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Quasar93

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Quasar93 last won the day on December 2

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About Quasar93

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  1. Critics of a Time Gap

    Those who do not think that the seventy weeks of Daniel 9:24-27 have a literal and chronologically precise fulfillment are opposed to the postponement of the seventieth week as a yet future time of seven years. Examples of such criticism can be found by those within the Reconstructionist movement, holding to a form of preterist postmillennialism. Gary DeMar complains: Placing a gap between the sixty-ninth and seventieth weeks of Daniel 9:24-27 "must be fixed" because of the system created by dispensationalists, not because the Bible mentions anything about a gap. . . . dispensationalists force the Bible to comply to an already developed system that insists that these events cannot be describing first-century events. Fellow preterist, Dr. Ken Gentry echoes DeMar’s refrain in the following: An overriding concern of the prophecy, in distinction to all other Messianic prophecies is that it is specifically designed to be a measuring time-frame. . . . If there were gaps between the units, the whole idea of measurement in the "seventy weeks" would vanish. An elastic yardstick is a worthless measure. None of the other prophecies brought forward as illustrations of a gap claim to be a measure of time. Dr. Gentry is right about one thing, that the Daniel 9 passage is the only Messianic prophecy that specifically deals with chronology or the time element. While I believe that I have shown that the passage itself requires a chronological postponement between the sixty-ninth and seventieth weeks of years, it is also supported by other Messianic passages which are not specifically time oriented, but clearly do refer to distinct time-periods: Christ’s first coming and his second coming. If anyone believes in the two comings of Christ, and both DeMar and Gentry do, then they also believe in a gap of time between the first and second coming of Christ. I want to show how this fits into a clear biblical pattern that in turn lends support to the notion of a gap of time in Daniel 9:24-27. By Thomas Ice For full details of Scriptural gaps: http://www.raptureready.com/featured/ic ... ks-11.html [site has moved] Quasar93
  2. What is the Day of the Lord?

    When you post something representing it is a quote of mine, when in fact it is something you posted, it is a misrepresentation! So don't try arguing out of it! I showed you in a previous post where Jesus called His reference to Daniel, in Mt.24:15 -21 TRIBULATION, in the KJV, the NASB and then ESV translations. Xapiche?! Quasar93 s m
  3. What is the Day of the Lord?

    The teachings of Jesus, Matthew, Luke, John and Paul, on the coming Pre-trib rapture of the Church is documented in the four post link below, that refute you: https://www.tapatalk.com/groups/deeperwalk/the-biblical-teaching-of-the-pre-trib-rapture-of-t-t19401898.html Quasar93
  4. What is the Day of the Lord?

    FYI, you have completely misrepresented what I wrote,that you quoted at the top of your post. I wrote the following: >>>"Quote by Diaste: >>>" The first half of the week is not called 'tribulation'. Jesus calls this time of unrest, 'the beginning of sorrows', 'birth pains' or similar depending on the bible version, but never 'tribulation'. Calling the first half 'tribulation' is a misnomer and I'm not sure why this occurs when it's never referenced as such in scripture."<<< That's what it was about. The 70th and final week/seven years of Daniel, is called the tribulation. The final 3.5 years of it is called the Great Tribulation, the Day of the Lord. Quasar93
  5. Ancient Jewish Marriage customs Gen.29:20 "So Jacob served seven years for Rachel and they seemed to him but a few days because of his love for her." Precisely as the case is with the Bride/Church to the marriage to the Lamb/Jesus in Rev.19:7-8, in the seven year span, from Jesus using John to symbolize the Church. in Rev.4:1-2, confirming 2 Thess.2:3 and 7-8, Jn.14:2-3, 28 and 1 Thess.4:16-17, until the second coming of Jesus, with His Church, from the marriagein heaven, as recorded in Rev.19:14. A seven year period of time, as recorded in Dan.9:27. There is nothing at all in your above post that refutes a single passage of Scripture that teaches the coming pre-trib rapture of the Church, as recorded below: https://www.tapatalk.com/groups/deeperwalk/the-biblical-teaching-of-the-pre-trib-rapture-of-t-t19401898.html Quasar93
  6. THERE WILL BE TWO MORE TEMPLES BUILT IN ISRAEL

