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Ghosts, demons, and Christians perspective

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#1
the_patriot2014

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An in depth look at ghosts and demons, to whom it may concern.
 
  The past few days, I got into a interesting discussion with a friend of mine on facebook (and one of her not so friendly friends) about ghosts. This friend, whom I will not name out of respect, said that she believed in ghosts, and listed some arguments supporting them, not all of them invalid, but the discussion did want me to go through, and address these points-not as an attack on said persons view, I have no doubt this person saw what she fully believed to be a ghost-but as a honest look, concerning the facts, and according to the Bible. 
First off, the last argument this person had, was that animals, particularly cats, can see them. I would like to point out the obvious flaw-as well as the solid part, of this argument. The flaw is, cats, and other animals, cannot speak any human language-and we cannot speak animal, so while we may see an animal acting strange, we obviously have no idea what its actually seeing, because we arn't in its head-and it can't tell us. It could be a small insect we can't see, maybe the cat has mental issues (which in my opinion is about 99% of all housecats, but ill admit to a certain amount of personal bias there) And furthermore, animals, especially cats and dogs-have an innate ability to sense natural phenomenon-like seismic activity, storms, etc. and often react to that. They also have a very, very strong sense of hearing-they can hear things, that we cannot. And animals, when they hear something that they don't recognize they turn their head toward the noise-making it look like theyre staring at nothing, when it reality, it could be your neighbor two doors down blowing a dog whistle. Now, I do believe in the possibility they maybe seeing something "supernatural" but I will cover that later on in this discussion.
The second argument presented, was that young kids see them. First off, not all kids see them, but its true-many kids report seeing what they think of as ghosts. But, let me point out some logical, explanations, before we dive into the supernatural (I will get to the supernatural, do not worry) First off, have you ever hear the term what goes in, must come out? Well its true. If a kid sees something-that childs brain will process it, and it will come out some way or another, each kid is different. If a kid watches a lot of adult TV, and has an active imagination, or raised believing in ghosts, its very possible that kid is actually seeing things-things that are real in his mind, but are not actually real. Or, the kid sees something that they don't understand-and think its a ghost, when in reality it may have just been pipes creaking in a old building and a strange shadow caused by a raccoon.
Second, from a lot of research done on the subject-a lot of ghost sightings by kids, are kids from abused homes. Some of these may, actually be legitimate-but I will address that later, but many of these I suspect are just the kids minds way of processing what they are going through.
The final argument, is that people who arn't open to it, arn't going to see them. This is actually a argument against them, believe it or not. If ghosts are real-as this person suggests they are, then theyre going to be real-whether I believe in them or not. And my lack of believing in them, isn't going to stop me from seeing them. Not in the slightest. Ghosts, by the sheer definition-are basically the "spirits" of people who came back from the dead, well if we come back from the dead as ghosts-lets look at this numerically. If we accept a Biblical age of the earth of beween 6-10,000 years, were talking billions of people having lived and died, which means billions of ghosts, which means there should be so many ghosts running around, that there would be absolutly no denying of them, good, evil or otherwise. Even if we were to say only a select few came back as ghosts, there would still be so many there would be no denying them. Especially if they are evil-like many suggest they are, but to date there has not been one documented case of a ghost murdering someone off of the big screen. (amazing how that is only seen in hollywood) 
  These are all earthly, and rational arguments against the existence of ghosts, now lets look at what the Bible has to say. Lets start with 2 corinthians 5:5-8 
So we are always of good courage. We know that while we are at home in the body we are away from the Lord, 7 for we walk by faith, not by sight. 8 Yes, we are of good courage, and we would rather be away from the body and at home with the Lord
So, basically, laid out this passage is addressing believers-that when when we leave the body we go home to be with the Lord, not to haunt our future generations. Now, how about the unbeliever? Jesus said it best in Matthew 25:46 
And these will go away into eternal punishment, but the righteous into eternal life
Further repeated in Luke 16:22-24
22 The poor man died and was carried by the angels to Abraham’s side.6 The rich man also died and was buried, 23 and in Hades, being in torment, he lifted up his eyes and saw Abraham far off and Lazarus at his side. 24 And he called out, Father Abraham, have mercy on me, and send Lazarus to dip the end of his finger in water and cool my tongue, for I am in anguish in this flame.’
       Pretty clear, in both the case of the believer and unbeliever, they do not come back. That is what the Bible says. But, yet we have ghosts sightings? Certainly, many many of these are misunderstandings (people seeing something they don't understand and ascribing it to something else) pranks, imagination, or wanting to believe something so much they actually see it-and heaven knows how many are drug induced, but certainly, theyre not all fake. In fact, I would say, statistically, some of these sightings of "supernatural" beings have to be legit. Well, how can that be, if there is no such thing as ghosts?
what If I told you there was a completly legitimate, and logical explanation for these sightings, one that is not only Biblical, but also explains why only some can see them-while it doesn't affect others. This explanation, explains why some kids-especially those in abusive homes, see these "creatures" while many do not. The answer, is there are supernatural beings that most of us cannot see-good and bad. The first, is Angels-these are heavenly beings who follow God-these are righteous beings who serve God, and we never have anything to fear, often watch over us. Angels appeared as messengers in Biblical times to many-Mary, mother of Jesus being the most notable.
The other supernatural being is the demon. Demons, are fallen angels who serve satan-and will do anything to kill, steal and destroy (john 10:10) and lure people away from Christ. They will do anything-including masquerading as ghosts. and hauntings. There is a biblical example-in Mark 5:1-20, a legion of demons possesssed a man and used him to haunt a graveyard, this man had superhuman strength, could break any bond that was placed on him, and lived in a graveyard-people were frightened of him, until Jesus cast the demons out and into a herd of pigs.
My point is this, Demons, will do anything to lure people away from the truth. If by appearing to them as ghosts and scaring the daylights out of them, well if the person is living in fear of something like this-then it is one more thing hindering them from following God. They can torment people-and possess people. In the case of many abused kids-it is very possible there is a demon in the house tormenting the childs parents-or adding torment to the child on top of the abuse. Its even possible animals maybe able to see them.
Now, as to why some people see them-and some people don't, theres two things-for many non-believers, demons, and satan, know what works with some and not work with others. A ghost appearance might affect one person, while the next person will just assume they ate something that didn't agree with them, and a ghost appearance wouldn't work. A ghost appearance, to a strong christian-would do no good, because christians understand what these are-demons, and they can have no effect on us, unless we let them. A demon can affect a christian-certainly, but only so far as the christian will let them. Christians understand that there is no such thing as a ghost-which is why you see, by far, very few christians who have ever seen one. 
So, do people see ghosts? no, they don't. Many do however, see something far scarier-demons. A ghost, is nothing more then a figment of imagination-a creature, created to explain something that many people, do not understand-demons, and the demonic realm. They are not something to be laughed at-but neither are they something to fear-at least not by christians, for God gave us a spirit not of fear, but of power and love and self-control (Second Timothy 1:7) So, if you have Christ-you have absolutly nothing to fear from Demons. They maybe able to affect you in different, indirect ways-but they cannot harm, or possess you, and all you have to do if you feel their presence, is turn to God. If you are not a believer, and you believe you are being haunted-or see ghosts, do not fear! but turn to God, He is faithful, and willing to forgive. for God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten son, so that whosoever believeth on Him shall not perish but have everlasting life. Life without fear of demons, a life without fear of man-made creations, but a life full of hope.
 
