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    • Many thanks for the info on Sep 23. As for Ps 41:9, David was referring to someone who betrayed to him. Maybe Ahithophel. That’s how OT readers would have understood it. It was not intended as prophecy, otherwise we would have to explain how the disease in 41:8 was fulfilled by Jesus. The NT nevertheless draws parallels between the lives of David and Jesus so as to show that Jesus qualifies as the “son” of David because many features of his life mirrored that of David’s. It is typology not prophecy.
    • That could depend on what version of the bible you read & how they have translated the Hebrew word. As it is it is translated differently even in the same bible, these are possibly the major factors followed by our own preconceived ideas that you have been brought up on, then getting the bible to fit your idea. Hell, pit, grave, Gehenna,(Hades Greek & Sheol Hebrew,same I may have missed some thats just off the top of my head.  The Jewish publication society bible & the Tanakh/ the complete Jewish bible make no mention of Hall in their bibles if the Jews being experts in their own Hebrew language don't include hell. I think that would only confirm that there is no single word that means hell in the Hebrew manuscripts. There are also several bible versions also rejecting any notion of hell occurring in the Greek manuscripts of the new testament. It was first introduced the Catholic church & incorporated into their bible by Jerome. Who also mistranslated as many as four different words to mean hell  
    •   The references to Isaiah 26, Psalm 27, Zephaniah 2, and Jeremiah 30 all speak to the nation of Israel, and not the church.  They also are all addressing what is happening on earth, not things that will take place in heaven, so none of these in any way speak to a rapture.  What they speak to is the same thing one finds in Revelation 12 regarding Israel during the 3 1/2 year period of the great tribulation.   Revelation 12:13 And when the dragon saw that he had been thrown down to the earth, he pursued the woman who had given birth to the male child. 14 But the woman was given the two wings of the great eagle so that she might fly from the serpent into the wilderness, to the place where she is to be nourished for a time, and times, and half a time. 15 The serpent poured water like a river out of his mouth after the woman, to sweep her away with a flood. 16 But the earth came to the help of the woman, and the earth opened its mouth and swallowed the river that the dragon had poured from his mouth.   Zechariah prophesied about 2/3 of Israel that will be cut off and die, and 1/3 that will be brought through the fire, this would be the righteous mentioned in all of the passages you referenced.  None of this has anything to do with Gentiles, these prophecies were all in regards to Israel. God bless
    • Don't think we will ever agree,so I'll just leave this for now I Thessalonians 4:13-18 The subject is where are the dead. V13 But I would not have you to be ignorant, brethren, concerning them which are asleep, that ye sorrow not, even as others which have no hope. asleep in Greek means to decease, to be dead. This is talking about people that are already dead not people that are living on earth now. The second our flesh body dies our soul goes back to God. Ecclesiastes 12:7
      V7 Then shall the dust return to the earth as it was: and the spirit shall return unto God who gave it. We can take comfort knowing that our loved ones who have passed on are with God our Father and not lying in a hole in the ground. The flesh body stays in the ground but our soul goes back to God. The people that have no hope are those that do not believe in Jesus Christ as the only begotten Son of God. V14 For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so them also which sleep in Jesus will God bring with him. This is talking about people that have passed on that believed in Jesus Christ as the Son of God. V15 For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep. Prevent means to precede before hand, to have arrived at already. We are still talking about where the dead are the subject has not changed. This verse tells us that people that have died are already with Jesus. The people alive when Jesus returns will not be with Jesus before the people that have already passed away because they are already there. V16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first: This tells us when Jesus will return and not before. This is not the rapture. The rapture is a lie and can not be found in God's word. This is talking about the second coming of Jesus at the end of the tribulation. Jesus will come at the seventh trump and not before the seventh trump for anyone. Those that have died already rise first because they are already with Jesus. The second we die we go back to God our Father. V17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord. This happens after the tribulation when Jesus returns as Lord of lords and King of kings. This is not talking about a rapture, their is no rapture. Clouds is symbolic for a mass of people. Hebrews 12:1
      V1 Wherefore seeing we also are compassed about with so great a cloud of witnesses, let us lay aside every weight, and the sin which doth so easily beset us, and let us run with patience the race that is set before us, When Jesus returns at the seventh trump the people alive on earth at that time will be changed into their spiritual bodies in the twinkling of an eye. I Corinthians 15:52-53
      V52 In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.
