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America & the other Super Powers in God`s Word?

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Hi rollinTHUNDER & Montana Marv,

 

You say that the Revived Roman Empire will be the last Global Government. Now what specific scriptures prove that. Note, I don`t mean general scriptures on a final government but specific scriptures showing that it is the revived Roman Empire. Can you do that, so I (& others) can see what you base your view on?

Hi Marilyn,

I thought we already covered this.  Nevertheless, we have three bearing witness to Daniel's fourth and final beast.

Daniel 2:40-45

And the fourth kingdom shall be strong as iron: forasmuch as iron breaketh in pieces and subdueth all things: and as iron that breaketh all these, shall it break in pieces and bruise.

41 And whereas thou sawest the feet and toes, part of potters' clay, and part of iron, the kingdom shall be divided; but there shall be in it of the strength of the iron, forasmuch as thou sawest the iron mixed with miry clay.

42 And as the toes of the feet were part of iron, and part of clay, so the kingdom shall be partly strong, and partly broken.

43 And whereas thou sawest iron mixed with miry clay, they shall mingle themselves with the seed of men: but they shall not cleave one to another, even as iron is not mixed with clay.

 

44 And in the days of these kings shall the God of heaven set up a kingdom, which shall never be destroyed: and the kingdom shall not be left to other people, but it shall break in pieces and consume all these kingdoms, and it shall stand for ever.

45 Forasmuch as thou sawest that the stone was cut out of the mountain without hands, and that it brake in pieces the iron, the brass, the clay, the silver, and the gold; the great God hath made known to the king what shall come to pass hereafter: and the dream is certain, and the interpretation thereof sure.

 

King Neb saw a statue representing all of the empires from Babylon until the stone (Christ) comes to smash at the feet and ten toes, which is the revived Roman Empire and/or a global government that begins in Europe.

Daniel 7:19-27

Then I would know the truth of the fourth beast, which was diverse from all the others, exceeding dreadful, whose teeth were of iron, and his nails of brass; which devoured, brake in pieces, and stamped the residue with his feet;

20 And of the ten horns that were in his head, and of the other which came up, and before whom three fell; even of that horn that had eyes, and a mouth that spake very great things, whose look was more stout than his fellows.

21 I beheld, and the same horn made war with the saints, and prevailed against them;

22 Until the Ancient of days came, and judgment was given to the saints of the most High; and the time came that the saints possessed the kingdom.

23 Thus he said, The fourth beast shall be the fourth kingdom upon earth, which shall be diverse from all kingdoms, and shall devour the whole earth, and shall tread it down, and break it in pieces.

24 And the ten horns out of this kingdom are ten kings that shall arise: and another shall rise after them; and he shall be diverse from the first, and he shall subdue three kings.

25 And he shall speak great words against the most High, and shall wear out the saints of the most High, and think to change times and laws: and they shall be given into his hand until a time and times and the dividing of time. (3 1/2 yrs. or 42 months)

26 But the judgment shall sit, and they shall take away his dominion, to consume and to destroy it unto the end.

27 And the kingdom and dominion, and the greatness of the kingdom under the whole heaven, shall be given to the people of the saints of the most High, whose kingdom is an everlasting kingdom, and all dominions shall serve and obey him. (Emphasis mine)

 

Revelation 13:1-9

And I stood upon the sand of the sea, and saw a beast rise up out of the sea, having seven heads and ten horns, and upon his horns ten crowns, and upon his heads the name of blasphemy.

2 And the beast which I saw was like unto a leopard, and his feet were as the feet of a bear, and his mouth as the mouth of a lion: and the dragon gave him his power, and his seat, and great authority.

3 And I saw one of his heads as it were wounded to death; and his deadly wound was healed: and all the world wondered after the beast.

4 And they worshipped the dragon which gave power unto the beast: and they worshipped the beast, saying, Who is like unto the beast? who is able to make war with him?

5 And there was given unto him a mouth speaking great things and blasphemies; and power was given unto him to continue forty and two months. (3 1/2 yrs./42 months/1260 days)

6 And he opened his mouth in blasphemy against God, to blaspheme his name, and his tabernacle, and them that dwell in heaven.