    The difference in the dimensions of the Millennial temple as compared with the two previous ones: There is a vast difference between the Temple described by Ezekiel and that of the other Temples. For example, Temple researcher and archeologist Dr. Randall Price highlights the vast grandeur of Ezekiel's Temple compared to the others. " One of the problems for many who seek to interpret Ezekiel's vision of the Temple literally is the problem of the immense size of the building (compared to the sizes of the First and Second Temples). According to Ezekiel's text, the millennial city of Jerusalem and the Temple will together encompass a 2,500 square-mile area. The portion reserved for the priests and Levites is some 50 miles, while the Temple courts will be one mile square. These dimensions are larger than those of the modern State of Israel." (Randall Price, The Temple and Bible Prophecy, p. 531). The vast size of the temple has led some to interpret the Temple spiritually since the current physical landscape cannot hold the structures. However, God's work during the Great Tribulation provides ample descriptions of physical changes to the earth and the Temple proper will sit higher than any structure around. That currently is not the case, so the mountains surrounding the temple mount will be split (Zech. 13:4) and the Temple mount will rise (Zech. 14:10). For the rest of the article: http://scofieldministries.blogspot.com/ ... by-dr.html In addition: http://www.templemount.org/ezektmp.html Quasar93
  7. THERE WILL BE TWO MORE TEMPLES BUILT IN ISRAEL The tribulation temple: Matthew 24:15 - When you see the “abomination of desolation,” spoken of through Daniel the prophet, standing in the holy place… 2 Thessalonians 2:4 - "...so that he sets himself up in God's temple, proclaiming himself to be God" Revelation 11:1 - "...Go and measure the temple of God and the alter..." The Millennial temple: Ezekiel 43:7 - "...this is the place of my throne...This is where I will live among the Israelites forever." Ezekiel 43:27 - …your priests will your burnt offerings and peace offerings on the altar, and I will accept you, declares the Lord. Zechariah 6:12-13 - ...Here is the Man whose name is the Branch, and he will…build the temple of the Lord. At the present time there is no temple on the Temple Mount in Jerusalem, the location of both the first and second Jewish Temples. Instead, two Muslim shrines, The Dome of the Rock and the Al Aqsa Mosque, stand on the Temple Mount. Meantime, the Jewish people to consider the Temple Mount to be the most sacred place for Jews in all the world. No wonder the Temple Mount is a political powder keg and must be part of any formula for peace in the Middle East! According to the Bible, a temple will once again stand on the Temple Mount. How and when the Temple Mount will be available for a future temple remains to be seen. Biblical prophecy “buffs” have proposed all kinds of potential scenarios for how all of this could take place—everything from earthquakes to explosives to the collapse of the Temple Mount platform! Some well-meaning Christians have felt that the biblical predictions of a future Temple should be spiritualized, saying that these prophecies refer to the Church or to the individual Christian. Indeed, 1 Corinthians 3:16 makes it quite clear that the Church, as the body of Christ, is the spiritual temple of the Holy Spirit. And in 1 Corinthians 6:19 we are taught that the physical body of every individual believer is to be honored and kept clean, because it is the temple of the Holy Spirit. But these wonderful New Testament truths do not alter the biblical predictions of a literal future Temple in Jerusalem. The question of a future Temple gets more complicated when we realize that the Bible teaches that two temples are yet to stand on the Temple Mount in the future. First will come a Tribulation Temple, followed by a Millennium Temple which will be built when the Lord returns and sets up His kingdom on this earth. Let's look at the Scriptures dealing with these two future temples. Here: http://www.templemount.org/TM34.html Here: http://sonstoglory.com/ThirdTempleEzeki ... Temple.htm [No tribulation temple shown] Quasar93
  8. Let me see your Scriptural evidence the Church was not in heaven before the man of lawlessness [Same person as all three of the "he's" in Dan.9:27] as 2 Thess.2:3 and 7-8 tell us it will be! Quassar93
  9. What is the Day of the Lord?

