InChristAlways

I find a concordance extremely helpful when looking up specific words and/or phrases. http://www.eliyah.com/lexicon.html Strong's Concordance - King James Version: Strong's Lexicon (FULL Search by Strong's word number [e.g. 3091 Hebrew] OR English word!) Hebrew Greek Condensed Brown-Driver-Briggs Hebrew Lexicon OR Thayer's Greek Lexicon (Search by Strong's word number [e.g. 2424 Greek] Verses where house of Israel and house of Judah are used: https://www.blueletterbible.org/search/search.cfm?Criteria="house+of+Israel"&t=YLT#s=s_primary_0_1 "house of Israel" occurs 152 times in 146 verses in the YLT. Only mentioned in 6 verses of the NT: 2 verses each in Matthew, Acts and Hebrews [concerning the New Covenant]. Note in Hebrews 8:8 both Houses are mentioned but in Hebrews 8:10, only the House of Israel is mentioned. Not sure if there is any significance of that. Act 2:36 assuredly, therefore, let all the house of Israel know, that both Lord and Christ did God make him -- this Jesus whom ye did crucify.' Act 7:42 and God did turn, and did give them up to do service to the host of the heaven, according as it hath been written in the scroll of the prophets: Slain beasts and sacrifices did ye offer to Me forty years in the wilderness, O house of Israel? Heb 8:8 For finding fault, He saith to them, 'Lo, days come, saith the Lord, and I will complete with the house of Israel, and with the house of Judah, a new covenant, Heb 8:10 because this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel, after those days, saith the Lord, giving My laws into their mind, and upon their hearts I will write them, and I will be to them for a God, and they shall be to Me for a people; ================================================== In contrast to the house of Judah which is mentioned in only 1 verse of the NT, Hebrews 8:8 concerning the NC. https://www.blueletterbible.org/search/search.cfm?Criteria="house+of+judah"&t=YLT#s=s_primary_0_1 "house of judah" occurs 39 times in 39 verses in the YLT. Heb 8:8 For finding fault, He saith to them, 'Lo, days come, saith the Lord, and I will complete with the house of Israel, and with the house of Judah, a new covenant, ============================================== Israel mentioned in 3 verses of the covenantle book of Revelation: Rev 2:14 'But I have against thee a few things: That thou hast there those holding the teaching of Balaam, who did teach Balak to cast a stumbling-block before the sons of Israel, to eat idol-sacrifices, and to commit whoredom; Rev 7:4 And I heard the number of those sealed, 144 thousands were sealed out of all the tribes of the sons of Israel Rev 21:12 having also a wall great and high, having twelve gates, and at the gates twelve messengers, and names written thereon, which are those of the twelve tribes of the sons of Israel, ===================================== Judah is mentioned in 2 verses of Revelation: Rev 5:5 and one of the elders saith to me, 'Weep not; lo, overcome did the Lion, who is of the tribe of Judah, the root of David, to open the scroll, and to loose the seven seals of it; Rev 7:5 of the tribe of Judah 12 thousand were sealed; of the tribe of Reuben 12 thousand were sealed; of the tribe of Gad 12 thousand were sealed; =============================================== I did a google search on the difference between those 2 houses/nations and came up with a few links: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Two_House_theology The United Monarchy of Israel became divided after King Solomon's reign passed to his son Rehoboam in about 931 BCE. Rehoboam refused to grant the northern ten tribes relief from Solomon's taxation and they subsequently formed their own autonomous nation in the north, making Jeroboam their king. The Kingdom of Israel (the Ten Lost Tribes) was taken into Assyrian captivity starting in 740 BCE, culminating with the seizure of Samaria in 721 BCE. Even after invitations to return, many years later, no large representation of the tribes ever returned to their former boundaries. Between 597 and 586 BCE, the Kingdom of Judah was taken into the Babylonian captivity. Cyrus the Great later granted Judah permission to return to their lands, which they did, but the Jewish–Roman wars took a significant toll which included the Destruction of the Second Temple and exile from Jerusalem (except for the day of Tisha B'Av) and the renaming of Roman Judaea to Syria Palaestina. ============================================= https://www.douglashamp.com/two-houses-now-united-the-house-of-israel-and-house-of-judah-restored-as-one/ When we speak of the Kingdom of God, there is no longer a House of Judah (Jews) and House of Israel (who were scattered to the gentiles/nations). As far as tribes go, there were twelve tribes and there always will be twelve tribes, as evidenced by the twelve tribes in Revelation 7 and 14 and by the twelve gates of the New Jerusalem. Hence, there will always be those who are from