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What has happened over the years? Before mega churches, light shows, smoke machines and Christian rock where ears were tickled. This is where souls were saved, hymns were sung and preachers, preached the word of God, visited the sick, and ministers knew the people in the congregation personally. (copied from facebook)

We Christians sometimes have disagreements or conflicts when discussing biblical scriptures , but its how we approach the discussion that makes all the difference ( 2 Tim. 3:16,17 ). The key is not to anger the person or to prove that they are wrong, but to win there friendship and understanding. An attitude like that doesn't come from us alone but from the Lord working through us ( 2Tim. 4:5 ). The right attitude to have when discussing Christian doctrine is to be humble and take no pleasure in being right and others being wrong. Only giving our Lord Jesus Christ all the glory matters, and it matters more than anything else ( 1Cor. 10:31 ; Gal. 1:5 ; and Rom. 5:2 ). When we believe someone is in error of scripture we can show them , but with the right attitude and a teachable spirit. There is a good chance that someone can be taught if it's done in love, with the Spirit of Christ without pride, ego, or a personal agenda ( Col. 3: 13 ; Heb. 12: 14-15 ) So often when someone has a different view of scripture they go into these discussions with a sort of " game theory", mentally. The whole thing becomes about who's right and who's wrong rather than building each other up in Christ ( Eph. 4: 15-16 ). The discussion often times goes bad as both parties stew in there own thought's and feeling's of hurt and anger ( Phil. 2:1-7 ). We must remember that we are accountable to God for our actions. We can't control what the other person say's, but we can control how we answer ( Rom. 14: 10-13 ). We must also remember to pray for the person that we disagree with, and mean it, because the Lord can see the true intensions of our heart ( Matt. 5: 44,45 ). We can all have differences on scripture, not to prove our point, but to show the kind of love that Jesus showed, because our Lord said that we are to love each other as much as we love ourselves ( John 13: 34,35 and Gal. 5:13 ).

The best approach is to do what you've been doing, stay open to discussion yourself, and consider what others say. It is not our job to convince anyone of anything, present your case and reasoning for it, and leave the rest up to God. Frustration with these other things will only come if you allow it to, and just accept that some are not open to what anyone else says. God can convince them of the truth if need be, that should be enough for us. Remember, even Jesus shook the dust off in regards to those who refuse to hear.

Yes~! Thy word is true from the beginning: and every one of thy righteous judgments endureth for ever. Psalms 119:160 Yes Indeed~! Thy word have I hid in mine heart, that I might not sin against thee. Psalms 119:11 Love, Your Brother Joe

Approaching a discussion of Scripture from the direction of one being the Teacher, and one the person in need of teaching is often just as guilty of causing disputations. In my opinion, when two mature Believers speak about their differing understandings of a Verse, or passage of Scripture, both must be willing to learn, and both must be willing to respect the others understanding. The Holy Spirit imparts understanding of Scripture as He will. One Scripture may have different meanings for 2 or 3, or more Believers. In my experience, the Holy Spirit imparts the understanding of a Scripture based on what He knows the Believer needs at that point and time in their life. I would hazard to guess (like me) all here have an understanding of a particular Scripture, and, at some point, read that Scripture anew, and received a far different understanding! That is from Spiritual growth in my opinion. The Apostle Paul taught about Believers having different understandings of Scripture based on their Spiritual growth. God bless.....

I feel I am having so many butting head issue on here because no one seems to want to learn anything. It is like you know your right about some topic. You post that topic on a discussion bored which means people are open to discussing it, but there seems to be no room for discussing. The poster knows they are right in all that they say about the topic and is only posting the topic so that other people join in with agreement with them. This is not how I think a discussion bored should be. Thus I think the reason why I have so many issues with other posters at times. No one is listing to anyone else and no one ever considers that maybe they are wrong in their thinking. They just say "this is how it is end of story good bye!" I mean what is the point of all of that? I post topics not because I think I am 100% right, but because I think I could be right, but I want to run this by some other people and see what they have to say about. If they can show me I am mistaken in my thinking then I consider that. But so many topic posted on here are just "I am right and if you disagree with me you disagree with God" type of post. It is like trying to debate the Sunday morning sermon with the pastor while he is preaching it. Dose anyone else see this going on here? Maybe it is just me? Maybe I need to take some more time off?

Their is just one last thing I would like to make mention of to us all. Praaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaise the LORD peoples ........................that's right , PRAISE THE LORD and keep on a praising .