    The first half of the week is not called 'tribulation'. Jesus calls this time of unrest, 'the beginning of sorrows', 'birth pains' or similar depending on the bible version, but never 'tribulation'. Calling the first half 'tribulation' is a misnomer and I'm not sure why this occurs when it's never referenced as such in scripture. Quote by Diaste: >>>" The first half of the week is not called 'tribulation'. Jesus calls this time of unrest, 'the beginning of sorrows', 'birth pains' or similar depending on the bible version, but never 'tribulation'. Calling the first half 'tribulation' is a misnomer and I'm not sure why this occurs when it's never referenced as such in scripture."<<< That's what it was about. The 70th and final year of Daniel, is called the tribulation. The final 3.5 years of it is called the Great Tribulation. Quasar93
  10. Applying Scripture Literally.

    1. According to Rev.14:3, the 144,000 were redeemed from the earth and did not defile themselves with women. Being redeemed from the earth reveals they were among the righteous ones who went to OT Sheol, before Jesus first advent, as described in Lk.16:19-23. Where both the righteous and the wicked went, because it was impossible for the blood of bulls and goats to take away their sins, as seen in Heb.10:4. 2. After Jesus shed His blood and died on the cross, He went to Sheol/prison in the spirit to preach to them there according to 1 Pet.3:18-20. Among them were the 144,000 righteous OT saints, who then received Jesus as their Lord. 3. When Jesus ascended into heaven, recorded in Acts 1:9, He brought all of the OT saints from Sheol with Him to heaven, including the 144,000 Israelites, according to Eph.4:7-10. This is also the reason why it was said of them they had not been defiled by women, since going to heaven, having been born again when receiving Jesus as their Lord. 4. After the Church is raptured, according to Jn.14:2-4, 28; 1 Thes.4:13-17 and 2 Thes.2:1-8, the man of lawlessness, the antichrist is revealed, as seen in 2 Thes2:3, 4 and 8, the seven year tribulation begins, according to Dan.9:27 and Rev.6:2, by the first rider on the white horse in the first of the seven seals. 5. Just before the seventh seal is opened, God will place the 144,000 Israelites on the earth, recorded in Rev.7:1-8, to preach the Gospel to all those left on earth after the departure of the Church. In the same way He will place His two witnesses on earth as seen in Rev.11:3-6. There is no other way they could get here as converted evangelists, since there won't be a single person on earth to preach the Gospel to them, to do so, after the departure of the Church before the tribulation begins. 6. The Great Multitude of Rev.7:9-17 is a parenthetic passage of all of those who the 144,000 will bring to the Lord during the seven year tribulation. The Great Multitude have nothing to do with the Church and will be known as the martyred tribulation saints. The very same ones who will participate as martyrs in the first resurrection in Rev.20:4 and 6. 7. When the mission has been completed, the 144,000 will all be translated back to heaven in Rev.14:3 and God will commission an angel to preach the Gospel to all those left on the earth, after their departure, according to Rev.14:6-7. Quasar93
  11. Applying Scripture Literally.