the tribe of Judah and those from the tribe of Levi, Benjamin, Asher, Naphtali, etc. But these twelve tribes are no longer divided in two nations – they are now one. In conclusion, Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob, were not Jews; they were Hebrews. Jacob’s sons became the Israelites and when the nation split, two nations emerged known as the House of Judah and the House of Israel. God divorced the House of Israel because of their incredible adultery and then scattered them to the nations/gentiles. He promised to remarry them back and the only way for that to happen was for Immanuel to die thereby cancelling the initial marriage contract (Old Covenant). When he arose, He was free to marry her under a new marriage contract (New Covenant) in Jesus’ blood. This new covenant brings the two houses together and the two shall never again be two nations. If you are under the New Covenant, you have come either from the House of Judah or the House of Israel (who were wanders among the gentiles). You might be genetically Hebrew but if you aren’t then you are part of the mixed multitude. Assuming you are not Jewish, then you are no longer a “gentile”: you have been grafted in to the commonwealth (all twelve tribes) of Israel! You are now a Hebrew and you can enter the kingdom through the work of Jesus on the cross, who removed the middle wall of separation between the House of Israel and the House of Judah. ===================================================================== Gal 3:28 There is neither Jew nor Gentile, neither slave nor free, nor is there male and female, for you are all one in Christ Jesus. Col 3:11 Here there is no Gentile or Jew, circumcised or uncircumcised, barbarian, Scythian, slave or free, but Christ is all, and is in all.

Very interesting. The house/nation of Judah included 3 Tribes: Judah, Benjamin and the priestly tribe of Levi [which remained with the Tribe of Judah after the split from Solomon]. There were no Hebrew Jews/Judeans before the birth of Judah. http://www.biblebelievers.org.au/jew.htm The Etymology of the Word "Jew" In his classic Facts are Facts, Jewish historian, researcher and scholar Benjamin Freedman writes: Today most people think of Jews as the people of Israel, but that is not correct. An Israelite was one who had descended from Jacob. In Jesus' time individual Jews may or may not have descended from Jacob, but they all recognized Pharisaism and not the Law of Moses. A Jew is properly a Judean............................... ============================================================================= Judah is listed as 4th born in Genesis, but listed 1st in Revelation: 12 Tribes of Revelation 7 1. Judah = "I will praise the Lord" 12 original Tribes in the OT: Genesis 29:31-35 Genesis 30:1-22 Genesis 35:17-19 1. Reuben 2. Simeon 3. Levi 4. Judah 5. Dan 6. Naphtali 7. Gad 8. Asher 9. Issachar 10. Zebulun 11. Joseph 12 Benjamin Jesus is of course our Chief Shepherd: Jer 50:6 “My people have been lost sheep. Their shepherds have led them astray; They have turned them away on the mountains. They have gone from mountain to hill; They have forgotten their resting place. Zec 10:3“My anger is kindled against the shepherds, And I will punish the goatherds. For the LORD of hosts will visit His flock, The house of Judah, And will make them as His royal horse in the battle. Jhn 10:14 'I am the good Shepherd, and I know my sheep, and am known by mine, 16 and other sheep I have that are not of this fold, these also it behoveth me to bring, and my voice they will hear, and there shall become one flock -- one shepherd. Heb 13:20 And the God of the peace, who did bring up out of the dead the great Shepherd of the sheep -- in the blood of an age-during covenant -- our Lord Jesus, 1Pe 2:25 for ye were as sheep going astray, but ye turned back now to the Shepherd and overseer of your souls. 1Pe 5:4 and at the manifestation of the chief Shepherd, ye shall receive the unfading crown of glory. ================================================ Revelation also shows Jesus being the Lion/Lambkin of the tribe of Judah and the Chief Shepherd over all the tribes of Israel: Reve 2:27 And He shall be shepherding<4165> them in rod iron, as the instruments, the pottery, is being crushed, as I have gotten beside the Father of Me. Reve 7:17 That the Lambkin in midst of the throne shall be shepherding<4165> them and shall be leading them upon life springs of waters and the God shall be rubbing-away every tear out of theie eyes. Reve 12:5 And she brought forth a Son, a male, who is about to be shepherding<4165> all the Nations in rod/staff, iron. And is caught-away the child of her toward the God, and toward the throne of Him. Reve 19:15 And out of the mouth of Him is issuing forth a sharp/keen sword, that in it He should be smiting the Nations. And He shall be shepherding<4165>them in rod iron and He is treading the trough of the wine of the fury of the God, the Almighty.