7 And it was given unto him to make war with the saints, and to overcome them: and power was given him over all kindreds, and tongues, and nations.

8 And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world.

9 If any man have an ear, let him hear. (emphasis mine)

 

Revelation 13:11-17

And I beheld another beast coming up out of the earth; and he had two horns like a lamb, and he spake as a dragon.

12 And he exerciseth all the power of the first beast before him, and causeth the earth and them which dwell therein to worship the first beast, whose deadly wound was healed.

13 And he doeth great wonders, so that he maketh fire come down from heaven on the earth in the sight of men,

14 And deceiveth them that dwell on the earth by the means of those miracles which he had power to do in the sight of the beast; saying to them that dwell on the earth, that they should make an image to the beast, which had the wound by a sword, and did live.

15 And he had power to give life unto the image of the beast, that the image of the beast should both speak, and cause that as many as would not worship the image of the beast should be killed.

16 And he causeth all, both small and great, rich and poor, free and bond, to receive a mark in their right hand, or in their foreheads:

17 And that no man might buy or sell, save he that had the mark, or the name of the beast, or the number of his name.

 

King Neb saw two iron legs and two feet w/ ten toes, Daniel saw a divided kingdom w/ ten horns, and John saw two beasts and ten kings.  All of these kingdoms or empires are one and the same, and will expire with the coming of the King of kings and Lord of lords.

 

 

Cheers

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Hi rollinTHUNDER,

 

Thank you for taking the time to set out what you think is the Historic View. Now I also believe every word of scripture that you wrote, because, as we know it is God`s word. However have you ever looked closely at this Historic View. If we did that we would see that it is based solely on man`s interpretation of God`s symbols. And we know that God Himself explains His symbols in His word otherwise it is open season for everyone`s interpretation & opinions.

 

 

Let`s have a look together -

 

GOD`S SYMBOL - the Head.

GOD`S INTERPRETATION - `You, O King,......are this head ....` (Dan. 2: 37 & 38)

 

 

GOD`S SYMBOL - the chest & arms.

GOD`S INTERPRETATION - `and Darius the Mede received the kingdom...`  (Dan.5: 31)

 

 

GOD`S SYMBOL - the belly & thighs.

GOD`S INTERPRETATION - `and the male goat is the kingdom of Greece.`   (Dan. 8: 21)

 

 

GOD`S SYMBOL - the legs.

GOD`S INTERPRETATION - `& it came to pass in those days that a decree went out from Caesar Augustus....` (Luke 2: 1)

 

 

GOD`S SYMBOL - the feet & toes.

GOD`S INTERPRETATION - `so the Lord of Hosts will come down to fight for Mount Zion........Then the ASSYRIAN shall fall......` (Isa. 31: 4 - 8)

 

    `at the time of the end....the king of the NORTH (ASSYRIA) ...shall plant the tents of his palace between the seas & the glorious holy mountain...` (Dan. 11: 40 - 45)

`Thus He shall deliver us from the ASSYRIAN, when he comes into our land...   & it shall be in that day.....I will execute vengeance in anger & fury...` (Micah 5: 6 - 15)

 

 

God specifically interprets His own symbols. There is NOT one reference to the Revived Roman Empire in God`s interpretation. It has always been man putting his thoughts over God`s.

 

 

We cannot base the teaching in God`s word on our interpretation of His symbols. There needs to be what God says besides the symbol. God uses the symbols to encapsulate what He has written concerning the subject.

 

 

 

I hope that is clear.

 

 

(PS. I did go back & read all that you wrote, but could not see where there was an explanation showing specifically that the Roman Empire would be revived. I only saw symbols interpreted by man. I also realise this historic view has been around for a long time but we really need to examine it with the contemporary view, fairly.)

Edited by Marilyn C
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Hi rollinTHUNDER,

 

Thank you for taking the time to set out the Historic View. Now I also believe every word of scripture that you wrote, because, as we know it is God`s word. However have you ever looked closely at this Historic View. If we did that we would see that it is based solely on man`s interpretation of God`s symbols. And we know that God Himself explains His symbols in His word otherwise it is open season for everyone`s interpretation & opinions.

 

 

Let`s have a look together -

 

GOD`S SYMBOL - the Head.