    Reference you have made to the 144,000 is in Rev.14, not Rev.12. See ther following: Who/what are the 144,000 Israelites ? According to the Bible, Jesus, Paul and John revealed, those of us who belong to His Church, will be CAUGHT UP [Raptured] to Him in the clouds of the sky, before the antichrist is revealed, as recorded in 2 Thes.2:3 and 7-8. Who triggers the seven year tribulation/70th Week of Daniel, God decreed Israel to go through in Dan.9:27. [In connection with the Church = Jn.14:1-4 and 28; 1 Thes.4:14-18 and 2 Thes.2:1-8]. In connection with Israel = Jer.30:7 and Dan.9:27, where the person who 'confirms a covenant/treaty/agreement with Israel is the antichrist, and all three of the "he's" in that vs, triggers the 70th and final 'Week,'/seven year tribulation/Day of the Lord. Seen also in 2 Thes.2:3-4 and 7- 8]. Jesus said He has two sheep folds, Israel whom He was addressing, and the "other one He must also bring," the Church, according to Jn.10:16. He prophecied that they will become one fold with one Shepherd. He also said many who are first will be last [Israel] and many who are last will be first [The Church] in Mt.19:30. This will be fullfilled after the first resurrection af all the tribulation saints, in Rev.20:4-6, and then rule with Christ for 1,000 years, in Rev.4 and 6. He meant His Church will be CAUGHT UP to be with Him before the tribulation, according to 1 Thes.4:16-17 and 2 Thes.2:1-8] and that Israel will go through the tribulation [Dan.9:27]. When Israel finally recognizes Jesus as their Messiah, according to Zech.12:10 , they will then come into the same sheep fold with the Church and the two will become one fold, with Jesus being the one Shepherd, when He establishes His Millennial kingdom here on earth according to Rev.20:6. When the Church is Caught Up to be with the Lord in heaven, the antichrist is revealed and the tribulation begins, according to 2 Thes.2:3-4, 7-8; Dan.9:27 and Rev.6:2]. The overview of the tribulation, begins with the first of the four riders, on the white horse, who is the antichrist, in the first of seven seals; after the six seals, before the seventh seal that contains the seven trumpet judgements begins in Rev.; God will send 144,000 consisting of 12,000 Israelites from each of twelve of their tribes, that He "redeems from the earth" according to Rev.14:3. Sealing them, and they become converted believers in Jesus Christ who will take the place of the Raptured Church, to preach the Eternal Gospel in their absence, to all those left on the earth, according to Rev.7:1-8. Whom God will send here from heaven [as He will His two witnesses of Rev.11]. They were the righteous ones in OT Sheol when Jesus preached the gospel to them, according to 1 Pet.3:18-20. Then when He ascended into heaven, in Acts 1:9, He took all the righteous ones who came from OT Sheol with Him, as seen in Eph.4:7-10, fulfilling the prophecy in Ps.68:18. [During OT times, the spirits of the righteous dead went to Sheol, as did the wicked, because it is impossible for the blood of bulls and goats to take away sin, according to Heb.10:3-4, Lk.16:19-23 and in Ps.49:14-15, until Jesus shed His blood and died on the cross, amplified by Paul in Rom.3:25-26. The efforts of their work as evangelists is then revealed in the parenthetic [preview] view of the Great Multitude seen in heaven, recorded in Rev.7:9-17, who represents all of those who will be saved during the tribulation, and who are also the martyrs who participate in the first resurrection of Rev.20:4-6. They are the tribulation saints and are the ones who will be left behind, when the Church is raptured, and do not belong to the Church, until after the 144,000 bring them to the Lord. The 144,000 do not belong to the Church or they would be raptured with the Church before the tribulation begins. When their work is finished, the 144,000 will be translated, and return to heaven, in Rev.14:1-5. When that happens, the earth will once again be without anyone to preach the Eternal Gospel. So God will commission an angel to do so in Rev.14:6-7. Therefore, the 144,000 are all converted Israelites who take the place of the Raptured Church to preach the Gospel to all those who will be left behind when Jesus comes to take His Church with Him to our Father in heaven, as previously address above, documented in Jn.14:2-4 and 28; 1Thes.4:13-17 and 2 Thes.2:1-8. Quasar93
  12. If the Church didn't get into heaven as when 2 Thess.2:3 and 7-8 reveal, then supposing you tell me how they are present for the marriage that take place in heaven, according to Rev.19:7-8, while the tribulation is taking place on earth. Then return with Jesus from heaven in verse 14! You remain refuted! Case closed! Quasar93
  13. What is the Day of the Lord?