I think too its good to start from genesis. It gives light to why we ended up here at this time. We do need to know the history of where evil came from and why man fell. Then the book of John shows christ and his ministry.

I love, love the old testament and spend a lot of time in it. It is absolutely dripping rich in allegorical spiritual truth/lessons as well as instruction in righteousness/holiness. Everything that I can think of that is in the New Testament is from the Old Testament and can be traced back to it. In Christ and by His Spirit we now have more revelation of the truths that are in the OT.....the NT writings affirm and reveal many of those truths.

This is what we have been seeing, people opening churches for money and as a result they just talk what attracts people (flesh). "Shepherd the flock of God which is among you, serving as overseers, not by compulsion but willingly, not for dishonest gain but eagerly;" - 1 Peter 5:2 They are just leading the flock to the slaughter, this is very serious. They are playing with fire, and eternal fire. "Whoever causes one of these little ones who believe in Me to sin, it would be better for him if a millstone were hung around his neck, and he were drowned in the depth of the sea." - Matthew 18:6

How VITAL the Old Testament is. My father drilled that into my heart and mind when I was young and I have never forgotten it. When one is witnessing to a non-believer or one who has never heard, yes, the emphasis is on the gospel: Jesus Christ and him crucified. The death, burial, and resurrection. Today that is the beginning once sin is understood. And yet, the Old Testament can shed so much light onto the gospel and it should be read and studied by New Testament Christians. My weekly Bible study group is going through the entire Bible, verse by verse. You'd be shocked at how many times we have to flip to the New Testament to view the words of Christ, Paul, Peter, and more and see how these Old Testament accounts are part of those accounts as well. We started in Genesis and are now in 2 Samuel, but we've also been in almost every book of the New Testament. "All scripture is".....well, you know that verse.

I have the strongest unction that we about to learn a dear and deep lesson . A time is coming when no one who remains in the true version of chrisanity will be accepted anywhere PEROID . House and cave churches are coming back , but watch as all the dross is burned away HOW MUCH REAL JOY will be with those who are truly of Him. Persecution don't destroy the church , it wont wipe christanity out , NO OUR FAITH WILL BLOSSOM like a ten thousand foot rose bush . NO fear of what is soon to come . I say it would not be a bad idea for some who are led , to either go look at those old buildings so at least we can start sending those who really want to hear the WORD to places where the true men will be ready to feed the flocks . I do see a time fast approaching where persecutions will only strengthen those who are His and we will meet in even caves, with little , BUT GREAT JOY . FOR OUR JOY IS THE LORD .

I am led to get them in the gosples and to learn JESUS before some pastor explains both Christ and his pattern away . Get them into the gosples and all the letters the apostels wrote . cause many men in most pulpits have taught a way around JESUS and the apostels pattern. Scary stuff I know . but we got to get them to LEARN JESUS and not mens contrary traditions . we need to get them to learn the pattern and traditions the APOSTELS SET . And yowm , I do think Gensis is a good place to also work in their . JUST PRAISE THE LORD PEOPLES , sound the songs of JOY and PRAISE for all to hear and get them absorbed in the bible . Now how bout we leap up and praise the LORD peoples .

So after have posted this yesturday here on the forum i got encouraged by all you my brothers and sisters and i pleaded the blood of jesus before going to bed, and remembered all the things you guys told me and gave me strenght and the demonic manefestations went away for this night and i finally slept good. I have figured out i must pray in order to keep this things away. Thank you all who replied to my post below. Good Bless you all, So Goodmorning beothers and sisters , i decide tonopen an account here since i am not a memeber of a church but i consider myself a christian, i recently started gettling closer and closer to our lord jesus christ and i stopped my sinful ways and i have been resisting the devil, and lately ive felt attacked by him, i developed a disease and two days ago i was sleeping when i woked up to a loud diabloical roar in my room my two babies were asleep with my husband but i guess i was the only one aware of it. The second night i was in sleep paralysis and i saw i black shadow next to my bed wanting to pull me to itself, it wanted to drag me out of the bedand i couldnt scream and i wanted to say jesus help me but i couldnt and when i finally could that thing just left and i woked up to reality which seemed like a real dream. Im scared i dont know if getting closer to god is attracting all this things.