Hello George. You have touched upon one of my favorite OT books and is indeed a book about Jesus evangelizing, being tried, crucified, buried, and resurrecting. Has anyone noticed the similarity of the ship and temple in Jonah 1 and Matthew 8? Rotherham) Jonah 1:4 And Yahweh hath cast a great wind on the sea, and there is a great tempest in the sea, and the ship hath reckoned to be broken; 5 and the mariners are afraid, and cry each unto his god, and cast the goods that are in the ship into the sea, to make it light of them; and Jonah hath gone down unto the sides of the vessel, and he lieth down, and is fast asleep. 14 Then cried they unto Yahweh and said, "Ah now Yahweh, pray let it not be that we perish for this man's life, neither lay upon us innocent blood,--for Thou, O Yahweh, as thou hast pleased hast ever done. 15 So they took up Jonah and hurled him into the sea,--and the sea, left off, her roaring. 17 Now Yahweh had appointed a great fish, to swallow up Jonah,--and Jonah was in the belly of the fish, three days and three nights. Just like Jonah was asleep on the ship when the tempest arose, so also was Jesus asleep on the boat when a tempest came up: Matt 8:23 And when he entered into the boat his disciples did follow him, 24 and behold, a great tempest arose in the sea, so that the boat was being covered by the waves, but He was sleeping Matthew 12:40 for, as Jonah was in the belly of the fish three days and three nights, so shall the Son of Man be in the heart of the earth three days and three nights. [Matt 12:40/Luke 11:29] I not only view Jonah as a type of Jesus, but also as a type of Saul/Paul in the NT. Both were Hebrews and both were commanded to go preach to the Gentiles and Kings: Jonah 3:1 And is becoming word of Yahweh unto Jonah a second-time to say of "Rise thou! go to Nineveh! the great City and call to her! the call that I am speaking to thee' 3 But Jonah arose to flee to Tarshish/08659 Tarshiysh from to of faces of Yahweh.................5 And the men of Nineveh believe in God and proclaim a fast, and put on sackcloth, from their greatest even unto their least, Rotherham) Jonah 1:9 And he said unto them "A Hebrew am I,--and Yahweh, the God of the heavens, do I revere Him who made the sea and the dry land. Young) 2 Corinthians 11:22 Hebrews are they? I also! Israelites are they? I also! seed of Abraham are they? I also! Young) Philippians 3:5 circumcision on the eighth day! of the race of Israel! of the tribe of Benjamin! a Hebrew of Hebrews! according to law a Pharisee! Nineveh and Jonah are also mentioned in the NT: Matt 12:41 `Men, Ninevites shall be resurrecting/standing up/anasthsontai <450> (5698) in the judging with this generation and shall be condemning it, that they reform/repent into the proclamation of Jonah and behold! more of Jonah here. Luk 11:32 'Men of Nineveh shall be standing-up<450> in the judgment with this generation and shall condemn it, because they reformed at the proclamation of Jonah; and behold!, greater than Jonah here! And like the Apostles which were empowered by the Holy Spirit at Pentecost to preach to the ends of the earth, so too was Paul also chosen to go to the Gentiles a The word Tarsus is fairly similar to the Tarshish in Jonah Acts 1:8 But you will receive power when the Holy Spirit has come upon you, and you will be My witnesses in Jerusalem and in all Judea and Samaria, and to the end of the earth.” Acts 9:15 Said yet the Lord toward him "be thou going! that a vessel of-choice<1589> is to Me thisone, of the to bear the Name of Me before nations and kings,and sons of Israel". Acts 21:39 But Paul said, I am a man which am a Jew of Tarsus/tarseuV <5018>, a city in Cilicia, a citizen of no mean city: and, I beseech thee, suffer me to speak unto the people.