A Christian Perspective on Ghosts,
The_Patriot2014

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#2
LadyC

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my perspective, based on my understanding of scripture, is that we are to have no communication with the dead. we're warned about it more than once. if it wasn't possible, then the warnings in scripture would be pointless.

 

saul consulted a medium to bring back the ghost of samuel. the bible gives a pretty clear account of that incident. samuel spoke to saul during that 'encounter'... prophetic words of God.

 

i know the arguments against ghosts. perhaps it's a question of how a person defines a ghost as opposed to a demon. but to MY understanding of scripture, they are real, and they aren't demons. but they are strictly off limits... possibly, at least in part, because to put any faith in those who have already died is to NOT put your faith in God.

 

that's my christian perspective. i won't try to talk anyone out of theirs, nor will i engage in debate over mine.


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alien224

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Boooo
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LadyC

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i should point out that i don't think the typical 'ghosts' that people see in haunted hotels or wherever are what they think they are. i don't know whether those are ghosts or demons. in the encounter between saul and samuel after saul's death, he did not see saul with his physical eyes. he was 'brought up' by the medium, who saw and described him, and then saul and samuel spoke... although it does not appear that samuel spoke 'through' the mouth of the medium, so i suppose saul could hear, but not see. does that have any bearing on modern day witnesses to ghostly apparitions and whether those visions are real or not? maybe. i'm a huge skeptic of such visions. i believe they see SOMEthing, but i don't know what that something is.