GOD`S INTERPRETATION - `You, O King,......are this head ....` (Dan. 2: 37 & 38)

 

 

GOD`S SYMBOL - the chest & arms.

GOD`S INTERPRETATION - `and Darius the Mede received the kingdom...`  (Dan.5: 31)

 

 

GOD`S SYMBOL - the belly & thighs.

GOD`S INTERPRETATION - `and the male goat is the kingdom of Greece.`   (Dan. 8: 21)

 

 

GOD`S SYMBOL - the legs.

GOD`S INTERPRETATION - `& it came to pass in those days that a decree went out from Caesar Augustus....` (Luke 2: 1)

 

 

GOD`S SYMBOL - the feet & toes.

GOD`S INTERPRETATION - `so the Lord of Hosts will come down to fight for Mount Zion........Then the ASSYRIAN shall fall......` (Isa. 31: 4 - 8)

 

    `at the time of the end....the king of the NORTH (ASSYRIA) ...shall plant the tents of his palace between the seas & the glorious holy mountain...` (Dan. 11: 40 - 45)

`Thus He shall deliver us from the ASSYRIAN, when he comes into our land...   & it shall be in that day.....I will execute vengeance in anger & fury...` (Micah 5: 6 - 15)

 

 

God specifically interprets His own symbols. There is NOT one reference to the Revived Roman Empire in God`s interpretation. It has always been man putting his thoughts over God`s.

 

 

We cannot base the teaching in God`s word on our interpretation of His symbols. There needs to be what God says besides the symbol. God uses the symbols to encapsulate what He has written concerning the subject.

 

 

 

I hope that is clear.

 

 

(PS. I did go back & read all that you wrote, but could not see where there was an explanation showing specifically that the Roman Empire would be revived. I only saw symbols interpreted by man. I also realise this historic view has been around for a long time but we really need to examine it with the contemporary view, fairly.)

Hi Marilyn,

I understand what you are saying, but I just can not seem to wrap my mind around this. It seems to me, that in order to arrive at such a conclusion, one must add another beast, a fifth one, after the Roman Empire. However, I believe scripture is very clear that the feet and ten toes and/or the divided kingdom with ten horns comes from and is part of Daniel's 4th beast (Rome).

Just as the chest and two arms of silver represented both the Medes and Persians, the two legs of iron represented both the Imperial Roman Empire followed by the Holy Roman Empire. And as we can see below, the ten horns come out of the same kingdom, Daniel's 4th beast.

Daniel 7:19-27

Then I would know the truth of the fourth beast, which was diverse from all the others, exceeding dreadful, whose teeth were of iron, and his nails of brass; which devoured, brake in pieces, and stamped the residue with his feet;

20 And of the ten horns that were in his head, and of the other which came up, and before whom three fell; even of that horn that had eyes, and a mouth that spake very great things, whose look was more stout than his fellows.

21 I beheld, and the same horn made war with the saints, and prevailed against them;

22 Until the Ancient of days came, and judgment was given to the saints of the most High; and the time came that the saints possessed the kingdom.

23 Thus he said, The fourth beast shall be the fourth kingdom upon earth, which shall be diverse from all kingdoms, and shall devour the whole earth, and shall tread it down, and break it in pieces.

24 And the ten horns out of this kingdom are ten kings that shall arise: and another shall rise after them; and he shall be diverse from the first, and he shall subdue three kings.

25 And he shall speak great words against the most High, and shall wear out the saints of the most High, and think to change times and laws: and they shall be given into his hand until a time and times and the dividing of time. (3 1/2 yrs. or 42 months) (emphasis mine)

The world has already experienced the legs of iron, but the feet and ten toes will not be seen until after the abomination of desolation and just before Christ returns.

Cheers

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Marilyn,

 

And yet again, I notice some of the moderators have deleted some of my posts here in this thread too. Did you complain?

 

Just because you initiated this thread, does that mean those disagreeing with your suppositions on those Daniel Scriptures they will have their posts deleted too like mine? rollingTHUNDER doesn't agree with you and I on the 5th beast, so will his posts be deleted too?

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Hi Salty,

 

I`ve just got on & read your post. And no I didn`t complain as I`ve been asleep. Must have been how you said something. I often have to go back & read my posts as I get a certain emotion after I`ve read something then after awhile when I`ve asked the Lord to settle me then I can say it with the right heart.

