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    Who are Worthy Servants?

    By George

    Shalom everyone, Since I've been asked, I'll post up a quick reference guide to what the different functions of ministry are.  We instituted a checks and balances sort of system at Worthy, so that no one person or persons have complete authority. Worthy Steward -- That's me -- and why do I call myself a Steward.  It's merely because I'm a steward of the Lord's ministry.  It's not "my" ministry -- and not "my" work.  It's the Lord's work!    Worthy Servants -- Those are Forum Moderators, who check reported posts, send PM's to keep the peace so to speak, and try to keep this "experiment " running smoothly! Worthy Chat Moderators -- Those are Chat Moderators, who keep Worthy Chat clean, and help "steer" chat. Worthy Watchman -- These are a group of "oversight" individuals, whose role is not to "moderate" but a means of checks and balances to the different moderators.  When things come up -- they are responsible to review Reported Posts, Moderator actions / inactions, and even comment as to "why" things were handled the way they were. Platinum Members -- These are individuals, who help "watch" over the ministry, and have only one "extra" function.  To be able to minister behind the scenes in the chat room as they have Private Message ability. So in essence, the moderation team is a group of individuals who "volunteer" their time, and often get criticized no matter what they do!  Either they are moderating too heavily, not moderating too much, why is this "false" doctrine allowed to be discussed, etc. are some of the common complaints I've heard over the 15+ years we've run Worthy!  It really doesn't change over the years -- just the members.  Many people don't realize how much turnover there is on forum boards!  I'm not sure how many different moderating teams we've gone through -- but it's significant! Past Moderation Style We've always like to keep a clean board. and in the past we removed, hid, and deleted harmful posts.  However, when we do so, many people NEVER see how much moderating is being done behind the scenes!  How many posts are "cleaned up"?  The moderators have a few options at this point.  First, we'll send a Private Message, trying to "steer" people to what is and what is not acceptable.  If this doesn't work, then we will place individuals on "Moderator Review" for a certain period of time.  At this point, most of those individuals placed on Moderator Review never come back.  What most people do not realize is that "Moderator Review" is the last thing we really want to do as moderators -- because it increases our workload!  So what is changed? Changes in Moderation We are simply not "cleaning" up the board any longer.  If someone personally attacks someone, then we will simply leave the attack on the board -- EDIT the post -- leaving it intact, but commenting on the post that we as the moderating team do not feel this is appropriate, and the steps we've taken to fix the problem.  We'll send a Private Message to the offender, issue a Moderation point, and ban the person from the thread -- ONLY FROM THE THREAD -- not from the forums!  Just the thread itself!  How I believe this will help in the long run? 1st -- People will actually begin to see how much "moderating" is being done "openly"! 2nd -- By having posts NEVER hidden -- it'll be easy to refer to "past" infractions as a means of "instructing, and correcting". 3rd -- Hopefully people will change their posting styles! People always try to "win a debate"!  In doing so, they forget that sometimes you win -- by laying down the fight for ANOTHER time!  Usually in the "heat of battle" a nasty thing appears -- PRIDE!  Do you not know that "pride is the source of all contentions!"  (Proverbs 13:10a KJV Only by pride cometh contention)  If you're truly wanting to change someone's mind -- you have to be CAREFUL not to offend.  Why?  As Proverbs 18:19 says, "A brother offended is more unyielding than a strong city, and quarreling is like the bars of a castle."  Remember the instruction that Paul gave to Timothy written in 2 Timothy 2:23-26,  Have nothing to do with foolish, ignorant controversies; you know that they breed quarrels. And the Lord's servant must not be quarrelsome but kind to everyone, able to teach, patiently enduring evil,  correcting his opponents with gentleness. God may perhaps grant them repentance leading to a knowledge of the truth, and they may come to their senses and escape from the snare of the devil, after being captured by him to do his will.  The hardest part of this passage is being "kind to everyone" and "patiently enduring evil!"  If the first reaction is to trade insult for insult -- then you're failing at being an instructor of the Word!  Notice how it concludes -- that God opens their hearts to the TRUTH -- it's not us -- it's the work of God!  However, we can do a pretty good job of "hindering" someone coming to the knowledge of the truth by purposely "offending" them!  Forgetting by offending them -- you're actually HINDERING the means by which someone comes to the truth. If you have any thoughts, any questions, we're all about transparency -- so ask away! Your brother in the Lord with much agape love, George
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  1. The Three Parts of the Spirit – #2 Intuition

    Intuition is the consciousness within man’s spirit – it is direct and not dependant on anything else. We do not need the help of the mind, the emotion, or the will before we can have this knowledge. Through the intuition man can truly ‘know’ something while his mind can only make him understand it. All God’s revelation and all the moving of the Holy Spirit are known by the believers through the intuition.

    John 6:64 64“But there are some of you who do not believe.” For Jesus knew from the beginning who they were who did not believe, and who it was that would betray Him. (Jesus knew from the beginning.)

    Mark 2:8 - Immediately Jesus, aware in His spirit that they were reasoning that way within themselves, said* to them, “Why are you reasoning about these things in your hearts? (Jesus knew in his spirit.)

    Mark 8:12 - Sighing deeply in His spirit, He said*, “Why does this generation seek for a sign? Truly I say to you, no sign will be given to this generation.” (Sighing deeply in his spirit.)

    Acts 20:22 - And now, behold, compelled by the spirit, I am on my way to Jerusalem, not knowing what will happen to me there, (Compelled by the Spirit.)

    1 Corinthians 2:11-12 - For who among men knows the thoughts of a man except the spirit of the man which is in him? Even so the thoughts of God no one knows except the Spirit of God. Now we have received, not the spirit of the world, but the Spirit who is from God, so that we may know the things freely given to us by God,

     

     

    ALBERT FINCH MINISTRY

    Flowers (12).jpg

  2. Shalom everyone,

    We added a new feature, called Member Map!  Go ahead, pin yourself, and meet other WCF'ers near you!

    member-map.jpg

    You'll find the Member Map on the Naviagation Toolbar just below the LOGO.