Hello George. You have touched upon one of my favorite OT books and is indeed a book about Jesus evangelizing, being tried, crucified, buried, and resurrecting. Has anyone noticed the similarity of the ship and temple in Jonah 1 and Matthew 8? Rotherham) Jonah 1:4 And Yahweh hath cast a great wind on the sea, and there is a great tempest in the sea, and the ship hath reckoned to be broken; 5 and the mariners are afraid, and cry each unto his god, and cast the goods that are in the ship into the sea, to make it light of them; and Jonah hath gone down unto the sides of the vessel, and he lieth down, and is fast asleep. 14 Then cried they unto Yahweh and said, "Ah now Yahweh, pray let it not be that we perish for this man's life, neither lay upon us innocent blood,--for Thou, O Yahweh, as thou hast pleased hast ever done. 15 So they took up Jonah and hurled him into the sea,--and the sea, left off, her roaring. 17 Now Yahweh had appointed a great fish, to swallow up Jonah,--and Jonah was in the belly of the fish, three days and three nights. Just like Jonah was asleep on the ship when the tempest arose, so also was Jesus asleep on the boat when a tempest came up: Matt 8:23 And when he entered into the boat his disciples did follow him, 24 and behold, a great tempest arose in the sea, so that the boat was being covered by the waves, but He was sleeping Matthew 12:40 for, as Jonah was in the belly of the fish three days and three nights, so shall the Son of Man be in the heart of the earth three days and three nights. [Matt 12:40/Luke 11:29] I not only view Jonah as a type of Jesus, but also as a type of Saul/Paul in the NT. Both were Hebrews and both were commanded to go preach to the Gentiles and Kings: Jonah 3:1 And is becoming word of Yahweh unto Jonah a second-time to say of "Rise thou! go to Nineveh! the great City and call to her! the call that I am speaking to thee' 3 But Jonah arose to flee to Tarshish/08659 Tarshiysh from to of faces of Yahweh.................5 And the men of Nineveh believe in God and proclaim a fast, and put on sackcloth, from their greatest even unto their least, Rotherham) Jonah 1:9 And he said unto them "A Hebrew am I,--and Yahweh, the God of the heavens, do I revere Him who made the sea and the dry land. Young) 2 Corinthians 11:22 Hebrews are they? I also! Israelites are they? I also! seed of Abraham are they? I also! Young) Philippians 3:5 circumcision on the eighth day! of the race of Israel! of the tribe of Benjamin! a Hebrew of Hebrews! according to law a Pharisee! Nineveh and Jonah are also mentioned in the NT: Matt 12:41 `Men, Ninevites shall be resurrecting/standing up/anasthsontai <450> (5698) in the judging with this generation and shall be condemning it, that they reform/repent into the proclamation of Jonah and behold! more of Jonah here. Luk 11:32 'Men of Nineveh shall be standing-up<450> in the judgment with this generation and shall condemn it, because they reformed at the proclamation of Jonah; and behold!, greater than Jonah here! And like the Apostles which were empowered by the Holy Spirit at Pentecost to preach to the ends of the earth, so too was Paul also chosen to go to the Gentiles a The word Tarsus is fairly similar to the Tarshish in Jonah Acts 1:8 But you will receive power when the Holy Spirit has come upon you, and you will be My witnesses in Jerusalem and in all Judea and Samaria, and to the end of the earth.” Acts 9:15 Said yet the Lord toward him "be thou going! that a vessel of-choice<1589> is to Me thisone, of the to bear the Name of Me before nations and kings,and sons of Israel". Acts 21:39 But Paul said, I am a man which am a Jew of Tarsus/tarseuV <5018>, a city in Cilicia, a citizen of no mean city: and, I beseech thee, suffer me to speak unto the people.