 

Hope you can work through this difficulty.

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Hi rollinTHUNDER,

 

Now we are getting to specifics. This is helpful. I have three points to share with you regarding our topic.

 

1. WORLD RULERS not World History.

 

I hear that because you see the 2 arms you think that is the 2 aspects of the Medes & Persians, & when you see the 2 legs you are reminded of the 2 aspects of Rome when the Empire was split up. However for this explanation to be true it would have to hold for each of the parts of the great Image. Thus the `belly & thighs,` (2 thighs - upper parts of the legs) would have to be 4 thighs, as 4 is what the Greek Empire was divided up into.

 

So this thinking is not consistent & we know that God is. The great Image is a representation of the World Rulers, not their Empires after them. it is an overview as we know of the names of the gentile World Rulers who they were but not the details of the history in between.

 

 

 

2. CONTEMPORARY FACT.

 

We know that for a prophecy to be true it has to come to pass. So what do we see today concerning Europe & Islam? Europe today as we know rollinTHUNDER (& shown in your tapes) has not long before it becomes part of the Islamic Empire. Not by force, or coercion but by the birth rate. Europeans are below the sustainable birth rate for their culture to survive & the Moslems are fast taking over. In fact in just a few short years, well within our lifetime, I think the estimate was 2025 - 10 years. So no Revived Roman Empire. 

 

 

3.DESCRIPTION OF THE FINAL WORLD RULER.

 

`It shall devour the whole earth, tread it down, break it in pieces & crush it.`    (Dan. 7: 7  AMP)

 

When we see what is happening around the world it is horrifying, the torture, mutilations, beheadings, hangings, burnings, chopping to piece of humans, from children, to women & men & old people. And I`m sure you are not blind to all of this. I`ve only seen & read a small amount but the extent is horrifying & continues to get worse. RollinTHUNDER I do not need to ask you who is doing this, for in your heart you know.

 

I believe the difficulty with the Historic View is that it has been spoken about, long enough, loud enough, by as many enough so called experts, that people just believe it even though -

 

- God`s word says different.

-Contemporary statistics show different.

-& horrifying events clearly show different.

 

 

I suggest rollingTHUNDER (& others) take a good look for this is what is already upon the earth & it is increasing daily & coming to our countries for they are in our midst. You have a good brain RT, you listen & are aware (you shared your tapes). So take a good long look at what the Historic view is based on & read again the Contemporary view.

 

 

What is really taking place?????

Edited by Marilyn C
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Marilyn,

 

And yet again, I notice some of the moderators have deleted some of my posts here in this thread too. Did you complain?

 

Just because you initiated this thread, does that mean those disagreeing with your suppositions on those Daniel Scriptures they will have their posts deleted too like mine? rollingTHUNDER doesn't agree with you and I on the 5th beast, so will his posts be deleted too?

 

 

Just a side note as I am not involved with this thread much.    I've been here for about ten years now and most t of posts that I  have seen deleted, they are almost inevitably done so over the attitude of the writer.

If you are missing posts I would recommend you read them carefully before you post them to make sure than are not offensive.  I didn't see the posts that disappeared so I wouldn't know, but if you PM Fez he could either tell you why or find out.

 

I know how frustrating it is for sometimes I spend a long time writing a post to find the thread locked over someone getting personal about things.....    

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Hi rollinTHUNDER,

 

I think it is important to write about what the `fruits,` or consequences of believing either the Historic view or the contemporary view.

 

HISTORIC VIEW.

 

I have noted as I read articles of those with the Historic view that there is always speculation & opinions.

 

Will this bring about.....?

Is this Psalm ......?

Where is America....?

Why isn`t this......? etc, etc.....

 

And then there are the flood of books with so much conjecture & so called mysteries & judgments.

Because the Historic view does not have any specific details of what is happening today people seem to get obsessed with watching everything that is happening & live either in constant fear or a conspiracy hunt or just block it all out, saying we are not meant to know.

 

 

CONTEMPORARY VIEW.