    God bless,

    George

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    missmuffet
    Latest Entry

    Every Day

    in His

    Presence

    Dr. Charles Stanley

    July 21,. 2016

     

    Call Out To Him

    O God, have mercy! I look to You for protection....I cry out

    to God Most High, to God who will fulfill His purpose for me.

    Psalm 57:1-2

    Are there obstacles or difficulties that seem to block you from

    fulfilling God's purposes for your life? Perhaps you've worried,

    planned, and toiled but have ultimately failed to achieve what you

    desire, and despair is beginning to settle in. If so, it is time for you

    to stop doing and begin asking.

    Friend, the Lord your God is sovereign. He can soften hearts

    that you could never touch, change circumstances beyond your

    control, provide resources you can't even dream of attaining, and

    untangle messes that seem unredeemable. And He is waiting for

    you to cry out to Him for deliverance.

    Friend, it is sheer pride that keeps you relying on yourself rather

    than depending on and obeying Your heavenly Father, who wants

    to be your strength, your life, and your all. Stop trying to figure

    everything out. Kneel before Him and leave all that concerns you

    in His hands. He will not fail you.

    Lord, You are my only hope and help. I count on You,

    Father. Lead me in the way I should go. amen.

     

  3. The Tribulation Pt 3: The Lamb Breaks the Seals

     

     

    In Part 2, we left off where Jesus, the Lamb of God, stood holding the scroll he had taken from God the Father, ready to break the first seal on it;

    “Then I saw when the Lamb broke one of the seven seals, and I heard one of the four living creatures saying as with a voice of thunder, “Come.” I looked, and behold, a white horse, and he who sat on it had a bow; and a crown was given to him, and he went out conquering and to conquer.” (Revelation 6:1-2, NASB)

    Looking at this verse, we see that the first horseman is upon a white horse. Historically, a white horse has symbolized a victorious war, and we are told in this verse that the rider rides out AS a conqueror, i.e. someone who has already conquered. As a side note: the Jewish never used horses as beasts of burden, but rather reserved them for war. The ox and the donkey took on the role of burden in that society.

    The rider carries a bow, which was used as a distance weapon rather than an up-close melee weapon. We can infer from this fact that the rider himself will not get personally involved in conquering, but will instead command and conduct his warfare from a distance. That he carries no arrows shows that while he seems to have the force of command/ leadership, he has no actual means in the moment in of himself to enforce it.

    We also see that he wears a crown, in this case, the Greek word stephanos , a wreath of victory instead of the diadema of authority. This indicates that he has already won a battle or competition, and is therefore a victor.

    So, what we are seeing then is a rider who is already a victor, has conducted war successfully, who rides a hose of victory, and conducts warfare from a distance without getting into the battle himself. This cannot be Christ, as he wears crowns of AUTHORITY, carries a sword which proceeds from his mouth, and gets into the battle HIMSELF. In fact, at Armageddon, he is the ONLY one who does any sort of fighting at all! As John is seeing all of this, Christ is in heaven, present with his father, reading from the scroll.

    An important clue that we have to his identity is found in 2 Thessalonians:

    "Let no one in any way deceive you, for it will not come unless the apostasy comes first, and the man of lawlessness is revealed, the son of destruction, who opposes and exalts himself above every so-called god or object of worship, so that he takes his seat in the temple of God, displaying himself as being God. Do you not remember that while I was still with you, I was telling you these things? And you know what restrains him now, so that in his time he will be revealed. For the mystery of lawlessness is already at work; only he who now restrains will do so until he is taken out of the way. Then that lawless one will be revealed whom the Lord will slay with the breath of His mouth and bring to an end by the appearance of His coming; that is, the one whose coming is in accord with the activity of Satan, with all power and signs and false wonders, and with all the deception of wickedness for those who perish, because they did not receive the love of the truth so as to be saved.." (2 Thessalonians 2:3-10, NASB, emphasis mine)

    The one who holds back the lawlessness in this world, i.e. "the Restrainer" is the Holy Spirit; once he is no longer restraining the evil in this world, then the Antichrist can come forth unopposed. Because the Body of Christ is sealed with the Holy Spirit, at least some Christians would have discernment to recognize the Antichrist for who he is, and would begin preaching against him. So, by necessity, the church would have to be removed from the planet before he could be revealed; in fact, the elders, as mentioned in part 1, represent the church in heaven.

    I think we can then put everything together and see for ourselves who the first rider is.

    The Lamb then breaks the second seal:

    "When He broke the second seal, I heard the second living creature saying, “Come.” And another, a red horse, went out; and to him who sat on it, it was granted to take peace from the earth, and that men would slay one another; and a great sword was given to him" (Revelation 6:3-4, NASB)

    Normally, the Greek word for sword, machaira, means a small sword or dagger; here, a LARGE sword means that the sword is a massive bladed weapon. In battles during that era, warriors usually favored swords that were about 16-18 inches long, such as the Roman Gladius. But for executions, a large axe or sword was used to ensure a clean cut. The rider rides as an executioner, taking lives in a pre-ordered, methodical manner. The red color, a fiery red at that, shows the fire of battle and violence, as men fought and killed one another because of this rider. Red is also the color of blood, and one can imagine that blood indeed would be spilled freely in such circumstances.

    Another thing to note: this is yet another reason the First Horseman is the Antichrist, as you cannot take peace from somewhere that it is not. The only one who can pull this one off is “Satan’s Masterpiece”, and the world is being turned over to its’ sin as a judgment at this point, much as Romans 1 reads. The Antichrist, though not fully in control yet, is using his influence and satanically-given abilities to “smooth over” age-old enmities in order to further his position.

    The Lamb breaks the third seal:

    "When He broke the third seal, I heard the third living creature saying, “Come.” I looked, and behold, a black horse; and he who sat on it had a pair of scales in his hand. And I heard something like a voice in the center of the four living creatures saying, “A quart of wheat for a denarius, and three quarts of barley for a denarius; and do not damage the oil and the wine.” (Revelation 6:5-6, NASB)

    A black horse whose rider carried scales was an ominous vision indeed, and the instructions he is given tell us a great deal of his purpose. A quart of wheat was about 1/8 of a bushel, and was the daily allowance of a servant or a slave. Barley, cheaper than wheat and less nutritious, was allowed in more quantity. A penny, in Greek, dēnariou or denarius, was a day's wages for a laborer in John's time. We are essentially being told that famine would follow, and that food would be measured out to such an extent that oil and wine, used in medical treatment in ancient times (see Jesus' parable of the Good Samaritan) would be scarce. Food and medical supplies (the FDA covers both in the US, incidentally) would be in short supply in the time immediately after the ride of the Second Horseman, and it makes perfect sense: war usually brings those things. With the command for the oil and the wine not to be harmed, medical treatment can be seen as being "doled out" as well, as supplies would be needed for war.

