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    And besides it does not say the term "great" falling away, but rather just falling away, and in the other scripture of some departing from the faith, it does not say how many the some are. But if we look at what is happening today, you can see that the falling away is great. And some departing from the faith, just shows that not all shall depart from the faith.

    The latter times is now of course, but I believe that the falling away and the departing from faith is referring to the same thing, it is a witness verse, to the falling away. It is the Catholic church leading this apostasia, and Christians that partake of this ecumenical movement are falling away from the faith through compromise. And Islamabad, the falling away totally fits the context, for think of it this way, what better way to prepare people to receive the antichrist, but by there being less Christians standing for truth? And in this chapter it talks about the mystery of iniquity, the wicked one, so why not something else that is negative such as the falling away? And besides by comparing scriptures with scriptures, which God tells us to do, you see that the Holy Ghost is still present, and there is not another scripture that bears witness with your interpretation of it referring to the Holy Ghost being taken out of the way, but there is another scripture that bears witness of a departing of the faith in the latter days !!! I know were you are coming from Islamabad, I use to believe also that he who was taken out of the way, refers to the Holy Ghost, until I did a thorough study of it myself, then I had to let go of that doctrine. We have to be able , in some fashion to think for ourselves, through of course seeking understanding of scriptures through the Holy Ghost.

    And this scripture: 2Th 2:3 (3) Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition; Fits well with this scripture: 1Ti 4:1 (1) Now the Spirit speaketh expressly, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits, and doctrines of devils;

    Even most of the people who actually wrote the old English bibles, and translated the word:"apotasia" as departure, knew that it was referring to a departure of the faith, here is info on this: (https://bewareofthewolves.blogspot.ca/2016/01/apostasia-rebellion-or-rapture-thomas.html) (...William Tyndale interpreted apostasia as a departure from the faith.. "sheweth that there shall be a departure from the faith....." 2 Thessalonians 2:3 Let no ma deceave you by eny meanes for the lorde commeth not excepte ther come a departynge fyrst and that that synfnll man be opened ye sonne of perdicion." {5} Tyndale NT Commentary: "The necessary prelude to the coming of Christ is 'the rebellion'.... falling away hardly gives the force of apostasia..... In classical Greek, the word apostasia denoted a political or military rebellion; but in the Greek Old Testament we find it used of rebellion against God (e.g. Joshua xxii. 22), and this becomes the accepted biblical usage." {6})... ...The Original Geneva Footnotes The Geneva Bible (Breeches Bible) includes marginal notes authored by John Calvin, John Knox, Miles Coverdale, and many other leaders of the Reformation. The Second Epistle Of Paul To The Thessalonians: "Lest the Thessalonians should think that Paul neglected them, because he went to other places, rather than come to them, he writeth unto them and exhorteth them to patience and other fruits of faith, neither to be moved with that vain opinion of such as taught that the coming of Christ was at hand, for as much as before that day there should be a falling away from the true religion, even by a great part of the world, and that Antichrist should reign in the Temple of God;" 2 Thessalonians 2: " 2 He sheweth that the day of the Lord shall not come, till there be a departure from the faith, and that the Antichrist be revealed, 8 whose destruction he setteth out, 15 and thereupon exhorteth to constancy." {7}...)

    The bible says to compare the word with the word , which is what I have done, and besides what you say of the 2 witnesses makes absolutely no sense, how do you say that they begin in the last half of the tribulation yet they begin before the mid point ??? And it being 3 1/2 days rather than 3 1/2 years ? because what the bible says is that they prophesy for 3 1/2 years (not days), and at the mid point the Antichrist shall kill them. Rev 11:3 (3) And I will give power unto my two witnesses, and they shall prophesy a thousand two hundred and threescore days, clothed in sackcloth. 1.260 days equals to 3 1/2 years via the Jewish calender of the bible. And at the mid point the Antichrist kills them: Rev 11:7 (7) And when they shall have finished their testimony, the beast that ascendeth out of the bottomless pit shall make war against them, and shall overcome them, and kill them. And at this mid point is when he begins his persecution of people who reject his mark.

