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do all people that don't believe deserve hell?

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#1
celebratejesus

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I will be honest in saying that I love the God of the bible, but in a couple of areas, I just don't get it.  One is hell for ALL that do not believe in Him.  I know this gets talking about a lot online, but I wanted to start a thread here.  It is important to me to talk about my doubts, just as important to me as sharing my beliefs, and helping others.  This is a hard question, and I get one of two answers usually.  The first, yes, all who do not believe in the Lord Jesus as their Savior, and that He is the one and only Way to the Father.  The second is something like, well, we don't know everything, God doesn't tell us all things since we can't handle it with our pea-brains.

 

I felt discouraged today because I saw where some just could not believe a loving God would send certain folks to hell.  Hitler is an easy one to see in hell, or any other child murderer, etc.  But what about people that just lived their life, surviving, but truly not harming any others, no more than a saved christian hurts someone else.  Saved christians like myself still mess up.

 

Ok, what do you say, and thank you in advance for anything really solid (biblical) even if the bottom line is, yep, you're goin to hell if you don't get saved.

 

God bless, denise, a sister in Christ



#2
ayin jade

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The real question is does anyone deserve heaven? 

 

No. We are all sinners and condemned for our sins. But the Lord, in His love, paid for our sins. Thing is, we must believe in Jesus. Those who do not are rejecting His gift of salvation. 



#3
Butero

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First of all, I believe you are correct in that those who don't believe in Jesus are doomed for eternity in hell.  I also agree with AJ that none of us really deserve to go to heaven.  Your bigger question is whether or not someone deserves to go to hell, simply because they don't believe in Jesus.  Not by our way of measuring things.  We don't send people to prison for life for serious crimes, yet we are talking about people spending eternity in hell.  But we are not measuring things by our way of thinking.  The Bible says God's ways are higher than man's ways, so in God's way of looking at it, everyone deserves to go to hell if they reject the way of escape he provided through is Son Jesus Christ.  I don't claim to fully grasp that, and doubt I ever will because I have limited knowledge, but I believe it to be true. 



#4
bopeep1909

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We all deserve hell.We are all sinners.But Jesus died on the cross and shed his blood for us so we will not go to hell if we are believers. It is John 3:16.It is a choice.God has given everyone a choice to believe in Jesus Christ.If a man was bitten by a snake and he could choose to lay there and die or go to the hospital and get help and probably live is it the hospitals fault if the man chooses to lay there and die?Where do you want to spend your eternity.In heaven or hell.It comes down to that.



#5
other one

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Jesus told us that no one can come to the Father except they go through him......   I do believe that truly is telling us that he and he alone decides who goes to heaven and who doesn't...  I'm not sure it is a good thing to try and make that decision for him....   we don't really have a clear view of everything.



#6
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But what about people that just lived their life, surviving, but truly not harming any others,

 

That person's unbelief itself is harming others, dragging other people into weird things, nothingness, idolatry and then to hell.

 

For example, "But what about a homosexual that just lives their life, surviving, but truly not harming any others."



#7
bopeep1909

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A person can not just say they are a good person and go to heaven.Many unbelievers think that.They will have a big surprise when they die.You have to be a believer of Jesus Christ to go to heaven.



#8
Qnts2

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This has been said already, but I will put my own thoughts on this.

 

Every single person has sinned. All fall short of the glory of God. The wages of sin is death.

 

So, very simply, every single person has sinned, so every single person is condemned to hell because they have sinned. That is where we all start. Not a single person is innocent. When Jesus came to die for sins, every single person had sinned and was already condemned to die, and are essentially living on death row.

 

Had Jesus not come to die for our sins, we would all receive the penalty we deserve, because we have sinned. Every single person would end up in hell because every single person has sinned. So, in essence, no one goes to hell for rejecting Jesus. Had Jesus never come, we would all go to hell because we have sinned, and that is the penalty we rightly deserve.   Jesus came to offer a way out for people already condemned due to sin. If people turn down what Jesus came to offer, their destiny does not change, they were headed for hell because they sinned, and they are still headed for hell because they sinned.    



