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Why would God have ordained stoning and burning people as a punishment


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After Adam every human dies once anyway. A natural death has not much advantage over an unnatural one. Moreover, God's priority is to save souls. Unlike humans who count bodies, God counts souls. He counts overall how many souls will be saved along the timeline of humanity.

 

 

If this is true then wouldn't killing all babies be the natural way to ensure the most souls are saved?   

Edited by Bonky
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If this is true then wouldn't killing all babies be the natural way to ensure the most souls are saved?  

 

~

 

I

 

But now he is dead, wherefore should I fast? can I bring him back again? I shall go to him, but he shall not return to me. 2 Samuel 12:23

 

Think That Could Be a Godless (Atheist) Way Of Thinking

 

Deliver me, O my God, out of the hand of the wicked, out of the hand of the unrighteous and cruel man. Psalms 71:4

 

Mengele routinely conducted experiments on humans, the most famous of which were conducted on twins selected on the unloading platforms of Auschwitz. At the end of the experiments, Mengele simply injected chloroform directly into the hearts of many of these twins. After the war, Josef Mengele practiced medicine in Buenos Aires in the 1950's. He "had a reputation as a specialist in abortions," which were illegal at the time. Mengele was arrested after he killed a girl in his abortion clinic, but an Argentine judge released him. Mengele was never extradited and presumably died in Chile in 1979.

 

But Mengele wasn't the only one. Vilis Kruze was a former SS officer who after the war worked as an abortionist for Kaiser Permenente in Ohio and Hawaii. It seems you can take the doctor out of the killing camp, but you can't take the killing camp out of the doctor. http://www.ldi.org/deathcamps/Holocaust1.cfm#TheTop

 

That Underpins The Current American

 

Moreover thou hast taken thy sons and thy daughters, whom thou hast borne unto me, and these hast thou sacrificed unto them to be devoured. Is this of thy whoredoms a small matter, That thou hast slain my children, and delivered them to cause them to pass through the fire for them? Ezekiel 16:20-21

 

"Several years ago, when 17,000 aborted babies were found in a dumpster outside a pathology laboratory in Los, Angeles, California, some 12-15,000 were observed to be black." --Erma Clardy Craven (deceased) Social Worker and Civil Rights Leader http://www.blackgenocide.org/black.html

 

Holocaust

 

Rescue those being led away to death; hold back those staggering toward slaughter. If you say, “But we knew nothing about this,” does not he who weighs the heart perceive it? Does not he who guards your life know it? Will he not repay everyone according to what they have done? Proverbs 24:11-12 (NIV)

 

Any person born after January 22, 1973 is a survivor of the American abortion holocaust.  On this date, the Roe vs. Wade decision legalized abortion on demand throughout all 50 states.  Since this infamous decision, over 56 million children have been killed all in the name of “choice”.  If you were born after the legalization of abortion in the U.S., we challenge you to consider yourself a survivor of the abortion holocaust.  One third of your generation has been killed by abortion. http://www.survivors.la/who-are-the-survivors/

 

~

 

Believe

 

For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life. John 3:16

 

And Be Blessed Beloved

 

A new heart also will I give you, and a new spirit will I put within you: and I will take away the stony heart out of your flesh, and I will give you an heart of flesh. Ezekiel 36:26

 

Be Very Blessed

 

As far as the east is from the west, so far hath he removed our transgressions from us. Psalms 103:12

 

Love, Joe

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After Adam every human dies once anyway. A natural death has not much advantage over an unnatural one. Moreover, God's priority is to save souls. Unlike humans who count bodies, God counts souls. He counts overall how many souls will be saved along the timeline of humanity.

 

 

If this is true then wouldn't killing all babies be the natural way to ensure the most souls are saved?   

 

 

Hi Bonky. When I was an unbeliever, I used to think this was a good point to use against pro-lifers who believed in Christianity. However, I now realize a major weakness in this argument which Fresno Joe touches upon later, but never directly explains that I can tell. I do NOT believe those who die in infancy will end up in hell, either, as some would claim (a nightmare scenario in which some Christians would use as a defense against your argument). 

 

Sinful people would have to kill those infants for them to end up in heaven as babies. By saving one set of people, you could be simultaneously damning another set of people, so that purpose would be defeated. God does NOT want people to kill innocent babies and that is esteemed a sin worthy of death in His eyesight.