 

While I can appreciate  people`s frustration, I believe that God does want us to know what is happening today. When I share with others, encourage, mentor, & disciple them, they see that what God has written in His word, aligns with what they see happening in the world today. Then we do not have to follow all the every day events, because we know what God has said, & it quite clearly unfolds before our eyes. Thus we get on with encouraging, & mentoring others & helping them in their daily life to learn to trust God. There is no need to speculate or have our opinions as God has set it out clearly & simply for us.

 

 

My prayer is that the Holy Spirit will open our eyes to His truth of Christ & His purposes.

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Hi rollinTHUNDER,

 

Now we are getting to specifics. This is helpful. I have three points to share with you regarding our topic.

 

1. WORLD RULERS not World History.

 

I hear that because you see the 2 arms you think that is the 2 aspects of the Medes & Persians, & when you see the 2 legs you are reminded of the 2 aspects of Rome when the Empire was split up. However for this explanation to be true it would have to hold for each of the parts of the great Image. Thus the `belly & thighs,` (2 thighs - upper parts of the legs) would have to be 4 thighs, as 4 is what the Greek Empire was divided up into.

 

So this thinking is not consistent & we know that God is. The great Image is a representation of the World Rulers, not their Empires after them. it is an overview as we know of the names of the gentile World Rulers who they were but not the details of the history in between.

Hi Marilyn,

I believe there is a significant difference. When Greece was divided into four regions it was no longer the dominant world empire it was under Alexander the Great. Each quad only had a shared piece of the pie, but the two arms and legs were individual powerful empires (Arms: Medes & Persians; Legs: Roman Empire & Holy Roman Empire).

 

 

 

2. CONTEMPORARY FACT.

 

We know that for a prophecy to be true it has to come to pass. So what do we see today concerning Europe & Islam? Europe today as we know rollinTHUNDER (& shown in your tapes) has not long before it becomes part of the Islamic Empire. Not by force, or coercion but by the birth rate. Europeans are below the sustainable birth rate for their culture to survive & the Moslems are fast taking over. In fact in just a few short years, well within our lifetime, I think the estimate was 2025 - 10 years. So no Revived Roman Empire.

I've heard that the Islamic religion was created by the Vatican. And yes, it sure looks like time is quickly running out for a few of those European nations. I'm still watching with interest, and with an open mind. I think it's too early still for me to draw any conclusions about Islam, so I'll continue to watch for now. I am very aware that they dream of a caliphate, but I also see the possibility that the elite may be using them to manipulate the power structure in the world. Time will certainly tell.

 

 

3.DESCRIPTION OF THE FINAL WORLD RULER.

 

`It shall devour the whole earth, tread it down, break it in pieces & crush it.`    (Dan. 7: 7  AMP)

 

When we see what is happening around the world it is horrifying, the torture, mutilations, beheadings, hangings, burnings, chopping to piece of humans, from children, to women & men & old people. And I`m sure you are not blind to all of this. I`ve only seen & read a small amount but the extent is horrifying & continues to get worse. RollinTHUNDER I do not need to ask you who is doing this, for in your heart you know.

 

I believe the difficulty with the Historic View is that it has been spoken about, long enough, loud enough, by as many enough so called experts, that people just believe it even though -

 

- God`s word says different.

-Contemporary statistics show different.

-& horrifying events clearly show different.

 

 

I suggest rollingTHUNDER (& others) take a good look for this is what is already upon the earth & it is increasing daily & coming to our countries for they are in our midst. You have a good brain RT, you listen & are aware (you shared your tapes). So take a good long look at what the Historic view is based on & read again the Contemporary view.

I don't yet see the ten horns, so the jury is still out on them, so to speak. You have not yet convinced me of a fifth beast. When I post scriptures to prove my point, you ignore them and import other prophecies that don't seem to have anything at all to do with these ten horns. Daniel 7:19-24 makes it very clear to me that these ten horns will come from Daniel's fourth beast (Rome). Do you think Islam will conquer the EU or will they join forces???

 

 

What is really taking place?????

I was hoping to hear your thoughts about these things.

Cheers

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Hi rollinTHUNDER,

 

You are very good to chat with as you work through things also & don`t just give the big `dump` of info. And I just came on here to give my summary & I see you said `I was hoping to hear your thoughts about these things.` We certainly will journey this all together in the next few years.