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the_patriot2014

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I think the case of saul and samuel, was a one time thing that God orchestrated to further His will, and it wasn't a talking to Samuels ghost-but rather, from samuel, by Gods side-not a ghost but samuel himself, and it was for a very specific reason-something God orchestrated. Mediums, cannot actually get you to talk to a dead person-often times when a person goes through a medium-they are not talking to a loved one (though they are led to believe that) in many cases, mediums use questions to learn about said dead person and then make deductions and make generic, believable statements that make the person seeking the coversation believe it is their loved one, other times it is actual demons who the person is conversing with. It is just another trick in satans arsenol to distract people from the one true God, and one should not take one passage from scripture-and take it out of context-and use it to prove the existence of ghosts.


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Cletus

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I agree with what pat and the bible say about human ghosts, people do not see those. Technically, demons are ghosts/spirits. The bible says lucifer used to have the apperance of precious stones and music just sort of emmited from his "being" I believe that when lucifer and the angels who rebeled were cast out of heaven they were disembodied. Meaning they are just a spirit/ghost. This is apart of the reson we read of people being possesed in the bible, and elsewhere. These spirits need a "house." The bible tells us oir body is the temple of God. My perspective as a christian on demons is this, I have studied aboit demons, the occult, voodoo, various books of the dead, etc., etc. On my studies I came upon a word that refers to demons, or in thier religion gods(little g) and this term is shadow walker. I have actually seen a demon. I was in a yelling match with an ex-girlfriend(years ago) and we were right next to my bedroom door. There was a very distinct and different knockon my door. I opened my door that went into a hallway. Directly accross the halway was another door and I heard the door open right after the knock but before I opened my door. Upon opening the door me and my ex was standing in the door looking at this shadow. It was man shaped and about 6 foot tall. There were no distinguishable features of face or limb, just an outline. Its eyes glowed bright blue and it laughed a real creepy laugh and shut the door behind it. I knew it was a demon instantly but my girlfriend said what the ______ is that? At first I was shocked at what i had seen, but omce the door shut behind it, I realized there is only one door to this room and its trapped and I did not like this thing and wanted to kill it.(I was not saved then) We went in to investigate, I told her to stand by the door and holler if she saw anything. I proceeded to look behind and under every piece of furniture. Nothing. Looked in the closets. Nothing. The windows had been screwed shut and would not open. This thing just vanished. I was not saved then. Both me and my ex-girl friend saw it. Demons are very real. Ghosts of people, well, I think based on the bible demons can appear as a loved one or a person because the bible says demons can appear as a being of light, which is deceptive. There really is not anything to be afraid of about demons if you are saved. If they could do us harm we would probably already know about it and it would be addressed in the bible. It is kinda creepy the first time you see this.
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#7
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patriot, all others:
I think that we should bring the word 'Ghost' into the 21th Century, England and Shakespere used two words to signify a disembodied spirit, 'Ghost' and 'Sprite'.That is why the King James Translator have the Disciples seeing Jesus walking on the water and they said it was a Ghost and they have that Jesus giving up the Ghost. The validity of spirits walking the Earth aside we should use the word spirit, though I don't think the world will ever change terminology.

Though I don't believe that a spirit linger on the Earth, I wouldn't wish to spend the night in a purported place of so-called hauntings, that is just human nature.

In Louisiana, we have our places of hauntings, as it is believed, such as in Baton Rouge, it has been reported that Confederate Soldiers have been seen walking a street.

I believe that a tide of interest in spirits has arose due to paranormal shows, it is very sad to see this in the natural man (sinner) and Christians.

[I welcome moderation if I give too much "glory" (not meaningly) to the paranormal.)
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Openly Curious

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Personally I do not believe in ghosts at all.  What I mean by a ghost is those kinds that are portrayed as being trapped between two worlds upon their death, for some reason or another they are not able to let go and depart this world thus trapped.  I believe ghosts in this form is unbiblical and a bunch of whooy.  I do believe that when a person dies that they do give up the ghost which is to say that their spirit leaves their body and will be in the presence of the Lord or in hell.

 

I do believe in angelic host of heaven who serve in the ranks of God's army on behalf of his children who are obedient to his will.   I also believe in the demonic realm of angels who serve in the ranks of Satan's army who bring temptations to the hearts of man trying to destroy their faith in God.  It this army of demonic angels who serve Satan that we fight against as saints of God as we wrestle not against flesh and blood but we fight a spiritual battle and we fight with spiritual weapons not carnal (worldly, earthly weapons made by hands).  As you can read this in Ephesians 6.