 

I do not believe a born again Christian would do this, only those who are unsaved. By advocating people to sin, especially in an extreme way like this, they could be hardened in general and less likely to receive the gospel later on after their sin, and they could be more likely to go to hell themselves, in place of those infants who could have lived to adulthood. Also, I believe everyone has a genuine chance to be saved, due to the general revelation of something greater than all this given by God from conception to all men, as per John 1. If men truly want the truth, I strongly believe they will find it and God will give it to them. I believe those who never heard the gospel would have rejected the truth anyway as they never really wanted it.

 

If the infants survived to adulthood, it would still be their responsibility to find the truth and accept it. It would NOT be God's or someone else's fault for them going to hell simply because they were never killed as babies. Again, why should one set be damned for another set? Think about it.

Edited by Seeking1
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God has a purpose for every human life.  If he was just wanting to create souls to be with him in heaven, he could just create us in heaven and skip the whole earthly existence.  It's not up to us to determine how and when a person should die.  More to the point, though, we're not allowed by God to murder.

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If the infants survived to adulthood, it would still be their responsibility to find the truth and accept it. It would NOT be God's or someone else's fault for them going to hell simply because they were never killed as babies. Again, why should one set be damned for another set? Think about it.

Except that many Christians hint that it is God that actually reaches out to the future Christian and gives them the gift of faith. So putting all the blame on the human doesn't seem fair to me. I know it makes people feel better about non believers ending up in hell, but I reject that line of thought.  Then there are the Calvinists, who have such a loving version of God that hand picks his elect.   

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Blessings Bonky,,,,

    I doubt that any Christian "feels better" about a non-believers fate,it is just something we have to accept because they have made their choice,,,,,,,,,,,,,

     I really don't understand your question,,,,,,,,,,or the point of it?It sounds like something a vigilante madman would think of,,,,,,," kill the innocents before they are defiled",,,,,,,,there is no justification for murder,no matter the murderers motive,,,,,,,,

     Maybe I have missed what you are talking about,I certainly am not saying that YOU are insane,I think you know that as we have always had good discussions and you have always been nice to talk with,,,,,,,,,,good to see you again,God Bless you & to God be the Glory!                                                                                  With love-in Christ,Kwik

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If the infants survived to adulthood, it would still be their responsibility to find the truth and accept it. It would NOT be God's or someone else's fault for them going to hell simply because they were never killed as babies. Again, why should one set be damned for another set? Think about it.

Except that many Christians hint that it is God that actually reaches out to the future Christian and gives them the gift of faith. So putting all the blame on the human doesn't seem fair to me. I know it makes people feel better about non believers ending up in hell, but I reject that line of thought.  Then there are the Calvinists, who have such a loving version of God that hand picks his elect.   

 

the earth and everything in it is to be destroyed by fire according to scripture........    you don't have to be here when that happens, it's up to you. 

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I agree with Lek.

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Where is the "stoning and burning" in the discussion?  Seems like it has just become another abortion debate.  This forum has plenty of those already.

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Stoning and burning were not "ordained", but were certainly the penalty for certain sins.  Sins always result in a penalty, and the ultimate penalty is Hell (which is far worse than stoning or burning).  At the same time, God does not desire that anyone should suffer this penalty, therefore He has made full provision for sin and sinners in the Lord Jesus Christ.

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Stoning and burning were not "ordained", but were certainly the penalty for certain sins.  Sins always result in a penalty, and the ultimate penalty is Hell (which is far worse than stoning or burning).  At the same time, God does not desire that anyone should suffer this penalty, therefore He has made full provision for sin and sinners in the Lord Jesus Christ.

I desire that my child doesn't get beaten, therefore I don't beat my child...no matter how angry they make me or how much they disobey.

Going by your logic, I could beat the living daylights out of my child, when someone criticizes me I could just say "they chose to disobey". Who's going to sit there and defend me?

Edited by Bonky
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Blessings Bonky,,,

    I don't understand how what Ezra said can be compared to beating a child & then saying "they chose to disobey",,,,,,,,,,can you explain further,I am confused,,,,,,,,,,,,,actually ,I have been confused from the beginning-lol

                                                                                                    With love-in Christ,Kwik

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Blessings Bonky,,,

    I don't understand how what Ezra said can be compared to beating a child & then saying "they chose to disobey",,,,,,,,,,can you explain further,I am confused,,,,,,,,,,,,,actually ,I have been confused from the beginning-lol

                                                                                                    With love-in Christ,Kwik

 

"God doesn't want people to go to hell" 

 

Yet it's his rule that makes this possible in the first place.   Let's not pretend that God doesn't have some involvement, dare I say, responsibility in this whole thing.   The over all message I get from Christians is..."God didn't send you to hell, you did".    I think my analogy shows how flawed this whole scenario is.   