Is the Gehenna that Jesus spoke about to the corrupt murderous 1st century Jewish Rulers the same as the Lake of Fire in Revelation? I put the wicki definitions down for now. Thoughts? Matthew 10:28 “And do not fear those who kill the body but cannot kill the soul. But rather fear Him who is able to destroy both soul and body in gehenna<1067>. Matthew 23:33 "Serpents! brood of vipers! how? ye may be fleeing from the judging<2920> of the Gehenna<1067> Revelation 14:11 And the smoke of the tormenting of them is ascending into Ages to-Ages.......... [Ezekiel 39:12/Luke 16:24,26] Revelation 18:13 and cinnamon, and odours, and ointment, and frankincense, and wine, and oil, and fine flour, and wheat, and cattle, and sheep, and of horses, and of chariots, and of bodies and souls of men. Revelation 20:15 and if any one was not found written in the scroll of the life, he was cast to the lake of the fire. ==================================== https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gehenna Contents 1 Etymology 2 Geography 2.1 Archaeology 3 The concept of Gehinnom 3.1 Hebrew Bible 3.2 Targums 3.3 Rabbinical Judaism 3.4 Christianity (New Testament) 3.4.1 Translations in Christian Bibles 3.5 Quran 4 See also 5 References Gehenna is a small valley in Jerusalem. In the Hebrew Bible, Gehenna was initially where some of the kings of Judah sacrificed their children by fire.[1] Thereafter, it was deemed to be cursed (Book of Jeremiah 7:31, 19:2–6).[2] In rabbinic literature, Gehenna is a destination of the wicked.[3] This is different from the more neutral Sheol/Hades, the abode of the dead, although the King James Version of the Bible usually translates both with the Anglo-Saxon word "hell". In the King James Version of the Bible, the term appears 13 times in 11 different verses as Valley of Hinnom, Valley of the son of Hinnom or Valley of the children of Hinnom. The Valley of Hinnom is the modern name for the valley surrounding Jerusalem's Old City, including Mount Zion, from the west and south. It meets and merges with the Kidron Valley, the other principal valley around the Old City, near the southeastern corner of the city. A lake of fire appears in both ancient Egyptian and Christian religion, as well as in Plato's Gorgias as a place of after-death punishment of the wicked. The phrase is used in five verses of the Book of Revelation. In the biblical context, the concept seems analogous to the Jewish Gehenna, or the more common concept of Hell. The image of the lake of fire was taken up by the early Christian Hippolytus of Rome in about the year 230 and has continued to be used by modern Christians. Prior to Christianity, Plato identified the lake with Tartarus, where the souls of the wicked are tormented until it is time for them to be reborn, and where some souls are left. ====================================== Contents 1 Ancient Egyptian religion 2 Christianity 2.1 Book of Revelation 2.2 Denominational views 2.3 Third century 2.4 Twentieth century 2.5 Universalist eschatology 3 See also 4 References A lake of fire appears in both ancient Egyptian and Christian religion, as well as in Plato's Gorgias as a place of after-death punishment of the wicked. The phrase is used in five verses of the Book of Revelation. In the biblical context, the concept seems analogous to the Jewish Gehenna, or the more common concept of Hell. The image of the lake of fire was taken up by the early Christian Hippolytus of Rome in about the year 230 and has continued to be used by modern Christians. Prior to Christianity, Plato identified the lake with Tartarus, where the souls of the wicked are tormented until it is time for them to be reborn, and where some souls are left.