Posting them together in case it helps to see the similarities. EZEKIEL 31:1-18 And it came to pass in the eleventh year, in the third month, in the first day of the month, that the word of the LORD came unto me, saying,Son of man, speak unto Pharaoh king of Egypt, and to his multitude; Whom art thou like in thy greatness? Behold, THE ASSYRIAN WAS A CEDAR in Lebanon with fair branches, and with a shadowing shroud, and of an high stature; and his top was among the thick boughs. The waters made him great, the deep set him up on high with her rivers running round about his plants, and sent out her little rivers unto all the trees of the field. Therefore his height was exalted above all the trees of the field, and his boughs were multiplied, and his branches became long because of the multitude of waters, when he shot forth. All the fowls of heaven made their nests in his boughs, and under his branches did all the beasts of the field bring forth their young, and under his shadow dwelt all great nations. Thus was he fair in his greatness, in the length of his branches: for his root was by great waters. The cedars in the garden of God could not hide him: the fir trees were not like his boughs, and the chesnut trees were not like his branches; nor any tree in the garden of God was like unto him in his beauty. I have made him fair by the multitude of his branches: so that all the trees of Eden, that were in the garden of God, envied him. Therefore thus saith the Lord GOD; Because thou hast lifted up thyself in height, and he hath shot up his top among the thick boughs, and his heart is lifted up in his height; I have therefore delivered him into the hand of the mighty one of the heathen; he shall surely deal with him: I have driven him out for his wickedness. And strangers, the terrible of the nations, have cut him off, and have left him: upon the mountains and in all the valleys his branches are fallen, and his boughs are broken by all the rivers of the land; and all the people of the earth are gone down from his shadow, and have left him. Upon his ruin shall all the fowls of the heaven remain, and all the beasts of the field shall be upon his branches: To the end that none of all the trees by the waters exalt themselves for their height, neither shoot up their top among the thick boughs, neither their trees stand up in their height, all that drink water: for they are all delivered unto death, to the nether parts of the earth, in the midst of the children of men, with them that go down to the pit. Thus saith the Lord GOD; In the day when he went down to the grave I caused a mourning: I covered the deep for him, and I restrained the floods thereof, and the great waters were stayed: and I caused Lebanon to mourn for him, and all the trees of the field fainted for him. I made the nations to shake at the sound of his fall, when I cast him down to hell with them that descend into the pit: and all the trees of Eden, the choice and best of Lebanon, all that drink water, shall be comforted in the nether parts of the earth. They also went down into hell with him unto them that be slain with the sword; and they that were his arm, that dwelt under his shadow in the midst of the heathen. TO WHOM ART THOU THUS LIKE IN GLORY AND IN GREATNESS AMONG THE TREES OF EDEN? yet shalt thou be brought down with the trees of Eden unto the nether parts of the earth: thou shalt lie in the midst of the uncircumcised with them that be slain by the sword. This is Pharaoh and all his multitude, saith the Lord GOD.

Since when do we need to change the gospel or the Bible to suit people? Its the PEOPLE that the gospel and Bible changes!

IF that bible makes lite of sin , its bye bye time for it . jokes , sarchasams, no wonder lots of churches are less and less serious about anything .

Butero,I don't know where this church is, but I do know that a little church like this is where I really grew in the Lord,it had solid preaching sermons,no worldly stuff and everything was dealt with in the right way by the elders of the church, we don't need big modern ,we shouldn't have to attract people to come to the church because of how good it looks or because of the music,too may preachers these days want to become polulair by preaching a feel good sermon

I looked on Amazon and took a look inside a pre-view copy of this Bible. From what I have read it seems it is using sarcasm to get the point across. An example is while it does say alternative definition" for "church" is "what you have to get dressed up for so you can be bored for an hour at a morning service". It is then followed by saying "if you want to stop being bored in church, then start by listing to the sermon." Followed by a few other bits of advice. The same is for the bit about witnessing to your friends. The meaning being yeah, your friends may laugh at you. But here is what you can do. You really need to see the whole picture here. Before tossing things into the fire.

Shocking. Another "seeker friendly" approach. It is SO misguided and is very FAR from being the way of Christ and His word. How far the church has fallen, it makes me weep.