    Jesus breaks the fourth seal:

    "When the Lamb broke the fourth seal, I heard the voice of the fourth living creature saying, “Come.” I looked, and behold, an ashen horse; and he who sat on it had the name Death; and Hades was following with him. Authority was given to them over a fourth of the earth, to kill with sword and with famine and with pestilence and by the wild beasts of the earth. (Revelation 7-8, NASB)

    Upon an pale horse green horse ( Greek chlōros, "green"), Death rides across the planet, as the toll from the wars and famine mount. Hades is in tow with him, following behind as would be logical: many would not be going to heaven, but instead the holding place for lost souls until the Judgment.

    As described in the verse, 1/4 of the planet is given to them, to kill with violence (sword), famine and plague. This follows the red and black horses, and is a natural result of war and shortage of food. People get sick, are injured, and die of disease, shortage of medical care and starvation. Considering that right now there are 7.4 billion people in the world (as of this revision), 1/4 of the population would be 1,850,000,000 people. That's almost 2 BILLON people that would die by the time of the 4th seal! To put it into plainer terms, that’s nearly the entire populations of China and Europeput together.


    That's a lot of people to die, and this is only the BEGINNING of the Tribulation!

    Jesus Christ breaks the fifth seal:

    "When the Lamb broke the fifth seal, I saw underneath the altar the souls of those who had been slain because of the word of God, and because of the testimony which they had maintained; and they cried out with a loud voice, saying, “How long, O Lord, holy and true, will You refrain from judging and avenging our blood on those who dwell on the earth?” And there was given to each of them a white robe; and they were told that they should rest for a little while longer, until the number of their fellow servants and their brethren who were to be killed even as they had been, would be completed also. (Revelation 6:9-11, NASB)

    We see in this verse that those who have been murdered for sharing their testimony and the Gospel are crying out to the Lord to avenge them; we don't see a particular judgment happen here, or so it would seem. Some may ask "how is this judgment on mankind?" Those that were killed by rebellious man for their faith have essentially accused man to the Lord. And unlike Satan, who accuses out of spite and rage, these accuse out of anguish and a desire for justice. And God is not about to let their cries for justice go unheard: they were given white robes, a symbol of righteousness and purity. If they were not just in asking for justice, God would not have given them something symbolizing righteousness. They are told they have to wait because their number is not yet complete. There will be more on the way, sadly, and God cannot jump the gun on this. once their number is full, his judgment can be completed against those that have shed their blood.

    The Lord Jesus breaks the sixth seal:

    "I looked when He broke the sixth seal, and there was a great earthquake; and the sun became black as sackcloth made of hair, and the whole moon became like blood; and the stars of the sky fell to the earth, as a fig tree casts its unripe figs when shaken by a great wind. The sky was split apart like a scroll when it is rolled up, and every mountain and island were moved out of their places. (Revelation 6:12-14, NASB)

    At this point, a tremendous quake strikes the planet with concussive force, so hard that every island and mountain is moved!! The Sun is blacked out as if someone dropped a burlap sack over it, and the moon turns a deep, blood red. This sort of thing can happen with such phenomena as volcanoes erupting, which can follow especially violent earthquakes. Another thought is that eruptions of volcanoes can send tremors through the ground as well. The sky disappearing as a scroll begin rolled up refers to how fast the sky is obscured, which can also happen when a volcano erupts; ash is shot into the sky, and in a matter of minutes, all is pitch black and a eerie silence fills the land. As for the reference to the stars in the sky, this could be either "shooting stars" (meteorites) or possibly ejection from volcanoes, which would appear like shooting stars. Literal starts would be a bit of a stretch here, as literal stars in the sky dwarf the planet and would incinerate it. Another possibility is a nuclear exchange (Hal Lindsey seems to think this is the case in his take on the Tribulation, in several of the judgments). Since John had probably not seen a volcano erupt, he was most likely putting all of this into the best description he could.

    We also read the reaction of the people on the earth after all of this:

    "Then the kings of the earth and the great men and the commanders and the rich and the strong and every slave and free man hid themselves in the caves and among the rocks of the mountains; and they said to the mountains and to the rocks, “Fall on us and hide us from the presence of Him who sits on the throne, and from the wrath of the Lamb; for the great day of their wrath has come, and who is able to stand?” (Revelation 6:15-17, NASB)

    The planet is in absolute terror, to the point they have taken refuge IN the mountains. It's known that at NORAD's base in CheyenneMountain in the US, the complex is built INSIDE a mountain. It's conceivable that other shelters for the rich and for government personnel have been constructed inside mountains or at the very least, within the ground. But for someone to be so scared that they literally want tons of rock to obscure them from the outside says a great deal. It also says how little they care for those they 'control": they would just as soon leave the masses to fend for themselves, while THEY themselves get to safety.

    But in this time, there IS no true safety, save in the Lord

    As a note: in this passage, the people say “Fall on us and hide us from the presence of Him who sits on the throne and from the wrath of the Lamb; for the great day of their wrath has come, and who is able to stand?” All of this is still the first seal, and each seal is opened one after another; “When” the second seal is opened, for example, indicates that these things are happening in a chronological order, and that the seals are opened one after another. And the entire time of the Tribulation is the “wrath of the Lamb”. It’s not just a third or even a half; it’s the whole time, and all of this is happening in a chronological order thus far. In a bit, we’ll see scripture go back and explain what has just happened in parts, but that is the Semitic style of writing.


    In Part 4, we'll see the Lamb break the last seal, and unleash the first of the Trumpet Judgments.


    I bid you all peace.