 

I`m sorry that you think I am ignoring your scriptures, but it`s just as I explained. I believe those scriptures also as they are God`s word but man has put his interpretation upon those symbols & nowhere in scripture does it say that Rome is the last Gentile Ruler. That is what I was asking for, other                          scriptures  to explain about Rome, to back up the historic view of symbols.  

 

Now my summary of the Contemporary View.

 

1. Political - British Com. & USA - mouthpiece of World System.

2. Economic - European Union - Economic philosophy of World System.

 

 

Russia - preparing for War. (against Israel)....................................................................................WW3

 

Islam - on the rise...................................................................................................................................................treads down the others.

 

 

 

 

That is just a bare outline but there is much detail within each segment as you would know RT.

 

Blessings, Marilyn.

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Daniel 2:40 - Finally, there will be a fourth kingdom, strong as iron......

 

The final kingdom is Rome (old Rome, then new Rome).  There are no others according to Scripture.  Now who is allied with Rome, or a better term is in subjection to Rome.  Rome is the final world power.  No contemporary view matters, what is thought to be contemporary now, may be gone tomorrow.  We must stick with Scripture.

 

In Christ

Montana Marv

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http://www.scribd.com/doc/26566406/The-3-City-States

 

 

this is a bit too long to post here in it's entirety, plus the pictures are important.

 

If you want to find Rome today, I believe you will find it in this article.

It is important to read the whole thing for it all ties together to form a global Rome.....   and it's really been here complete for a hundred and forty years

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http://www.scribd.com/doc/26566406/The-3-City-States

 

 

this is a bit too long to post here in it's entirety, plus the pictures are important.

 

If you want to find Rome today, I believe you will find it in this article.

It is important to read the whole thing for it all ties together to form a global Rome.....   and it's really been here complete for a hundred and forty years

Thanks other one,

Just as I suspected, that Rome had expanded westward. I've noticed that the UK, EU & US were intimate bedfellows but could never figure out the connection. We just sent billions to bail out Europe, undoubtedly so the elite can keep their evil empire afloat. This is very interesting and makes a lot of sense.

Cheers

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Hi Montana Marv,

 

So you say `there are no others according to scripture.` to back up the symbol, that Rome is the `divided kingdom.` God always interprets His symbols otherwise it is any one`s opinion.

 

`And the fourth kingdom shall be as strong as iron........

whereas the feet & toes....the kingdom shall be divided;`   (Dan. 2: 2: 40 & 41)

 

Two different kingdoms there described. One strong & one divided.

 

We will all just have to wait & see, ay.

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Hi other one,

 

Just read the link. Very interesting & continues to show that `those who are great exercise authority over the rulers of the Gentiles,` as Jesus said.

 

Scripture has it all as we know.

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What really is bothering me now as much as anything else is how they are letting Islam infiltrate our lands....   I'm thinking they are going to let us have at each other until there is a lot less of us to have to deal with..

 

 

and the way the devil is working it, we have no choice unless we want to submit to Allah...

 

it certainly is an interesting time to live.

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Hi other one,

 

A lot of truth in what you said. However we know that God is above all these powers & He will `herd the heathen folk` finally into the valley of Josaphat. (Joel 3: 2 Knox)

 

 

Zechariah gives a good picture of how God is `herding` the people. Four great spirits of heaven are sent to gather the peoples for judgment from the four corners of the earth. (Zech. 6: 1 - 8)

 

`These are the 4 spirits of heaven, who go out from their station before the Lord of all the earth.`  (Zech. 6: 5)

 

 

Also in Acts we see that God is in charge of mankind, & the boundaries of their power blocs.

 

`God...made from one, every nation of mankind .......determined their appointed times, & the boundaries of their habitation.` (Acts 17: 26)

 

 

 

How wonderful that we know our precious Lord & Saviour.

Edited by Marilyn C
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that's true, however from what I read it may well be that the beast will kill most all of us before all that happens....   not that it's a really big deal...