#9
JustinM

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We all deserve to go to Hell.  Unfortunately, so few of us are wise enough to realize that and asked to forgiven for our sins and be pardoned from it.

 

For example:

 

What if all anyone needed to do to be pardoned from an execution was to confess their crime, seek forgiveness and ask for a pardon?  You can bet every person on death row would do that, in a heart beat.  So, why hasn't everyone done that when it comes to being pardoned from Hell?

 

We are all on death row and that is simply all that is required from us.  Why aren't we asking for help?



#10
OakWood

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Non-believers don't deserve to go to Hell because they don't believe - they go to Hell because they reject Christ. There's a difference between not believing and wilfully rejecting. Many Atheists don't believe but will in the future, but there are also some that don't want to believe. They simply don't want to know, and that is the difference.

As for everybody deserving Hell, it's not true. How do I know? Because God says so. If he believed that we deserve it, he wouldn't have sent his son.



#11
other one

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Non-believers don't deserve to go to Hell because they don't believe - they go to Hell because they reject Christ. There's a difference between not believing and wilfully rejecting. Many Atheists don't believe but will in the future, but there are also some that don't want to believe. They simply don't want to know, and that is the difference.

As for everybody deserving Hell, it's not true. How do I know? Because God says so. If he believed that we deserve it, he wouldn't have sent his son.

 

What about all the people who were born, lived and died never hearing about Jesus?



#12
OakWood

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Non-believers don't deserve to go to Hell because they don't believe - they go to Hell because they reject Christ. There's a difference between not believing and wilfully rejecting. Many Atheists don't believe but will in the future, but there are also some that don't want to believe. They simply don't want to know, and that is the difference.

As for everybody deserving Hell, it's not true. How do I know? Because God says so. If he believed that we deserve it, he wouldn't have sent his son.

 

What about all the people who were born, lived and died never hearing about Jesus?

 

 

Exactly - do they deserve Hell?

Did Jesus, not visit the dead and offer them salvation too? I'm terrible at remembering verses of scripture, so perhaps somebody can help me out here, but I'm sure that Jesus offers salvation to those that died before him, and I'm pretty sure there's somewhere in scripture that says that those who died without Christ will be judged according to their deeds.

Now, as Christians we don't have to be judged of all our deeds because any sins that we repented of have been wiped clean - our faith has saved us, so it will be a lot more difficult for those who died without Christ but not impossible. In the end, no matter what they believed in, or didn't believe in - everybody will be judged by Christ!



#13
celebratejesus

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Thank you everyone, for your replies, but I realize that this isn't exactly what I am struggling with.  So I guess it's ok if I change the topic slightly since I started the thread.  The thing that I am being hit with, maybe even tormented with (so yes, it could be a spiritual attack) is the fact that God condemns (or allows) unbelieving, unrepentant people to literally burn in hell in everlasting agony.  I mean that is what I see in the bible.  Hell is like sitting in a chair with gasoline poured all over you, and someone lights a match. And this isn't just for minutes until you are dead, but for eternity. If I am wrong, please, someone step up to bat here.

 

I have been loving God for a long time, and to be honest, I just didn't "think" about hell, I just thought of all the good things, and how it is going to be in heaven.  But something I read either in John, or maybe in the OT (I go back and forth, little of each, every day) reminded me again, of what those that don't choose Christ have waiting for them in hell.

 

denise



#14
OakWood

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Thank you everyone, for your replies, but I realize that this isn't exactly what I am struggling with.  So I guess it's ok if I change the topic slightly since I started the thread.  The thing that I am being hit with, maybe even tormented with (so yes, it could be a spiritual attack) is the fact that God condemns (or allows) unbelieving, unrepentant people to literally burn in hell in everlasting agony.  I mean that is what I see in the bible.  Hell is like sitting in a chair with gasoline poured all over you, and someone lights a match. And this isn't just for minutes until you are dead, but for eternity. If I am wrong, please, someone step up to bat here.

 

I have been loving God for a long time, and to be honest, I just didn't "think" about hell, I just thought of all the good things, and how it is going to be in heaven.  But something I read either in John, or maybe in the OT (I go back and forth, little of each, every day) reminded me again, of what those that don't choose Christ have waiting for them in hell.