      V53 For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality. The rapture is a lie from Satan trying to trick God's children into believing in a easy way out. Always remember as long as we are still in our flesh bodies the true Christ has not returned yet. Satan will come back to this earth with supernatural powers saying he is Christ here to rapture you away but it is a lie. V18 Wherefore comfort one another with these words. We can comfort our loved ones and friends when they lose some one they love because we can tell them where their loved ones are when they pass away. The moment some one dies they go back to God our Father. You may be surprised to know that God's word does say something about people teaching you to fly away to try to save your soul. What does God's word say about this, lets go to Ezekiel 13 to find out. Ezekiel 13:16-23 V16 To wit, the prophets of Israel which prophesy concerning Jerusalem, and which see visions of peace for her, and there is no peace, saith the Lord GOD Their will be no true peace until Jesus returns to this earth after the antichrist has been here and not before, for anyone. Some people believe in the false peace of the rapture and it is just that a false peace. The prophets talked about here are false prophets not teaching the true word of God. People telling you that you don't have to read the book of Revelation because you'll be gone. They are lying to you, their is no rapture and God is against people that tell you their is. V17 Likewise, thou son of man, set thy face against the daughters of thy people, which prophesy out of their own heart; and prophesy thou against them, This is telling people who know the truth to tell the truth to God's other children. The ones that prophesy out of their own heart are ones that go on teaching the lie that their is a rapture when God Himself said that it's not true. V18 And say, Thus saith the Lord GOD; Woe to the women that sew pillows to all armholes, and make kerchiefs upon the head of every stature to hunt souls! Will ye hunt the souls of my people, and will ye save the souls alive that come unto you? The pillows and kerchiefs these false prophets use to cover the outstretched arms of Jesus by teaching the lie of the rapture. The people that teach others the rapture are leading them right to the arms of the antichrist. Nowhere in the word of God does it say that Jesus will come for anybody before the great tribulation. God asked if these false prophets will save these people that they lie to by teaching them the rapture. When in fact these false prophets are leading these people straight to death, the antichrist. Only Jesus Christ can save somebody. V19 And will ye pollute me among my people for handfuls of barley and for pieces of bread, to slay the souls that should not die, and to save the souls alive that should not live, by your lying to my people that hear your lies? Some people are lying to God's children just for money. They are slaying souls by teaching people the rapture which will lead them right into the arms of the antichrist when he comes to earth claiming to be Jesus Christ. V20 Wherefore thus saith the Lord GOD; Behold, I am against your pillows, wherewith ye there hunt the souls to make them fly, and I will tear them from your arms, and will let the souls go, even the souls that ye hunt to make them fly. God Himself is against the teaching of a quick escape to save your soul. God is saying that their is no rapture. The true Jesus Christ is not coming back for anyone until after the antichrist has already been on earth, God said so. God is against people that teach lies to His children about the rapture. It covers the outstretched arms of the true Jesus by leading His children right into the arms of the antichrist. V21 Your kerchiefs also will I tear, and deliver my people out of your hand, and they shall be no more in your hand to be hunted; and ye shall know that I am the LORD. God will save His people from the lie of the rapture by giving the truth in His word. Read the word on your own and ask God to give you understanding in His word so you can see the truth about the rapture. V22 Because with lies ye have made the heart of the righteous sad, whom I have not made sad; and strengthened the hands of the wicked, that he should not return from his wicked way, by promising him life: The righteous is Jesus Christ, we all fall short to His righteousness. God is telling us by people teaching the lie of the rapture Jesus becomes sad. Sad because they are being deceived and lead strait to the antichrist. By teaching the rapture people strengthen the hand of Satan who is the antichrist. V23 Therefore ye shall see no more vanity, nor divine divinations: for I will deliver my people out of your hand: