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The fact that there are unsaved people here, and still lots of work to do. People in Heaven, do not need our help, people here do! 21For to me, to live is Christ and to die is gain. 22But if I am to live on in the flesh, this will meanfruitful labor for me; and I do not know which to choose. 23But I am hard-pressed from both directions,having the desire to depart and be with Christ, for that is very much better; 24yet to remain on in the flesh is more necessary for your sake. 25Convinced of this, I know that I will remain and continue with you all for your progress and joy in the faith, 26so that your proud confidence in me may abound in Christ Jesus through my coming to you again. Phillipians 1

Yes, but easily obtained. Take a cow, slit open it's belly, pull the cow out of it's skin, and use the legs for laces.

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"The Bondage breaker "from Neil Anderson is a good book to start with...

I recently listened to a friend's testimony in church. It was a part of her life that few people knew about. Her father had molested her from the time she was a young child until she was a teenager and could get away. She later blamed herself for him being put away and breaking up the family. For years, she just buried it and "forgot" about it. Later, God dealt with her that leaving it buried was not healthy. God took her through a process of healing and forgiveness that freed her from it. When any of us have things buried inside, those things can cause a lot of unhealthy patterns of behavior and emotion in our lives. Sometimes it is like having a broken leg and trying to run or dance. Until the leg heals, there is some stuff we simply cannot do well. Spiritual and emotional wounds are just the same. They can prevent us from running and dancing spiritually and emotionally speaking. Sometimes it is just a matter of determining to forgive someone and following through; other times, there are hurts and wounds so deep that it requires God's intervention to heal something before we can move forward. There are some things we can deal with just between God and us; there are some things that we need to have someone along side of us. Sometimes it is helpful to talk to an experienced pastor or Christian counselor. Our church has a couple ministries with mature experienced Christians that will walk alongside someone with prayer and encouragement for dealing with these things.

It sounds to me like you try to give this issue to the Lord, but are unwilling to let it go, take your hands off it so God can heal you of your wounds. It's like poison ivy. It itches, but if you continue to scratch it, it will spread. Don't give your thoughts over to her father. Instead, focus on what you have with her now. We find in scripture the following: Philippians 4:8 Finally, brethren, whatever things are true, whatever things are noble, whatever things are just, whatever things are pure, whatever things are lovely, whatever things are of good report, if there is any virtue and if there is anything praiseworthy—meditate on these things. You know yourself that meditating on what he is not doing for your daughter only gives you more heartache. Meditate on what God has done for you and your daughter along with what is ahead for the two of you. If there is to be a change in his heart, it will not come by your continuing request, but it will come because of the Holy Spirit as He works in his heart. Remember, if you want God to fix something, you need to let it go completely, including your thoughts. How this is done is when you start thinking about it, turn from those thoughts and focus on Him.

A couple people I respect on another Christian forum mentioned it so I thought I'd check it out. I originally planned to mostly lurk and read and learn what I could. I hadn't planned on saying much. I'm mostly interested in practical Christian living and spiritual growth. I like to find threads where people are sharing their experiences and advice. There's a lot to learn from people who've walked through places I haven't.

Found it by googling Christian forums. Thankful I did. Lots of great folks here and when I log in it feels a little like "home" now.

As a kid, I ate a sliced bologna on day old bread with mustard and a banana or apple every day at school. Every day! Tuna on Friday. (seven of us kids) My Mexican friends in school would not trade even one of their tacos for the bologna. Since school days, I have never eaten bologna again, unless fried crisp (burnt) with cheese and tomatoes and onions and mayonnaise, and never mustard. Being a carpenter all my life, I lived fifty years on construction job sites, brown bagging. After marriage my wife made my lunches, (Thank You Jesus!) most all the time. And it was like having her speak to me through her small oasis of home in that little brown bag of goodies, for my thirty minuets of rest and quiet. And she liked to leave love notes. Sometimes I missed them, hidden somewhere in the bag. So she would put them in the sandwich. I sometimes missed them also. (Hard to explain to a group of old carpenters why I sometimes pull a slip of paper out of a mouth full of food) Since discovering the playmate cooler many years back, I looked forward to lunch with curiosity, since now I would get just about anything, from thermos hot stew, to bowls of fresh fruit. And my favorite, leftovers. Salt and pepper, napkins, jalapenos, Soda and cold water, main meal, fruit and usually a mint or candy. (occasional note still). I really believe that getting those cool tasty lunches daily, the reminder of her thoughtfulness and love, contributed greatly to our forty six years of marriage. For sure. I was on face book when it came out for one day, as required to join to view pictures sent by my cousin. When I discovered the software went into my PC and found my contacts (friends) and sent my email address to them, I decided there is something a little too invasive with this new club of crazies, and unsubscribed. I do have business friends who say it is a necessary evil to conduct their businesses, the modern way of advertising. I wouldn't know. But what I see and (hear) is it creates a sense of heard instinct. The crowd, the pack, the mob mentality. People change when they want to be included in the conversation, the pack, and with it, their morals often, and their individuality. No, not all, but most. Like some forums. Someone makes a comment, the next one has to top it, and pretty soon it's no holds bared, anything goes. What would have happened if the first couple of res ponders had posted their praise for the wife for her wisdom in being careful with their income and saving for the future, and shared ways to make their own lunches more appetizing, more personal, as a loving spouse who appreciates her hardworking man? And the direction gravitated towards more on how each individual showed her love in helping her life-mate through the daily struggles of life? A soft answer.