 

denise

 

Well firstly, it mentions everlasting torment or so I remember (tormented day and night for ever and ever), I don't remember reading anywhere where it mentions 'everlasting agony'. There's a big difference, I believe. Torment could be anything. But if it's eternal,it won't be pleasant and you definitely wouldn't want to go there. I would find it pretty tormenting to be stuck in this World forever (as it is now with all the crime, suffering and so on). That wouldn't pleasant, especially if there was no hope of it ever ending.

Agony, on the other hand is too frightening to even contemplate and frankly, I can't see the point!

Some Christians do have morbid imaginations. I remember one Christian claiming that Hell would be like the worst pain ever, then multiplied by a million. As much as I tried, I couldn't find that anywhere in my copy of the Bible!



#15
kwikphilly

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Blessings Sis "D"

     Sis why are you struggling with this so?God is a Just Merciful & Loving God....He spared not His Only Begotten Son,because He loves us?Just imagine from His standpoint...I am condemned to die(me-Kwik),sentenced to be burned alive at the stake but you(you-Denise)step up to the lynch mob & say}"Stop,I want to take Kwiks place-I love her-burn me,not her"......and I walk over & spit in your face while you are burning!I say"nah,thats okay- I don't love you-I don't care that you did that I did not ask you to".......................You see,yes....they will burn in eternal torment

     And the worst part is.....your dad asked you to die for me & you said"yes"& he watched you burn for me & he watched as I spit in your face!!!!!!

                                                                                                                            With love,in Christ-Kwik



#16
celebratejesus

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Thank you everyone, for your replies, but I realize that this isn't exactly what I am struggling with.  So I guess it's ok if I change the topic slightly since I started the thread.  The thing that I am being hit with, maybe even tormented with (so yes, it could be a spiritual attack) is the fact that God condemns (or allows) unbelieving, unrepentant people to literally burn in hell in everlasting agony.  I mean that is what I see in the bible.  Hell is like sitting in a chair with gasoline poured all over you, and someone lights a match. And this isn't just for minutes until you are dead, but for eternity. If I am wrong, please, someone step up to bat here.

 

I have been loving God for a long time, and to be honest, I just didn't "think" about hell, I just thought of all the good things, and how it is going to be in heaven.  But something I read either in John, or maybe in the OT (I go back and forth, little of each, every day) reminded me again, of what those that don't choose Christ have waiting for them in hell.

 

denise

 

Well firstly, it mentions everlasting torment or so I remember (tormented day and night for ever and ever), I don't remember reading anywhere where it mentions 'everlasting agony'. There's a big difference, I believe. Torment could be anything. But if it's eternal,it won't be pleasant and you definitely wouldn't want to go there. I would find it pretty tormenting to be stuck in this World forever (as it is now with all the crime, suffering and so on). That wouldn't pleasant, especially if there was no hope of it ever ending.

Agony, on the other hand is too frightening to even contemplate and frankly, I can't see the point!

Some Christians do have morbid imaginations. I remember one Christian claiming that Hell would be like the worst pain ever, then multiplied by a million. As much as I tried, I couldn't find that anywhere in my copy of the Bible!

 

LOL, I'm sorry Willow but that was great!  Like, what's the point!  I can't see it either, and no, I don't see that in the bible.  I didn't even know if agony was in there, that was just my word for how I am thinking about hell.  I mean, it shouldn't be a picnic, that's for sure. I see, and believe, it can't get worse then hell, fire or no fire. Worse than anything anyone has suffered on Earth. That is why I was wrestling with the idea of people that just never really "get" it about God, but even their act of rejecting Him isn't what separates them for eternity, it is that Jesus is the only way to God.  There had to be (or has to be) a reconciliation, and there has to be Jesus Who is the Way to being able to reconcile with God.  

 

I just read a comment on it that reminded me the bible says "where the worm never dies" something like that.  And also, another word for hell is Gihanna??  Which is a word they used for a garbage dump.  Let me get some verses here:

 

Matthew 25:41

41 “Then He will also say to those on the left hand, ‘Depart from Me, you cursed, into the everlasting fire prepared for the devil and his angels: 42 for I was hungry and you gave Me no food; I was thirsty and you gave Me no drink; 43 I was a stranger and you did not take Me in, naked and you did not clothe Me, sick and in prison and you did not visit Me.’