It is excuses like: "I do not understand", "It is condemning me", "It goes against me, how is that love?!". Because love: "does not rejoice in iniquity, but rejoices in the truth;" - 1 Corinthians 13:6 He just want to save and to heal us from our detrimental state. "For we ourselves were also once foolish, disobedient, deceived, serving various lusts and pleasures, living in malice and envy, hateful and hating one another." - Titus 3:3 And to give us life, to free ourselves from the dominion of Satan and to be under the care and dominion of God. "to open their eyes, in order to turn them from darkness to light, and from the power of Satan to God, that they may receive forgiveness of sins and an inheritance among those who are sanctified by faith in Me." - Acts 26:18 If they were not blind by their own pride, they could see and understand that all that God wants is to gives us life indeed. "For the hearts of this people have grown dull. Their ears are hard of hearing, And their eyes they have closed, Lest they should see with their eyes and hear with their ears, Lest they should understand with their hearts and turn, So that I should heal them." - Matthew 13:1 He loves us. "We love Him because He first loved us." - 1 John 4:19

One thing that is important to remember too is that there are some things about scripture that are non negotiable. You either believe in them or you are not saved. But there are things in scripture that are not necessary to believe in to be saved and God doesnt want us to engage in excessive nitpicking like Saturday or Sunday, eating meat or not, believing in the Rapture. You can certainly talk about such things but dont get into rancorous discussions about things that are just not that important.

I love the Country Church. The majority of Churches I have attended, the Congregation numbered between 20 and 60. I got to know some good, loving, God fearing Saints in those Churches, but I also know (like was said earlier) some of them, (a few of them?) were Spiritually dead. Still, I could never attend a Mega Church.......not knocking those who do, it just isn't for me...... This is one I love to see. Would love to go there.

Some Christians believe that the last generation will see the end times as this verse alludes to: Mathew 24:34 “Truly I say to you, This generation shall not pass, till all these things be fulfilled.” And in Psalms we read that a generation can last eighty years: Psalm 90:10 Our days may come to seventy years, or eighty, if our strength endures; yet the best of them are but trouble and sorrow, for they quickly pass, and we fly away. In 1949 Israel finally became an independent nation again after the Israeli War for Independence that lasted from 15 May 1948 to 20 July 1949. The war lasted nine months which is alluded to in this verse: Isaiah 66:8 Yet no sooner is Zion in labour than she gives birth to her children. 80 years from 1949 is 2029 which is also 2000 years from the year of Jesus' death in 30AD. Both of which would be Jubilee years and coincides with the 6000th year of human history according to the Bible which fits the prophetic Sabbath week. Jesus returns in the 6000th year of Earths history in 2029 to reign on Earth for 1000 years, as it states He does in the Book of Revelation: Revelation 20:4 They had not worshipped the beast or its image and had not received its mark on their foreheads or their hands. They came to life and reigned with Christ a thousand years. The Bible teaches us that a day is like a thousand years: 2 Peter 3:8 But do not forget this one thing, dear friends: With the LORD a day is like a thousand years, and a thousand years are like a day Psalm 90:4 A thousand years in your sight are like a day that has just gone by, or like a watch in the night. This 7000 year time line reflects the seven days of creation.

Pastors do not take from the collection plate, any more than a store clerk takes from the cash register. As to the value of a pastor, how do I value my own? The men that stayed with me day after day after day as my wife died? The men that stayed with me at my own hospital bed? The men that pray for me by name? The men that have spent years studying Greek and Hebrew sacrificing their time that they shall be better prepared to share the word of God with me? The men that have been called of the Holy Spirit and given the gifts that both serve and sustain the local body of Christ as it's head under Christ Jesus ? How much are they worth to me? At the least a double portion! At least double that of the typical skilled educated expert in their own field. Let the elders who rule well be considered worthy of double honor, especially those who labor in preaching and teaching. For the Scripture says, “You shall not muzzle an ox when it treads out the grain,” and, “The laborer deserves his wages.” Do not admit a charge against an elder except on the evidence of two or three witnesses.

This is not representative of freedom, this is tyranny in action.

He that waters shall be watereth, so if he keeps giving he will never lack. But saying he should give all his money to people in need?? There is no wisdom in that.

Well, Obama/Clinton sent Victoria Nolan and five or six CIA operatives there working with multiple Oligarchs and overthrew the Ukraine government. Then hand picked the people to run the country..... they then told Russia that they were not going to renew the lease on the only warm water port that Russia has close to their country and move the NATO fleet into that port which is on the western side of Crimea. To make matters worse the People in Crimea are ethnic Russians and 85% of them did not want to be part of Ukraine so they took a vote and joined Russia... The people in eastern Ukraine are ethnically Russian and speak Russian and the natural Ukrainians started treating them as second class citizens and the Russian speaking population asked Russia for help and Putin came to their rescue and the rest is history. We made as big of mess of that as we did the Middle East... Putin and Russia as a whole does not want to be part of the Global Government..... they also do not want to be beholding to the Rothschild central banks, so when they had paid off all their debt, they then became the enemy of the globalists and we must get them involved in a war so they would need to borrow the money to fight it...... been working that way for several hundred years now.