 

But I do not believe in ghosts that purposedly gets trapped in between two worlds because something is causing them to hold on to something in this world until they are able to let go.  Because it is not biblical once your spirit leaves your body it leave this world at that time as well.  The body goes back to the dust of the ground from which it came and the spirit of man goes back to God in heaven or to hell.


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#9
Butero

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There is no question that people, including myself, have experienced "ghostly" things during our lifetime we cannot explain.  Many of us that have pets have seen our dogs or cats acting strange, barking when nothing is there, or just acting odd.  People will try to come up with an explanation for this, and create a type of doctrine, like OC pointed out.  They will claim this is the spirit of people trapped in this world that haven't gone into the light, and they will claim that animals see things we cannot.  I have no doubt there are strange things that are happening in this world, but we can't be sure of the true nature of those occurrences.  We see them and try to come up with answers, just like when someone spots a strange object in the sky.  It is labeled as a UFO, but that doesn't have to mean grey aliens from another planet.  It could have a completely different explanation, but we just don't know what it is. 

 

Are ghosts really demons?  Are they just events that already happened somehow being replayed before our eyes?  What about poltergeists activity?  Ghosts or demons?  People will always try to create an answer to what takes place, but it doesn't mean their conclusions are the right ones.  Even in the case of Saul and the witch,  nobody can be sure it was Samuel.  It could have been an imposter posing as Samuel.  I am not 100 percent convinced one way or the other, though I believe it was an imposter, a demon disguised as Samuel.  We all desire closure on everything, so we dig in our heels and claim to have come up with the definite answer, but we could be wrong. 


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#10
other one

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I'm drawn between what I read in the Bible and experienced in life.   I know that we have what might be called a ghost (spirit) that goes back to God when we die.   We are told not to have any contact with them whatsoever....    I also am pretty sure that demons are the spirits of those whose fathers were fallen angels and when they die they have no where to go for they were never meant to be and are not of God.

 

I have experienced the Demons living with us for several years and I think I can say that I know that cats can either see them or experience their presence and I've never seen a cat comfortable around them.

 

There is a place at Tinker Air Force Base in Oklahoma that was a morgue during World War II that has some kind of spiritual happenings most nights.    People working there at night all experience the phenomena over time.  And it's not just a mental thing for they are capable of moving things.  

I think they are not ghosts of simply people for invoking the name of Jesus will make them leave you alone.

 

The contact between Saul and Samuel to me just validates the concept that it is possible to speak and hear from the dead, but also shows how God has commanded not to do it.     Interestingly at Tinker, one can hear distant chatter between whatever it is but not clear enough to understand what they are saying......   and over the 25 years I worked around and in that place I never heard anyone say that they ever talked to one of them.

 

So I personally would say that I don't think the spirits we come in contact with are the disembodied spirits of dead people, but of the offspring of angels that should not be.   Most of them come from before the flood.   I'm guessing that those at Tinker Air Force Base were possessing the people who died there during the war and are just hanging around.  I don't think I really need or want to know how all that happens.      I had a really really bad interface with them in the 70's and don't care to repeat that ever.


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#11
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There is no question that people, including myself, have experienced "ghostly" things during our lifetime we cannot explain.  Many of us that have pets have seen our dogs or cats acting strange, barking when nothing is there, or just acting odd.  People will try to come up with an explanation for this, and create a type of doctrine, like OC pointed out.  They will claim this is the spirit of people trapped in this world that haven't gone into the light, and they will claim that animals see things we cannot.  I have no doubt there are strange things that are happening in this world, but we can't be sure of the true nature of those occurrences.  We see them and try to come up with answers, just like when someone spots a strange object in the sky.  It is labeled as a UFO, but that doesn't have to mean grey aliens from another planet.  It could have a completely different explanation, but we just don't know what it is. 

 

Are ghosts really demons?  Are they just events that already happened somehow being replayed before our eyes?  What about poltergeists activity?  Ghosts or demons?  People will always try to create an answer to what takes place, but it doesn't mean their conclusions are the right ones.  Even in the case of Saul and the witch,  nobody can be sure it was Samuel.  It could have been an imposter posing as Samuel.  I am not 100 percent convinced one way or the other, though I believe it was an imposter, a demon disguised as Samuel.  We all desire closure on everything, so we dig in our heels and claim to have come up with the definite answer, but we could be wrong. 