    YBIC,

    -Robert

     

  4. Another blog entry that was lost and is now resurrected.

     

    1 Timothy 4:7 But refuse profane and old-womanish tales, and exercise yourself to godliness.

    I saw an inspirational story posted on a Christian forum that talked about a soldier hiding from the enemy in World War II. This soldier took refuge in a cave. He prayed to God and was hidden by a spider web.

    This seems like a nice story, but it turns out to be a story from another religion, from their religious texts. That troubled me. To see a mythological event from a false religion find its way into the culture of English speaking Christians. Can a Christian find morality within a false religion? I don’t think one can. All other religions, if they have morals, are a pale shadow of Christ’s way, and those other religions lead to eternal death. Why bother getting moral stories from false religions when we have the perfect and true religion of following Jesus?

    As the bible tells us, 1 Timothy 1:4 nor to give heed to fables and endless genealogies (which provide doubts rather than the nurture of God in faith). We should instead keep our eye on the Lord. To do as it says in Philippians 4:8-9 Finally, my brothers, whatever things are true, whatever things are honest, whatever things are right, whatever things are pure, whatever things are lovely, whatever things are of good report; if there is any virtue and if there is any praise, think on these things. Do those things which you have also learned and received and heard and seen in me. And the God of peace shall be with you.

  5. The King is coming,are you ready?

    Heaven and earth will pass away, but My words will never pass away. 36No one knowsabout that day or hour, not even the angels in heaven, nor the Son, but only the Father. 37As it was in the days of Noah, so will it be at the coming of the Son of Man.…Matt.24:36

     

  6. “For now we see through a glass, darkly…”

    It is my belief that we gain insights not only from a structured classroom but also from the vast wonderful creation that the Lord places before us. We simply have to ask, “Father, open my eyes that I might see.”

    A few years back I happened to look out my kitchen window and there sat a small, scraggly puppy. He was a cute little thing, but, could we take on another dog? We already had two large Rhodesian Ridgebacks. This little guy looked like a small border collie. It’s not all that uncommon for a stray to show up out here in the country, but seldom do we see young puppies. Normally it’s the older guys that have started to chew on furniture or dig holes in the yard. People just don’t consider all the factors involved when becoming dog owners. Cute little puppies grow up to be dogs. Like children, without the correct training and discipline, they can grow up to have serious problems.

    • Pr 22:6 Train up a child in the way he should go: and when he is old, he will not depart from it.

    Anyway – here was this pup and I had to check him out. Before I even got close to him I could tell that he was in trouble. He was too weak to run from me. I knelt down and slowly reached for him, thinking he would sniff my hand. He didn’t. Instead he laid his head in my hand and closed his eyes. I caressed him for a short while and then fetched him food and water. I doubted that he had the strength to eat. I went back into the house to give him privacy, and when I went outside a short while later, he had disappeared. I searched but couldn’t find him anywhere. I thought he went off somewhere to die.

     The next morning he was back by the front porch. I got more food and water and again went back into the house. Again, he disappeared. This pattern continued for a few days until I discovered that he was hiding underneath the bushes that lined the house. The next time I fed him I sat on the porch steps, but didn’t reach out to him when he came out to eat. The days passed and with patience and kindness I slowly gained his trust, me sitting on my porch steps and he watching me with one eye while he ate.  He didn’t allow me to handle him until the trust was firmly established. Once he submitted to me, I discovered that he had been severely mistreated.  I later thought of how I was before finding my Savior. The world is a hard place in which to live, especially for a non-believer. It can beat us down, strip us of a desire to live –leave us in a condition just like this little broken pup.

     

    • 1Pe 5:8-9 Be sober, be vigilant; because your adversary the devil, as a roaring lion, walketh about, seeking whom he may devour, Whom resist stedfast in the faith, knowing that the same afflictions are accomplished in your brethren that are in the world.
    •  

    I named him Cabo and he lived in the front yard for a few weeks while gaining in strength and health. The two big dogs lived in the backyard, separated from the world by an electric fence that was never “hot.” Eventually, Cabo became healthy and self assured and one day boldly ducked under the wire and braved the back yard. The female Ridgeback immediately claimed the pup as her own.

    One day, after being a part of the family for a couple of months, hubby and I took some treats out to the dogs. Pigs ears, I think they’re called, and our dogs loved them. The two big brown dogs would gobble them up in minutes. This particular day we handed them out, first to the Ridgebacks, who were aggressive to have them, and then to the little guy. He smelled it, but wasn’t sure what to do with it. He was more interested in getting a pet than he was a treat. I kept holding it out for him and he finally took it, realizing that it was all for him.

    What happened next was a sheer pleasure for me to watch. Cabo wasn’t sure what to do with the treat, so he played with it. And, as he did, his whole demeanor turned to joy. He would toss the treat and then fetch it. He rolled, ran, jumped.  He enjoyed this treat to the fullest. It was the funniest thing to watch. I believe, if given the vocal ability, he would have declared this “the best day ever.”

     

    • Ne 8:10 Then he said unto them, Go your way, eat the fat, and drink the sweet, and send portions unto them for whom nothing is prepared: for this day is holy unto our Lord: neither be ye sorry; for the joy of the LORD is your strength.
    •  

    Eventually, the big dogs noticed that the pup still hadn’t eaten his treat. I watched them approach Cabo, slowly and deliberately. Their purpose was clear. The little guy, however, didn’t’ even notice them. He was too busy embracing this newfound joy. The big dogs found a spot to lie down, never taking their eyes off the pig ear. After stern words to the Ridgebacks, I went back inside the house but continued to watch from the windows.

    For the better part of the day Cabo played with his treat. The big dogs stalked him, drooling as they lusted after the pig ear. Of course, they had their own earlier but consumed it so fast they didn’t even enjoy it. Now they wanted his.

    As Christians, do we ever do this? Do we carelessly consume the blessings the Lord gives to each of us, only to envy those of another? How many times do we desire what our brother has, thinking it’s a better treat?

