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Why should I become Christian when ...

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#1
Sim_Bahai

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Okay, I am a bit angry, I have to admit. I took a lot of effort to register here, and after the first posting, when I introduced myself, saying I am not Christian but Baha'i, I got that "welcome":

 

I was told I am an "unbeliever" (which I am not!), that my religion sucks, is even evil perhaps (our prophet was called a "false prophet") and that they will pray for my soul that I will see "the truth". Then the moderator put me on "unbeliever" status, so I could no longer reply in that thread.

 

I never had a welcome on any other forum that was remotely that rude.

 

Is that really the image you Christian folks want to give members of different religions of Christianity? "At the fruits you will recognize them", Jesus said. Are that the fruits your kind of Christianity is bearing? I assumed Jesus taught about love, friendship and hospitality first, not about judging and ostracizing people.

 

If you want to convince "unbelievers" to "see the truth", maybe you should really work on your attitude. Because at least me, you will not convince with that fanatic attitude. On the contrary. I once again was confirmed that it was right not to become Christian.

 

Baha'u'llah said that the purpose of religion is peace, unity and harmony, and when a faith instead results in fanaticism, bigotry and hatred, "it would be a truly religious act to renounce such a faith". Think about it, and think about why so many people seem to have a problem with Christians these days.



#2
fire-heart

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Okay, I am a bit angry, I have to admit. I took a lot of effort to register here, and after the first posting, when I introduced myself, saying I am not Christian but Baha'i, I got that "welcome":

 

I was told I am an "unbeliever" (which I am not!), that my religion sucks, is even evil perhaps (our prophet was called a "false prophet") and that they will pray for my soul that I will see "the truth". Then the moderator put me on "unbeliever" status, so I could no longer reply in that thread.

 

I never had a welcome on any other forum that was remotely that rude.

 

Is that really the image you Christian folks want to give members of different religions of Christianity? "At the fruits you will recognize them", Jesus said. Are that the fruits your kind of Christianity is bearing? I assumed Jesus taught about love, friendship and hospitality first, not about judging and ostracizing people.

 

If you want to convince "unbelievers" to "see the truth", maybe you should really work on your attitude. Because at least me, you will not convince with that fanatic attitude. On the contrary. I once again was confirmed that it was right not to become Christian.

 

Baha'u'llah said that the purpose of religion is peace, unity and harmony, and when a faith instead results in fanaticism, bigotry and hatred, "it would be a truly religious act to renounce such a faith". Think about it, and think about why so many people seem to have a problem with Christians these days.

My friend im sorry this upset you in their defence they were trying to help you. I understand that you came here to learn and discuss so thats why i didnt try to convert you to christianity. If you ever need to talk im all ears. but no one was hateful to you, lets calm down and get to know each other okay?:]



#3
Sim_Bahai

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My friend im sorry this upset you in their defence they were trying to help you. I understand that you came here to learn and discuss so thats why i didnt try to convert you to christianity. If you ever need to talk im all ears. but no one was hateful to you, lets calm down and get to know each other okay?:]

 

 

Thank you for your nice words. Yes, perhaps he was trying to help me, but that's not the way such an approach comes across to anybody who isn't Christian already.

 

I will not attempt to convert or proselityze anybody here, but I do want respect for my faith. I will not run around here either blaming all the Christians who refuse to recognize Baha'u'llah as the second coming of the pharisees who crucified Jesus. I totally respect your faith, and will not badmouth it.

 

That is because I believe faith, no matter which one, is nothing that's an objective matter. It's something you can only find individually, as a matter between you and God, and by listening to your heart. I cannot force you to see my faith is true, just like I cannot force anybody to see the beauty in a good poem. Either you see it, or you don't. And attempting to force anybody to see it is not just useless, but even rude -- and certainly nothing that's appropriate for the beauty of that poem.



#4
bopeep1909

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Sim please explain your religion of Baha'i to me.Who is God to you?I am sorry that you have had a negative experience and maybe I can explain in a Christian way why you might have been labeled as an unbeliever.Jesus Christ loves you.



#5
Sim_Bahai

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Sim please explain your religion of Baha'i to me.Who is God to you?I am sorry that you have had a negative experience and maybe I can explain in a Christian way why you might have been labeled as an unbeliever.Jesus Christ loves you.