Throw those hands up sister and praise the Lord . My soul is lit on fire yet again . The joy of the LORD is our strength.

Amen! And written down expressly for a reason....that we would learn from it.

Mary, I want you to pray for me. It shocked me to read the first few sentences of this, because it is precisely where I left off in a conversation I was having with some Messianic Jews recently over the feasts. I have been working on my own spiritualized interpretations of the feasts in relation to the path each New Testament believer in Christ is supposed to walk. But that is admittedly a spiritualized application, and I believe in partial, literal and even spiritualized fulfillments of prophecy. In other words, I also found their arguments about the fulfillment of the feasts to be very interesting as well and something I wanted to look into, but didn't have the energy. By His grace I need to get into this with you, and badly, but it will take His grace to devote myself to it fully. So pray He gives me the time and ability if you would. P.S. Should I not respond to this again, please post me privately. It's as if the Lord is requiring me to deal with this, so He's leading me right back to it, LoL. God bless, Hidden

You loved sister . the trees are used figuratively as men . Is this not something amazing . i too have read that part where JESUS first healed him and he said I see men and trees walking , then the second time he restored his sight back to normal. ONLY JESUS DONT MAKE MISTAKES THEIR was a purpose for why that occurred. Its not like JESUS slipped up and was like OH no , here let me try again . NOPE the man was seeing in the SPIRIT realm. Yeah. JESUS don't make mistakes . You be blessed sister .

Sister you loved . What I say next is to me and all of us . so its just a general reminder . Look , the early church reminded Be YE HOLY they reminded and were far more grave than men today are . Just really ponder this . Do not Let these things even once be named among you as becometh saints . Don't even come close to todays , hey guys we cant stop sinning attitude. Or how about LET all who name the name of Christ depart from inquity . Sounds a far cry from look we should try and do better, um hey relax god knows their heart I mean I understand that most folks have sat under men who barely correct squat which led to acceptance of some sins and more and more sins being accepted. Sin is deadly . We got to understand this . I mean James said brethren if one does ERR from the truth and one converts him back he has saved a SOUL from death. far cry from oh God is love , all is well , you cant fall once you saved . I mean what on earth, we got to do something . I understand that folks aint used to ones like me . No , I really do . But hey now , I encourage too. I did like where yown made that post that said we should teach them promises too. He is right on that . He is . We should not get so offended if people misunderstand us . I mean in truth people , even here think I am one false wolf . Yeah I know its sad , but that is the way it is . I still love them , I still care for their soul and I still do all to both warn and encourage. God spared one of the worst when he spared me and changed me and keeps working on me . Therefore what is it to me if many or some think I is the big bad wolf . I aint better than JESUS PLEASEEEE HE IS the only goodness I have . IF people see me as evil , call me satan or whatever ...........they called the ONLY RIGHTEOUS one that first AND HE IS RIGHTEOUS , ours is but a gift . Now I loves you all. But I got to do as I am led of GOD to do. and when Yowm brought up that post the other day about the promises..........the SPIRIT said That is so needful too. I Have great peace in the LORD the only times I don't is when I don't heed his voice. Sister you loved . reminders about being holy and grave warnings , exhortations don't bother me at all. I hear those and even though I have long known................all it does is sharpen me . Now lets stir one another up , exactly the way we led too. I hope some do bring many pslams and many songs too, and warnings , IF ITS TRUTH my soul is happy .