    Unfortunately all puppies grow out of that cute, playful stage. Cabo did as well. His back right leg never fully recovered from the injuries he received before finding his way to our house, but that didn’t slow him down any. Utilizing three legs he could still outrun the other dogs. Had he been placed in a pound I doubt he would have been adopted. The world had left its scars on him and would have rejected him because of it. I found great value, however, in this little dog, simply because he loved me. He never went to his food dish before first coming to me for affection.  When I went into the back yard he was always the first to greet me and stayed the longest. If I stayed outside all day, he would have been by my side the entire time. He lived to please me.

    • Ps 40:7-8 Then said I, Lo, I come: in the volume of the book it is written of me.  I delight to do thy will, O my God: yea, thy law is within my heart.

    Cabo learned discipline well and loved the words of approval afterwards.  As he aged he matured into a calmer dog and one that still looked to his master for attention. The more diligently I worked with him, the deeper the understanding became between us and the stronger the bond. He left behind the playful antics of a pup, but if anything, the joy that he had as a puppy only deepened as he learned that to obey meant more time spent with me.

    • Joh 15:10-11 If ye keep my commandments, ye shall abide in my love; even as I have kept my Father’s commandments, and abide in his love. These things have I spoken unto you, that my joy might remain in you, and that your joy might be full.

    Cabo became a seasoned backyard warrior. He patrolled the perimeters of his half acre yard, knowing that it was but a small portion of a much larger kingdom. He valiantly ran off the evil truck that regularly attempted to steal his masters’ trash. Every week he fiercely fought to make the steel demon set the dumpster back down, and leave in defeat. There was an alfalfa farm north of a tree line through which he could not see, but he was aware that his master worked there often and that made it important. He didn’t understand about the house either, but he knew it was the dwelling place of the master. Even though he couldn’t see it all, or understand most of it, he knew that he belonged there and that he had ownership.

    My broken puppy lived a good long life. He crawled up to my porch, looking for a place to die, and ended up inheriting a place to live. Certainly the teaching process didn’t always come easy for either of us, but the sacrifice given from both sides enabled a relationship that was enriched far beyond simply “owning a dog.”

    There were times when I felt like Cabo. Broken, lost, nowhere to really belong and call home. But Just like Cabo I found a wealth of joy when I realized that I too was found by my Master. I clearly recall the joy that flooded my heart in my early days with the gifts of mercy and grace that He freely gave. Now, after many years of knowing the greatest gift is Himself, I’ve learned to listen for His voice so I too can walk with Him and have a fullness of joy that is only found in Him and not merely His gifts. Now, like Cabo looking towards the alfalfa field, I too look for the return of my Master, when I will finally see Him face to face.

    • 1Cr 13:12 For now we see through a glass, darkly; but then face to face: now I know in part; but then shall I know even as also I am known.
  7.  

    oblogani.gif The Post-trib position in a nutshell compared with the Bible
    A short Bible study on a topic that some want to make way too complicated - Omegaman
    Post-Trib Belief What the Bible (NASB) Says

    The software here makes formatting difficult. There is an easier to read version if you prefer

    July 28th, 2014 - Omegaman 3.0

     

    There will be a time of trouble Jesus called birth pangs

    You will be hearing of wars and rumors of wars. See that you are not frightened, for those things must take place, but that is not yet the end.7“For nation will rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom, and in various places there will be famines and earthquakes. 8“But all these things are merely the beginning of birth pangs. Followed by persecution, even to death, a time of tribulation 9“Then they will deliver you to tribulation, and will kill you, and you will be hated by all nations because of My name. There will be a sign 15“Therefore when you see the ABOMINATION OF DESOLATION which was spoken of through Daniel the prophet, standing in the holy place (let the reader understand), 16then those who are in Judea must flee to the mountains. 

    Then the tribulation will be great, but it will be limited

    21“For then there will be a great tribulation, such as has not occurred since the beginning of the world until now, nor ever will. 22“Unless those days had been cut short, no life would have been saved; but for the sake of the elect those days will be cut short. After the tribulation, Jesus will come visibly in the sky 29“But immediately after the tribulation of those days THE SUN WILL BE DARKENED, AND THE MOON WILL NOT GIVE ITS LIGHT, AND THE STARS WILL FALL from the sky, and the powers of the heavens will be shaken. 30“And then the sign of the Son of Man will appear in the sky, and then all the tribes of the earth will mourn, and they will see the SON OF MAN COMING ON THE CLOUDS OF THE SKY with power and great glory. He then will send angels to gather His elect 31“And He will send forth His angels with A GREAT TRUMPET and THEY WILL GATHER TOGETHER His elect from the four winds, from one end of the sky to the other. In Jesus time, only the Father knew the exact time of Jesus visible return 36“But of that day and hour no one knows, not even the angels of heaven, nor the Son, but the Father alone. But it will be like the days of Noah, when calamity overtook the surprised unbelievers 37“For the coming of the Son of Man will be just like the days of Noah. 38“For as in those days before the flood they were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, until the day that Noah entered the ark, 39and they did not understand until the flood came and took them all away; so will the coming of the Son of Man be. Believers should also be ready for His return, though they do not know the exact time. 42“Therefore be on the alert, for you do not know which day your Lord is coming. 44“For this reason you also must be ready; for the Son of Man is coming at an hour when you do not think He will.

    The Bible, to prevent deception. tells us the order of the events:

    3As He was sitting on the Mount of Olives, the disciples came to Him privately, saying, “Tell us, when will these things happen, and what will be the sign of Your coming, and of the end of the age?”
    4And Jesus answered and said to them, “See to it that no one misleads you."

    Every verse listed so far, was from the 24th Chapter of the book of Matthew. You have just read them yourself, exactly as they are in the bible, and in the same order, so you can see for yourself, what Jesus said about these things.As you can see, He did not use figurative or symbolic language, he was very clear, and used lots of words which indicat time sequences, words like "then" and "at that time". There is no need to spin Jesus' words or make unwarranted assumptions, as many are tempted to do.
    Let's look at some more info from the apostles Paul and from John 

    There will be a time when Jesus catches up (raptures) His church.


    From 1 Thess chapter 4

    Notice again the sequence: The Lord descends from Heaven, a shout, and angel, a trumpet, and those who have died in Christ rise, Then the living Christian join them in the air.