I think everyone feels overwhelmed when we first start reading the Bible. Also, we all have questions about many things. You'll also find that sincere Christians have disagreements over what particular parts of the Bible mean. I've been a Christian over 40 years, have read the Bible through more times than I can remember, and there are sections that I don't understand, and sections that I have changed my opinion on what I think a few times. The main point is that God uses the Bible to teach us about Himself. The primary goal of Bible reading should be to learn more about God. I think most Christians at some point have digressed from that and look to the Bible to win arguments with other Christians about particular topics. But ultimately, the goal is to sit down and read and meditate and learn more about God when we do read the Bible. With regard to your questions, one approach is to have someone to answer some questions. Another approach is to learn to find answers on your own. I'll try to give some advice here about doing that. Point 1: Buy a good Study Bible that is best suited for you! I would pick a version of the Bible that is comfortable for you to read for your day to day reading. The Bible was originally written primarily in Hebrew, Aramaic, and Greek. The English versions we have today are translated from those languages. There are different ways of translating with their advantages and disadvantages. Some hold very tightly to the original language words and grammar often resulting in stilted and unnatural sounding English. Some translate thought for thought to provide the closest possible equivalent in English to the original. Others (called paraphrases) translate very loosely thought for thought but contain the translators opinions more often. Most Christians use a translation that they are comfortable with. (As a quick note, there are a small number of Christians that strongly believe that only their particular version is the "real" Bible. If you do an internet search on Bible versions you will often get some hits on sites like that that will call all other versions than theirs "perversions" where they claim to prove all differences from their Bible prove that other versions are bad.) Here is a link to a nice comparison table of English translations. http://www.northwest.cc/uploads/2/1/0/1/210144/bibletranslationchart.pdf (I don't know anything about this church, just that this is a nice table.) Physically, there are smaller print Bibles and larger print Bibles and different printing fonts. Each translation usually is printed in different forms, some larger and smaller, some hard cover or soft cover, etc. Also, many Bibles are printed with helpful footnotes and more information. One particularly useful printing of the Bible is a Study Bible. A good study Bible can be very helpful. There are many study Bibles that contain a lot of footnotes and explanations of things. This can be very helpful because the information is right there alongside the passages you are reading. My wife owned a copy of the NIV Study Bible printed by Zondervan. I found that to be a nice one. I actually "borrowed" it from her and read it myself one time through reading the footnotes and explanations. I found it to give very balanced coverage on many things. If you don't already have a Bible (or are considering getting a new one), it is one worth considering. Here's a link to a hard cover version of it at an online store I've used a lot. https://www.christianbook.com/niv-study-bible-hardcover/9780310438922/pd/438922?event=ESRCG One caution is that some study Bibles have notes written by one person or one particular group. These can sometimes have a very heavy bias toward particular opinions. I personally like the study Bibles and notes done by a group of Christians representing a range of different views. That is part of why I liked the NIV Study Bible mentioned above. There are definitely many good ones out there. This is just one I'm familiar with and am comfortable recommending. Point 2: Start reading with the Gospels and Acts My advice would be to start reading the New Testament. The first four books (Matthew, Mark, Luke, and John) are called the gospels. These were written by 4 different people that relate different accounts of some of the things that Jesus did during His time on earth. The first 3 cover a wide range of things that Jesus did. The gospel of John is different in that it covers a smaller number of things but in more detail. After these is the book of Acts which talks about the early church. I think that these are the best starting point. In my opinion, learning about Jesus and the church is a good foundation to start from to get familiar with the Bible. If you learn how to read and study in these parts of the Bible, you will find other parts easier to read and study. Some Christians would dive right into books and passages dealing with Christian doctrine and what to believe. My preference is to start learning about Jesus and His followers and what they actually did. Also, the gospels and Acts are narratives. That is they relate stories and events that are easier to understand and study. I think it is best to start practicing reading and studying these books first because they are among the easiest to learn how to read and study. Point 3: Learn to use good reference materials Christians have produced a lot of good books and other materials to help understand the Bible. Most Christians who become serious students of the Bible use reference materials to be able to learn from other people. One book on bible study that I'd highly recommend is "How to read the Bible for all it's worth" by Gordon Fee and Douglas Stuart. https://www.christianbook.com/bible-worth-fourth-edition-special-edition/gordon-fee/9780310517825/pd/517825?event=ESRCG I read this book in its first edition about 30 years ago when it first came out. It provided insights and tools for me that I have used for decades. It will provide you with a good base for learning how to look at the context of different books of the Bible. It also discusses available reference materials. Bible dictionaries contain a lot of information on different topics. For example, if you started reading the Gospel of John, you could look up "John" or "John, Gospel of" or something like that. You would then find an entry that gives information about that topic. One thing to be aware of is that there are a large number of Bible dictionaries available of different levels of quality. Some of the older ones are available free online. However, note that many Bible dictionaries rely on information from archeology and other sources. Many more archeological discoveries and similar work have expanded our knowledge of biblical history and culture over the years. Also, newer ones often have a lot more pictures, maps, and other such things than the older ones. There are also concordances. These are reference books that contain all the verses where a particular word is found. For example, look up the word "love" and it will list every verse in the Bible where "love" occurs. In the days before computers, these were a unique resource. Now, there are a number of programs, apps, and sites that will let you do the same thing. One of their uses is to help look up particular passages if you remember a few words in it. There are a lot of free online Bible study and reference materials. The quality varies a lot!!!!! The amount of bias varies a lot!!!!! If you use online materials, I'd recommend trying to find multiple sources that are actually different from each other. Point 4: Get started and realize that this is a lifelong process Then, I'd say just start reading one of the gospels. If you have a study Bible, read the footnotes. If you have a Bible dictionary, look up information about people, places, and books of the Bible. In practice, a good study Bible (like the NIV one I mentioned above) contains some of the information a Bible dictionary would contain. When you finish that gospel, read the next gospel. And when you finish the four gospels, read Acts. This will provide you a solid base of knowing about Jesus and the church as well as practicing reading, studying, and starting to learn to answer questions on your own. As you read something, rejoice in what you do understand. If there is something you don't understand, make an attempt to use a study Bible or Bible dictionary to get some answers. If you find answers, cool!!!! You are learning how to be a student of the Bible. If you cannot find answers, don't sweat it and keep trying. You'll find that over the months and years, it will slowly become a part of you. Learning to read and understand the Bible is a lifelong task that is never finished. You just make more and more progress and most importantly, you simply learn more and more about who God is. Recognize that sometimes God's Spirit might bring particular verses to our attention (and this might have little to do with "study" per se). Sometimes, a verse might convict us that we need to change something about ourselves. Sometimes, a verse might jump out at us and give us encouragement. Remember, this is about building a strong foundation for a lifetime of Bible reading and study. Some people want to start into the "advanced" stuff right away. Please resist this temptation. Learn to read, meditate, look at reference materials, and most importantly, learn how to learn. This is a learn to crawl before you walk before you run type of thing. Rejoice at the accomplishments and hang in there. At first, you'll have a lot more questions you need to just leave for another day. But as you go on, you find that you'll have more and more answers. Best wishes.

When I was married I used to get up very early in the morning to prepare my husband's lunch. It is a blessing to serve others, even more to the person who is your partner. If your partner does or does not do the same for you that should not change what you are before the eyes of God.