and ye shall know that I am the LORD. God will deliver His people by giving them the truth in His word. In II Thessalonians 2:1-12 it talks about the return of Jesus Christ. It tells us their are certain things that must happen before Jesus returns to this earth. II Thessalonians 2:1-12 V1 Now we beseech you, brethren, by the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, and by our gathering together unto him, Beseech means to ask or request a person to do something. This is telling us to pay attention because this tells us what must happen before Jesus returns. V2 That ye be not soon shaken in mind, or be troubled, neither by spirit, nor by word, nor by letter as from us, as that the day of Christ is at hand. This is saying don't believe people when they say Jesus Christ can come at any time. Their are things that must happen before Jesus returns. V3 Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition; Don't let any one deceive you, read God's word with understanding. This verse tells us that Jesus will not return until the son of perdition be revealed. Perdition means to perish and die. Satan is the only one who has been sentenced to death by God so far. Ezekiel 28:11-19
      V11 Moreover the word of the LORD came unto me, saying,
      V12 Son of man, take up a lamentation upon the king of Tyrus, and say unto him, Thus saith the Lord GOD; Thou sealest up the sum, full of wisdom, and perfect in beauty.
      V13 Thou hast been in Eden the garden of God; every precious stone was thy covering, the sardius, topaz, and the diamond, the beryl, the onyx, and the jasper, the sapphire, the emerald, and the carbuncle, and gold: the workmanship of thy tabrets and of thy pipes was prepared in thee in the day that thou wast created.
      V14 Thou art the anointed cherub that covereth; and I have set thee so: thou wast upon the holy mountain of God; thou hast walked up and down in the midst of the stones of fire.
      V15 Thou wast perfect in thy ways from the day that thou wast created, till iniquity was found in thee.
      V16 By the multitude of thy merchandise they have filled the midst of thee with violence, and thou hast sinned: therefore I will cast thee as profane out of the mountain of God: and I will destroy thee, O covering cherub, from the midst of the stones of fire.
      V17 Thine heart was lifted up because of thy beauty, thou hast corrupted thy wisdom by reason of thy brightness: I will cast thee to the ground, I will lay thee before kings, that they may behold thee.
      V18 Thou hast defiled thy sanctuaries by the multitude of thine iniquities, by the iniquity of thy traffick; therefore will I bring forth a fire from the midst of thee, it shall devour thee, and I will bring thee to ashes upon the earth in the sight of all them that behold thee.
      V19 All they that know thee among the people shall be astonished at thee: thou shalt be a terror, and never shalt thou be any more. John 17:12
      V12 While I was with them in the world, I kept them in Thy name: those that Thou gavest Me I have kept, and none of them is lost, but the son of perdition; that the scripture might be fulfilled. II Thessalonians verse 3 tells us that Jesus will not come for anyone until Satan is revealed. Their is no rapture. Jesus will not come for anybody until that happens. Satan is the one that deceives the world and that can be read in Revelation 12:9 and 20:10 Revelation 12:9
      V9 And the great dragon was cast out, that old serpent, called the Devil, and Satan, which deceiveth the whole world: he was cast out into the earth, and his angels were cast out with him. Revelation 20:10
      V10 And the devil that deceived them was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are, and shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever. V4 Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God. Satan is the antichrist and will return to this earth with supernatural powers able to have lighting fall from heaven. Many will be deceived and think that he is Jesus here to rapture them away. Satan will sit in the temple of God which is in Jerusalem. V6 And now ye know what withholdeth that he might be revealed in his time.
      V7 For the mystery of iniquity doth already work: only he who now letteth will let, until he be taken out of the way. Satan will be cast out of heaven down to earth to play the roll of Jesus Christ. Satan will say that he is here to rapture you away but as always Satan is lying. Satan will be cast out of heaven by Michael in the last days. Revelation 12:7-9
      V7 And there was war in heaven: Michael and his angels fought against the dragon; and the dragon fought and his angels,
      V8 And prevailed not; neither was their place found any more in heaven.