 

Thank you, bopeep. I will gladly answer all questions you may have about the Baha'i faith, but I am not sure if this is the right forum here and I don't want to come across as attempting to convert anybody.

 

So just a short answer: God is one and only and undivided, the creator of everything, and it's man's highest goal to recognize Him. But we can only see God through His divine messengers, or prophets or manifestations (no matter how you call them), such as for example Abraham, Moses, Jesus and Baha'u'llah. We believe in Jesus Christ, that He was born to virgin Mary and fathered by the Holy Spirit, but we also believe Baha'u'llah was the "helper" announced in John 14 and 16. That's where we differ from Christians.

 

We focus on Baha'u'llah's teachings, because we believe He was the most recent prophet, but we also believe in the other prophets and believe they are essentially the same in their core, and we must not place one of them before the other.

 

I know, this sounds absurd for many Christians perhaps, but that is the same feeling I have towards some Christian teachings. So I think we should live and let live, right? :)



#6
Fez

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Sim please explain your religion of Baha'i to me.Who is God to you?I am sorry that you have had a negative experience and maybe I can explain in a Christian way why you might have been labeled as an unbeliever.Jesus Christ loves you.

 

Thank you, bopeep. I will gladly answer all questions you may have about the Baha'i faith, but I am not sure if this is the right forum here and I don't want to come across as attempting to convert anybody.

 

So just a short answer: God is one and only and undivided, the creator of everything, and it's man's highest goal to recognize Him. But we can only see God through His divine messengers, or prophets or manifestations (no matter how you call them), such as for example Abraham, Moses, Jesus and Baha'u'llah. We believe in Jesus Christ, that He was born to virgin Mary and fathered by the Holy Spirit, but we also believe Baha'u'llah was the "helper" announced in John 14 and 16. That's where we differ from Christians.

 

We focus on Baha'u'llah's teachings, because we believe He was the most recent prophet, but we also believe in the other prophets and believe they are essentially the same in their core, and we must not place one of them before the other.

 

I know, this sounds absurd for many Christians perhaps, but that is the same feeling I have towards some Christian teachings. So I think we should live and let live, right? :)

 

So I think we should live and let live, right?

 

Sorry, no, you are wrong.

 

The bible is the only truth. And the only way to God is through His Son Jesus.

 

I am sorry if that makes you angry, but the truth must be told. You serve a false prophet, and his way leads to death.

 

Please, please, consider your position, your eternity rests on it.



#7
other one

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Sim, might I welcome you to worthy.......  

 

Might I add so you might understand that Worthy is not a discussion forum, it is a Christian Ministry that is privately owned and operated out of Israel.   While parts of the web site have been set aside for those outside the basic Christianity teachings, there are places where outside ideas tend to confuse issues.  Especially to new Christians or very young ones...   I'm not part of the organization, but just a long time residence here.    Please don't take it personally.....   



#8
Sim_Bahai

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Sim, might I welcome you to worthy.......  

 

Might I add so you might understand that Worthy is not a discussion forum, it is a Christian Ministry that is privately owned and operated out of Israel.   While parts of the web site have been set aside for those outside the basic Christianity teachings, there are places where outside ideas tend to confuse issues.  Especially to new Christians or very young ones...   I'm not part of the organization, but just a long time residence here.    Please don't take it personally.....   

 

 

Hello other one,

 

thank you very much for the explanation! I didn't mean to intrude your "Christians only party", if that's what it is here. :) So maybe I am not at the right place here. Nothing wrong about that; it would be wrong too if I intruded a forum about cars with the intention of talking about ... I don't know, trains or computers.

 

Certainly I don't want to confuse young Christians with my ideas, at a place that is supposed to strengthen their faith.

 

I'm just here because Gliding Wings mentioned this forum, and I assumed it is a (mostly Christian) debate forum with focus on Christian topics, but generally open. Also, I wasn't able to read the Terms of Use when registering, because whenever I clicked on it, I was again redirected on the registering page. So I had no idea.

 

So, can you tell me, are there certain sections on this forum where opinions from members of other religions are welcome, or should I better look for another place? If there are such sections, which are they?

 

Best wishes,

Sim



#9
Sim_Bahai

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Sorry, no, you are wrong.

 

The bible is the only truth. And the only way to God is through His Son Jesus.

 

I am sorry if that makes you angry, but the truth must be told. You serve a false prophet, and his way leads to death.