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Yet it's his rule that makes this possible in the first place....  

Let's not pretend that God doesn't have some involvement, dare I say, responsibility in this whole thing.  

The over all message I get from Christians is..."God didn't send you to hell, you did"....   

I think my analogy shows how flawed this whole scenario is....

 

~

 

Dear One,

 

When the woman saw that the fruit of the tree was good for food and pleasing to the eye, and also desirable for gaining wisdom, she took some and ate it. She also gave some to her husband, who was with her, and he ate it. Genesis 3:6 (NIV)

 

To Start At The Beginning, We Surely Stinketh

 

All of us have become like one who is unclean, and all our righteous acts are like filthy rags; we all shrivel up like a leaf, and like the wind our sins sweep us away. Isaiah 64:6 (NIV)

 

And Then Some Blame The Innocent One

 

Every good and perfect gift is from above, coming down from the Father of the heavenly lights, who does not change like shifting shadows. James 1:17 (NIV)

 

Yet It Is Only By His Grace

 

For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith—and this is not from yourselves, it is the gift of God— not by works, so that no one can boast. Ephesians 2:8-9 (NIV)

 

That Whosoever Will

 

For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life. John 3:16 (NIV)

 

Will

 

for it is God who works in you to will and to act in order to fulfill his good purpose. Philippians 2:13 (NIV)

 

~

 

Believe

 

And everyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved. Acts 2:21 (NIV)

 

And

 

Very rarely will anyone die for a righteous person, though for a good person someone might possibly dare to die. But God demonstrates his own love for us in this: While we were still sinners, Christ died for us. Romans 5:7-8 (NIV)

 

Be Blessed Beloved

 

Though you have not seen him, you love him; and even though you do not see him now, you believe in him and are filled with an inexpressible and glorious joy, for you are receiving the end result of your faith, the salvation of your souls. 1 Peter 1:8-9 (NIV)

 

Love, Joe

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After Adam every human dies once anyway. A natural death has not much advantage over an unnatural one. Moreover, God's priority is to save souls. Unlike humans who count bodies, God counts souls. He counts overall how many souls will be saved along the timeline of humanity.

 

 

If this is true then wouldn't killing all babies be the natural way to ensure the most souls are saved?   

 

 

 

All babies go to heaven... may comfort those who lost babies. But it makes for lousy theology. In Gethsemane Jesus essentially asked the Father if there be any other way (to save people) take this cup from me. And he was met with silence and went to the cross and died... if the death of babies would be another way of salvation, the Jesus did not have to go to the cross... God could have arranged for all who would ever believe to be born at the same time and then blow up the planet.

 

Carried to its logical conclusion... if babies go to heaven then allowing them to live risks eternal hell. Allowing them to live does them no favors. And abortion is not such a bad thing afterall... if all babies go to heaven.

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Except that many Christians hint that it is God that actually reaches out to the future Christian and gives them the gift of faith.

 

I wouldn't say that "God reaches out to the future Christian", I'd say instead, The Lord reaches out to the sinner .. that means all of us.

 

 

So putting all the blame on the human doesn't seem fair to me.

   

Every individual is responsible for their own actions .. I do not agree with the premise .. I mean, don't we even teach our children this? 

 

I know it makes people feel better about non believers ending up in hell

 

 

Not true .. Firstly, no sincere Christian would "feel better" about non believers ending up in hell & if one did feel that way, I'd suggest that person were spiritually immature .. at best.

 

Secondly, scripture does not say that non believers automatically end up in hell .. this is what the 2nd resurrection judgment is for .. to judge all people who ever lived that were not in Christ nor ever heard of Christ (including BC generations) .. this group is judged by their deeds .. not the same as being covered by grace in Christ, but they will be judged fairly nevertheless .. after all, God provided every man with a conscience, it all comes down to how much of that conscience each man either heeded  or each man carelessly seared .. it all comes back to the individual .. sounds fair to me. 

 

 

 but I reject that line of thought.

 

So do the scriptures.

 

 

Then there are the Calvinists, who have such a loving version of God that hand picks his elect.  

 

  

Have no idea what Calvinists teach, however, in the bigger picture, what is it to any man what God so chooses to do with His own? 