Now I want to try and make the case that the Assyrian of Ezekiel 31 (v.2) who was a tree in the Garden of Eden (v. 18)is the same Lucifer/Assyrian spoken of in Isaiah 14.......and see if it fits........please compare the OP (Ez. 31) with Is. 14 below. And also keep in mind that Jesus/Messiah is referred to as the "Branch" elsewhere in scripture, ie, a tree in other words (of life)......similarly Lucifer is called an abominable branch (a tree in other words) below: Isa 14:3-26 And it shall come to pass in the day that the LORD shall give thee rest from thy sorrow, and from thy fear, and from the hard bondage wherein thou wast made to serve, That thou shalt take up this proverb against the king of Babylon, and say, How hath the oppressor ceased! the golden city ceased! The LORD hath broken the staff of the wicked, and the sceptre of the rulers. He who smote the people in wrath with a continual stroke, he that ruled the nations in anger, is persecuted, and none hindereth. The whole earth is at rest, and is quiet: they break forth into singing. Yea, the fir trees rejoice at thee, and the cedars of Lebanon, saying, Since thou art laid down, no feller is come up against us. Hell from beneath is moved for thee to meet thee at thy coming: it stirreth up the dead for thee, even all the chief ones of the earth; it hath raised up from their thrones all the kings of the nations. All they shall speak and say unto thee, Art thou also become weak as we? art thou become like unto us? Thy pomp is brought down to the grave, and the noise of thy viols: the worm is spread under thee, and the worms cover thee. How art thou fallen from heaven, O Lucifer, son of the morning! how art thou cut down to the ground, which didst weaken the nations! For thou hast said in thine heart, I will ascend into heaven, I will exalt my throne above the stars of God: I will sit also upon the mount of the congregation, in the sides of the north: I will ascend above the heights of the clouds; I will be like the most High. Yet thou shalt be brought down to hell, to the sides of the pit. They that see thee shall narrowly look upon thee, and consider thee, saying, Is this the man that made the earth to tremble, that did shake kingdoms; That made the world as a wilderness, and destroyed the cities thereof; that opened not the house of his prisoners? All the kings of the nations, even all of them, lie in glory, every one in his own house. But thou art cast out of thy grave like an ABOMINABLE BRANCH, and as the raiment of those that are slain, thrust through with a sword, that go down to the stones of the pit; as a carcase trodden under feet. Thou shalt not be joined with them in burial, because thou hast destroyed thy land, and slain thy people: the seed of evildoers shall never be renowned. Prepare slaughter for his children for the iniquity of their fathers; that they do not rise, nor possess the land, nor fill the face of the world with cities. For I will rise up against them, saith the LORD of hosts, and cut off from Babylon the name, and remnant, and son, and nephew, saith the LORD. I will also make it a possession for the bittern, and pools of water: and I will sweep it with the besom of destruction, saith the LORD of hosts. The LORD of hosts hath sworn, saying, Surely as I have thought, so shall it come to pass; and as I have purposed, so shall it stand: That I WILL BREAK THE ASSYRIAN in my land, and upon my mountains tread him under foot: then shall his yoke depart from off them, and his burden depart from off their shoulders. This is the purpose that is purposed upon the whole earth: and this is the hand that is stretched out upon all the nations.