 

Please, please, consider your position, your eternity rests on it.

 

 

Well, I respect your opinion and your faith, and well possible you are right. We will never know for 100%, until we enter the next world and it will be revealed.

 

Well possible I will learn then that you were right. Or you will have to learn I was right.

 

Not sure if this is the right place for that, please tell me if not, but can you give me a reason, a single convincing reason why Christianity is true and all other religions are wrong/false? Because members of all religions simply come to believe for a couple of reasons: Either they believe in their faith because they were taught so from early childhood. Or because people they trust, their parents or special teachers, taught them. But hey, that's not just the case with Christians, but with Jews, Muslims, Hindu and so on too. So just believing because someone told us to cannot convince anybody.

 

So what other reason is there?

 

You will tell me my eternity rests on becoming Christian. Muslims will tell me my eternity rests on becoming Muslim and Christians go to hell. So will members of other religions. It's word against word. So how can I know who is right?


Edited by Sim_Bahai, 22 May 2014 - 02:00 PM.


#10
kwikphilly

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Blessings Sim,

     This is a Christian Ministry,so you do not believe that Jesus is God......therefore you are an unbeliever here.Am I not an unbeliever of the baha'i? This should not provoke your anger,nor should quoting Scripture & people praying for you............I don't think anyones prayers for me could ever offend me no matter what their faith.I really don't understand where you see hatred,anger,bigotry?What would you expect to find from a Christian Ministry?Perhaps you just never read the Bible....Jesus is called"
"the Truth''....the Bible is called :the Word"...Jesus is 'the Word'       

      As we believe & have Faith that Jesus is God ,did anyone take offense by you calling Him merely "a Divine messenger"?You are outraged because someone called your prophet a 'false prophet ' & yet it is okay that you deny our Christ Jesus is God,would that not be blasphemy?And not one person displayed any anger about your statement against GOD...because we understand that you do not know,& by this you feel you are not welcomed?

    Are you really here because you want to learn about our Faith?Because if you do we would love to help in anyway we can.....Perhaps you will reconsider & look at those posts again,try to see through our eyes as we have looked through yours and not been offended by your words because we did not think your words had malicious intent,am I wrong?Peace to you,friend

                                                                                                                            With love-in Christ,Kwik



#11
bopeep1909

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Sim, might I welcome you to worthy.......  

 

Might I add so you might understand that Worthy is not a discussion forum, it is a Christian Ministry that is privately owned and operated out of Israel.   While parts of the web site have been set aside for those outside the basic Christianity teachings, there are places where outside ideas tend to confuse issues.  Especially to new Christians or very young ones...   I'm not part of the organization, but just a long time residence here.    Please don't take it personally.....   

 

 

Hello other one,

 

thank you very much for the explanation! I didn't mean to intrude your "Christians only party", if that's what it is here. :) So maybe I am not at the right place here. Nothing wrong about that; it would be wrong too if I intruded a forum about cars with the intention of talking about ... I don't know, trains or computers.

 

Certainly I don't want to confuse young Christians with my ideas, at a place that is supposed to strengthen their faith.

 

I'm just here because Gliding Wings mentioned this forum, and I assumed it is a (mostly Christian) debate forum with focus on Christian topics, but generally open. Also, I wasn't able to read the Terms of Use when registering, because whenever I clicked on it, I was again redirected on the registering page. So I had no idea.

 

So, can you tell me, are there certain sections on this forum where opinions from members of other religions are welcome, or should I better look for another place? If there are such sections, which are they?

 

Best wishes,

Sim

 

Baha'i thank you for explaining your beliefs.As Christians we are to love our neighbor.God wants us to be kind to everyone and that includes those who do not share our faith.

The word "Christian is used three times in the Holy Bible Acts 11:26;26:28 and 1 Peter  4:16.A true Christian is a person who has put faith and trust in the person and work of Jesus Christ,including His death on the cross as payment for sins and His resurrection on the third day.As Christians we look at John 3:16 For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life. .This promises us that when we die as a Christian we will go to heaven for an eternity to be with Jesus Christ the risen Son of God.We believe that if you have not asked Jesus Christ into your life before you die that you will go to hell for an eternity.It is your choice.God gives everyone a choice to believe in Him or not.But it has to include His Son Jesus Christ.