The Apostle's Creed (100-250 A.D.) The origin of the Apostles' Creed is less clear than that of the Nicene Creed. The most common view is that it was originally developed in the first or second century and was influenced later by the Nicene Creed. The earliest historical evidence of the creed's existence is in a letter written by the Council of Milan in 390 A.D. Almost every denomination has a slightly different version of the Apostles' Creed. Below is the ecumenical version of the English Language Liturgical Consultation (ELLC). The Creed: I believe in God, the Father almighty, creator of heaven and earth. I believe in Jesus Christ, God's only Son, our Lord, who was conceived by the Holy Spirit, born of the Virgin Mary, suffered under Pontius Pilate, was crucified, died, and was buried; he descended to the dead. On the third day he rose again; he ascended into heaven, he is seated at the right hand of the Father, and he will come to judge the living and the dead. I believe in the Holy Spirit, the holy catholic Church, the communion of saints, the forgiveness of sins, the resurrection of the body, and the life everlasting. Amen. Nicene Creed (325 A.D.) We believe in one God the Father Almighty, Maker of heaven and earth, and of all things visible and invisible. And in one Lord Jesus Christ, the only-begotten Son of God, begotten of the Father before all worlds, God of God, Light of Light, Very God of Very God, begotten, not made, being of one substance with the Father by whom all things were made; who for us men, and for our salvation, came down from heaven, and was incarnate by the Holy Spirit of the Virgin Mary, and was made man, and was crucified also for us under Pontius Pilate. He suffered and was buried, and the third day he rose again according to the Scriptures, and ascended into heaven, and sitteth on the right hand of the Father. And he shall come again with glory to judge both the quick and the dead, whose kingdom shall have no end. And we believe in the Holy Spirit, the Lord and Giver of Life, who proceedeth from the Father and the Son, who with the Father and the Son together is worshipped and glorified, who spoke by the prophets. And we believe one holy catholic and apostolic Church. We acknowledge one baptism for the remission of sins. And we look for the resurrection of the dead, and the life of the world to come. Amen. The Athanasian Creed (500 A.D.) Whosoever will be saved, before all things it is necessary that he hold the catholic faith. Which faith except every one do keep whole and undefiled; without doubt he shall perish everlastingly. And the catholic faith is this: That we worship one God in Trinity, and Trinity in Unity; Neither confounding the Persons; nor dividing the Essence. For there is one Person of the Father; another of the Son; and another of the Holy Ghost. But the Godhead of the Father, of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost, is all one; the Glory equal, the Majesty coeternal. Such as the Father is; such is the Son; and such is the Holy Ghost. The Father uncreated; the Son uncreated; and the Holy Ghost uncreated. The Father unlimited; the Son unlimited; and the Holy Ghost unlimited. The Father eternal; the Son eternal; and the Holy Ghost eternal. And yet they are not three eternals; but one eternal. As also there are not three uncreated; nor three infinites, but one uncreated; and one infinite. So likewise the Father is Almighty; the Son Almighty; and the Holy Ghost Almighty. And yet they are not three Almighties; but one Almighty. So the Father is God; the Son is God; and the Holy Ghost is God. And yet they are not three Gods; but one God. So likewise the Father is Lord; the Son Lord; and the Holy Ghost Lord. And yet not three Lords; but one Lord. For like as we are compelled by the Christian verity; to acknowledge every Person by himself to be God and Lord; So are we forbidden by the catholic religion; to say, There are three Gods, or three Lords. The Father is made of none; neither created, nor begotten. The Son is of the Father alone; not made, nor created; but begotten. The Holy Ghost is of the Father and of the Son; neither made, nor created, nor begotten; but proceeding. So there is one Father, not three Fathers; one Son, not three Sons; one Holy Ghost, not three Holy Ghosts. And in this Trinity none is before, or after another; none is greater, or less than another. But the whole three Persons are coeternal, and coequal. So that in all things, as aforesaid; the Unity in Trinity, and the Trinity in Unity, is to be worshipped. He therefore that will be saved, let him thus think of the Trinity. Furthermore, it is necessary to everlasting salvation; that he also believe faithfully the Incarnation of our Lord Jesus Christ. For the right Faith is, that we believe and confess; that our Lord Jesus Christ, the Son of God, is God and Man; God, of the Substance [Essence] of the Father; begotten before the worlds; and Man, of the Substance [Essence] of his Mother, born in the world. Perfect God; and perfect Man, of a reasonable soul and human flesh subsisting. Equal to the Father, as touching his Godhead; and inferior to the Father as touching his Manhood. Who although he is God and Man; yet he is not two, but one Christ. One; not by conversion of the Godhead into flesh; but by assumption of the Manhood into God. One altogether; not by confusion of Substance [Essence]; but by unity of Person. For as the reasonable soul and flesh is one man; so God and Man is one Christ; Who suffered for our salvation; descended into hell; rose again the third day from the dead. He ascended into heaven, he sitteth on the right hand of God the Father Almighty, from whence he will come to judge the living and the dead. At whose coming all men will rise again with their bodies; And shall give account for their own works. And they that have done good shall go into life everlasting; and they that have done evil, into everlasting fire. This is the catholic faith; which except a man believe truly and firmly, he cannot be saved. The Creed of Chalcedon (A.D. 451) -Sometimes Called Confession We, then, following the holy Fathers, all with one consent, teach men to confess one and the same Son, our Lord Jesus Christ, the same perfect in Godhead and also perfect in manhood; truly God and truly man, of a reasonable (rational) soul and body; consubstantial (coessential) with the Father according to the Godhead, and consubstantial with us according to the Manhood; in all things like unto us, without sin; begotten before all ages of the Father according to the Godhead, and in these latter days, for us and for our salvation, born of the Virgin Mary, the Mother of God, according to the Manhood; one and the same Christ, Son, Lord, Only-begotten, to be acknowledged in two natures, inconfusedly, unchangeably, indivisibly, inseparably; the distinction of natures being by no means taken away by the union, but rather of the property of each nature being preserved, and concurring in one Person and one Subsistence, not parted or divided into two persons, but one and the same Son, and only begotten, God, the Word the Lord Jesus Christ; as the prophets from the beginning (have declared) concerning him, and the Lord Jesus Christ himself has taught us, and the Creed of the holy Fathers has handed down to us. Chaldedon, Bib Sac, 138:552:326 The Old Roman Creed (2nd Century) An earlier and abbreviated Apostle’s Creed. I believe in God the Father almighty; and in Christ Jesus His only Son, our Lord, Who was born of the Holy Spirit and the Virgin Mary, Who under Pontius Pilate was crucified and buried, on the third day rose again from the dead, ascended to heaven, sits at the right hand of the Father, whence He will come to judge the living and the dead; and in the Holy Spirit, the holy Church, the remission of sins, the resurrection of the flesh (the life everlasting). The Old Roman Creed is cited in Tertullian and Ireneus’s writings. ———————————— The Creeds are actually very Scriptural when you check them out: Colossians 2:9, Colossians 1:16, Colossians 1:19, Colossians 2:2-3, John 1:3, John 8:58, John 17:20-23, John 10:30, John 20:28, Titus 2:13, Philippians 2:10-12, 1 John 4:1-3, 2 John 1:17, Romans 1:1-10, Matthew 3:14-17, Hebrews 1:1-14, Hebrews 2:5-18, Hebrews 7:22, Hebrews 9:15, Genesis 1:26, Genesis 3:22.

We are on the eve of 500th Anniversary of the Protestant Reformation. Martin Luther is credited for starting this "inferno" that got Solae Scriptura (Scripture alone) and Ad Fontes (Back to sources, the Scriptures) a major tenant of most Reformed Churches (From Lutheran to Charismatic). Here we will discuss the Reformation in Germany (Martin Luther and Malchathon), Geneva (John Calvin), Scotland (John Knox), Switzerland (Zwingli), England (Henry VIII, Tyndale), and the forerunners of John Hus (Hussites), Peter Waldo, John Wycliffe, Jerome of Prague, and beyond. Welcome to Reformation!

The Medieval Church and Its History covers 1300yrs of Church History! That is quite a chunk, and since it is such vast period of Church History I dedicate an entire topic/thread to it. Here you may discuss and share anything pertaining to Medieval Church History. Share books, images, and more.

Jesus said in John 16:38 that He came from the Father and entered the world,now I'm leaving the world and go back to the Father. How would you feel about having to leave your house and traveling day by day to our eternal destination ,we will be where Jesus is and our loved ones who have gone before us,life is so fragile ,nobody knows if they have tomorrow , many of the people we know are already on the other side where they live forever in the most perfect heavenly place,are you ready to go?What would keep you from not wanting to leave this world?