Good post. I always try to look up equivalent Hebrew/Greek words to better understand both the Hebrew OT and Christian NT. Sheol and Hades is one example. YLT is a good version as he renders "sheol" and "hades" correctly. I believe Jesus would have used the word Hebrew word "sheol" when speaking to the 1st century Hebrew Jews. https://www.blueletterbible.org/search/search.cfm?Criteria=sheol&t=YLT#s=s_primary_0_2 "sheol" occurs 64 times in 62 verses in the YLT. Psa 16:10 For Thou dost not leave my soul to Sheol, Nor givest thy saintly one to see corruption. Jon 2:2 And he saith: I called, because of my distress, to Jehovah, And He doth answer me, From the belly of sheol I have cried, Thou hast heard my voice. https://www.blueletterbible.org/search/search.cfm?Criteria=hades&t=YLT#s=s_primary_0_1 "hades" occurs 11 times in 11 verses in the YLT. Mat 12:40 for, as Jonah was in the belly of the fish three days and three nights, so shall the Son of Man be in the heart of the earth three days and three nights. Act 2:27 For You will not leave my soul in Hades, Nor will You allow Your Holy One to see corruption. Act 2:31 “he, foreseeing this, spoke concerning the resurrection of the Christ, that His soul was not left in Hades, nor did His flesh see corruption. Rev 1:18 and he who is living, and I did become dead, and, lo! I am living to the ages of the ages. Amen! and I have the keys of the hades and of the death. =================================== https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sheol She’ol (/ˈʃiːoʊl/ SHEE-ohl, /-əl/; Hebrew שְׁאוֹל Šəʾōl), in the Hebrew Bible, is a place of darkness to which all the dead go, both the righteous and the unrighteous, regardless of the moral choices made in life, a place of stillness and darkness cut off from life and separated from God.[1] The inhabitants of Sheol are the "shades" (rephaim), entities without personality or strength.[2] Under some circumstances they are thought to be able to be contacted by the living, as the Witch of Endor contacts the shade of Samuel for Saul, but such practices are forbidden (Book of Deuteronomy 18:10).[3] While the Hebrew Bible describes Sheol as the permanent place of the dead, in the Second Temple period (roughly 500 BC – 70 AD) a more diverse set of ideas developed. Sheol is considered to be the home of both the dead righteous and wicked, separated into respective compartments until the Last Judgement (e.g. 1 Enoch 22; Luke 16:19-31). In some texts, it was considered a place of punishment, meant for the wicked dead alone,[4] and is equated with Gehenna in the Talmud.[5] When the Hebrew scriptures were translated into Greek in ancient Alexandria around 200 BC, the word " ================================================= https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christian_views_on_Hades

I didn't realize the timing of the birth of Jesus was that controvertial. I have been celebrating it on Dec 25 for as long as I can remember. I was born and raised in a Catholic family. That aside, I did find a thread on it using the excellent WCF search function for those interested. Some interesting poll stats. Might be a good time to bump that thread up? https://www.worthychristianforums.com/topic/160275-was-jesus-born-on-christmas-dec25th/?tab=comments#comment-1902310 Most Christians Say Jesus Wasn't Born on Dec. 25, Poll Finds By Anugrah Kumar , Christian Post Contributor December 24, 2012|8:49 am When King James Bible Online asked the 110,000 users on its Facebook page if they believe Jesus was born on Dec. 25, Christmas Day, 83 percent of those who responded answered in the negative. A majority of the respondents also said Santa Claus is a "lie." The date of the birth of Christ was among the four questions King James Bible Online asked as part of its survey, titled "What Do Christians Really Believe About Christmas," that was conducted this month. Only 11 percent of the respondents said tradition is right about the date of Jesus' birth. Six percent marked "Not sure." King James Bible Online, a website inviting its visitors to read the Bible online, says 65 percent of its users live in the United States. And 96 percent of those polled said they are Christian. Interestingly, while the majority of the respondents do not believe Jesus was born on Dec. 25, 71 percent said they think Christians should celebrate Christmas. One-fourth of the respondents said "No." When asked, "Do you think it's OK to let kids believe in Santa Claus?" the majority, or 64 percent, said, "Definitely not, it's a lie." However, 28 percent said, "Yes, it's just for fun," and six percent had no opinion. The last question of the survey was, "Do you think it's OK to have a Christmas tree in a church building?" More than half, or 58 percent, of respondents marked "Yes," while 39 percent said "No." Three percent said they were not sure. The majority of those polled, 82 percent, reported they have been a Christian for more than 10 years, and 79 percent said they had read the entire Bible at least once. Females in the group made up about 60 percent of the respondents. Several academics have made the claim that Jesus was born several years earlier than commonly believed. In his recently published book, Jesus of Nazareth: The Infancy Narratives, Pope Benedict XVI argues that the Christian calendar is based on a miscalculation. "The calculation of the beginning of our calendar – based on the birth of Jesus – was made by Dionysius Exiguus, who made a mistake in his calculations by several years," says the 85-year-old pontiff in the book that was published weeks before Christmas. "The actual date of Jesus's birth was several years before," the pope argues. Exiguus, or Dennis the Small, was a 6th-century monk from Eastern Europe who is best known as the inventor of the Anno Domini (AD) era, which is used to number the years of both the Gregorian calendar and the Julian calendar.