 

1 Sam 28:15-20

15 And Samuel said to Saul, Why hast thou disquieted me, to bring me up? And Saul answered, I am sore distressed; for the Philistines make war against me, and God is departed from me, and answereth me no more, neither by prophets, nor by dreams: therefore I have called thee, that thou mayest make known unto me what I shall do.

16 Then said Samuel, Wherefore then dost thou ask of me, seeing the Lord is departed from thee, and is become thine enemy?

17 And the Lord hath done to him, as he spake by me: for the Lord hath rent the kingdom out of thine hand, and given it to thy neighbour, even to David:

18 Because thou obeyedst not the voice of the Lord, nor executedst his fierce wrath upon Amalek, therefore hath the Lord done this thing unto thee this day.

19 Moreover the Lord will also deliver Israel with thee into the hand of the Philistines: and to morrow shalt thou and thy sons be with me: the Lord also shall deliver the host of Israel into the hand of the Philistines.

20 Then Saul fell straightway all along on the earth, and was sore afraid, because of the words of Samuel: and there was no strength in him; for he had eaten no bread all the day, nor all the night.
KJV

I just can't get past the Bible not telling us that this was a fraud.  I am forced to believe it really was Samuel.    If you read everything  during that time, I have never seen anything that says anything but it was Saul, and if it was not then God told us something that wasn't true.......    and my whole existence rejects that.


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#12
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I believe what the witch at Endor saw was actually Samuel, 'today you will be with me', he said. That with other things lead my to believe saw the Judge and Prophet.
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LadyC

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I think the case of saul and samuel, was a one time thing that God orchestrated to further His will, and it wasn't a talking to Samuels ghost-but rather, from samuel, by Gods side-not a ghost but samuel himself, and it was for a very specific reason-something God orchestrated. Mediums, cannot actually get you to talk to a dead person-often times when a person goes through a medium-they are not talking to a loved one (though they are led to believe that) in many cases, mediums use questions to learn about said dead person and then make deductions and make generic, believable statements that make the person seeking the coversation believe it is their loved one, other times it is actual demons who the person is conversing with. It is just another trick in satans arsenol to distract people from the one true God, and one should not take one passage from scripture-and take it out of context-and use it to prove the existence of ghosts.

 

we all know that modern day mediums ask generic questions and give stock answers, but i wasn't around thousands of years ago to know how they practiced then. patriot, i didn't take just one passage and take it out of context. i mentioned (rather non-specifically) that God also tells us many times in scripture not to talk to the dead...  the bible refers to those who speak to the dead as necromancers or spiritists. ghosts are sometimes referred to in scripture as "familiar" spirits.

 

deut 18:11 or one who conjures spells, or a medium, or a spiritist, or one who calls up the dead. 

lev 19:31 ‘Give no regard to mediums and familiar spirits; do not seek after them, to be defiled by them: I am the Lord your God.

isaiah 8:19 And when they say to you, “Seek those who are mediums and wizards, who whisper and mutter,” should not a people seek their God? Should they seek the dead on behalf of the living?

lev 20: 6 ‘And the person who turns to mediums and familiar spirits, to prostitute himself with them, I will set My face against that person and cut him off from his people.

lev 20:27  ‘A man or a woman who is a medium, or who has familiar spirits, shall surely be put to death; they shall stone them with stones. Their blood shall be upon them.’”

1 john 4:1 Beloved, do not believe every spirit, but test the spirits, whether they are of God; because many false prophets have gone out into the world.

 

 

why would God command over and over that we NOT communicate with the dead if it were impossible to do so?

saul died, according to scripture, specifically because he broke faith with God and had someone call up saul.  (1 chronicles 10:13)

 

 

 

so patriot, you can disagree with my understanding of scripture, and you can tell me why you disagree. it could be that sometimes my understanding is in error and another viewpoint might make me see more clearly. but i'd certainly appreciate it if you NEVER again accuse me of taking one passage (or many passages) out of context. my understanding of scripture as it pertains to any subject that i weigh in on almost always comes from lengthy, in depth study of a particular topic over the years. and on those occasions when it doesn't, i will always state that i haven't done much study on it.


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#14
LadyC

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Personally I do not believe in ghosts at all.  What I mean by a ghost is those kinds that are portrayed as being trapped between two worlds upon their death, for some reason or another they are not able to let go and depart this world thus trapped.  I believe ghosts in this form is unbiblical and a bunch of whooy.  I do believe that when a person dies that they do give up the ghost which is to say that their spirit leaves their body and will be in the presence of the Lord or in hell.