"There have been seven Ecumenical Councils in the true Orthodox Christian Church: 1. Nicea; 2. Constantinople; 3. Ephesus; 4. Chalcedon; 5. the second at Constantinople; 6. the third at Constantinople; 7. the second at Nicea. The first Ecumenical Council. The First Ecumenical Council was convened in 325 A.D., in the city of Nicea, under the Emperor Constantine I. This Council was called because of the false doctrine of the Alexandrian priest Arius, who rejected the Divine nature and pre-eternal birth of the second person of the Holy Trinity, namely the Divine Son of God the Father, and taught that the Son of God is only the highest creation. 318 bishops participated in this Council, among whom were St. Nicholas the Wonderworker, St. James, bishop of Nisibis, St. Spiridon of Tremithus, and St. Athanasius, who was at that time a deacon. The Council condemned and repudiated the heresy of Arius and affirmed the immutable truth, the dogma that the Son of God is true God, born of God the Father before all ages, and is eternal, as is God the Father; He was begotten, and not made, and is of one essence with God the Father. In order that all Orthodox Christians may know exactly the true teaching of the faith, it was clearly and concisely summarized in the first of seven sections of the Creed, or Symbol of Faith. At this Council, it was resolved to celebrate Pascha on the first Sunday after the first full moon following the spring equinox, after the Jewish Passover. It also determined that priests should be married, and it established many other rules or canons. The Second Ecumenical Council. The Second Ecumenical Council was convened in the year 381, in the city of Constantinople, under the Emperor Theodosius I. This Council was convoked against the false teaching of the Arian bishop of Constantinople, Macedonius, who rejected the deity of the third Person of the Holy Trinity, the Holy Spirit. He taught that the Holy Spirit is not God, and called Him a creature, or a created power, and therefore subservient to God the Father and God the Son, like an angel. There were 150 bishops present at the Council, among whom were Gregory the Theologian, who presided over the Council, Gregory of Nyssa, Meletius of Antioch, Amphilochius of Iconium and Cyril of Jerusalem. At the Council, the Macedonian heresy was condemned and repudiated. The Council affirmed as a dogma the equality and the single essence of God the Holy Spirit with God the Father and God the Son. The Council also supplemented the Nicene Creed, or "Symbol of Faith," with five Articles in which is set forth its teaching about the Holy Spirit, about the Church, about the Mysteries, about the resurrection of the dead, and the life in the world to come. Thus they composed the Nicene-Constantinopolitan Creed, which serves as a guide to the Church for all time. The Third Ecumenical Council. The Third Ecumenical Council was convened in the year 431 A.D., in the city of Ephesus, under Emperor Theodosius II. The Council was called because of the false doctrine of Nestorius, Archbishop of Constantinople, who profanely taught that the Most-holy Virgin Mary simply gave birth to the man Christ, with whom then God united morally and dwelled in Him, as in a temple, as previously He had dwelled in Moses and other prophets. Therefore, Nestorius called the Lord Jesus Christ, God-bearing, and not God incarnate; and the Holy Virgin was called the Christ-bearer (Christotokos) and not the God-bearer (Theotokos). The 200 bishops present at the Council condemned and repudiated the heresy of Nestorius and decreed that one should recognize that united in Jesus Christ at the time of the incarnation were two natures, divine and human, and that one should confess Jesus Christ as true God and true Man, and the Holy Virgin Mary as the God-bearer (Theotokos). The Council also affirmed the Nicene-Constantinopolitan Creed, and strictly prohibited making any changes or additions to it. The Fourth Ecumenical Council. The Fourth Ecumenical Council was convened in 451 A.D., in the city of Chalcedon, under Emperor Marcian. The Council met to challenge the false doctrine of an archimandrite of a Constantinople monastery, Eu-tychius, who rejected the human nature of the Lord Jesus Christ. Refuting one heresy and defending the divinity of Jesus Christ, he himself fell into an extreme, and taught that in the Lord Jesus Christ human nature was completely absorbed in the Divine, and therefore it followed that one need only recognize the Divine nature. This false doctrine is called Monophysitism, and followers of it are called Monophysites. The Council of 650 bishops condemned and repudiated the false doctrine of Eutychius and defined the true teaching of the Church, namely that our Lord Jesus Christ is perfect God, and as God He is eternally born from God. As man, He was born of the Holy Virgin and in every way is like us, except in sin. Through the incarnation, birth from the Holy Virgin, divinity and humanity are united in Him as a single Person, infused and immutable, thus reputing Eutychius; indivisible and inseparable, reputing Nestorius. The Fifth Ecumenical Council. The Fifth Ecumenical Council was convened in 553 A.D., in the city of Constantinople, under the famous Emperor, Justinian I. It was called to quell a controversy between Nestorians and Eutychians. The major points of contention were the well-known works of the Antiochian school of the Syrian church, entitled "The Three Chapters." Theodore of Mopsuestia, Theodoret of Cyrus, and Ibas of Edessa, clearly expressed the Nestorian error, although at the Fourth Ecumenical Council, nothing had been mentioned of their works. Nestorians, in argument with Eutychians (Monophysites), referred to these works, and Eutychians found in them an excuse to reject the Fourth Ecumenical Council and to slander the universal Orthodox Church, charging that it was deviating toward Nestorianism. The Council was attended by 165 bishops, who condemned all three works and Theodore of Mopsuestia himself, as not having repented. Concerning the other two, censure was limited only to their Nestorian works. They themselves were pardoned. They renounced their false opinions and died in peace with the Church. The Council reiterated its censure of the heresies of Nestorius and Eutychius. The Sixth Ecumenical Council. The Sixth Ecumenical Council was convened in the year 680 A.D., in the city of Constantinople, under the Emperor Constantine IV, and was composed of 170 bishops. The council was convoked against the false doctrine of heretics, Monothelites, who, although they recognized in Jesus Christ two natures, God and man, ascribed to Him only a Divine will. After the Fifth Ecumenical Council, agitation provoked by the Monothelites continued and threatened the Greek Emperor with great danger. Emperor Heraclius, wishing reconciliation, decided to incline Orthodoxy to concession to the Monothelites, and by the power of his office, ordered recognition that in Jesus Christ is one will and two energies. Among the defenders and advocates of the true teachings of the Church, were St. Sophronius, Patriarch of Jerusalem, and a monk from Constantinople, St. Maximus the Confessor, who for his firmness in the faith had suffered having his tongue cut out and his hand chopped off. The Sixth Ecumenical Council condemned and repudiated the heresy of Monothelitism, and formulated the recognition that in Jesus Christ are two natures, Divine and human, and in these two natures there are two wills, but that the human will in Christ is not against, but rather is submissive to His Divine will. It is worthy of attention that at this Council excommunication was pronounced against a number of other heretics, and also against the Roman Pope Honorius, as one who acknowledged the teaching of one will. The formulation of the Council was signed by a Roman delegation, consisting of Presbyters Theodore and Gregory, and Deacon John. This clearly shows that the highest power in Christendom belongs to the Ecumenical Council, and not to the Pope of Rome. After eleven years, the Council again opened a meeting in the imperial palace, called Cupola Hall (in Greek, Trullos), in order to resolve questions of primary importance pertaining to the Church hierarchy. In this regard, it supplemented the Fifth and Sixth Ecumenical Councils, and therefore is called the Fifth-Sixth (Quintsext) Synod. This Council established canons by which the Church must be guided, namely, 85 canons of the holy Apostles, canons of the six Ecumenical and seven local councils, and canons of thirteen Fathers of the Church. These canons afterward were supplemented by canons of the Seventh Ecumenical Council and another two local councils, and comprise the so-called "Nomocanon," in English, "The Rudder," which is the foundation of Orthodox Church government. Here several innovations of the Roman Church were condemned as not being in agreement with the spiritual decisions of the Ecumenical Church, namely, the requirement that priests and deacons be celibate, a strict fast on Saturdays of the Great Fast, and the representation of Christ in the form of a lamb, or in any way other than He appeared on the earth. The Seventh Ecumenical Council. The Seventh Ecumenical Council was convened in 787 A.D., in the city of Nicea, under the Empress Irene, widow of the Emperor Leo IV, and was composed of 367 fathers. The Council was convened against the iconoclastic heresy, which had been raging for sixty years before the Council, under the Greek Emperor Leo III, who, wishing to convert the Mohammedans to Christianity, considered it necessary to do away with the veneration of icons. This heresy continued under his son, Constantine V Copronymus, and his grandson, Leo IV. The Council condemned and repudiated the iconoclastic heresy and determined to provide and to put in the holy churches, together with the likeness of the honored and Life-giving Cross of the Lord, holy icons, to honor and render homage to them, elevating the soul and heart to the Lord God, the Mother of God and the Saints, who are represented in these icons. After the Seventh Ecumenical Council, persecution of the holy icons arose anew under the Emperors Leo V, of Armenian origin, Michael II, and Theophilus, and for twenty-five years disturbed the Church. Veneration of the holy icons was finally restored and affirmed by the local synod of Constantinople in 843 A.D., under the Empress Theodora. At this council, in thanksgiving to the Lord God for having given the Church victory over the iconoclasts and all heretics, the celebration of the Triumph of Orthodoxy was established on the first Sunday of Great Lent, which is celebrated by the Orthodox Church throughout the world. Note: The Roman Catholic Church, in addition to these seven Councils, recognizes more than 20 "ecumenical" councils. Incorrectly included in this number were councils in the Western Church, held after the separation of the Western Church. Protestants, in spite of the example of the Apostles and acknowledgment of the entire Christian Church, do not recognize a single one of the Ecumenical Councils." (Orthodox Photos.com). Here is a place to discuss all Seven Ecumenical Councils and their place Church History. The decisions of these councils helped form the basis the Church for millennia. The First Council of Nicea have us the Nicene Creed, and the decisions at subsequent councils is worth delving into and discussing. So let us delve into these Seven Ecumenical Councils.