    As the translations of the KJV, ESV and NASB of Mt.24:21 reveal: 21"For then there will be a great tribulation, such as has not occurred since the beginning of the world until now, nor ever will." Quasar93
  14. The Scriptures thoroughly refute you, as my posts clearly reveal to you. The following as another example: >>>ranslation History of apostasia and discessio: By Thomas Ice, PhD.The first seven English translations of apostasia all rendered the noun as either " departure" or " departing." They are as follows: Wycliffe Bible (1384); Tyndale Bible (1526); Coverdale Bible (1535); Cranmer Bible (1539); Breeches Bible (1576); Beza Bible (1583); Geneva Bible (1608) . This supports the notion that the word truly means " departure." In fact, Jerome' s Latin translation of the Greek Septuagint, known as the Vulgate, from around the time of 325 A.D. renders apostasia with the Latin word "discessio," also meaning " departure." Why was the King James Version the first to depart from the established translation of "departure" in 1611 A.D.? [It is more than likely due to overzealous RCC scribes who altered the original wording of vs 3. to accommodate their teachings of Amillenialism, which rejects both the pre-trib rapture of the Church as well as Jesus Millennial reign her on earth].<<< Quasar93
  15. Quote by Inchrist: >>>"This is nothing more than an attempt to suppress the biblical right to test all things. You do not own the right to biblical interpretation. Period! You have been shown your symbolism of John/church in Rev 4 to be inconsistent....does Dr Ice not have a rebuttal on the inconsistency for you?"<<< Quote by Inchrist: >>>"This is nothing more than an attempt to suppress the biblical right to test all things. You do not own the right to biblical interpretation. Period! You have been shown your symbolism of John/church in Rev 4 to be inconsistent....does Dr Ice not have a rebuttal on the inconsistency for you?"<<< To the contrary. In all of my posts to you, as in the very one you quoted me in your reply to me, are open invitations to prove the views you have, as revealed in my following remarks that you quoted: >>>"The Biblical teaching of the pre-trib rapture of the Church by Jesus, Matthew, Luke, John and Paul That you reject, insisting you know better than they do. Prove any of the following is false, or your views are. You remain refuted. Case closed."<<< Your claim my views that Rev.4:1-2 symbolize the Apostle John symbolizing the Church being called up into heaven before the tribulation begins, as being inconsistent, could not be further from the truth. I stated together with that remark, that it confirmed 2 Thess,2:3 and 7-8. Review the following translation history of 2 Thess.2:3 from Thomas Ice, in rebuttal of your views, in the following from my previous post you ignore: >>>2 Thess.2:1-8: The precise timing of the rapture of the Church:"Concerning the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ and our being gathered to Him, we ask you, brothers, not to become easily unsettled or alarmed by some prophecy, report or letter supposed to have come from us, saying that the Day of the Lord [The 70th and final Week/seven year tribulation of Dan.9:27] has already come." 2 Thes.2:1-2. Which is a direct reference to 1 Thes.4:17 and the theme of Paul's entire pre-trib rapture message in 2 Thes.2:1-8. When we will be CAUGHT UP TOGETHER WITH THEM IN THE CLOUDS TO MEET THE LORD IN THE AIR. [Parenthetics mine].The "Day of the Lord" Paul refers to in vs 2, alludes to Dan.9:27, when God will intervene into the affairs of man for the last time, culminating in the second coming of Jesus to the earth. In that passage of Scripture, the Day of the Lord is triggered by the "he" who "confirms a covenant [An agreement] for one Week" [The Day of the Lord/ 70th and final Week/seven year tribulation], who is the antichrist. The second, and same "he," who stops Israel from the offerings and sacrificing in the temple of God, and the third, and same "he," who breaks his covenant in the middle of the Week [After 3.5 of the 7 year total], and sets up the abomination of desolation Jesus referred to in Mt.24:15, in His Olivet Discourse, about the sign of His second coming, and of the end of the age.In verse 3: "Don't let anyone deceive you in any way, for that Day [The Day of the