    13But we do not want you to be uninformed, brethren, about those who are asleep, so that you will not grieve as do the rest who have no hope. 14For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so God will bring with Him those who have fallen asleep in Jesus. 15For this we say to you by the word of the Lord, that we who are alive and remain until the coming of the Lord, will not precede those who have fallen asleep. 16For the Lord Himself will descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel and with the trumpet of God, and the dead in Christ will rise first. 17Then we who are alive and remain will be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air, and so we shall always be with the Lord. 

    Like Jesus before him, Paul also said there was a sign to look for, a sigh that would appear before our gathering to Him in the rapture. Beleivers are to look for this man, and by that will now that the 2nd coming of Jesus, is then imminent.

    2 Thess 2

    1Now we request you, brethren, with regard to the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ and our gathering together to Him, 2that you not be quickly shaken from your composure or be disturbed either by a spirit or a message or a letter as if from us, to the effect that the day of the Lord has come. 3Let no one in any way deceive you, for it will not come unless the apostasy comes first, and the man of lawlessness is revealed, the son of destruction, 4who opposes and exalts himself above every so-called god or object of worship, so that he takes his seat in the temple of God, displaying himself as being God. 

    Jesus will come like a thief on unbelievers, but watchful Christians will know that He is about to come.

    1 Thess 5

    1Now as to the times and the epochs, brethren, you have no need of anything to be written to you. 2For you yourselves know full well that the day of the Lord will come just like a thief in the night. 3While they are saying, “Peace and safety!” then destruction will come upon them suddenly like labor pains upon a woman with child, and they will not escape.4But you, brethren, are not in darkness, that the day would overtake you like a thief; 5for you are all sons of light and sons of day. We are not of night nor of darkness; 6so then let us not sleep as others do, but let us be alert and sober. 

    Since we know that the dead in Christ rise first, followed by the rapture (vs 16 & 17 of 1 Thess 4) of the living believers, if we only knew if that resurrection was before or after the tribulation, we could understand if the rapture was before or after the tribulation. Believers who die in the tribulation, for their testimony of Jesus, come to life in the first resurrection, to be followed by the rapture (1 Thess 4:17) rapture.

    4Then I saw thrones, and they sat on them, and judgment was given to them. And I saw the souls of those who had been beheaded because of their testimony of Jesus and because of the word of God, and those who had not worshiped the beast or his image, and had not received the mark on their forehead and on their hand; and they came to life and reigned with Christ for a thousand years. 5(The rest of the dead did not come to life until the thousand years were completed.) This is the first resurrection. 

    This has been a summary of the Post Tribulation Rapture viewpoint, also known as Historic Premillenialism, along with some scripture passages which can be said to support this understanding. There were assertions, and there were supporting verses and passages, without inserting things like an invisible, secret coming (is there even one verse that says that? If so, I have never seen it), and idea that has become popular in modern times.

    I tried to keep this faithful to scripture, I tried to make it simple and clear. Jesus and Paul warned about deceptions to come, I take those warning seriously. Paul had this to say as well:

    3For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but wanting to have their ears tickled, they will accumulate for themselves teachers in accordance to their own desires, 4and will turn away their ears from the truth and will turn aside to myths. 5But you, be sober in all things, endure hardship, do the work of an evangelist, fulfill your ministry. 2 Tim 4

    I will end with this thought from the book of Acts:

    19“Therefore repent and return, so that your sins may be wiped away, in order that times of refreshing may come from the presence of the Lord; 20and that He may send Jesus, the Christ appointed for you, 21whom heaven must receive until the period of restoration of all things about which God spoke by the mouth of His holy prophets from ancient time.

    Some versions render that as "He must remain in heaven until the time"

    Personally, I find all these verses harmonize perfectly well with each other, and I beleive the Post-Trib rapture position, is consistant with them as well. I hope you found this helpful and informative
     



    (Reply to a question - question asker asked for question to be deleted - but ok to leave answer if name not mentioned)

    Your reply touches on something that is always an issue, the idea of interpretation. I have no idea if I am right or I am wrong, I believe I am right of course, otherwise I would change my view, lol.

    However, where I think my understanding and belief is different from many, is that I try not to interpret at all, I just read, and try to understand. If you read my post, and I assume you did, you will have noticed that I did two things - I stated aspects of the doctrine which I accept, and then I stated the scripture that appears to support those points. 

    You will have noticed that what I did not do was things like:

    "You see where it says 'elect', that is the Jews!" or:

    "See where it says the restrainer?" - that is the Holy Spirit:

    Those sorts of things, are interpretations, I just pointed out scripture and let it speak for itself.

    The things that are usually used to demonstrate a pre-tribulation rapture, are interpretations at best, usually they are arguments from silence, or assumed inferences not warranted by the text.

    For example, all of the ways people try to see a sudden, secret, any moment visit by Jesus, well, it is just odd, since the text never says any such thing. While I know people do not intend harm, it strikes me as dishonest to treat scripture so carelessly.

    Of course, I just stepped on millions of toes with that statement, but it frustrates me that people cannot see the difference between their assumptions and what the Bible actually says, and does not say.

    In my post I didn't even mention all the evidences that demonstrate the errors of pre-trib assumptions, I just tried to give positive evidence for a post trib position, and I did not have to assume or twist anything to do that - just posted scripture. I could still be in error for my understanding, but I do not think my understanding is unreasonable, and I expect that many others might notice that. My main point in my reply, that I would like you to take away, is that stating scripture, is not an interpretation, it is just stating scripture. I pointed out how, those scriptures might represent what I have come to believe. If the difference is not obvious, then I just wasted my time, but it will not be the first time I have done that.

    Thanks for taking the time to read my post and respond.

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    Recent Entries

    The_Patriot2016
    Latest Entry

    The Loner

        Recently, Ive been reading a lot of western novels (I know, me, read westerns) And I got to thinking, you know, there are a lot of different "characters" or types of people, in these novels, that all go together, to make the story real, and then I thought, I wondered what would happen, if I made a comparison of these different types of people, to people in the church today, and if it would be relevant. And keep in mind, many of these types, intermix, and share characteristics, and many people change from one to another. They all have strengths, and weaknesses, and when combined can make for a well oiled church. I am going to start a series, discussing these different types of people, their strengths, their weaknesses, and how they can help others, and how to help them.