This is probably one of the biggest areas that I struggle with and I’m tired of it! I hate not loving God the way I’m supposed to love God. I hate ?? waking up without giving God the love that He deserves. We don’t cry enough to the gospel message. We will cry when we read books or watch emotional movies, but when it comes to the gospel the most important message, the bloodiest message, the most glorious message, and the most beautiful message we treat it like just another message. I can’t live like this. I have to cry for God’s help. Do you have a passion for God? Have you sat down and thought to yourself I can’t live like this? I can’t live without you. I’m tired of words. I’m tired of emotion. Lord I have to have you or I’ll die. I’m tired of reading about your presence. I want to truly know your presence. We always claim that we love God, but where is our zeal? I have to cry out for tears for the Lord and a greater appreciation and love for the gospel of Jesus Christ. I don’t want the world. You can have it. I don’t want it! It leaves me dry and low. Only Christ can satisfy. Only Christ and nothing else. All I have is Christ! Quotes “My goal is God Himself, not joy, nor peace, Nor even blessing, but Himself, my God.” “Loving God – really loving Him – means living out His commands no matter what the cost.” – Chuck Colson “The true measure of loving God is to love him without measure.” – Assorted Authors “A man may study because his brain is hungry for knowledge, even Bible knowledge. But he prays because his soul is hungry for God.” Leonard Ravinhill “God gives salvation to the needy, but gives the deep things of His heart to the hungry who refuse to live without them.” It is horrible when your mind changes. One of the worst things in the world is when you first get saved and you can’t stop thinking about Christ. Then, out of nowhere your thought life changes. You go to play basketball with your mind on Christ and then you leave with your mind on the world. The scary part is that it becomes hard for you to get that love back. Thinking about things other than Christ becomes your life. It becomes so common. I can’t live like this. I can’t live when my mind is not centered on Christ. Many of you know what I am talking about. You go to do one thing and you come out and your zeal for Christ decreases. We have to cry out continually that our minds be put back on the gospel of Christ. 1. Colossians 3:1-2 Since, then, you have been raised with Christ, set your hearts on things above, where Christ is, seated at the right hand of God. Set your minds on things above, not on earthly things. 2. Romans 12:2 Do not conform to the pattern of this world, but be transformed by the renewing of your mind. Then you will be able to test and approve what God’s will is–his good, pleasing and perfect will. It’s a terrible thing when love gets common. You don’t treat your love the same. You know when there is a new song that you love so much so you replay it over and over again. Then, it becomes too common. It becomes boring and dull after a while and you don’t play it that much. When you first met your wife there was so much spark. You wanted to do things for her just because. Then, you got married and you got too comfortable. The things you would do for her you stopped doing them and these little things will bother any spouse. You don’t have to say it, but it is like with your life you’re saying, “oh it’s you again.” This is how many of us treat God when love gets so common. You’re not what you once were. You can obey everything, but still not love God and have a passion for God. In Revelation God says you lost that love and zeal you once had for me. You have been too busy for me that you haven’t been spending time with me. It’s either you start spending time with me or because I love you I will make a way for you to spend time with me. 3. Revelation 2:2-5 I know your works, your labor, and your endurance, and that you cannot tolerate evil. You have tested those who call themselves apostles and are not, and you have found them to be liars. You also possess endurance and have tolerated many things because of My name and have not grown weary. But I have this against you: You have abandoned the love you had at first. Remember then how far you have fallen; repent, and do the works you did at first. Otherwise, I will come to you and remove your lampstand from its place—unless you repent. Some of you are wondering why you don’t love God like you used to. It is because the world has got your heart. Your love for God has died so your love for the lost has died as well. You have lost your fight. Someone else has taken God’s place in your life. Sometimes it is sin. Sometimes it is the TV. You lose the love of God little by little until it is nothing. I must tell you there is no such thing as an ordinary Christian. You must repent and He is faithful to forgive. “God I don’t want this. I don’t want these desires. I want you.” Pray for a renewing of your mind and set your heart on seeking God. 4. Jeremiah 2:32 Does a young woman forget her jewelry, a bride her wedding ornaments? Yet my people have forgotten me, days without number. 5. Proverbs 23:26 My son, give me your heart and let your eyes delight in my ways. Do you thirst for Christ? Do you long to know Him? Do you hunger for Him? God I have to know you. Just like Moses said, “show me your glory.” Some of you reading this have read the Bible front and back, you always go to Bible study, and you know so much of the Word. But, are you seeking Him? You can know everything of God, but truly know nothing of God. It’s one thing to know the facts, but it is another thing to know God intimately in prayer. No one wants to seek God anymore. No one wants to wrestle in His presence until He changes you anymore. I want an invasion of the Almighty God. Are you seeking Him with all your heart? Are you living and breathing without God? Are you desperate for Him? Is this important to you? Are you truly looking for Him? Don’t tell me you’re looking for Him when you’re spending hours in front of the TV and you give God a cheap leftover 5 minute prayer before bed! 6. Genesis 32:26 Then the man said, “Let me go, for it is daybreak.” But Jacob replied, “ I will not let you go unless you bless me .” 7. .Exodus 33:18 Then Moses said, “Now show me your glory .” 8. Jeremiah 29:13 You will seek me and find me when you seek me with all your heart . 9. 1 Chronicles 22:19 Now devote your heart and soul to seeking the LORD your God . Begin to build the sanctuary of the LORD God, so that you may bring the ark of the covenant of the LORD and the sacred articles belonging to God into the temple that will be built for the Name of the LORD. 10. John 7:37 On the last and greatest day of the festival, Jesus stood and said in a loud voice, Let anyone who is thirsty come to me and drink. 11. 1 Chronicles 16:11 Seek the LORD and His strength; Seek His face continually . Can God share His heart with you? Do you want to know His heart? God will speak life, fill you with the knowledge of His heart, tell you special things that no one knows, and allow you to know what bothers Him. He wants all of you. He wants to talk to you daily. He wants to guide you. He had special things planned for you, but many people don’t seek God for it. Nothing can be done in the flesh. 12. Proverbs 3:32 For the froward is abomination to the LORD: but his secret is with the righteous . 13. John 15:15 No longer do I call you slaves, for the slave does not know what his master is doing; but I have called you friends, for all things that I have heard from My Father I have made known to you . 14. Romans 8:28-29 And we know that in all things God works for the good of those who love him , who have been called according to his purpose. For those God foreknew he also predestined to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brothers and sisters. Do you have time for God? You have time for what is important. You have time for your friends, shopping, watching TV, surfing the internet, but when it comes to God you don’t have time! Your life says He is not important. Are you reading Scripture to get to know Him in His Word and to conform into the image of Christ? Are you spending time with God in prayer? Busy, busy, busy! That is all I hear from Christians today. These are the same Christians who say that they want a change in their life. It’s all words. What does your life say? God wants to spend time with you. His heart beats faster for you. Before the world was created He saw you and said, “I want you,” but you neglect Him. Your life says He means nothing to you, but yet He still sees you as His precious child. 15. Ephesians 1:4-5 For he chose us in him before the creation of the world to be holy and blameless in his sight. In love. he predestined us for adoption to sonship through Jesus Christ, in accordance with his pleasure and will. 16. Colossians 1:16 For in him all things were created: things in heaven and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or powers or rulers or authorities; all things have been created through him and for him. One of the easiest times to forget God is when God has just delivered you from a great trial. God has delivered some of you and you have lost the love you once had for Him. You started thinking everything was done in the flesh. Satan starts to lie and say it was just a coincidence. You became prosperous. You became spiritually lazy and you have forgotten God. Some of the godliest people can only talk about how they used to go to the throne of God and how God used to reveal Himself in great ways. It’s terrible. It’s terrifying. God has to warn people. He says, “I know what happens when I bless people. They forget me. Be careful that you do not forget me.” God can take everything back. Sometimes breakthroughs and victories are so dangerous. When God gives you a victory you have to seek His face more than you have ever done in your life. 17. Deuteronomy 6:12 then take care lest you forget the Lord, who brought you out of the land of Egypt , out of the house of slavery . 18. Deuteronomy 8:11-14 “ But that is the time to be careful! Beware that in your plenty you do not forget the LORD your God and disobey his commands, regulations, and decrees that I am giving you today. For when you have become full and prosperous and have built fine homes to live in, and when your flocks and herds have become very large and your silver and gold have multiplied along with everything else, be careful! Do not become proud at that time and forget the LORD your God, who rescued you from slavery in the land of Egypt.” Some of you have forgotten the great price that was paid for you on the cross. When is the last time that you have cried to the gospel of Jesus Christ? You sing songs like God is holy and you read these verses in Scripture, but you don’t really grasp what they mean. Don’t you understand? God can’t forgive you if He is good and just. He has to punish you because we are wicked. You know what you were before Christ. You know! You even know your worst moments as a Christian when you fell so short. You know! Christ looked at you in your worst moment and said,” I’m going to take his/her place.” His Father said, “if you do that I’m going to have to crush you. Jesus said, so be it. I love him/her.” It pleased the Father to crush His sinless beloved Son for you. In your worst moment He became a curse for you and He no longer sees you as a wicked sinner, but a saint. Jesus came to make dead men live. Don’t you know that you are nothing and your life means nothing apart from Christ? Sometimes I ask why me? Why choose me? Why save me and not others in my family or my friends? You don’t realize how blessed you are. Set your mind on the gospel of Jesus Christ and that will rejuvenate your devotional life. 19. Galatians 3:13 Christ redeemed us from the curse of the law by becoming a curse for us , for it is written: “Cursed is everyone who is hung on a pole.” 20. 2 Corinthians 5:21 For God made Christ, who never sinned, to be the offering for our sin , so that we could be made right with God through Christ. We should be like David who was a man after God’s heart. One of the things that David did was mediate on the Word. He loved God’s Word. Do you have a passion for the Word? 21. Psalm 119:47-48 I shall delight in Your commandments, Which I love. And I shall lift up my hands to Your commandments, Which I love; And I will meditate on Your statutes. 22. Psalm 119:2-3 How blessed are those who observe His testimonies, Who seek Him with all their heart . They also do no unrighteousness; They walk in His ways. Salvation is by grace through faith in Christ alone. No works! Evidence that you are saved by faith in Christ is that you will have a new relationship with sin. You will be regenerate. You will be a new creation. Love is not just doing what is right. You will have a new zeal for Christ your Savior. The sins you once loved you now hate. It burdens you. You’re not the old person anymore you are new with new affections. The God you once hated you now long for. Are you regenerate? Does sin burden you now? Are you growing in your hatred for it and your love for God? I’m not talking about sinless perfection and I’m not saying that there isn’t struggles, but don’t tell me you’re Christian when your life hasn’t changed and you’re living in rebellion just like the world. You know that God loves you , but the question is do you love Him? We don’t obey because obeying saves us we obey because God saved us. We are new. It’s all grace. We are so thankful for what God has done for us on the cross. We love Him and we desire to honor Him with our lives. 23. 1 John 5:3-5 For this is what love for God is: to keep His commands. Now His commands are not a burden, because whatever has been born of God conquers the world. This is the victory that has conquered the world: our faith. And who is the one who conquers the world but the one who believes that Jesus is the Son of God? 24. John 14:23-24 Jesus replied, “Anyone who loves me will obey my teaching. My Father will love them, and we will come to them and make our home with them . Anyone who does not love me will not obey my teaching. These words you hear are not my own; they belong to the Father who sent me.” Are you longing to worship God in Heaven? Do you desire God so much that to die would be a blessing? Do you ever just sit and wonder about the joy and the blessing that is waiting for you in Heaven? Do you ever just sit outside at night and glorify God for His beautiful creation and think about the omnipotence of God? One glimpse of Heaven and you will never go back to your old life. 25. Philippians 1:23 But I am hard-pressed from both directions, having the desire to depart and be with Christ, for that is very much better. Bonus Matthew 22:37 Jesus replied: “ Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind .” Readjust your spiritual life today. Do you desire God? Cry out for more of Him today! Are you blessed with this message? Do a react..