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Hi other one,

 

It may seem that way, but the Lord is first bringing the Body of Christ to completion before He addresses the other two groups - Israel & the Nations. We are being brought to the unity of Faith (what we believe concerning Christ`s character & His purposes for the 3 groups). (Eph. 4: 13) When this `calling,` is complete it will then be taken to its eternal setting in the 3rd heaven. (Rev. 3: 21)

 

 

The `beast,` remember is only given authority for 3 & 1/2 years (42 months). (Rev. 13: 5) 

 

 

What we are seeing now is but the lead up to the Global Government. The main players are on stage & it is just time till the main one takes centre stage.

This will only happen after there is a major war so powers can shift. And this major war is started by God Himself (Ez. 38: 4 `I will turn you around....`)

 

 

But first things first & that is the Body of Christ. And this is what we are working through now -

 

`that we should no longer be children tossed to & fro and carried about with every wind of doctrine, by the trickery of men, in the cunning craftiness by which they lie in wait to deceive, BUT SPEAKING THE TRUTH IN LOVE  may grow up in all things into Him who is the -HEAD - CHRIST. `(Eph. 4: 14 & 15)

 

 

So you can see how important it is to speak as we are doing with the right attitude, & to discuss carefully like the Bereans, so that others reading can see us work through & let the Holy Spirit bring out the Truth.

 

 

Together in Christ, Marilyn.

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Hi rollinTHUNDER,

 

You are very good to chat with as you work through things also & don`t just give the big `dump` of info. And I just came on here to give my summary & I see you said `I was hoping to hear your thoughts about these things.` We certainly will journey this all together in the next few years.

 

I`m sorry that you think I am ignoring your scriptures, but it`s just as I explained. I believe those scriptures also as they are God`s word but man has put his interpretation upon those symbols & nowhere in scripture does it say that Rome is the last Gentile Ruler. That is what I was asking for, other                          scriptures  to explain about Rome, to back up the historic view of symbols.  

 

Now my summary of the Contemporary View.

 

1. Political - British Com. & USA - mouthpiece of World System.

2. Economic - European Union - Economic philosophy of World System.

 

 

Russia - preparing for War. (against Israel)....................................................................................WW3

 

Islam - on the rise...................................................................................................................................................treads down the others.

 

 

 

 

That is just a bare outline but there is much detail within each segment as you would know RT.

 

Blessings, Marilyn.

Hi Marilyn,

One could probably go several different directions with such an outline. So I'm waiting to see how you lay it out in your own understanding. In particular, I'm waiting to hear your view of the ten toes, horns and/or kings.

Cheers

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If you compare the world to how things were 2000 years ago, England would be Greece, the U.S. would be Rome, and the Muslims would be the Jews.  Following that, Scandinavian/German regions would be Russia/China.

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Hi Triniton,

 

I can understand what you are saying, however there is a difference -

 

Greece & Rome were the sole World Rulers of their era, while England has only been ruler over a quarter of the earth & the US is only part of other super powers that rule the earth. God tells us who the World Ruler are & who (I believe) are the super powers. There is a big difference.

 

Glad to see you enter the conversation. Marilyn.

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....and the Muslims would be the Jews....

 

~

 

Not

 

The LORD hath appeared of old unto me, saying, Yea, I have loved thee with an everlasting love: therefore with lovingkindness have I drawn thee. Jeremiah 31:3

 

Hardly

 

Thy words were found, and I did eat them; and thy word was unto me the joy and rejoicing of mine heart: for I am called by thy name, O LORD God of hosts. Jeremiah 15:16

 

Beloved

 

Kiss the Son, lest he be angry, and ye perish from the way, when his wrath is kindled but a little.

 

Blessed are all they that put their trust in him. Psalms 2:12

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Hi rollinTHUNDER,

 

Thank you for your interest in my view.-

 

`In particular, I`m waiting to hear your view of the 10 toes, horns /or Kings.`

 

I need to make an important point first. When I was learning to fly small aircraft, I had to do navigational exercises. This involved flying on a set course to other airfields. I was told that you must read the map first & then look at the ground layout. This may seem obvious but it is tempting to look at the ground & see a railway line, for example & then look at the map on you knee & say `yep,` that`s such & such town because it has a railway line going through it. But as we all realise many towns have railway lines going through them. And you could be quite off course & if you read from the ground you can make many towns seem like the one you want.  