 

Matthew 10:28

28 And do not fear those who kill the body but cannot kill the soul. But rather fear Him who is able to destroy both soul and body in hell.

 

2 Thes. 1:9

These shall be punished with everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord and from the glory of His power,

 

(this one directly above lets us know a bit more about hell, God won't be there, and that would be hell, a place without God)

 

Mark 9:48

48 where

‘Their worm does not die
And the fire is not quenched.’[a]

 

(wanted to add the one about the worm)

 

God bless all, and thanks again for working with me on this, denise, ysic

 



#17
celebratejesus

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Blessings Sis "D"

     Sis why are you struggling with this so?God is a Just Merciful & Loving God....He spared not His Only Begotten Son,because He loves us?Just imagine from His standpoint...I am condemned to die(me-Kwik),sentenced to be burned alive at the stake but you(you-Denise)step up to the lynch mob & say}"Stop,I want to take Kwiks place-I love her-burn me,not her"......and I walk over & spit in your face while you are burning!I say"nah,thats okay- I don't love you-I don't care that you did that I did not ask you to".......................You see,yes....they will burn in eternal torment

     And the worst part is.....your dad asked you to die for me & you said"yes"& he watched you burn for me & he watched as I spit in your face!!!!!!

                                                                                                                            With love,in Christ-Kwik

Why am I struggling, well, it's because of those that are not saved, like my family, like my mother that died 20 years ago.  I know I am not to put anyone, not even children or a husband (which I have neither).  It is hard to believe others I know will go to hell because they reject Christ, but I know what the bible says about that, they will unless they come to Jesus. I am struggling because I want to know the Truth, as much as I can.  And I read things in the bible that I question, so I seek help.

 

God bless, denise, a sister in Christ



#18
OakWood

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Thank you everyone, for your replies, but I realize that this isn't exactly what I am struggling with.  So I guess it's ok if I change the topic slightly since I started the thread.  The thing that I am being hit with, maybe even tormented with (so yes, it could be a spiritual attack) is the fact that God condemns (or allows) unbelieving, unrepentant people to literally burn in hell in everlasting agony.  I mean that is what I see in the bible.  Hell is like sitting in a chair with gasoline poured all over you, and someone lights a match. And this isn't just for minutes until you are dead, but for eternity. If I am wrong, please, someone step up to bat here.

 

I have been loving God for a long time, and to be honest, I just didn't "think" about hell, I just thought of all the good things, and how it is going to be in heaven.  But something I read either in John, or maybe in the OT (I go back and forth, little of each, every day) reminded me again, of what those that don't choose Christ have waiting for them in hell.

 

denise

 

Well firstly, it mentions everlasting torment or so I remember (tormented day and night for ever and ever), I don't remember reading anywhere where it mentions 'everlasting agony'. There's a big difference, I believe. Torment could be anything. But if it's eternal,it won't be pleasant and you definitely wouldn't want to go there. I would find it pretty tormenting to be stuck in this World forever (as it is now with all the crime, suffering and so on). That wouldn't pleasant, especially if there was no hope of it ever ending.

Agony, on the other hand is too frightening to even contemplate and frankly, I can't see the point!

Some Christians do have morbid imaginations. I remember one Christian claiming that Hell would be like the worst pain ever, then multiplied by a million. As much as I tried, I couldn't find that anywhere in my copy of the Bible!

 

LOL, I'm sorry Willow but that was great!  Like, what's the point!  I can't see it either, and no, I don't see that in the bible.  I didn't even know if agony was in there, that was just my word for how I am thinking about hell.  I mean, it shouldn't be a picnic, that's for sure. I see, and believe, it can't get worse then hell, fire or no fire. Worse than anything anyone has suffered on Earth. That is why I was wrestling with the idea of people that just never really "get" it about God, but even their act of rejecting Him isn't what separates them for eternity, it is that Jesus is the only way to God.  There had to be (or has to be) a reconciliation, and there has to be Jesus Who is the Way to being able to reconcile with God.  