    2Th 2:7-8 (7) For the mystery of iniquity doth already work: only he who now letteth will let, until he be taken out of the way. (8) And then shall that Wicked be revealed, whom the Lord shall consume with the spirit of his mouth, and shall destroy with the brightness of his coming: He who now letteth, is referred to as an "he", and I know that some say it refers to the church being taken out of the way, but the church in the scriptures is not referred to as an he, but rather as a bride. Now in other cases, some say that the "he" refers to the Holy Spirit, and yes the Holy Spirit can refer to an "he" , but does he refer to this "he" ? First of all the context of this , is that after this "he" is taken out of the way, then shall that wicked be revealed. Now I believe that he gets revealed in who he is, before the rapture happens, but say he gets revealed after the rapture, will the Holy Spirit still be here during the tribulation period? Yes he will be here, through the 2 witnesses, and many shall be getting saved during the tribulation period, and you need the Holy Spirit in order for people to get saved. And the 2 witnesses shall prophesy for the first 3 1/2 years of tribulation, so the Holy Spirit shall be here even at the very beginning of the tribulation period, which shows he never left. And here are other scriptures to think about: Joe 2:28-31 (28) And it shall come to pass afterward, that I will pour out my spirit upon all flesh; and your sons and your daughters shall prophesy, your old men shall dream dreams, your young men shall see visions: (29) And also upon the servants and upon the handmaids in those days will I pour out my spirit. (30) And I will shew wonders in the heavens and in the earth, blood, and fire, and pillars of smoke. (31) The sun shall be turned into darkness, and the moon into blood, before the great and the terrible day of the LORD come. Now we know that the start of the fulfillment of this outpouring of the Spirit, started on the day of Pentecost, in the book of Acts, but this out pouring shall even continue in some fashion unto the time, just before the great and terrible day of the Lord come, for it shall be poured out in those days , not just the time of Pentecost, though it does include this, but also up to the time of the second coming or the great and terrible day of the Lord come. I believe that the outpouring of the Spirit has never ceased, and that the book of Joel is an on going fulfillment, to were men at varying times, humbled themselves, and sought hard after God, and experience great moves of God to were it spread all over the earth in some fashion, and we can see this in various revivals of the past. And this move of the Spirit shall continue even unto the time of the second coming, which shows that the Holy Spirit will still be here. Act 2:38-39 (38) Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost. (39) For the promise is unto you, and to your children, and to all that are afar off, even as many as the Lord our God shall call. 1Co 13:8-10 (8) Charity never faileth: but whether there be prophecies, they shall fail; whether there be tongues, they shall cease; whether there be knowledge, it shall vanish away. (9) For we know in part, and we prophesy in part. (10) But when that which is perfect is come, then that which is in part shall be done away. See here it does not say that when he who is perfect is come, but rather when "that" which is perfect is come, which refers to everything being brought to perfection, to were there is a new earth, death has been completely dealt with and so forth, so the move of the Spirit may even continue, in some form , in the millenial reign. I see no evidence whatsoever of the Holy Spirit being taken out of the way !!!!!!!

    The word harpazo is used to refer to the catching away or rapture, but not the word apostasy. (Strong's concordance) (G726 ἁρπάζω harpazō har-pad'-zo From a derivative of G138; to seize (in various applications): - catch (away, up), pluck, pull, take (by force). Total KJV occurrences: 13) But the word apostasy means this: (Strong's concordance) (G646 ἀποστασία apostasia ap-os-tas-ee'-ah Feminine of the same as G647; defection from truth (properly the state), (“apostasy”): - falling away, forsake. Total KJV occurrences: 2) The 2 occurrences that the word Apostasia appears in the new testament, are as follows: 2Th 2:3 (3) Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition; And Act 21:21 (21) And they are informed of thee, that thou teachest all the Jews which are among the Gentiles to forsake Moses, saying that they ought not to circumcise their children, neither to walk after the customs. Forsaking Moses, is talking about a defection, a departing from Moses, but not a type of rapture, or catching away, and God uses the right word for the right thing, he is not a God of confusion. Now Harpazo is a right word for a catching away or rapture. And here are old English bibles via the word falling away: (Bishop's bible) (2Th 2:3 (3) Let no man deceaue you by any meanes, for [the Lorde shall not come] excepte there come a fallyng away first, & that that man of sinne be reuealed, the sonne of perdition,) (Tyndale bible) (3 Let no ma deceave you by eny meanes for the lorde commeth not excepte ther come a departynge fyrst and that that synfnll man be opened ye sonne of perdicion ) (Wycliffe bible) (3 [That] No man deceive you in any manner. For but dissension come first [For no but departing away, or dissension, shall come first], and the man of sin be showed, the son of perdition, ) (Geneva bible) (2Th 2:3 (3) Let no man deceiue you by any meanes: for that day shall not come, except there come a departing first, and that that man of sinne be disclosed, euen the sonne of perdition,) (KJV-1611) (2Th 2:3 (3) Let no man deceiue you by any meanes, for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sinne bee reuealed, the sonne of perdition,)