This contains the period of Church history from 100-333 A.D. Among those who emerged in their period was Polycarp, Barnabas, Origen, Eusebius, and many more. This is the part of Church History when people were fed to lions, Nero wore Christian skin as clothing, and some of worst persecutions the Church faced. In this part of Church History, brothers and sisters in Christ lived in caves in Petra, with ceilings at 2 feet to three feet tall.

Prodigy ;"Love is not just doing what is right". (But it is the evidence!) Hi Prodigy. This question has been put to me from various sources, and in bible studies. And my answer is; My Savior tells me that if I love Him, keep His commandments. I don't know if I qualify. Like Paul, the things I would, I don't. And the things I don't want to, that I do. Some day, though.

I'll put you and your family on my prayer list. Not trying to minimize the magnitude of your situation but whispering Jesus I need you right now to be my husband and to cover me and lead me is a great place to start. 9 years single after loosing my husband. I put my son through college with no student debt. living one day at a time some times so scared because i didn't know how i would pay the bills or buy food (I had no child support or alimony just bills and debt and sorrow and anger. But each day waking up and whispering to the Lord and whispering to him at night. 9 years later My Sons graduated from college, my cars and house are paid off, no credit card debt. I can not tell you how the Lord did it but one day at a time, one door open at a time i whispered and followed and He did.

so my grammar of saying i have a know so salvation made no sense? " I know what it means to be saved. " that was not the statement knowing what it means to be saved.. i said i had a know so salvation f or the life of me i have no idea what grammar has to do with saying i have a know so salvation. 1 john 5:13 5 words which is saying I KNOW THAT I KNOW THAT I KNOW BEYOND a shadow of doubt that i am saved.. i also know --- which means to have understanding or knowledge through a personal relationship .that i am saved. might i add i had no idea proper grammar was a requirement to post here. if that be the case admin needs to remove my account .

I am really sorry that you are going through a really tough time. I will definitely keep you in prayer. Like others have said, it's hard to see clearly when you feel like this. But take it one day at a time and even if you don't feel like it, keep talking to God and meditate on the Word. It's good that you are open to sharing this with us. I hope you keep sharing with us as you are willing and that you also have people close at hand that can listen and be there for you. At the same time, I can speak a lot of words of advice, but God is the One who will bring comfort and healing, so, again, go to him first.

Hey Karla! I'm so sorry you're walking a difficult road. I find that in seasons like the one you mention it's so important to not listen to our feelings but to constantly remind ourselves of His promises. His promise to YOU is that He has a plan to prosper you and not to harm you. He has good things for you. He promises us that in Him we have the abundance of life. He has never left you nor will He ever forsake you. He gives us the assurance that in Him we can bear all things and that NOTHING is impossible for Him. Friend, the season you are in is tough but we both know our God is tougher. He is a big God. He has never failed, not one time, and He will not start now. It will get better, dear sister, it will. Just keep holding on to His hand. I will be praying for you. -Amy

From real life adventures: My spouse always made me a lunch, except when I knew I was going out to eat, which wasn't usually known ahead of time. There would be five guys trying to eat a hurried lunch between helping client families. Each day I would put out my lunch till one day my elbow neighbor tried to set me up with the other guys for a razing. He said; Geesh, does your poor slave wife have to peel your oranges for you like that every day? The others joined in, and I responded; Oranges have peels? To which he added; And does she peel the skin off your grapes too? I responded; Why would grapes have skins? My wife made terrific lunches designed knowing I often had just a few moments to eat them. Occasionally I could not get time to eat at all. I once told her the chicken sandwich sure tasted salvey would she change brands for future refence? She said, Chicken? I haven't fixed you chicken all this week. I fixed you tuna, but that was days ago, didn't you eat it? -Oh oh, and I then knew the reason for my stomach distress. I always disliked tuna too for I had to use a lot of breath stuff afterward in order to meet with families. Tuna and Binaca, yum yum.