 

I just read a comment on it that reminded me the bible says "where the worm never dies" something like that.  And also, another word for hell is Gihanna??  Which is a word they used for a garbage dump.  Let me get some verses here:

 

Matthew 25:41

41 “Then He will also say to those on the left hand, ‘Depart from Me, you cursed, into the everlasting fire prepared for the devil and his angels: 42 for I was hungry and you gave Me no food; I was thirsty and you gave Me no drink; 43 I was a stranger and you did not take Me in, naked and you did not clothe Me, sick and in prison and you did not visit Me.’

 

Matthew 10:28

28 And do not fear those who kill the body but cannot kill the soul. But rather fear Him who is able to destroy both soul and body in hell.

 

2 Thes. 1:9

These shall be punished with everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord and from the glory of His power,

 

(this one directly above lets us know a bit more about hell, God won't be there, and that would be hell, a place without God)

 

Mark 9:48

48 where

‘Their worm does not die
And the fire is not quenched.’[a]

 

(wanted to add the one about the worm)

 

God bless all, and thanks again for working with me on this, denise, ysic

 

 

 

Jesus is indeed the only way to God, and if it sounded as if I meant otherwise, I didn't mean that.

What I meant was that if you haven't heard the word of Jesus then you can't possibly have rejected him, so because Jesus offers the gift of life to everybody, you can't possibly turn the gift down if you weren't aware of the offer.

So ultimately, it is the rejection of the offer that causes damnation.



#19
kwikphilly

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Blessings Sister"D"

      Ahhh,I understand completely..........I used to struggle with that also but I have received peace & I pray you do also

                                                                                                                     With love,in Christ-Kwik



#20
OakWood

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Blessings Sis "D"

     Sis why are you struggling with this so?God is a Just Merciful & Loving God....He spared not His Only Begotten Son,because He loves us?Just imagine from His standpoint...I am condemned to die(me-Kwik),sentenced to be burned alive at the stake but you(you-Denise)step up to the lynch mob & say}"Stop,I want to take Kwiks place-I love her-burn me,not her"......and I walk over & spit in your face while you are burning!I say"nah,thats okay- I don't love you-I don't care that you did that I did not ask you to".......................You see,yes....they will burn in eternal torment

     And the worst part is.....your dad asked you to die for me & you said"yes"& he watched you burn for me & he watched as I spit in your face!!!!!!

                                                                                                                            With love,in Christ-Kwik

Why am I struggling, well, it's because of those that are not saved, like my family, like my mother that died 20 years ago.  I know I am not to put anyone, not even children or a husband (which I have neither).  It is hard to believe others I know will go to hell because they reject Christ, but I know what the bible says about that, they will unless they come to Jesus. I am struggling because I want to know the Truth, as much as I can.  And I read things in the bible that I question, so I seek help.

 

God bless, denise, a sister in Christ

 

 

I look at it like this. It's kind of like simple economics.

Imagine if you commit a petty crime and a magistrate fines you twenty dollars, then you commit another crime and are fined another twenty dollars, then another crime you are fined thirty dollars.

You now owe seventy dollars and cannot pay for your crimes (sins) until every last cent is paid.

However, the court may decided to write your debts off, but even if it does, any economist will tell you that there is no such thing as a write off, somebody has to pay for it.

Jesus comes along with his infinitely large checkbook and pays off the seventy dollars for you. You are now debt free.

 

Those that died without Jesus have nobody to write off their debts so they cannot receive salvation unless they pay back every last penny. They are to be judged on every deed they have done, good or bad. I can't know for certain but I would imagine that good deeds may well balance out good ones, because they act as credits.

However, just paying back every penny is not enough, you have to accept God as well. God already knows in a person's heart whether he is 'of him' or not and whether he will accept him..

Then there are those who have rejected God completely, they have chosen Satan over him (you are not of me, you are of him) and they cannot pay back their debts. Their deeds don't count, good or otherwise.

God knows his flock and he will collect every single one of them, including the lost sheep. There are some sheep however, that don't belong to his flock. The sheep that don't belong to his flock do not have their names written into the book of life.






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