 

 

"God doesn't want people to go to hell"

 

Yet it's his rule that makes this possible in the first place.

 

His rule would have us see life not death .. we choose hell all on our own .. , God knows the end result of all things which is why He gives instruction, which is why He provides guidance .. let's not kid ourselves,,  every rotten thing that dogs mankind has come from the rottenness of mankind, not from God .. the blame is ours not His, and yet every naughty child will always scream, "it's not my fault".  

 

 

 

Let's not pretend that God doesn't have some involvement, dare I say, responsibility in this whole thing.

 

Then maybe God should be punished? Maybe He should be spat upon, slapped in the face, punched in the eye, mocked in public, whipped within an inch of His life .. then we can force His battered and in shock body to carry the instrument of His death through the baying crowds every excruciating step of the way to the site of execution, whipping Him some more for daring to fall under the weight of said instrument along the way, tearing the cartilage loose from His nose .. then maybe we could drive nails through His wrists and feet and have Him die the most cruellest way possible by slow asphyxiation on a cross whilst all the while being mocked by the onlooking crowds? 

 

Would that cover your own personal ills that have come upon you in this world? Would that even things up for you? (even though all the ills come upon you are by mankind itself and not God .. Whose innocence made that whole payment He made, in my opinion, one of deep and deserved shame upon all our heads.

 

I'd say the debt is more than paid wouldn't you?

 

 

The over all message I get from Christians is..."God didn't send you to hell, you did".

 

Law says don't kill .. man kills .. man gets caught .. man pays the price .. yep .. it's the laws fault alright.

 

 

I think my analogy shows how flawed this whole scenario is.

 

 

Flaws have been shown, yes .. I would agree with that.

Edited by Serving
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I wouldn't say that "God reaches out to the future Christian", I'd say instead, The Lord reaches out to the sinner .. that means all of us.

I'm not sure what this means.

 

 

So putting all the blame on the human doesn't seem fair to me.

Every individual is responsible for their own actions .. I do not agree with the premise .. I mean, don't we even teach our children this? 

What "action"? Being born a sinner [as the Bible claims] isn't an "action".

 

 

Then there are the Calvinists, who have such a loving version of God that hand picks his elect.

  

Have no idea what Calvinists teach, however, in the bigger picture, what is it to any man what God so chooses to do with His own? 

 

Because this being is described as all loving, merciful...as a father figure. Last time I checked, fathers protected their children from torture not setup a system where they could easily end up tortured for eternity.

 

"God doesn't want people to go to hell"

 

Yet it's his rule that makes this possible in the first place.

 

His rule would have us see life not death .. we choose hell all on our own .. , God knows the end result of all things which is why He gives instruction, which is why He provides guidance .. let's not kid ourselves,,  every rotten thing that dogs mankind has come from the rottenness of mankind, not from God .. the blame is ours not His, and yet every naughty child will always scream, "it's not my fault".  

I never blamed "God" for any of mankinds ills, just the ones imagined by an ultimately ugly religion.

 

 

Let's not pretend that God doesn't have some involvement, dare I say, responsibility in this whole thing.

 

Then maybe God should be punished? Maybe He should be spat upon, slapped in the face, punched in the eye, mocked in public, whipped within an inch of His life .. then we can force His battered and in shock body to carry the instrument of His death through the baying crowds every excruciating step of the way to the site of execution, whipping Him some more for daring to fall under the weight of said instrument along the way, tearing the cartilage loose from His nose .. then maybe we could drive nails through His wrists and feet and have Him die the most cruellest way possible by slow asphyxiation on a cross whilst all the while being mocked by the onlooking crowds? 

 

Would that cover your own personal ills that have come upon you in this world? Would that even things up for you? (even though all the ills come upon you are by mankind itself and not God .. Whose innocence made that whole payment He made, in my opinion, one of deep and deserved shame upon all our heads.

 

I'd say the debt is more than paid wouldn't you?

No you see I'm stating the case that torture is wrong, you and your ilk evidently are ok with it. So I'm not surprised you came up with this twisted scenario.

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Because this being is described....

as all loving, merciful....

as.... father....

 

~

 

My Beloved,

 

For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord. Romans 6:23

 

My Heavenly Father

 

Every good gift and every perfect gift is from above, coming down from the Father of lights with whom there is no variation or shadow due to change. James 1:17 (ESV)

 

~

 

Last time I checked....

fathers protected their children from torture....

not setup a system where they could easily end up tortured for eternity....