#12
Sim_Bahai

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Blessings Kwik,

 

sorry, I had no idea this is a Christian ministry. Now I understand better why some people reacted the way they did.

 

However, maybe I can help you to think about your approach when you address unbelievers, when it is your intention to guide them to what you think is the truth:

 

You have to realize you are speaking with people who do not share your beliefs, and you should meet them with respect for their beliefs and not with anything that may be interpreted as condescendence or condemnation. When the first thing you hear, after you've just said "hi" (and not said a single disrespectful word about Christianity), that you will go to hell and you worship a false prophet (which is just as bad as devil worship, right?), that people will pray for your soul and you are generally just a poor, disabled, blind something -- with that attitude, you will not win one single new person for Christianity.

 

Think a moment -- when someone does not know what you know, how can he feel any differently when a Christian addresses him like that? Maybe it is the truth, but it's a difference whether you slap the truth in the face of someone like a wet rug, or if you feed it spoon by spoon, respecting the speed by which he can swallow it.

 

This attitude is, in my opinion, also a major reason why so many people have a bad impression of Christianity these days. They feel Christians are arrogant, intolerant and codescending. And maybe Christians don't mean it that way, but maybe they really are. They should remember only God will decide in the end, and being too sure one is right and all others are wrong is hubris, which may well be punished in the end.

 

In my religion, aggressive proselityzing is forbidden. But we are required to convince people by good example, since deeds mean more than words, and to answer all questions people ask us about our faith. Also, we must meet all members of different religions with respect and friendship. This is why I will certainly not attempt to convert anybody here, and not badmouth any of your beliefs.

 

Best wishes,

Sim

 

Blessings Sim,

     This is a Christian Ministry,so you do not believe that Jesus is God......therefore you are an unbeliever here.Am I not an unbeliever of the baha'i? This should not provoke your anger,nor should quoting Scripture & people praying for you............I don't think anyones prayers for me could ever offend me no matter what their faith.I really don't understand where you see hatred,anger,bigotry?What would you expect to find from a Christian Ministry?Perhaps you just never read the Bible....Jesus is called"
"the Truth''....the Bible is called :the Word"...Jesus is 'the Word'       

      As we believe & have Faith that Jesus is God ,did anyone take offense by you calling Him merely "a Divine messenger"?You are outraged because someone called your prophet a 'false prophet ' & yet it is okay that you deny our Christ Jesus is God,would that not be blasphemy?And not one person displayed any anger about your statement against GOD...because we understand that you do not know,& by this you feel you are not welcomed?

    Are you really here because you want to learn about our Faith?Because if you do we would love to help in anyway we can.....Perhaps you will reconsider & look at those posts again,try to see through our eyes as we have looked through yours and not been offended by your words because we did not think your words had malicious intent,am I wrong?Peace to you,friend

                                                                                                                            With love-in Christ,Kwik


Edited by Sim_Bahai, 22 May 2014 - 02:16 PM.


#13
fire-heart

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Perhaps the reason you ask for to become a Christian is not in words but by observing us Christians. You see A christian above all is love. The bible says what comes from the mouth comes from the heart. so if we are christians you can read our posts and see what lies in our hearts.



#14
Sim_Bahai

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Perhaps the reason you ask for to become a Christian is not in words but by observing us Christians. You see A christian above all is love. The bible says what comes from the mouth comes from the heart. so if we are christians you can read our posts and see what lies in our hearts.

 

That is a good idea! :)

 

But that's one reason why I became Baha'i. I felt Baha'i are generally more true to what their religion teaches than Christians, and they are generally more loving. At least in my experience.



#15
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Shalom,

 I am sorry you think being labeled as a non-believer is wrong, but this being a Christian website...if you are not a Christian, that would in turn make you a non-believer. It's not a negative label. We do this here so we can know where people stand in their spiritual walk and know how better to address them and their needs here. People of other beliefs are indeed welcome here, as long as they abide by the terms of service. We are all open to discussion and even debate if it can be done in a respectful manner.

 

God Bless,

Hip



#16
Sim_Bahai

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Shalom,

 I am sorry you think being labeled as a non-believer is wrong, but this being a Christian website...if you are not a Christian, that would in turn make you a non-believer. It's not a negative label. We do this here so we can know where people stand in their spiritual walk and know how better to address them and their needs here. People of other beliefs are indeed welcome here, as long as they abide by the terms of service. We are all open to discussion and even debate if it can be done in a respectful manner.