 

Thus it is in relation to end-time events. We can look at the world situation & say `yep, there are 10 countries in the EU, or the world is divided into 10 sections or there are 10 regions.....` etc. So no end of speculation, & man`s opinions, if you see what I mean. So the point I am trying to make is, - we need to read the map first - we need to read God`s word first. We need to collect all the information that God has given us & then we will know where we are & not what we surmise by looking at the ground, looking at the world & trying to fit it into God`s map, His word.

 

So let`s look at all the info that God has said on this topic -  ref: (Dan. 2: 41 - 43.      7: 1 - 8,   18 - 20.     8: 23 - 25.     11: 36 - 45    Isa. 10: 24,   31: 8       14: 14     Micah 5: 5     Rev.13: 1 - 6       17: 9 - 13, 18.       18: 10) 

 

The kingdom shall be divided. (partly strong & partly brittle) (two ideologies that do not harmonise. AMP)

Symbolised by 10 toes, 10 horns, meaning 10 kings.

3 horns/kings gave their power to one that rose up in their midst.

7 horns/kings eventually give their power to that person for a short time.

The feet/toes, 4th beast, was dreadful, terrifying & extremely strong.

This kingdom arises after the first three & continues contemporaneously with them.

 

The person who gains power is proud, pompous & boastful.

He is from the North (of the broken up Greek empire). This is Assyria. (the region now divided into Iraq, Syria & Jordan.)

He is called the Assyrian quite a few times in God`s word.

This area is the region now divided into Iraq, Syria & Jordan.

He is also named the King of Babylon in Iraq (which will be the centre of the Global Government).

He is the 7th King over the Global Government.

He is possessed by Satan.

He is very clever at deceiving & conquers by `peaceful` policies.

 

 

Thus we have God`s map/word to refer to. Now who on the ground/in the world does that refer to.

 

Assyria is the northern area of the Middle east & is Islamic.

Islam is in constant conflict with its two ideologies - Sunni & Shi-ite.

They have shown themselves around the world to be quite terrifying, brutal & very strong.

 

Assyria is divided into 3 areas, Iraq, Syria & Jordan. 2 of these areas have come under a group calling it an Islamic State. They have their eyes on Jordan next.

The other part of the Middle East there is divided up into 7 other regions - Saudia Arabia, Kuwait, Qatar, United Arab Emirates, Bahrain, Oman, Yeman. They are called the Gulf Cooperation Council & are working towards greater Union monetary & military.

 

 

Thus to me rollin THUNDER, the 10 kings are these 10 Islamic regions that we see in the world today. I was taught this Contemporary view (of Dan. 7) many, many years ago by world recognised teachers in my denomination that I was brought up in. (Apostolic from Wales, England & Scotland.) At that time the Arabs were but sheiks of the desert. But I have watched the rise of this power with great interest, especially now as they have become very prominent in the world`s eyes not only for terrorism but for the great wealth they have. They also own much land, companies etc around the world They even have our Australian great horse race named for them - the Emirates cup, instead of the Melbourne Cup - the race which stops a nation here - great gamblers are Aussies.

 

I am watching (not in great detail though) the Syrian conflict for over the next few years I do believe these 3 regions will become the power base of the Anti-Christ. So we will see.

 

Hope that explains my thinking for you, rT.

 

Blessings & great chatting with you, Marilyn.

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A bit more rollinTHUNDER,

 

As we can see from God`s word the great Image that King Nebuchadnezzar saw, `stood before,` him. Thus the `feet & toes,` of the great image were standing in Babylon, which is in Iraq. This is part of the old Assyrian Empire. Now people may think that the Assyrians have long gone, but they are a race of people alive today. And do you know who is a famous Assyrian? (or of Assyrian descent/father) It is Andre Agassi, the famous tennis player whom many think is the best player of all time. Very interesting ay. 

 

And so we have the region of old Assyria come back into world view. (Iraq, Syria & Jordan) The ISIS, the Islamic State of Iraq & Syria now control much of those country`s people, land, towns, oil wells etc. Their leader is the most wanted man on earth, with a bounty of $10 million. His name is Abu Bakr al-Baghdadi. The `Time,` magazine says of him that `human guile can usually beat a high-tech solution.` So it will be interesting to see this part of world events unfold, especially in light of what I believe God`s word says on the subject.

Edited by Marilyn C
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