I believe what you are saying for the most part

FRUIT and SEEDS Fruit in scripture can of course be literal……and/or it can be allegorical for works, character, or WORDS….as in the fruit of the lips. Seeds are words.....when someone eats fruit in the bible in an allegorical sense they are eating seeds/words…….either truth or lies. So here below are some scriptures about fruit and seeds….which establishes the fact that there are allegorical references in the bible regarding fruit and seeds.....which come from trees. Notice in the gospels Jesus spoke quite a bit about two kinds of trees……….corrupt trees and good trees. Corrupt trees bring forth evil fruit/seeds/words……lies. While good trees bring forth good fruit/seeds/words…….truth. Word/seeds have the ability to reproduce after their own kind. Gen 1:12 And the earth brought forth grass, and herb yielding seed after his kind, and the tree yielding FRUIT, WHOSE SEED WAS IN ITSELF, after his kind: and God saw that it was good. Gen 3:2-3 And the woman said unto the serpent, We may eat of the fruit of the trees of the garden: But of the fruit of the tree which is in the midst of the garden, God hath said, Ye shall not eat of it, neither shall ye touch it, lest ye die. Gen 3:6 And when the woman saw that the tree was good for food, and that it was pleasant to the eyes, and a tree to be desired to make one wise, she took of the fruit thereof, and did eat, and gave also unto her husband with her; and he did eat. Psa 21:8-11 Thine hand shall find out all thine enemies: thy right hand shall find out those that hate thee. Thou shalt make them as a fiery oven in the time of thine anger: the LORD shall swallow them up in his wrath, and the fire shall devour them. THEIR FRUIT shalt thou destroy from the earth, and THEIR SEED from among the children of men. For they intended evil against thee: they imagined a mischievous device, which they are not able to perform. Deu 22:9 Thou shalt not sow thy vineyard with divers seeds: lest the fruit of thy seed which thou hast sown, and the fruit of thy vineyard, be defiled. (ie, no mixture of truth and lies) 2Ki 19:30 And the remnant that is escaped of the house of Judah shall yet again take root downward, and bear fruit upward. Psa 1:3 And he shall be like a tree planted by the rivers of water, that bringeth forth his fruit in his season; his leaf also shall not wither; and whatsoever he doeth shall prosper. Psa 21:10 Their fruit shalt thou destroy from the earth, and their seed from among the children of men. Pro 11:30 The fruit of the righteous is a tree of life; and he that winneth souls is wise. Pro 12:14 A man shall be satisfied with good by the fruit of his mouth: and the recompence of a man's hands shall be rendered unto him. Pro 13:2 A man shall eat good by the fruit of his mouth: but the soul of the transgressors shall eat violence. Pro 18:20 A man's belly shall be satisfied with the fruit of his mouth; and with the increase of his lips shall he be filled. Pro 18:21 Death and life are in the power of the tongue: and they that love it shall eat the fruit thereof. Sng 2:3 As the apple tree among the trees of the wood, so is my beloved among the sons. I sat down under his shadow with great delight, and HIS FRUIT was sweet to my taste. Isa 10:12 Wherefore it shall come to pass, that when the Lord hath performed his whole work upon mount Zion and on Jerusalem, I will punish the FRUIT OF THE STOUT HEART OF THE KING OF ASSYRIA, and the glory of his high looks. Isa 57:19 I create the FRUIT OF THE LIPS; Peace, peace to him that is far off, and to him that is near, saith the LORD; and I will heal him. Hos 10:13 Ye have plowed wickedness, ye have reaped iniquity; ye have eaten THE FRUIT OF LIES: because thou didst trust in thy way, in the multitude of thy mighty men. Hos 14:8 Ephraim shall say, What have I to do any more with idols? I have heard him, and observed him: I am like a green fir tree. From me is thy fruit found. Mat 3:10 And now also the axe is laid unto the root of the trees: therefore every tree which bringeth not forth good fruit is hewn down, and cast into the fire. Mat 7:17 Even so every good tree bringeth forth good fruit; but a corrupt tree bringeth forth evil fruit. Mat 7:18 A good tree cannot bring forth evil fruit, neither can a corrupt tree bring forth good fruit. Mat 7:19 Every tree that bringeth not forth good fruit is hewn down, and cast into the fire. Mat 12:33 Either make the tree good, and his fruit good; or else make the tree corrupt, and his fruit corrupt: for the tree is known by his fruit. Mat 13:8 But other fell into good ground, and brought forth fruit, some an hundredfold, some sixtyfold, some thirtyfold. Mat 13:23 But he that received seed into the good ground is he that heareth the word, and understandeth it; which also beareth fruit, and bringeth forth, some an hundredfold, some sixty, some thirty.

I think this one needs to rest a while, as it's nowhere near the vicinity of the OP at this point.

Really..... I think you should do a little research on the life of a pastor and come back to this post. Imagine a pastor having to minister to people with differing opinions , i am not sure he would last that long and the money therefore would be of little value. The pastor has to go visit the sick, take calls in the middle of the night, hear of complaints that people blow out of proportion and mediate between spouses ect. This is the life of a real modern day pastor and much more. Should he not be compensated for his time and not worry about if he can send his three children to university. If you want to hear well prepared sermons when you go to church, pay the man, but through a committee or something of that sort that can see the reality of the church income to expense ratio. This is the modern world and he is a part of it too. The pastor on his volition has to come to terms of the gospel and his stance of money and power. He can decline or accept amounts . At the end of the day, he will have to give an account for his duties to the flock and his maker on that day.

I believe it! Came to that conclusion the first time I went to see my now bride, at Texas. I had to drive at least three hours past the edge to get there.

If this is a double post, forgive me. Still slowly figuring out the quirks at this site, LoL. Thanks for your response, Pillar. My response to this would be that I think we simply need to return to a proper understanding of what the rules originally were. While I don't wish to get into strife with anyone over this, I do actually agree to much of what Alex posted. I think where the church went wrong is by reintroducing the Old Testament practice of tithing under the guise that it was the same thing as "giving and receiving," which is clearly not the case at all. Giving and receiving was voluntary, and mostly involved simple exchanges, like with food and clothing. There were larger exchanges, such as the sale of lands to provide all things common to believers (Acts 2:44). But again, this was all voluntary. Tithing on the other hand is compulsory, and in the modern era the application of this doctrine is what has opened the door for massive abuses in the name of Christ, even by conservative preachers, which seem to completely contradict the example Paul was trying to set that it is better to give than to receive (Acts 20:35). I do not stand in judgment over others, including those who disagree with my position on this. God is their Judge, and will judge justly. I simply think the church would be reaching the lost more if the example we are setting returned to the original New Testament doctrines laid down by the apostles. I see no problem in giving and receiving when there is true need, but obligating believers to give massive amounts of money that tempts ministers to live exorbitantly at the expense of the church needs to be corrected, and it will only start when we finally correct our understanding of what true "giving and receiving" was meant to accomplish among the brethren.