        The one I'm going to discuss today is "the loner". The loner, is someone who tends to avoid other people, to avoid hurt. In the novels, hes often a hermit, or someone who sticks to himself, often because of some past hurt, loss of a loved one, a fortune, or just burned by to many people. The person is often quiet, stays out of the way and no one thinks twice about them, but usually ends up playing some vital part in the story. Often, this person comes to the realization that they cant hide from all their problems, and there are more important things and people need help, and they come out and save the day.

        The modern day loner, like the ones in the books, tend to carry around a lot of pain, and a lot of baggage, and like the ones in the books, their answer to dealing with it, is basically to retreat inside themselves. They may attend church for awhile, but usually, end up forsaking the church. The pain comes from many sources, personal life, loss of a loved one, sometimes mental issues, and often, even from the church, and their answer is to retreat within themselves. If they are in church they are hiding alone in a back pew, or at home listening to a TV preacher. They have a hard time seeing past the pain and the hurt, and they have grown to not see any good in others.

        Now, they also, usually have big hearts and can be very caring people, they have often been through tough things, and can relate to others, and really be a great person to have in the church family, just for that very reason, but reaching them can be tough. They need to know that they are not alone, and that they are loved, and encouraged to reach out for help, that even though the church isnt perfect it is there for them. It often takes a lot of patience, and prayer, to reach this kind of person, but once you get them on your side, just like in the novels, they can play a instrumental role in your church, and can literally, move mountains. They often work behind the scenes, helping others that feel alone.  Their experience with pain, can be both their greatest weakness-but also their greatest strength.

        Each "loner" is different, about the best advice that can be applied all around, is to pray for them, and love on them, and listen to them, and be very encouraging. Beyond that, each ones different, but will take patience, and a lot of love to earn their trust. Once you do, you will not regret it. And if you are a loner reading this, please, remember, that God does love you, and promises to be there for you-if you let him. And please, I realize the church maybe hurtful, but it does need you, and the talents you alone can provide. Its tough, but try to look for the good in people, remember, God loves you!

    Here are some comforting verses, that may come as comfort to "the loner" in your life. All verses are taken out of the KJV

    Deuteronomy 31:6
    6 Be strong and of a good courage, fear not, nor be afraid of them: for the Lord thy God, he it is that doth go with thee; he will not fail thee, nor forsake thee.


    Psalm 91:15
    15 He shall call upon me, and I will answer him: I will be with him in trouble; I will deliver him, and honour him.


    Psalm 94:17-18
    17 Unless the Lord had been my help, my soul had almost dwelt in silence.
    18 When I said, My foot slippeth; thy mercy, O Lord, held me up.


    Isaiah 43:1-5 
    43 But now thus saith the Lord that created thee, O Jacob, and he that formed thee, O Israel, Fear not: for I have redeemed thee, I have called thee by thy name; thou art mine.
    2 When thou passest through the waters, I will be with thee; and through the rivers, they shall not overflow thee: when thou walkest through the fire, thou shalt not be burned; neither shall the flame kindle upon thee.
    3 For I am the Lord thy God, the Holy One of Israel, thy Saviour: I gave Egypt for thy ransom, Ethiopia and Seba for thee.
    4 Since thou wast precious in my sight, thou hast been honourable, and I have loved thee: therefore will I give men for thee, and people for thy life.
    5 Fear not: for I am with thee: I will bring thy seed from the east, and gather thee from the west;


    Matthew 28:20
    20 Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and, lo, I am with you always, even unto the end of the world. Amen.


    John 14:18
    18 I will not leave you comfortless: I will come to you


    1 Timothy 4:16-17
    16 At my first answer no man stood with me, but all men forsook me: I pray God that it may not be laid to their charge.
    17 Notwithstanding the Lord stood with me, and strengthened me; that by me the preaching might be fully known, and that all the Gentiles might hear: and I was delivered out of the mouth of 

     

    the loner 2.png

  8. Why is the church divided by denominations?

    Posted by Omegaman 2.0 on the September 4th, 2007

    divisionhalf.jpg

    Why are there so many denominations? Why is the church divided?

    I see these questions occasionally in chat. They are good questions. It is a question Christians have, especially new believers trying to choose their first church. It is a question non-believers have too. For them, it is evidence that Christians cannot even agree on what the Bible says. Truthfully, they are right. In the chatroom, we see this frequently. We have debates over doctrines and understandings, thankfully most of it is good natured, though often passionate. It is also stimulating intellectually, it drives people to the pages of scripture to see what the bible does indeed say about things, so, these differences can have a positive effect. Imagine if we all agreed! Would that necessarily guarantee we were correct, or could we all agree on the same misunderstandings?

    Jude 17-1917 But you, beloved, ought to remember the words that were spoken beforehand by the apostles of our Lord Jesus Christ, 18 that they were saying to you, “In the last time there shall be mockers, following after their own ungodly lusts.” 19 These are the ones who cause divisions, worldly-minded, devoid of the Spirit.

    Notice that in the passage above, divisions are not a good thing. Notice though, that Jude says that these people who cause divisions, are mockers who follow their unGodly lusts, and do not have the Spirit. These people, if we were to follow after them, would lead us away from the things of God. If you separate from your brethren to hang instead with your buddies at a bar, that is real division, not to be compared with denominations at all.

    1 Cor 11:18-20

    18 For, in the first place, when you come together as a church, I hear that divisions exist among you; and in part, I believe it. 19 For there must also be factions among you, in order that those who are approved may have become evident among you.

    In the above passage, Paul speaks of another kind of division. This one is also not a denominational division, he is addressing division among those gathered together at one place. The passage has a negative feel to it, as though Paul is disapproving of it. You see that in his statement “and in part, I believe it”. Then he goes on to say that these factions have to exist! The reason: So you can distinguish between those who are sound in the faith, and those who do not have approval. Again, in this case, division is a good thing, not a bad thing.

    So, what is a denomination anyway?