https://www.blueletterbible.org/lang/lexicon/lexicon.cfm?Strongs=G1067&t=YLT γέεννα géenna, gheh'-en-nah; of Hebrew origin (H1516 and H2011); valley of (the son of) Hinnom; ge-henna (or Ge-Hinnom), a valley of Jerusalem, used (figuratively) as a name for the place (or state) of everlasting punishment:—hell. G1067 matches the Greek γέεννα (geenna) occurs 12 times in 12 verses Matthew 10:28 “And do not fear those who kill the body but cannot kill the soul. But rather fear Him who is able to destroy both soul and body in gehenna<1067>. Matthew 23:33 "Serpents! brood of vipers! how? ye may be fleeing from the judging<2920> of the Gehenna<1067> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gehenna Gehenna is a small valley in Jerusalem. In the Hebrew Bible, Gehenna was initially where some of the kings of Judah sacrificed their children by fire.[1] Thereafter, it was deemed to be cursed (Book of Jeremiah 7:31, 19:2–6).[2] In rabbinic literature, Gehenna is a destination of the wicked.[3] This is different from the more neutral Sheol/Hades, the abode of the dead, although the King James Version of the Bible usually translates both with the Anglo-Saxon word "hell". In the King James Version of the Bible, the term appears 13 times in 11 different verses as Valley of Hinnom, Valley of the son of Hinnom or Valley of the children of Hinnom. The Valley of Hinnom is the modern name for the valley surrounding Jerusalem's Old City, including Mount Zion, from the west and south. It meets and merges with the Kidron Valley, the other principal valley around the Old City, near the southeastern corner of the city. ========================================= Why is Hell disappearing from the Bible? In this presentation I am focusing on the entire context of Gehenna, commonly translated as "hell" in the New Testament. In considering the historical context of these passages, and who Jesus is speaking to, it becomes apparent that Jesus is not referring to a realm of eternal punishment but rather earthly judgment related to that generation.