 

I do believe in angelic host of heaven who serve in the ranks of God's army on behalf of his children who are obedient to his will.   I also believe in the demonic realm of angels who serve in the ranks of Satan's army who bring temptations to the hearts of man trying to destroy their faith in God.  It this army of demonic angels who serve Satan that we fight against as saints of God as we wrestle not against flesh and blood but we fight a spiritual battle and we fight with spiritual weapons not carnal (worldly, earthly weapons made by hands).  As you can read this in Ephesians 6.

 

But I do not believe in ghosts that purposedly gets trapped in between two worlds because something is causing them to hold on to something in this world until they are able to let go.  Because it is not biblical once your spirit leaves your body it leave this world at that time as well.  The body goes back to the dust of the ground from which it came and the spirit of man goes back to God in heaven or to hell.

 

amen. 

 

as i pointed out earlier, i believe this may come down to how one defines "ghost". these ghostly apparitions people see all the time, i don't know what those are. most likely they are demons. whatever they are is supernatural, and is not of the Holy realm. i don't really think those who have already died are at liberty to come calling upon us.


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#15
Diatheosis

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About animals. There was the donkey who saw the angel of the Lord. and refused to go on.

 

Num 22:24Then the angel of the LORD stood in a narrow path of the vineyards, with a wall on this side and a wall on that side. 25When the donkey saw the angel of the LORD, she pressed herself to the wall and pressed Balaam's foot against the wall,

 

I could say for pretty sure such happens still today, whilst I am not advocating per se any kind of occult doctrines about the topic.

 

I came to read about this kabbalistic practice (Jihud) in which the student goes to the grave of his teacher after midnight and vizualizes his soul and the soul of the deceased teacher from the dead to be untied this way. Apparently it has had quite a big part in their practices. Does someone know more about it? This is what Isaac Luria was up to.

 

http://en.wikipedia....iki/Isaac_Luria

 

Of ghosts and demons after what I've experienced the definitions sound a bit restricted. But many mistake the latter as the former. One thing: seek the company of neither one. The ways of the occult only lead to insanity, of which I sadly know too many examples. Nothing Jesus could not resolve though.


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#16
other one

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I came to read about this kabbalistic practice (Jihud) in which the student goes to the grave of his teacher after midnight and vizualizes his soul and the soul of the deceased teacher from the dead to be untied this way. Apparently it has had quite a big part in their practices. Does someone know more about it? This is what Isaac Luria was up to.

I can warn you from personal experience that you should avoid looking into that subject.....   things automatically start to happen when you do.......   and you don't want or need those things in your life.


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#17
dscapp

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For a few years there I was really deep into found footage horror films.

I realized that, this specific genre plays a part in the occult and doesn't mash well will the body of Christ.

I repented months ago and haven't gone back, those movies are getting more evil as the years progress.

Ghosts do not exist, demons do however and demons work through people and people work through the occult.

There's two kinds of mystery, the mystery of holiness and the mystery of the demonic.

Finding out the mysteries of God is much better in the end, from personal experience.


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#18
other one

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For a few years there I was really deep into found footage horror films.

I realized that, this specific genre plays a part in the occult and doesn't mash well will the body of Christ.

I repented months ago and haven't gone back, those movies are getting more evil as the years progress.

Ghosts do not exist, demons do however and demons work through people and people work through the occult.

There's two kinds of mystery, the mystery of holiness and the mystery of the demonic.

Finding out the mysteries of God is much better in the end, from personal experience.

I would certainly agree with that.


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#19
sass

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my perspective, based on my understanding of scripture, is that we are to have no communication with the dead. we're warned about it more than once. if it wasn't possible, then the warnings in scripture would be pointless.

 

saul consulted a medium to bring back the ghost of samuel. the bible gives a pretty clear account of that incident. samuel spoke to saul during that 'encounter'... prophetic words of God.

 

i know the arguments against ghosts. perhaps it's a question of how a person defines a ghost as opposed to a demon. but to MY understanding of scripture, they are real, and they aren't demons. but they are strictly off limits... possibly, at least in part, because to put any faith in those who have already died is to NOT put your faith in God.

 

that's my christian perspective. i won't try to talk anyone out of theirs, nor will i engage in debate over mine.

hey am new can i get some attention 

i do believ bt i cany see


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#20
He giveth more grace

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    Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.

sass, if you need prayer we can pray for you in the "Prayer Requests" place on the board. If you need guidance just ask and a thread will be opened (started) for you to assist you, but we must move your conversation out of this thread, please. thank you.


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