Lord, the 70th and final Week, the seven year tribulation] will not come, until the "apostasia" [Greek term in which the original translation was "to depart," or "departure," meaning, the rapture of the Church] occurs and the man of lawlessness [The antichrist, and all three of the "he's" in Dan.9:27] is revealed [Who triggers the Day of the Lord/ the 70th and final Week/ the seven year tribulation], the man doomed to destruction." Which reveals the "apostasia" [Departure] will take place before the antichrist is revealed, who triggers the 70th Week/seven year tribulation. Confirmed in verses 7 and 8 below.Translation History of apostasia and discessio: By Thomas Ice, PhD.The first seven English translations of apostasia all rendered the noun as either " departure" or " departing." They are as follows: Wycliffe Bible (1384); Tyndale Bible (1526); Coverdale Bible (1535); Cranmer Bible (1539); Breeches Bible (1576); Beza Bible (1583); Geneva Bible (1608) . This supports the notion that the word truly means " departure." In fact, Jerome' s Latin translation of the Greek Septuagint, known as the Vulgate, from around the time of 325 A.D. renders apostasia with the Latin word "discessio," also meaning " departure." Why was the King James Version the first to depart from the established translation of "departure" in 1611 A.D.? [It is more than likely due to overzealous RCC scribes who altered the original wording of vs 3. to accommodate their teachings of Amillenialism, which rejects both the pre-trib rapture of the Church as well as Jesus Millennial reign her on earth].Theodore Beza, the Swiss reformer was the first to transliterate apostasia and create a new word, rather than translate it as others had done. The translators of the King James Version were the first to introduce the new rendering of apostasia as " falling away." Most English translators have followed the KJV and Beza in departing from translating apostasia as " departure." No reason was ever given."He [The antichrist] will oppose and will exalt himself over everything that is called God or is worshiped, so that he sets himself up in God's temple, proclaiming himself to be God." Vs 4. [The abomination of desolation, confirming Dan.9:27 and Mt.24:15]. See also 2 Thes.2:4.The rapture of the Church and verse 3 confirmed:In verse 7: "For the secret power of lawlessness is already at work; but the one who now holds it back will continue to do so until he [The saints - Church] is taken out of the way."The "he" who will be taken out of the way, is the one body of Christ, who bear the Holy Spirit within each of us [Eph.1:13-14], the Church of Jesus Christ. The very same as those who will participate in the "apostasia," the "departure," [the rapture] of the Church, in vs 3. Immediately following that:In verse 8: "And then the lawless one [The antichrist] will be revealed, whom the Lord Jesus will overthrow with the breath of His mouth and destroy by the splendor of His coming." Vs 8. [See Rev.19:17-21].The antichrist is found in all three of the "he's" in Dan. 9:27, confirmed by Jesus in Mt.24:15; Mk.13:14 and by Paul, in 2 Thes.2:3, 4 and 8.From the above Scriptural facts, there can be only one proper interpretation for the timing of the rapture of the Church, which will be immediately preceding the 70th and final/7 year tribulation, triggered by the antichrist, all three of the "he's" in Dan.9:27. Seen also as the first of the four horsemen of the apocalypse, riding the white horse, in the first of the seven seals, in Rev.6:2. There is no "pre-wrath" or post-trib rapture taught in the Scriptures. Other verses pertaining to the rapture of the Church: 1 Thes.1:10; 1 Thes.5:9; Rev.3:10 and Rev.4:1-2. Of the saints [Church] returning with Christ from their marriage in heaven, in Rev.19:7, 8 and 14; Jude 14 and Zech.14:4-5!<<< As I have previously posted, the Greek word "apostasia" has several meanings. It is the root word for the English word, "apostasy. It also means, "departure," or, "to depart. Which of them is used depends on the text of the subject it is used in. There is nothing whatever in either 1 Thess.4:13-18 or 2 Thess.2:1-8 that justifies the use of the words, "apostasy," or "falling awy." Because it is the teaching by Paul, about the rapture of the Church. Quasar93
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