    Look at the following definitions from Mirriam-Webster Dictionary:

    3. NAME, DESIGNATION; especially : a general name for a category

    4. A religious organization whose congregations are united in their adherence to its beliefs and practices.

    Didn’t see that one coming did you? Notice that a denomination is a uniting factor, not a dividing factor! There is a running joke between on of the other chat administrators and I, about Calvary Chapels. Calvary Chapels are a group of churches, who are self described as non-denominational. In the definitions above, denomination has to do with the name of something. Calvary Chapels have the name Calvary Chapel - obviously. As far as I know, they are united in their beliefs and practices. Do some CCs sprinkle while others dunk? No. Are there any CCs that teach the Jesus will not return for His church until after the great tribulation? I haven’t heard of one. Are their CC’s that do not believe in the perpetuity of the gifts of the Holy Spirit? I don’t think so. If it looks like a duck, walks like a duck, quacks like a duck, chances are it is a duck.

    So what is going one here? Why would a group of churches, who are united in belief, practice, and name, claim to be non-denominational? I have a theory. I believe that it is about marketing. Denominationalism, has a bad reputation. It smacks of stodgy old ways, inflexibility, to some, it is judgmental, rigid, organized religion. To be non-denominational, is hip. It sounds like you stand apart. It is similar to what we have in the states politically, when you register as a non partisan. It sounds like you are independent - have your own thoughts and views. It makes you different. Of course, in the real world, you are unique, just like everybody else.

    We have a church near were I live. It used to be called the First Baptist Church, or something like that (I always wondered where the second Baptist church is, but that is another story). Lately, they took done the familiar name plaque, and put up a very colorful one, now it is called Sonlight Christian Center, or some such thing. Marketing again, I suspect, who wants to hang out with Baptists? Of course, they still are Baptists, but they ‘needed’ a hipper name.

    So, am I against denominations? Am I against independent churches? Am I against churches that say they are but are not? I am not against any of those things. Let’s look at another passage:

    1 Cor 1:10-1310 Now I exhort you, brethren, by the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that you all agree, and there be no divisions among you, but you be made complete in the same mind and in the same judgment. 11 For I have been informed concerning you, my brethren, by Chloe’s people, that there are quarrels among you. 12 Now I mean this, that each one of you is saying, “I am of Paul,” and “I of Apollos,” and “I of Cephas,” and “I of Christ.” 13 Has Christ been divided? Paul was not crucified for you, was he? Or were you baptized in the name of Paul?

    That is a type of denominationalism that is not good. We do what these people are doing when we start gathering around a personality, like an author of a series of books, a famous preacher, or even the teachings of a great theologian from church history. Paul is pointing out, that there is only one church. All those who have been forgiven their sins through Jesus’ sacrifice, are the one church. It matter not what you call the church, who pastors it, who founded it, where it is, what language they speak, which bible version they prefer, what worship style they employ, or whether they meet in a beautiful building with hardwoods and stained glass, or an old factory, storefront, or even a home. If Christ is preached and they believe the bible, I am united with them, not divided from them. How can there not be denominations? When their are different countries and languages, customs and tastes, there will be denominations. When everybody belongs to one denomination, all agreeing, you can be sure that something evil or something wonderful has happened. If Jesus has returned for us, then it is something wonderful, until that day, their will be divisions based on preferences, understandings, languages customs, and sadly, even skin color.

    When you are a mature Christian, you will recognize the oneness of the church and stop focusing on petty differences. Do you give offerings only at your church? If so, why? Are there not other churches that have needs greater than yours? When Paul traveled in the first century, the offering he gathered where for other churches, those who were able, helped those who were needy. That is unity. Giving of your substance to other brothers and sisters, because you recognize that they are family.

    I am honored to be a part of Worthychat. Here, we come together from around the world. We are of different denominations, yet here, we are united. Do we squabble? Of course we do, what family doesn’t? Most husbands and wives squabble at times, yet, they remain one flesh, a unity. Differences do not mean you are divided, they just mean there are differences. We are human, God made us as individuals, not clones, celebrate the differences.

    1 Cor 12:12-2712 For even as the body is one and yet has many members, and all the members of the body, though they are many, are one body, so also is Christ. 13 For by one Spirit we were all baptized into one body, whether Jews or Greeks, whether slaves or free, and we were all made to drink of one Spirit. 14 For the body is not one member, but many. 15 If the foot should say, “Because I am not a hand, I am not a part of the body,” it is not for this reason any the less a part of the body. 16 And if the ear should say, “Because I am not an eye, I am not a part of the body,” it is not for this reason any the less a part of the body. 17 If the whole body were an eye, where would the hearing be? If the whole were hearing, where would the sense of smell be? 18 But now God has placed the members, each one of them, in the body, just as He desired. 19 And if they were all one member, where would the body be? 20 But now there are many members, but one body. 21 And the eye cannot say to the hand, “I have no need of you”; or again the head to the feet, “I have no need of you.” 22 On the contrary, it is much truer that the members of the body which seem to be weaker are necessary; 23 and those members of the body, which we deem less honorable, on these we bestow more abundant honor, and our unseemly members come to have more abundant seemliness, 24 whereas our seemly members have no need of it. But God has so composed the body, giving more abundant honor to that member which lacked, 25 that there should be no division in the body, but that the members should have the same care for one another. 26 And if one member suffers, all the members suffer with it; if one member is honored, all the members rejoice with it. 27 Now you are Christ’s body, and individually members of it.

    I would like to end with one final thought (I could go on and on, but I am feeling merciful tonight). People like to gather with others who are like them, the feel comfortable and part of something. Try to be accommodating in that way toward others, make them feel welcomed. But when you go out to look for a church to be part of, you will be tempted to find one, that suits your tastes and your beliefs. I am all for that, but I would like to caution you to keep things in perspective. Sound doctrine is more important that the style of worship or how nice the facilities are. If you try a new church, give it a chance, attend it three times at least, unless in is plainly scripturally unsound. If you have a personal belief about something, and you want to be around others who share that belief, don’t make it the central thing if it is a peripheral issue or not even a scriptural one, find a church that teaches the Bible, as it is, not with massaged meanings to make it fit what you wish it said. It is O.K. to be uncomfortable too, it can stretch and grow you. O.K., so that was two final thoughts, sue me.

    Thank you for taking the time out of your busy life to read this, now go into the chatroom and join the one body, your brothers and sisters in Christ. Omegaman