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    • I said, "You know nothing about me.  You're just an internet personality...just like me!  You have no idea where I've been.  You have no idea of my devotion.   You may have some idea that I'm a disgruntled Christian who is sick of other Christians condemning me AND VERY SICK OF CHRISTIANS WHO ATTRIBUTE ALL OF THE END-TIME EVILS TO CHRISTIANS AND THE CHURCH.  I'M FLIPPING OVER YOUR MILLIONAIRE PRE=TRIB TABLES, AND YOUR CHRISTIAN CHURCH IN APOSTASY BALONY." You said, I have no anger hostility, or sesentment toward you, just that a million Christians demonize themselves by doing what you're doing, i.e. attributing all of the end-time evils of 2 Thes. 2 to believers and the church when not ONE of you can show me WHY you believe WHAT you believe. I have a stern attitude toward blasphemy and an outright perversion of God's Word.  If you or anyone else can't show me where believers are found in the passage, maybe you should reconsider What you believe.  But the words, "I was wrong" just doesn't seem to appear in a Christians vocabulary.
    • Regardless what you think of me, I wish you would just look at this logically enough to stop blaming themselves for this evil.  It's NOT about me, it's about the results of my studies which results I accept and let change my mind.  I use to believe what you do on it.
    • This isn't splitting hairs, it's the difference between black and white.  It's the difference between the falling away and the evilsinthe passage being attributed to CHRISTIANS and the CHURCH.  In other words, the passage is about the man of sin and his followers, but for some reason, most believers love put themselve and THEIR religion, their Christian's, and their church in the middle of this evil.  They like to say this because they say they ARE NOT part of it because they are the TRUE church, they are true Christians.  They say the ones mentioned in the apostasy of 2 Thes. 2 are the false church, the heretical church, the inclusive church of all the world's religions, that's how Christian build themselves up.  I know what you're saying but what you describe ISN'T apostasy.  There are different ways the early church dealt with false teachers and false prophets.  False prophets were typically "among the people," they were NOT in the church.  Many of them just followed Peter and Paul around trying to gain a following of their own by 'sheep stealing,' usually for MONEY.  IF they were in the church, they were easily identifyable and thrown out. False teachers who were in the church and NOT preaching DAMNABLE heresy WERE ALLOWED TO STAY IN THE CHURCH, but people were admonished to avoid them. WHERE are we warned that false christ would come from WITHIN THE CHURCH?  Especially in the end-times?  I'm not sure?  A false Christ can simply be an anointed one of another religion, or can also be one that claims he IS christ.  Most people just disregard the fact that many in Islam are expecting jesus to return also.  And Rome???  Rome is not Babylon. Babylon is not Rome.'s just NOT found in any verse or passage of bible prophecy.  I keep asking people to show me where ROME is found in prophecy, but nobody ever shows me where! Just like he tempted Christ, the devil has been tempting the Church from day one.  IF you want to use the word 'idol,' Christians have had their idols since day one.  Jesus has parables about it.  What happened in Babylon was a real APOSTASIA where people were forced into accepting "the national religion."  But you're talking millenia ago.  Today, I just can't believe in a global apostasy resulting in a national religion.  Religion has become divisive as politics making it illogical to believe in a global government and religion.   "People say the anti-christ is a global dictator coming in peacefully, but the history of the world is that when one country tries to take over another it causes a war.  It's illogical to think one or two men could somehow unite the world politically and religiously."  It's illogical to think a national religion is coming. The lie that all paths lead to God can be considered apostasy. , but in 2 Thes. 2, it's an END-TIME event.  It's not something that began centuries ago and progressed up to today.  It's the end-time event that brings on the man of sin.   What makes you think "the secret power of lawlessness;  the lawless one;  whom the Lord Jesus will destroy; counterfeit signs, miracles, and wonders; every sort of evil that deceives those who "are perishing"; who refuse to love the truth and so be saved;  and delight in wickedness; and God sends them powerful delusion so that they will believe a lie! " HAS ANYTHING TO DO WITH THE CHURCH OR CHRISTIANS! Why would God send His own Christians powerful delusion?  This passage is talking about Muslims not Christians.  To attribute this to the end-time church say's nothing good about the power of God's Holy Spirit whom He say's He will pour out in the last days!  To teach that this is the kind of thing God's church will support in the last day's is blasphemy.  Why would anybody want to convert to Christ knowing that the church teaches it goes bad, accepts the man of sin, becomes an end-time harlot, and produces the man of sin?  It's self demonization.
      The only region and religion capable of fulfilling this is Islam.  A one world government and one world religion???  It's time to reconsider what the prophecy experts have been teaching you.  It is happening in ISIS and the Arab Middle East.
    • As I stated earlier, if you want to know what mystery is finished at the seventh trumpet, read the seventh trumpet.  No need to employ straw-men.  This is the seventh trumpet: Then the seventh angel sounded; and there were loud voices in heaven, saying, “The kingdom of the world has become the kingdom of our Lord and of His Christ; and He will reign forever and ever.” And the twenty-four elders, who sit on their thrones before God, fell on their faces and worshiped God, saying, “We give You thanks, O Lord God, the Almighty, who are and who were, because You have taken Your great power and have begun to reign.  And the nations were enraged, and Your wrath came, and the time came for the dead to be judged, and the time to reward Your bond-servants the prophets and the saints and those who fear Your name, the small and the great, and to destroy those who destroy the earth.”  And the temple of God which is in heaven was opened; and the ark of His covenant appeared in His temple, and there were flashes of lightning and sounds and peals of thunder and an earthquake and a great hailstorm.  Revelation 11:15-19 I'd be happy to list the times that the prophets talked about the kingdom of God on earth if you wish.  I'll do so right after you list where the prophets describe God's kingdom as beginning with the reign of the Antichrist because that's what you're saying happens.  Where did God reveal that to His servants the prophets?  I'm only interested in scriptures.  Please quote them. Hopefully you can see how irrational and conflicted your chronology is.  Seventh trumpet = the mystery of the kingdom is finished (see above scripture) as God revealed it to His servants the prophets.  The kingdom of God is established on earth.  That's what He revealed to His prophets.  Didn't He?  Regime change.  Revelation 12-19 is not chronological to, but provides additional insight for, Revelation 6-11.
    • Thank you, Reinitin, for sharing this testimony....that is a very good thing!   In His Love, Suzanne
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