 

~

 

Father & Son

 

But God commendeth his love toward us, in that, while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us. John 3:16

 

And The Choices

 

The Father loveth the Son, and hath given all things into his hand. He that believeth on the Son hath everlasting life:

 

and he that believeth not the Son shall not see life; but the wrath of God abideth on him. John 3:35-36

 

The Children Of Adam Make

 

For ye have not received the spirit of bondage again to fear; but ye have received the Spirit of adoption, whereby we cry, Abba, Father. Romans 8:15

 

~

 

No you see I'm stating the case that torture is wrong....

you and your ilk evidently are ok with it....

So I'm not surprised....

 

~

 

Beloved, Watch For It

 

Because sentence against an evil work is not executed speedily, therefore the heart of the sons of men is fully set in them to do evil. Ecclesiastes 8:11

 

Watch For

 

But your iniquities have made a separation between you and your God, and your sins have hidden his face from you so that he does not hear. Isaiah 59:2 (ESV)

 

It

 

For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life. John 3:16

 

~

 

Not Smelling The Stench Of One's Horrific Sins Against His Creator

 

We are all like one who is unclean, all our so-called righteous acts are like a menstrual rag in your sight. We all wither like a leaf; our sins carry us away like the wind. Isaiah 64:6 (NET)

 

And Blinded By That Utterly Hateful Mind Binder

 

If the Good News we preach is hidden behind a veil, it is hidden only from people who are perishing. Satan, who is the god of this world, has blinded the minds of those who don’t believe. They are unable to see the glorious light of the Good News. They don’t understand this message about the glory of Christ, who is the exact likeness of God. 2 Corinthians 4:3-4 (NLT)

 

Dear Brother, Son Of Adam

 

Jesus answered them, “Truly, truly, I say to you, everyone who practices sin is a slave to sin. John 8:34 (ESV)

 

Men Are Caged 

 

So if the Son sets you free, you will be free indeed. John 8:36 (ESV)

 

But....

 

Jesus said unto her, I am the resurrection, and the life: he that believeth in me, though he were dead, yet shall he live: John 11:25

 

Jesus Saves

 

And whosoever liveth and believeth in me shall never die. Believest thou this? John 11:26

 

Love And Prayers, Brother Joe

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After Adam every human dies once anyway. A natural death has not much advantage over an unnatural one. Moreover, God's priority is to save souls. Unlike humans who count bodies, God counts souls. He counts overall how many souls will be saved along the timeline of humanity.

 

 

If this is true then wouldn't killing all babies be the natural way to ensure the most souls are saved?

 

 

All babies go to heaven... may comfort those who lost babies. But it makes for lousy theology. In Gethsemane Jesus essentially asked the Father if there be any other way (to save people) take this cup from me. And he was met with silence and went to the cross and died... if the death of babies would be another way of salvation, the Jesus did not have to go to the cross... God could have arranged for all who would ever believe to be born at the same time and then blow up the planet.

 

Carried to its logical conclusion... if babies go to heaven then allowing them to live risks eternal hell. Allowing them to live does them no favors. And abortion is not such a bad thing afterall... if all babies go to heaven.

If my understanding is correct, there are only two possible ending points, heaven or hell. If babies do not go to heaven, they would instead end up in hell.

Going with the concept that life begins at conception, even babies never born would end up in hell. The local conclusion then is that God allows babies never born, never given the chance to sin or be saved, to suffer eternally. Why would a being that does that be worthy of either praise or worship?

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If my understanding is correct, there are only two possible ending points, heaven or hell. If babies do not go to heaven, they would instead end up in hell.

Going with the concept that life begins at conception, even babies never born would end up in hell. The local conclusion then is that God allows babies never born, never given the chance to sin or be saved, to suffer eternally. Why would a being that does that be worthy of either praise or worship?

 

Actually this is un-Biblical in the sense that David though he sinned with Bathsheba and his child died -- he expected to see his child.

 

2Sa 12:13  David said to Nathan, "I have sinned against the LORD." And Nathan said to David, "The LORD also has put away your sin; you shall not die.

2Sa 12:14  Nevertheless, because by this deed you have utterly scorned the LORD, the child who is born to you shall die."

2Sa 12:15  Then Nathan went to his house. And the LORD afflicted the child that Uriah's wife bore to David, and he became sick.

2Sa 12:16  David therefore sought God on behalf of the child. And David fasted and went in and lay all night on the ground.

2Sa 12:17  And the elders of his house stood beside him, to raise him from the ground, but he would not, nor did he eat food with them.

