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The Light

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About The Light

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  1. You are mistaken. You did not prove it by scriptures. You have incorrectly proven it to yourself. Another poster, Old Coot gave the perfect BIBLICAL explanation : The description of the woman mirrors the Genesis 37:9-11. And that is clearly Jacob/Israel... the twelve literal tribes and not some "spiritualized" idea of the Church being that entity. The answer is simple. Present day Israel will change after the fullness of the Gentiles comes in. Rom 11 25 For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in. Oh yes, the Word says the woman is Israel. It's not complicated, it's just a matter of you putting aside what you have been led to believe and accept the written Word of God. Israel is the woman so it would not persecute itself. Israel was reborn as a nation in 1948 proving yet again that God keeps His word. Isa 40 21 Have ye not known? have ye not heard? hath it not been told you from the beginning? have ye not understood from the foundations of the earth? Isa 60 8 Who are these that fly as a cloud, and as the doves to their windows? Here are the verses that you mentioned and they have absolutely nothing to do with the Church going to her place where she is nourished for a time, and times and half a time. It is those that flee as instructed when the abomination of desolation is set up in the nation of Israel that go to a place of protection. I would say that the earth is the earth. No need to dream up an explanation of what the earth is, as the earth is the earth. It's pretty easy to get sidetracked when you go about dreaming up things. Why not accept that the earth is the earth. You have gone about dreaming up a bunch of stuff. The 144,000 are 12,000 from each tribe of the 12 tribes of Israel exactly like the Word says. The false messiah will not be wrathed with the Church as the Church will not be on the earth when these events occur. We can see the Church in heaven before any seals are opened. The 1st six seals are the tribulation period.
  2. I don't believe you are correct. Those that are taken in Matt 24 are taken to the clouds. The ones that are left are cast into the wrath of God which is on the earth. Matt 24 28 For wheresoever the carcase is, there will the eagles be gathered together. Matt 24 31 And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other. Rev 14 14 And I looked, and behold a white cloud, and upon the cloud one sat like unto the Son of man, having on his head a golden crown, and in his hand a sharp sickle. 15 And another angel came out of the temple, crying with a loud voice to him that sat on the cloud, Thrust in thy sickle, and reap: for the time is come for thee to reap; for the harvest of the earth is ripe. 16 And he that sat on the cloud thrust in his sickle on the earth; and the earth was reaped. 17 And another angel came out of the temple which is in heaven, he also having a sharp sickle. 18 And another angel came out from the altar, which had power over fire; and cried with a loud cry to him that had the sharp sickle, saying, Thrust in thy sharp sickle, and gather the clusters of the vine of the earth; for her grapes are fully ripe. 19 And the angel thrust in his sickle into the earth, and gathered the vine of the earth, and cast it into the great winepress of the wrath of God. The Church will be gathered from heaven as they will be raptured before the tribulation. The 12 tribes go through the tribulation after fullness of the Gentiles comes in. They will be raptured from the earth prewrath. Jesus will be in the clouds and that is where the eagles will be.
  3. Yes the Pope claims to be the Vicar of Christ, God on earth. Where did that come from? It originated with the religion of ancient Babylon. This false religion spread all over the world. Who was Caesar? God on earth. Who was Pharaoh? God on earth. Who was Napoleon? God on earth. This false religion of the sun, moon and star is all over the world. The false savior is Tammuz, the reincarnated Nimrod. Tammuz from Babylon is Horus from Egypt, Apollo from Greece, Thor from Scandinavia, etc, etc, etc, etc, etc, etc, etc different names all over the world.
  4. You are merely proving my point which is both the Jew and Gentile can be in the fold Hosea 9 10 I found Israel like grapes in the wilderness; I saw your fathers as the firstripe in the fig tree at her first time: but they went to Baalpeor, and separated themselves unto that shame; and their abominations were according as they loved. So we see in Hosea that Gods plan was for Israel was to be in the first harvest as he saw the fathers of Israel as the first ripe in the fig tree at her first time. Since they served other Gods the Gentile will be in the first harvest, Pre Tribulation rapture, before the seals are opened. After the harvest of the Gentiles, which we can see in heaven in Rev 4, Rev 5, God turns his attention to the 12 tribes. We see that the 144,000 of the 12 tribes become the 1st fruits of the harvest. This harvest of the 12 tribes, which is guaranteed because there are 1st fruits, will take place in the pre wrath rapture. (Matt 24, Rev 6)
  5. Again, the woman is Israel. The fact that you feel a need to replace Israel with the Church isn't going to change the Word of God and His promise to Israel. In this instance it is where the throne of God is. Rev 19 19 And after these things I heard a great voice of much people in heaven, saying, Alleluia; Salvation, and glory, and honour, and power, unto the Lord our God: 2 For true and righteous are his judgments: for he hath judged the great whore, which did corrupt the earth with her fornication, and hath avenged the blood of his servants at her hand. 3 And again they said, Alleluia And her smoke rose up for ever and ever. 4 And the four and twenty elders and the four beasts fell down and worshipped God that sat on the throne, saying, Amen; Alleluia. Be careful? For speaking the truth that the Church is not Israel?
  6. The trumpets cannot happen before the 7th seal is opened. Rev 8 8 And when he had opened the seventh seal, there was silence in heaven about the space of half an hour. 2 And I saw the seven angels which stood before God; and to them were given seven trumpets.
  7. This is correct. We can see this tribulation in Matt 24. The tribulation is the 1st 6 seals. The rest of this is incorrect. You are attempting to put the wrath of God inside the tribulation. We can already see that the tribulation is over before the wrath of God begins. You need to figure out the order of Revelation as the trumpets cannot begin before the 7th seal is opened.