    Here is what the actual scriptures say: 2Th 2:7-8 (7) For the mystery of iniquity doth already work: only he who now letteth will let, until he be taken out of the way. (8) And then shall that Wicked be revealed, whom the Lord shall consume with the spirit of his mouth, and shall destroy with the brightness of his coming: When he who now letteth will let, gets taken out of the way, after this shall the wicked be revealed. The mystery of iniquity is not the antichrist perse of course, put rather the spirit of antichrist, which shall still be here when the antichrist gets revealed in who he is, which may have (possibly) already happened. So the one taken out of the way is not the antichrist, for he gets revealed after he who letteth that lets, gets taken out of the way. And after he who letteth gets taken out of the way, then the antichrist is revealed in who he is. And this wicked one who gets revealed , during Christ's second coming, Christ shall consume him and destroy him after a certain manner.

    Gal 4:26 (26) But Jerusalem which is above is free, which is the mother of us all. Of course this is said in a figurative way and not in a literal way, for no city in and of itself can be a literal mother, but in a figurative way, it is the mother of all true believers for believer's shall abide there, in essence in her womb. And always remember that this is figurative and not literal, which there is a cult out there that I know of, which uses this verse in a literal manner, and these people worship the mother god, along with this guy named Ahn Sahng-hong, it is called the church of God, but I call it the Korean church of God, which is a cult.

    Here is an interesting ti bit, I would like to add concerning this religion called "Mithraism" which was in existence at the time of the Roman empire. I know that Antiochus Epiphanes, is also said to be a type of antichrist, well do you know what his real name is ? Well here is info from Wikipedia: (Wikipedia) (Antiochus IV Epiphanes (/ænˈtaɪ.əkəs ɛˈpɪfəniːz/, alternatively /ænˈti.ɒkəs/ ; Ancient Greek: Ἀντίοχος Δ΄ ὁ Ἐπιφανής, Antíochos D' ho Epiphanḗs, "God Manifest";[1] c. 215 BC – 164 BC) was a Hellenistic Greekking of the Seleucid Empire from 175 BC until his death in 164 BC.[2][3][4] He was a son of King Antiochus III the Great. His original name was Mithradates (alternative form Mithridates); he assumed the name Antiochus after he ascended the throne) The name mithradates means this: (Wikipedia) (Mithridates /ˌmɪθˈrɪdətiːz/ or Mithradates (Old Persian 𐎷𐎡𐎰𐎼𐎭𐎠𐎫 Miθradāta) is the Hellenistic form of an Iranian theophoric name, meaning "given by the deity Mithra". In modern Persian it is called Mehrdad. ) So it means "given by the deity Mithra".

    I know that in the past the popular view was that the restrainer was the roman empire falling, and ecclesiastical Rome rising, and today the popular views is either the church or the Holy Ghost being the restrainer, but none of these views really fit the context, and there is such a thing as a future antichrist, and I do believe that he is here today, he is called many things, but also he is known as the Assyrian. 2Th 2:7 (7) For the mystery of iniquity doth already work: only he who now letteth will let, until he be taken out of the way. The mystery of iniquity of course refers to the spirit of antichrist, he who was even letting in Paul's day, refers to something that happened in the past, which eventually brought forth our modern day falling away, the word Latinos has something to do with it, that is the Latin man of the mass, and in Paul's day there was certain types of masses, even through this group called "Mithraism" , and even in Latin, and even types of Latin documents or scriptures, which they had similar types of masses in some fashion to Catholicism, and similar types of masses and the latin scriptures, were merged into Catholicism, and eventually what was brought forth is Jerome's Latin Vulgate. Near the time of the Vatican 2 council, the Latin man of the mass, was in essence taken out of the way, to were priest were now allowed to preach their sermons in their own language. The modern day ecumenical system was set like never before, and now they could preach from their corrupt bibles in their own languages, (Douay Rheims) now the protestant churches with their corrupt bibles such as the NIV , Message etc, could be brought forth in a type of ecumenical gathering, were churches are brought together, to merge with Rome. This is the falling away.
  12. Discerning of spirits