Look on the bright side. Some of these very tiny churches are no longer being used because the congregants actually were able to build larger facilities that had air conditioners and bathrooms and heat and electricity. I do think small, abandoned church buildings like this should be preserved for historic purposes or if used for something else, don't change anything about it. And to be frank and honest, some of these small churches were dead and cold. The size of the building isn't what makes the church, the people, on fire for God.

So what you are trying to say is that men called by God to serve him should never be rich?? The simple truth is that if you are called by God to carry out his works and your intentions are for your own selfish motives, then that is wrong and God detests such character. But if you were called by him and and you love carrying out his work with passion then that is exactly what Christ wants and he will bless you. He will cause people to favor you. So what do you do when God causes people to favor with huge amounts of money?? Will you reject it?? Jesus was not rich on earth because he wanted to use himself as an example to teach humility. Can a servant of God who is extremely wealthy not also be humble??

You feel the same way about the fence in Israel? After all, it is just "Palestinians" yearning to be free and live in the Promised Land even to the point that they will break it's laws to do so?

Don't worry,that will never happen and those things don't save us , it's only Jesus who will wash our sins away.. “In Him we have redemption through His blood, the forgiveness of sins, according to the riches of His grace” (Ephesians 1:7)

They are probably just trying to be funny, giving definitions that your average unsaved teen might normally use. But I would agree that this is inappropriate for a study bible

And I would add that the phrase "full of grace" in reference to Mary is a bit unscriptural. Was she endowed with an amazing form of grace in being chosen to bear the Christ-child? Yes, but the expression "full of grace" more technically refers to someone upon whom the Holy Spirit has descended in great power and fullness, and that is something entirely different.

Whoa! That is absolutely horrific! I agree with you in that these "alternative definitions" especially the one dealing with sex is disgusting and totally unworthy of being in a Teen Bible of all things. Who are these editor's who would think that these alternative meanings would help get teens interested in Church, prayer, and witnessing? Just reading them it's obvious that they would have the opposite effect. In their attempts to sound hip and in tune with teens they have disgraced the Word of God. Thanks for sharing. I hope that youth workers, Sunday school teachers, and parents will investigate these teenage Bibles to see what is being written in them...and then perhaps even lodge some complaints (something has to be done). This was very shocking to me, especially for one who has taught teenagers and been involved in youth ministry in the past. I am definitely going to pass on this information. Kudos and blessings to you!

Oh really? (My last name: O'Reillius) The Olivet Discourse is addressed only to 1st century Israel? Then why is Jesus' audience the very nexus of the Church. Who needs more study? You should never let your eschatology determine your theology. The book of Matthew is centered around five major discourses by Jesus, and only the last one - where He answers when He will come again - doesn't pertain to us -- according to you. And according to you -- Matthew's use of "elect" for whom is gathered up - is not defined as it is everywhere else in the New Testament - and Matthew was probably written after the Jewish Disciples of Jesus saw that the Holy Spirit was opened up to Gentiles too, as it was in Antioch.

Just a thought for the day,God used John in a mighty way ,the Bible said of him there was never a greater person born,John never performed miracles ,he simple was a witness to the Light(Jesus) Some people think that if they can,t perform miracles or if they don,t have the gifts they think they should have that Jesus doesn't love them or that they are not very good Christians, nothing is farther from the truth ,Jesus wants you to serve Him wherever you are and He will let you know His plan for you ,which could be to be witness for Jesus and to show people the light just like John. John 1041: Trough John never performed a sign,all that John said was true. Are we all we can be for Jesus?

Hi 4 It's most often the little things we do which count the most, if we obey Jesus and let Him work in and through us,He will lead us where He wants us to go and what He wants us to say to other people. Wherever the Spirit is there is freedom God placed us in Canada, far away from my family, which is from the Netherland. He wants us to glorify Him no matter where we are.. Therefore, since we are surrounded by such a great cloud of witnesses, let us throw off everything that hinders and the sin that so easily entangles. And let us run with perseverance the race marked out for us, Hebrews 12 :1