more members. I decided to stay in the Bible to get my answers, and away from what others are teaching. That is not to say I have no regard for what others think? If I believe a minister is a real man of God, and he is living right, I do value his opinion. I have a lot of respect for the minister at the church I am attending, and believe that he and his wife are living the Christian life. I don't believe everything the minister believes on every topic, but I respect him enough to seek his opinion. That would not be the case if I saw him living contrary to scripture, or his wife looking like thw world with short hair and pants. I don't necessarily believe everything they say is absolute truth, but I do respect them enough to examine something if they say it is sinful.

8. If your sense of worth is based on the opinions of a Christian leader, your reputation, your church membership, or a group’s opinion of you rather than a personal relationship with Jesus Christ. No

9. If you are more concerned with your reputation than with heart change in your life conforming to Christ.

I am not.

10. If you tell your children not to do something at church or around other Christian families that you allow in your home or elsewhere.

I found this point interesting for one reason. Romans teaches us that we may have the freedom to do something in our personal lives, but if that thing offends others, we are not to do it. Lets suppose that I was ok with drinking a beer after work (I don't by the way), but I knew that would offend others at church. For their sake, I would keep that quiet, and would tell my children not to tell others we allow any alcohol in our home. I can actually be doing something that is ok in the sight of God, but still be sinning in doing so if it makes my brother stumble.

11. If you believe that what people wear, skirt length, swimsuit type, tattoos, piercings, hairstyle, length of hair, etc. is a clear indication of a person’s spiritual maturity and character.

It is a clear indication of their spiritual maturity. Character? That depends on how long they have been saved, and who they have been learning from? Someone may not know any better. You might have a new Christian man with long hair, that doesn't know it is a shame. You might have that same man getting a tattoo because he doesn't know the Bible says not to print marks on your skin. You may have a woman wearing pants who hasn't read Deuteronomy 22:5, or has sat under false teachers that said it doesn't mean they can't wear pants.

12. You look at people’s lives and instinctively judge them rather than see them through God’s eyes – a work in progress for those who Believe and potential children of God for those who do not.

We can't see through God's eyes. We may strive to, and we may believe we do, but that is impossible. That is why it is impossible for us to give righteous judgment on anyone. We don't know their heart. It is like making a judgment on the outcome of a case where we didn't see all the evidence, and thinking we know more than the jury that saw everything. All judgment has been left to Jesus. That is why it is just as wrong to assume someone is righteous as making the assumption they are a sinner. We can't tell the wheat from the tares.

13. You believe you’re standards somehow make you superior to others.

I don't believe that.

14. When you miss a service or program at your church, even with a legitimate reason, you feel guilty.

Sometimes.

15. You’re so loyal to man-made tradition you don’t think any significant change could possibly be from God.

I reject nearly everything I see in this culture as contrary to scripture, so I know my opinions aren't based on man-made tradition. I went back to scripture and read it over and over and over again to discern what things people were saying were true, and what were lies?

16. You believe you’re church/denomination is the only group really focused on teaching God’s Word.

If such a group exists, I haven't found it. I wish I could find a church that had perfect truth.

17. You believe that those who have been divorced are less valuable in the eyes of God and you feel superior to them.

I don't believe that.

18. You believe that how your kids turn out is solely your responsibility and the measurement of your success or lack there-of as a Christian parent.

Once someone is an adult, they make their own choices. All any parent can do is their best to train up their kids in the way they should go. If they have been neglectful, of course they bear some responsibility, but someone can do everything right, to the best of their ability, and still have a rebellious child.

19. You believe that even associating much less discussing ideas with those different than you is sinful compromise.

I don't believe that, but if I see someone who is openly in sin, and I am discussing the Bible with them, I don't give as much weight to what they are saying as someone who is living right. An example would be two differen't women at my church. One has long hair and always wears a dress and one has short hair and wears jeans. I would give far more weight to what the first woman said than the second. Another example might be a man who has long hair and smokes, and another who has short hair and doesn't use tobacco. I would give far more weight to the opinion of the second man than the first.

20. If you believe that the expression of spiritual gifts (provided by the Holy Spirit) is evidence of one’s personal walk with God.

I don't believe that.

Sorry for any confusion over the way I did the response. I tried to put the answers in bold, but apparently forgot to put one of the where it belongs, and everything from that point on was in bold print. You use to be able to go back and fix it, but you can't anymore, so I just put the response below the question.

Edited by GoldenEagle
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2. If you believe God’s love for you depends on how much you have done for Him lately and the love you have shown him recently.

3. If you fall short because in your mind you need to be a better person, you haven’t prayed enough, or you don’t have enough faith.

4. If you believe God is predisposed to be angry with you because you are a sinner and let’s face it He knows you can do better.

14. When you miss a service or program at your church, even with a legitimate reason, you feel guilty.

Many times I have been guilty of these. :12:

You say that like you have done something wrong. What are you guilty of? Just because someone has a thread and says you are legalistic if you behave in a certain way, why do you automatically accept what they said as right? Maybe you are right in your thinking, and they are wrong? Just something to consider. This is something I came to realize a long time ago. Just because someone starts a thread, and says if you don't believe like they do you are wrong, that doesn't mean they are right. That goes for anything I say too. The people that post here, including me, are not God. We don't know everything, and we can be wrong. Scripture tells us to work out our own salvation with fear and trembling. I used to tell people at church never to take anthing I say without looking into it. The only absolute truth is in scripture. As you likely know, to me that is the KJV Bible, but again, you have to make up your own mind about that as well?

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How on earth does one attack legalism? je ne comprends pas (French: Translation - I do not understand)

Edited by GoldenEagle
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How on earth does one attack legalism? je ne comprends pas (French: Translation - I do not understand)

The same way they attack anything else. They speak evil of it. The bigger question is, why does one attack legalism? Jesus taught us that if we want to be great in his Kingdom, we will keep and teach the least commandments. That is legalism. It is strict adherance to God's laws.

Edited by GoldenEagle
<<< To insert the French translation into Sevenseas quote. >>>
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Legalism is branding yourself and trying to brand everyone else with your own fears of rejection because you just cannot accept that there is nothing you can do to be holy other than accept Christ and His sacrifice.

Jesus also taught us the greatest commandment. God is love...not legalism.

I am sorry that you continually imagine that anyone would like to be under the yoke of the law ... again. Of course you are free to pursue that impossible re-creation.

I really wish you had not thought you had to respond to what I wrote. I'm forgiven. You, did not die for me and you cannot forgive me.

Mute point.

In Christianity, legalism is the excessive and improper use of the law (10 commandments, holiness laws, etc). This legalism can take different forms. The first is where a person attempts to keep the Law in order to attain salvation. The second is where a person keeps the law in order to maintain his salvation. The third is when a Christian judges other Christians for not keeping certain codes of conduct that he thinks need to be observed.

Those things are legalism. Like you have stated, no one has to accept your opinion on what it is. I certainly don't.

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How on earth does one attack legalism? je ne comprends pas (French: Translation - I do not understand)

Jesus did.

Edited by GoldenEagle
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How on earth does one attack legalism? je ne comprends pas (French: Translation - I do not understand)

Jesus did.

That is EXACTLY what I meant by my question. Someone posted in this thread that legalism was being attacked. How can you attack legalism? It's not a good

thing to begin with.

Anyway, a can of worms has been opened again and I really do not want to deal with the wiggly things.

Edited by GoldenEagle
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