    Joh 10:24-26 (24) Then came the Jews round about him, and said unto him, How long dost thou make us to doubt? If thou be the Christ, tell us plainly. (25) Jesus answered them, I told you, and ye believed not: the works that I do in my Father's name, they bear witness of me. (26) But ye believe not, because ye are not of my sheep, as I said unto you. When the works of Christ are done, whether it be an healing, miracle or whatever, there will always be a Godly nature to it, it will never be for the sake of bringing attention to an individual, but rather bringing glory to God. When it is Christ, the fruit of the Spirit will follow, and not the works of the flesh. Mat 7:21-23 (21) Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven. (22) Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works? (23) And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity. Now there are genuine miracles, and claims of miracles that are not genuine, these specific people in Matthew 7:21-23 were not genuine, and God never ever knew these specific people. And when I first became born again, there were things I did not see before, which God was bringing conviction to me about , to were I felt uncomfortable in certain situations, to were I could not be part of these things. And there was this meeting I went to once, and this man spoke in tongues (which I believe in genuine tongues) which you could feel an evil presence therein. To gain more discernment it always takes to getting to know Christ better, and getting to know his word better, which of course Jesus is the word, and to allow him to ever conform us to his image.
  13. This has been blessing me today, encouraging me for our coming service, God is good.
  14. " Founded A Christian Nation "

    Hmmm interesting read, makes me want to look further in this issue, all I know is that under the new covenant, criminals should not just be let to go free.
  15. " Founded A Christian Nation "

    I like this answer, and here are other scriptures to think about: Luk 3:14-16 (14) And the soldiers likewise demanded of him, saying, And what shall we do? And he said unto them, Do violence to no man, neither accuse any falsely; and be content with your wages. (15) And as the people were in expectation, and all men mused in their hearts of John, whether he were the Christ, or not; (16) John answered, saying unto them all, I indeed baptize you with water; but one mightier than I cometh, the latchet of whose shoes I am not worthy to unloose: he shall baptize you with the Holy Ghost and with fire: This is what John the baptist said to the soldiers, to do violence to know man, and I totally agree with you Marilyn, especially in this saying:"The believer in the Body of Christ should have NO part in going to war (fighting) against other nations. They can of course be Chaplains, nurses, doctors, ambulance drivers, mechanics, etc looking after people and sharing their trust in Christ for eternal salvation.". So if you are a Christian, then as a soldier, you are told to do no violence to any man, which in the military you are required to do violence to a man if needs be. Now concerning protecting your family I believe that you can seek to subdue the person so they cannot do violence to your family, or seek out what the Lord would have you do in that moment, for he can protect you through angels etc. The disciples did not conquer the world by the sword, but conquered people's hearts through the gospel. And some died as a result. Here is another scripture: Luk 9:54-56 (54) And when his disciples James and John saw this, they said, Lord, wilt thou that we command fire to come down from heaven, and consume them, even as Elias did? (55) But he turned, and rebuked them, and said, Ye know not what manner of spirit ye are of. (56) For the Son of man is not come to destroy men's lives, but to save them. And they went to another village. We Christian's are in the saving business. Rom 13:3-5 (3) For rulers are not a terror to good works, but to the evil. Wilt thou then not be afraid of the power? do that which is good, and thou shalt have praise of the same: (4) For he is the minister of God to thee for good. But if thou do that which is evil, be afraid; for he beareth not the sword in vain: for he is the minister of God, a revenger to execute wrath upon him that doeth evil. (5) Wherefore ye must needs be subject, not only for wrath, but also for conscience sake. The rulers are ministers of God, and they can apply the judgments of God via the sword or capital punishment not in vain, for they are under the law, and Christians can be rulers as well, but cannot apply capital punishment on people, for as a soldier we are called to do violence to no man, and also it is no longer an eye for eye, we are no longer under the old covenant, we are called to lead people to Christ. Now should there be jails ? Of course there should, but the Christian is not called to violence in any way, shape or form.