 

God Bless,

Hip

 

Shalom Hip,

 

fair enough!

 

Maybe you can tell me which branches/denominations of Christianity are addressed here? Are the opinions advanced here strictly evangelical and literalist, or are, say, Catholics, Orthodox or liberal Protestants included here too?

 

Blessings,

Sim



#17
kwikphilly

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Blessings Sim.....

     I did not see where anyone condemned you to hell,called you poor or disabled?...........and in Christianity we do not try to convince anyone of Gods Truth ,the Holy Spirit does the enlightening nor is it by our effort to convert anyone,,,,if you are called by God then the Holy Spirit will convict your heart.

      I know Gliding Wings very well & I find it hard to imagine him not telling you that Worthy is a Christian Ministry,my friend is never at a loss for words-lol    I certainly did meet you with respect & explained to you that our Lord & Savior died for you as well as for me & loves you as He loves me ,has bore your sin as well as mine & offers you the same thing He offered me................that my friend,is far from condescending

      I am sorry that you are so defensive,it is difficult to receive anything that way,,,,,,,,we speak to unbelievers all day long,Sim....but they are simply "unbelievers"that are seeking what is missing in their life,some of them are not even sure of what they hope to find....I think the difference may be that you seem to stand firm in your "religion"and maybe(just maybe) you are not open to receive?I don't really know ,that is something only you know....but an angry reaction is not the usual & we speak no differently to anyone,,,,,,,we all fall short of the Glory of God & we all were once ,without Christ Jesus.........

      I hope you find whatever it is you are looking for,& as I said ,,,,,,,anything I can do to help,just ask

                                                                                                                                            With love-in Christ,Kwik

 

In my religion, aggressive proselityzing is forbidden. But we are required to convince people by good example, since deeds mean more than words, and to answer all questions people ask us about our faith. Also, we must meet all members of different religions with respect and friendship.

Not saying you are but some come just to promote their religion,,,,,,they come for many reasons,we welcome everyone & give everyone the benefit of the doubt & like Hippie says,,,,as long as they follow the TOS



#18
fire-heart

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Perhaps the reason you ask for to become a Christian is not in words but by observing us Christians. You see A christian above all is love. The bible says what comes from the mouth comes from the heart. so if we are christians you can read our posts and see what lies in our hearts.

 

That is a good idea! :)

 

But that's one reason why I became Baha'i. I felt Baha'i are generally more true to what their religion teaches than Christians, and they are generally more loving. At least in my experience.

 

So this baha, he was a prophet? I remember you saying someone was the second coming of Christ or something?



#19
Hippie333

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As far as what is expressed here/membership wise....the Worthy site is full of people from just about all types of denominations. As far as the ministry members themselves....we adhere to the Statement of Faith ( found here )    http://www.worthynet...tement-of-faith



#20
Sim_Bahai

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Perhaps the reason you ask for to become a Christian is not in words but by observing us Christians. You see A christian above all is love. The bible says what comes from the mouth comes from the heart. so if we are christians you can read our posts and see what lies in our hearts.

 

That is a good idea! :)

 

But that's one reason why I became Baha'i. I felt Baha'i are generally more true to what their religion teaches than Christians, and they are generally more loving. At least in my experience.

 

So this baha, he was a prophet? I remember you saying someone was the second coming of Christ or something?

 

 

Yes, we believe Baha'u'llah, like for example Moses or Jesus, was a prophet or manifestation of God or divine messenger. We believe the "helper" Jesus promised in John 14/16 was indeed not just the Holy Ghost, but a person -- Baha'u'llah.

 

In a manner of speaking, Baha'u'llah was also the second coming of Christ, but also the return of Abraham, Moses and other prophets/divine messengers/manifestations of God, because we believe all of them are essentially the same (their soul and spiritual side is the same, not their physical bodies).

 

The Second Coming was not meant to be taken literally, in our eyes, but was symbolical: The moment Baha'u'llah's revelation rose, the whole world died and everybody who embraced him came to a new life. We Baha'i are those living the new life.

 

Now I don't want to convince you that is the truth, I'm just explaining what I believe. I totally acknowledge that I may be wrong; none of us can ever be 100% sure, right? :) All we can do is doing our best according to our conscience and reason.






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