Blessings Everyone.... Funny,many people understand God Purpose for Pauls thorn is to result in Pauls humility....this is one way to Receive Gods Word as the Living Word of God can Present different different meanings at different times & in different situations.....I do Believe this holds true especially with this particular passage of Scripture,it has a very special meaning to me personally.... I do Believe the reason Paul did not say exactly what his "thorn" was ,was so that we could all relate it "our thorn"......of course anytime we have any care or concern,with any circumstance ,we must Humble ourselves before the Mighty Hand of God...and THEN"Cast our cares on Him" (1 Peter 5:6-9) When I was diagnosed with cancer,the last time,Stage 4 incurable cancer.....I knew I would be okay but yet the pain,before,during & after was almost unbearable,I understood I would not die & I would be Delivered & yet the scar tissue & pain remained.....Clearly ,I heard"My Grace is Sufficient"......That verse of Scripture helped me to Overcome "my thorn" ....in Spirit I could rise above my physicality & the body is of little or no consequence,Humbly,in Power of Holy Spirit by the Grace of God Its hard to explain but many times I have asked the Lord and I Received the answer I have learned to accept "NO",I Understand that is my "reminder" that He is a Miracle Working God.-I do see that as "No-not now,my Grace is ALWAYS Sufficient".....I don't know about anyone else but I do know that I can easily forget the things my Lord Has brought me out of when things are great,when I feel wonderful,when all is smoothe and life is trouble free......sometimes that "thorn" helps me to remember that if it were not for the Grace of God I would not be here at all Anyway,had Paul been specific & lets say he said his thorn was failing eyesight or always having enemies chasing him or "whatever" then I think we wouldn't be starting threads to discuss the topic because many would not be able to relate to it so well -.....Gods Word is for all of us,our personal hotline to our Father in Christ Jesus.....He Speaks to each of us in a very Intimate & Personal Way,we all have "a thorn"......it only serves to keep us close to God,reliant,dependent on Him.....imo Praise Jesus With love-in Christ,Kwik

Denadii, I think you are misunderstanding what we have been saying....the thorn was not given for the purpose of causing a temptation to happen...NOT at all. It was to PREVENT it from ever taking place. Paul never directly said what the thorn was; only its purpose....to prevent him from having pride. The thorn was simply a reminder that he was NOT greater than anyone else; or that he had risen above the need to be totally reliant on Gods grace. NOR is there any mention of God removing the reminder. We aren't promised a life free of problems. But we are promised that through it all God's love and salvation is guaranteed to us. God's grace is enough to get us through life. We do not have to strive to be something we are not or think greater of ourselves than we are. If we had perfect bodies, perfect jobs, etc. . . we would not rely on God to be there for us. That is what Paul is talking about... What God does for us .

It is a pity, that some people would treat guests better than they would their spouses.

From what I found it looks like they hold to "Miaphysitism" - that the person of Jesus Christ, Divine nature and Human nature are united (μία, mia - "one" or "unity") in a compound nature ("physis"), the two being united without separation, without mixture, without confusion, and without alteration. Miaphysitism is not Monophysitism and the Monophysite churches are not Miaphysite. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Miaphysitism

The Crusader dedicates His sword in church, and his wife prays by His side Painting by Edmund Leighton In the Middle Ages, the Crusader would take his sword into the church to be blessed by a priest. This was a custom from 1101-1291 A.D.

Thanks for the links. Hmm, the problem is the Coptic Church does not affirm the divinity of Christ, while Jesus and Apostles do in the Bible (John 17:19-21, Colossians 2:9, Colossians 1:19, John 1:1-3, Titus 2:13, John 10:30, Hebrews 1:1-14, Revelation 1:8, Genesis 1:24, and beyond).

The Ethiopians had ties to Judaism through Queen Sheba and King Solomon.(1 Kings 10) The first Ethiopian Christian is recorded in Acts 8:26-38 when the Ethiopian Eunuch is baptized by Phillip. According to Wikipedia they were administratively part of the Coptic Orthodox Church of Alexandria from the first half of the 4th century until 1959. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oriental_Orthodoxy https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ethiopian_Orthodox_Tewahedo_Church http://www.ethiopianorthodox.org/english/canonical/books.html

In Middle Ages Christian faith had major external appearances. In fact, outward acts of piety were a sign of devotion. This would take shape in giving alms to poor, penances such as walking on your knees on gobble stones leading to a church, crusades where a milites Christi (knight of Christ) fough infidels and protects pelegrins (pilgrims) from Saracens (Muslims). For the Clergy, the instruments, mantels, mitre, and other paraphanalia of the faith were made of gold and elaborately woven: A Crosier (scepter, staff and shepherd like cane) The Globus Crusiger (orb of rule, believed to be in Christ's hand, monarch hold it at cornation to represent that they rule in Christ's stead, "divine right of kings.") A Crown (possibly Hungarian or Transalvanian) An altar piece of St. George slaying the Dragon

This period of Church History becomes more relevant as the persecution of the Church spreads. I recommend if you want a very concise account of this period to read "The History of Church," Eusebius, Penguin Publishers. It not an easy read through, but it will give you the details of persecution all the way to the Battle of Milvan Bridge and Constantine the Great's Conversion.

In 22 Days the 500th Anniversary of Protestant Reformation will happen! Here is some information on Luther and His beliefs: "Luther was not a systematic theologian, trading in logical definitions or philosophical consistency. The systematizers who followed his wake picked out two key principles in his thought, Sole Fide and Sola Scripture: "Faith alone" and "Scripture alone." But this risks missing the point. Luther's theology was not a doctrine; it was a love affair. Consuming love for God has been part of Christian experience since the beginning, put Luther's passion had a reckless extravagance that set it apart, and which down Protestantism History. He pursued His love for God with blithe disregard for the bounds set by church and tradition. It was intense, desolating, intoxicating passion, sparked by his life-upending glimpse of God's incomprehensible , terrible, beautiful, and beautiful love for him. Like any lover, he found it incredible that his beloved should love him, unworthy as he was. And yet he discovered over the long years of prayer and study, that God loved him wildly, irresponsibly, and beyond all reason. God, in Christ, had laid down his life for him. This was not as the medieval's subtle theology had taught, a transaction, or a process by which believers to do whatever was in their power to pursue holiness. It was a sheer gift, all that mattered was accepting it. This talk of grace and free forgiveness was dangerous. If grace is free, and all we need do is believe, surely that would lead to moral anarchy? The fact that free forgiveness can look like a license to sin has plagued Protestantism for centuries. But for Luther, to even ask this question was blockheaded. What kind of lover needs rules about how to love? What kind of lover has to be bribed or threatened into loving? God loves us unreservedly. If we recognize that love, we love him unreservedly in return. Luther's breakthrough a dazzling, corrosive, simplicity to it. The power of those two principles, "faith alone," and "Scripture alone," lay in the word "alone." There is nothing and no one else other than God incarnate in Jesus Christ worth attending to. Being a Christian means throwing yourself abjectly, unreservedly, on Christ's mercy. Living the Christian life is to live Christ's Life-that is, abandoning all security and worldly ambitions to follow Him "through penalties, deaths, and hell." It is only then that we may find peace. That ravishing paradox is at heart of Protestantism." (The Protestants, Alec Ryrie, pages 20-21).

This reminds me a lot of "A Pilgrim's Progress" by John Bunyan. I want to be able to trust Him fully and just give up everything for Him. Life with Him is so much better.