      V9 And the great dragon was cast out, that old serpent, called the Devil, and Satan, which deceiveth the whole world: he was cast out into the earth, and his angels were cast out with him. This will happen before the true Jesus returns to this earth. The true Jesus will not come for any one until Satan is already here on earth. V8 And then shall that Wicked be revealed, whom the Lord shall consume with the spirit of his mouth, and shall destroy with the brightness of his coming: This is when Satan is on this earth saying he is Jesus here to rapture you away. Then the true Jesus returns to earth as King of kings and Lord of lords and Satan is bound for a thousand years. Revelation 20:1-3
      V1 And I saw an angel come down from heaven, having the key of the bottomless pit and a great chain in his hand.
      V2 And he laid hold on the dragon, that old serpent, which is the Devil, and Satan, and bound him a thousand years,
      V3 And cast him into the bottomless pit, and shut him up, and set a seal upon him, that he should deceive the nations no more, till the thousand years should be fulfilled: and after that he must be loosed a little season. V9 Even him, whose coming is after the working of Satan with all power and signs and lying wonders, Jesus returns after Satan has already been on earth claming to be Jesus saying he is here to rapture you away. Satan is the antichrist and he will come before the true Jesus Christ. V10 And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved. Many will be deceived by Satan because he is the king of deception. He will have supernatural powers and many will believe that he is Jesus because they did not receive the truth in God's word. We need to read the word of God on our own and ask Him to give us understanding in His word. Don't believe what anyone tells you read God's word for your self it's your life. V11 And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie:
      V12 That they all might be damned who believed not the truth, but had pleasure in unrighteousness. People who don't read God's word with understanding and do not believe in the truth of His word will go on believing in lies. We are to study God's word. II Timothy 2:15
      V15 Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth. Read God's word and ask Him to give you understanding in His word. The rapture is a total lie from Satan himself. Nowhere in God's word does it say that Jesus will come back for any one before Satan comes to earth as the antichrist. As long as we are still in our flesh bodies the true Jesus Christ has not returned yet. Just know,your very soul is at stake..........
    • According to the popular belief, Jesus is going to reign 1000 years in person, presumably right after the last of the plagues. The earth is going to look something like, to be honest, after reading the following it would be anyone's guess as to what it would look like, but one thing for sure, it will be uninhabitable.  Isaiah 24:19 
       ‭The earth is utterly broken down, the earth is clean dissolved, the earth is moved exceedingly.‭ Isaiah 24:20 
       ‭The earth shall reel to and fro like a drunkard, and shall be removed like a cottage; and the transgression thereof shall be heavy upon it; and it shall fall, and not rise again.‭  Isaiah 13:13 
       ‭Therefore I will shake the heavens, and the earth shall remove out of her place, in the wrath of the LORD of hosts, and in the day of his fierce anger.‭  Jeremiah 4:23 
       ‭I beheld the earth, and, lo, ‭it was‭ without form, and void; and the heavens, and they ‭had‭ no light.‭  4:24 
       ‭I beheld the mountains, and, lo, they trembled, and all the hills moved lightly.‭  4:25 
       ‭I beheld, and, lo, ‭there was‭ no man, and all the birds of the heavens were fled. 4:26 
       ‭I beheld, and, lo, the fruitful place ‭was‭ a wilderness, and all the cities thereof were broken down at the presence of the LORD, ‭and‭ by his fierce anger.‭   
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      Hebrews 12   Therefore, since we are surrounded by so great a cloud of witnesses, let us also lay aside every weight, and sin which clings so closely, and let us run with endurance the race that is set before us,  2 looking to Jesus, the founder and perfecter of our faith, who for the joy that was set before him endured the cross, despising the shame, and is seated at the right hand of the throne of God.
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