2Sa 12:18  On the seventh day the child died. And the servants of David were afraid to tell him that the child was dead, for they said, "Behold, while the child was yet alive, we spoke to him, and he did not listen to us. How then can we say to him the child is dead? He may do himself some harm."

2Sa 12:19  But when David saw that his servants were whispering together, David understood that the child was dead. And David said to his servants, "Is the child dead?" They said, "He is dead."

2Sa 12:20  Then David arose from the earth and washed and anointed himself and changed his clothes. And he went into the house of the LORD and worshiped. He then went to his own house. And when he asked, they set food before him, and he ate.

2Sa 12:21  Then his servants said to him, "What is this thing that you have done? You fasted and wept for the child while he was alive; but when the child died, you arose and ate food."

2Sa 12:22  He said, "While the child was still alive, I fasted and wept, for I said, 'Who knows whether the LORD will be gracious to me, that the child may live?'

2Sa 12:23  But now he is dead. Why should I fast? Can I bring him back again? I shall go to him, but he will not return to me."

 

David expected to see his child, when he was going to die.

 

There's a concept called the "age of accountability" whereby the grace of God covers the sins of children who die before they truly understand of their position before the Lord.  The "age of accountability" varies and isnt' based on an "age" but rather a maturity level in which they can be held accountable for their actions.

 

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If my understanding is correct, there are only two possible ending points, heaven or hell. If babies do not go to heaven, they would instead end up in hell.

Going with the concept that life begins at conception, even babies never born would end up in hell. The local conclusion then is that God allows babies never born, never given the chance to sin or be saved, to suffer eternally. Why would a being that does that be worthy of either praise or worship?

Actually this is un-Biblical in the sense that David though he sinned with Bathsheba and his child died -- he expected to see his child.

 

2Sa 12:13  David said to Nathan, "I have sinned against the LORD." And Nathan said to David, "The LORD also has put away your sin; you shall not die.

2Sa 12:14  Nevertheless, because by this deed you have utterly scorned the LORD, the child who is born to you shall die."

2Sa 12:15  Then Nathan went to his house. And the LORD afflicted the child that Uriah's wife bore to David, and he became sick.

2Sa 12:16  David therefore sought God on behalf of the child. And David fasted and went in and lay all night on the ground.

2Sa 12:17  And the elders of his house stood beside him, to raise him from the ground, but he would not, nor did he eat food with them.

2Sa 12:18  On the seventh day the child died. And the servants of David were afraid to tell him that the child was dead, for they said, "Behold, while the child was yet alive, we spoke to him, and he did not listen to us. How then can we say to him the child is dead? He may do himself some harm."

2Sa 12:19  But when David saw that his servants were whispering together, David understood that the child was dead. And David said to his servants, "Is the child dead?" They said, "He is dead."

2Sa 12:20  Then David arose from the earth and washed and anointed himself and changed his clothes. And he went into the house of the LORD and worshiped. He then went to his own house. And when he asked, they set food before him, and he ate.

2Sa 12:21  Then his servants said to him, "What is this thing that you have done? You fasted and wept for the child while he was alive; but when the child died, you arose and ate food."

2Sa 12:22  He said, "While the child was still alive, I fasted and wept, for I said, 'Who knows whether the LORD will be gracious to me, that the child may live?'

2Sa 12:23  But now he is dead. Why should I fast? Can I bring him back again? I shall go to him, but he will not return to me."

 

David expected to see his child, when he was going to die.

 

There's a concept called the "age of accountability" whereby the grace of God covers the sins of children who die before they truly understand of their position before the Lord.  The "age of accountability" varies and isnt' based on an "age" but rather a maturity level in which they can be held accountable for their actions.

JohnD above made the claim that this was poor theology, that idea is what I was responding to.

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Posted · Report post

No idea where JohnD is coming from -- but it's what I see in Scripture.  :)

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His point had some merit, if belief in Jesus is the only way to salvation, then babies have no such belief.

Edited by Uncertain
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Posted · Report post

Then you'll have to explain Scripturally where David was going to -- in order to see his baby -- considering his baby died before even the birth of Jesus.

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Then you'll have to explain Scripturally where David was going to -- in order to see his baby -- considering his baby died before even the birth of Jesus.

Your view also has merit, both can be supported by scriptures and both can be refuted by other scriptures, that is one of the reasons I'm at the point in my life I am. Seemingly every doctrine has this potential based upon interpretation of the passages.

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