  8. The woman is Israel and not the Church. The Church is in heaven, pre trib. The twelve tribes that go through the tribulation are the seed of the woman.
  9. Matt 24 is not the second coming when Christ sets up His kingdom on earth as many believers think and teach. It is the gathering of the believers from heaven and earth to join the Lord in the clouds. The believers will then go to heaven for the marriage supper as the earth goes through the wrath of God. Only those in the nation of Israel (not counting the unrighteous of course) that flee when the abomination of desolation is set up will go through the wrath of God, and they will do so in a place of protection. Immediately after the tribulation the twelve tribes that are scattered across the earth (the seed of the woman), are told to look up, their redemption draws nigh. This is when the last trump is blown and it will be on the Feast of Trumpets. The Church will already be in heaven and will not go through the tribulation as we can see them in heaven in Rev 5. The seals are the tribulation period which is the 70th week of Daniel. The wrath of God is not in the tribulation period as we can see that the tribulation is over before the wrath of God begins.(as shown in Rev 6) Matt 24 27 For as the lightning cometh out of the east, and shineth even unto the west; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be. 28 For wheresoever the carcase is, there will the eagles be gathered together. 29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken: 30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory. 31 And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other. Here we can see that if the days of the great tribulation were not shortened no flesh would be saved. Most people think this means if the great tribulation was not shortened, there would be no one left alive on earth. However, it really means that if the great tribulation was not shortened all the believers would be killed. Therefore there would be no flesh alive to be caught up to receive salvation. Only the dead would be caught up to receive their incorruptible body, as there would be no one alive that would be saved. Matt 24 21 For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be. 22 And except those days should be shortened, there should no flesh be saved: but for the elect's sake those days shall be shortened. So Matt 24 shows the coming of Jesus at the last trump. It shows that there would be no flesh alive to receive their incorruptible body when the last trump is blown and Christ returns in the clouds. All eyes will see this coming of the Lord.
  10. By comparing the coming of the Lord in Matt 24 to Rev 6 we can tell that a rapture happens at the 6th seal. Since we know that those that love God are not appointed to wrath we can safely conclude that a rapture occurs before any trumpets are blown by angels.
  11. So what do you believe. No rapture? Pretrib? Pre wrath? Mid trib?
  12. Some will continue to debate, as there are issues that most don't agree on. Over time through this debate their views can gradually change because they took the time to read what others have to say. I see it all the time - They say, I used to be pre trib etc etc, but now etc etc. So, some will debate and others will cut and run when they have no scriptural answers. When they are challenged, they act like they know it all, but really they have no answers. Iron sharpens iron, but what happens to hay.
  13. The verse you quoted below says he does NOT know. Mat 24:42-44 KJV Watch therefore: for ye know not what hour your Lord doth come. But know this, that if the goodman of the house had known in what watch the thief would come, he would have watched, and would not have suffered his house to be broken up. Therefore be ye also ready: for in such an hour as ye think not the Son of man cometh.
  14. No, when He comes in His day it will be like lightning etc. Noah enters the ark 7 days before the flood and the ark doors are closed. The day the flood comes is His wrath. The Church will not be here for the tribulation as they are in the ark 7 days before the flood. There will be another day of the son of man, when it will be like lightning etc. At this coming all eyes will see Him in the clouds. It will be like the days of Lot and destruction, wrath will occur the day Lot leaves Sodom. You should rethink this. He comes for the Gentiles, then the eyes of the 12 tribes are opened and they are regrafted into the olive tree. That BEFORE comment is impossible because the day of the son of man IS WHEN HE COMES as lightning. They say those things now. Even when He comes for the Church, those that are here will not know that He has come. Those that gain understanding, the twelve tribes will understand. These are told to look up their redemption draws nigh, which happens at the end of the tribulation. Those here will know that He is coming soon. As for the church, the GOODMAN will not know when the master will return. Two raptures. One for the Gentiles and one for the twelve tribes.
  15. I believe that you are completely missing the point. Yes, the days of the son of man are plural. One of the days of the son of man will be like the days of Noah, where Noah is in the ark 7 days before the flood. Another day of the son of man is like the days of Lot, where destruction comes the day Lot leaves Sodom. Conclusion. The Church is raptured before the tribulation, which is before the seals are opened. The ark doors are shut 7 days before the flood. We see then that God opens the eyes of the Jews when the fullness of the Gentiles comes in. The twelve tribes that are scattered across the earth will go through the tribulation, as they are the seed of the woman in Rev 12. They will be raptured pre wrath as we can see in Rev 6 and Matt 24. All eyes will see this coming of the Lord. No secret here. The woman, Israel goes through the wrath of God in a place of protection.(Those that flee as instructed, one third) Again, the Church will be in heaven pre trib. Those that go through the tribulation and are raptured prewrath are the 12 tribes that are scattered across the earth. This can proven by the 144,000 first fruits which is a guarantee of a harvest of the 12 tribes. There will be a secret rapture of the Church when He comes before the tribulation. The world will not see Him. Then there will be a prewrath rapture of the 12 tribes that are scattered across the earth as God keeps his promise to His people and regrafts them onto the olive tree. We see the gathering in Matt 24 and Rev 14. Only the woman, the nation of Israel go through the wrath of God. The ones that flee when the abomination of desolation is set up toward the end of the week, will go through the wrath of God in a place of protection. There is a difference between the seals - the tribulation, and the trumpets (and vials) - the wrath of God.
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