Could you share about Oriental Orthodox Church and Ethiopian Orthodox Tewahedo Church? I know The Oriental Orthodox Church schismed from the rest of Eastern Orthodox Church, but I know nothing more about them. Perhaps I could open a topic for you to share about these churches? You're welcome. I totally agree that Church History is badly needed today and that most churches are ignorant of rudimentary Church history. If we learn from Church History we can stop reineventing the wheel. We can take from best, and spit out bones, and not repeat mistakes, "those who do not learn from history are bound to repeat it."

Sometimes I think if I was to ever fully commit to an Orthodox Christian Church it would be to an Oriental Orthodox Church like The Ethiopian Orthodox Tewahedo Church since they were not apart of the Seventh Ecunemical Council. One thing is for sure, If a person believes The Nicene and Apostles' Creed They are My Brother or Sister in Christ. Thanks again for making this club. Church History Is So Badly Needed Today. Most of The Church is Completely Ignorant of Even Basic Church History. It's just sad.

Icons are a reason I did not join the Orthodox Church either: According to the official stance on Icons in Eastern Orthodoxy, "they are windows into heaven and time". (From Book Praying with Icons, Linette Martin, Ancient Spiritual Disciples, and https://www.theosophical.org/publications/quest-magazine/42-publications/quest-magazine/1433-icons-windows-to-the-divine Icons act as transmitters, conduits, and windows into a spiritual dimensions, which frankly is rather creepy. I do not read anywhere in Scripture where an Apostle or Jesus emphasizes such mystical practices. Icons are suppose to help Orthodox travel in time to the event depicted or transport you spiritually to a place with them, and if you are Orthodox you suppose to greet an Icon as if its the person represented, wither Christ or saint, and kiss the icon. All of this goes beyond veneration or honor, and even beyond idolatry. Sources: Praying with Icons (Ancient Spiritual Disciplines), Linette Martin The Orthodox Church, Bishop Kallistos Ware The Orthodox Church, Katherine Clark, Simple Guides The major reason II could not join the Orthodox Chruch, is that Orthodox Church calls everything "mystery" and is very mystical, even the Gospel is considered mystery, when in reality the Gospel is easy to believe and understand (John 3:16, John 6:40, John 17:3, Acts 16:31, Acts 15:9-11, Romans 10:9-10, Revelations 3:20).

No it does not if you are reading the Bible correctly.

God did not choose paul for his character. When HE drew paul, puals character was persecuting Christains. GOD gave paul NEW CHARACTER. not a one of us were called out due to OUR character. Mine was far worst than most. NO. God just drew me cause he Loved me and He uses us for HIS OWN GLORY. be blessed. Pauls thorn was due to the abundance of revelations He had been given. that can puff a man up . GOD TOOK care of that with some humbling so as paul would LEAN on HIM and not on PAUL. IF we read what paul himself said and don't take what our man glorying in self preachers say. Many a preach , will teach that God sees something GOOD in us so HE calls us . WRONG answer preach. We naught but evil. And GOD truly is the ONLY GOODNESS we have . Only let us be faithful to the Goodness OF HIS SPIRIT HE puts in us by grace and OBEY the Spirit. Have a blessed day now.

Hi Warrior, Thanks for sharing this. I loved the reminder that God is more interested in our character than our comfort. I have grown so much more during the hard times, than when things were easy. Blessings

There have been many times that I have had to remind myself that God is with me in the situation, and where my grace has run out, His is sufficient. Thank you for sharing this Town. Blessings

There is a big difference between temptation and being puffed up with pride. It wasn't that Paul would be tempted, but that God was preventing Paul from being prideful. It would have hindered Paul's ministry. Whatever the thorn was, it prevented temptation from even taking place. It kept Paul from being prideful and reminded him he was just another John Doe that was human like everyone else.

The most challenging Council for me is the The Seventh Ecumenical Council. (787 A.D) I like Icons and I think they are cool. I don't think there is anything wrong with Icons in of themselves but Icon Veneration makes me cringe. I don't even know how to explain it fully what I mean. The thought of bowing to and kissing a picture makes me cringe. I just can't do it. It's one of the things that keeps me from fully committing to Eastern Orthodoxy. • I love making the sign of The Cross • I can easily believe in the real presence of Yeshua Messiah in The Eucharist. • I can easily believe that Mother Mary remained a virgin her whole life. I just can't get past icon Veneration. I mean no disrespect whatsoever to Orthodox Christians on the site. This is just my personal thoughts.

Hi 4 It's most often the little things we do which count the most, if we obey Jesus and let Him work in and through us,He will lead us where He wants us to go and what He wants us to say to other people. Wherever the Spirit is there is freedom God placed us in Canada, far away from my family, which is from the Netherland. He wants us to glorify Him no matter where we are.. Therefore, since we are surrounded by such a great cloud of witnesses, let us throw off everything that hinders and the sin that so easily entangles. And let us run with perseverance the race marked out for us, Hebrews 12 :1

You are most welcome, I am glad you asked the question. Another important element of Third Ecumenical Council was the condemnation of Nestorius [The Nestorians], who accidently founded the Nestorians. Here is the sad fact, Nestorius did not teach what Nestorians believe, he was trying to explain the two natures of Christ (God and Man), but what happened is a cult formed known as the Nestorians who believe that "all flesh (physical matter, the seen earth, food, sex. and etc) is evil, and all spirit (supernatural and spiritual things) are good; that there is a Jesus who is flesh and evil, and Jesus who is spirit and good (very similar to what Zoroastrianism)." (Church History in Plain Language 4th Ed, Bruce Shelley, and Christian History Made Easy by Timothy Paul Jones). Poor Nestorius was simply trying to explain Orthodox doctrine, and cult formed on misunderstanding of what he was saying. This would happen with Catholic Saints, the Roman Church had shrines for the saints, and the newly converted Barbarians (Saxons, Picts, Anglos, and Franks) thought that visiting holy shrines and touching the dead bones of saints infused and gave the pilgrim holiness; this was repudiated by the clergyman until someone thought, "we can make money from this," (something the Monk and Theologian Martin Luther would confront later in the 16th century, see The Indulgences). It was wise the Council condemned Nestorian/Zoroastrian beliefs, but poor Nestorius was simply trying to explain the Two Natures of Christ and his listeners misconstrued what it meant and created the cult of Nestorianism/Nestorians.

Thanks for the info.

One of issues that crept up was that The Coptic Church denied that Jesus was God [denied the deity of Jesus], which goes against teaching of Apostles that Jesus is God (John 1:1-18, Matthew 3:16-17, Colossians 2:9, Colossians 1:19, Titus 2:13, John 17:20-23, 1 John 4:15, John 6:40, John 10:30, John 20:28, Hebrews 1:1-14) and The Nicene Creed, Apostle's Creed, and Athansian Creed which affirm deity of Christ. The Coptic Church decided Jesus was just a prophet (something Muslims believe, calling Jesus Isa). So I imagine in addition to the Coptic Controversy, there were heterodox and complicated issues with the rest of Oriental Orthodox Churches, and why they are not in Eastern Orthodox communion.

Adam never ate from the Tree of Life. Genesis 3:22-24 Then the Lord God said, “Behold, the man has become like one of Us, to know good and evil. And now, lest he put out his hand and take also of the tree of life, and eat, and live forever”— therefore the Lord God sent him out of the garden of Eden to till the ground from which he was taken. So He drove out the man; and He placed cherubim at the east of the garden of Eden, and a flaming sword which turned every way, to guard the way to the tree of life.

Amen and I believe we will continue dying to self as part of the process of sanctification until the end of our life , it is a life long progress~~ Galations 2:20 I have been crucified with Christ. It is no longer I who live, but Christ who lives in me. And the life I now live in the flesh I live by faith in the Son of God, who loved me and gave himself for me.