Hello Debp.........Sorry about that. I am still getting use to this forum and will try not to let it happen again. On my way to view that board now. I just tried to edit it out but am unable to, and I also posted vids on some other threads so feel free to edit them out. Blessings

Posted December 10 The truth I’m about to present is not popular to Christians which is shocking. But here it is. The King James Version Bible is the pure Word of God and it does not contain any errors. No not a single one. =========================================== Personally, I use the KJperVersion as a paper weight, JK...........It is grossly mistranslated and would probably make for good Bible for children and newbies to Jesus. I prefer going directly to the Hebrew and Greek Mss along with a good concordance and lexicon for deeper study. From google search. Everything one wants to know about that version but were afraid to ask.....and for good reason! https://www.google.com/search?client=firefox-b-1-ab&sxsrf=ACYBGNRZ-ESNgGxVnsxLGTR81JGLfiw6mw%3A1576544224920&source=hp&ei=4Cf4XY7SNdHwsQWN6Y24Ag&q=king+james+version+mistranslated&oq=king+james+version+mistranslated&gs_l=psy-ab.3...304859.334591..335535...15.0..0.232.4947.11j29j2......0....1..gws-wiz.....10..35i362i39j0j0i131j35i39j0i20i263j0i10j0i22i10i30j0i22i30j33i160.LLILqQs9U1I&ved=0ahUKEwiOwvzzvLvmAhVReKwKHY10AycQ4dUDCAc&uact=5 http://www.considerthis.net/Files/Textfile/kjv-errors.htm Many adherents to the theory of an inerrant translation of scripture, namely those referred to as KJV-onlyists, are thoroughly convinced that Yahuwah has preserved His sacred written word in the English language through the translation of the King James Version, which is also called the Authorized Version. (The naming of this version is another interesting story that I will not go into here. Let it suffice that if you are interested there are many accurate sources available that tell that story.) These King James Onlyist people can (and usually do) get arrogant, violently agitated, and very rude with anyone who opposes their theory on any grounds, but especially on the grounds that the errors of translation that are there are quite obvious to anyone with an honest and discerning eye. Let it be understood and rest assured that if there is ONE error ANYWHERE in ANY translated text of scripture, then that error is a fatal flaw in the idea of divine inspiration and therefore the version CANNOT be a divinely inspired translation, but the work of man. Our Eloah cannot and will not make ANY errors of ANY kind ANYWHERE . Unhappily for the KJV-onlyists, there are many, many errors of translation found in the King James Version of the scriptures that can be readily seen by anyone who is honest in their evaluation of what they are reading. These errors on occasion cause the meaning of a particular verse or passage to be muddled and in some cases will even change the intended meaning to the point that it will be completely misunderstood by the average reader. Conclusion The very apparent errors of translation in the KJV, and a lot of them have been carried over into other versions, have also produced the greatest majority of so-called "contradictions" of scripture and so given the opponent a solid basis for denying the divine inspiration of the original language texts. Listen to the naysayers of scripture and see if that is not the message you hear. Then look at the particular passage under attack and even though what they say is in accordance with the KJV, it will not be in accordance with the underlying original language text. So the only honest and legitimate conclusion possible is that there is no "divinely inspired" translated version of scripture. Since that is the case, and you are responsible for what you believe, it behooves you to take no man’s word for what is in scripture. Get the original language scripture and learn how to decipher it for yourself. The texts are easily obtained and with the language tools available today the decipherment is not as hard as you may imagine.

Gathering around the tree and playing Christmas carols and reading the account of the birth of of Lord and Savior, Jesus the Christ........... The Arch Messenger Gabriel is mentioned in only 4 verses of the Bible. 2 times in Daniel and 2 times in Luke concerning John the Baptist and Jesus. https://www.blueletterbible.org/search/search.cfm?Criteria=gabriel&t=YLT#s=s_primary_0_1 "gabriel"occurs 4 times in 4 verses in the YLT. Luke 1:19And the messenger answering said to him, ‘I am Gabriel, who have been standing near before God, and I was sent to speak unto thee, and to proclaim these good news to thee, 20and lo, thou shalt be silent, and not able to speak, till the day that these things shall come to pass, because thou didst not believe my words, that shall be fulfilled in their season.’ YLT) Luke 1 26And in the sixth month was the messenger Gabriel sent by God, to a city of Galilee, the name of which [is] Nazareth, 27to a virgin, betrothed to a man, whose name [is] Joseph, of the house of David, and the name of the virgin [is] Mary. 28And the messenger having come in unto her, said, ‘Hail, favoured one, the Lord [is] with thee; blessed [art] thou among women;’ 29and she, having seen, was troubled at his word, and was reasoning of what kind this salutation may be. 30And the messenger said to her, ‘Fear not, Mary, for thou hast found favour with God; 31and lo, thou shalt conceive in the womb, and shalt bring forth a son, and call his name Jesus; 32he shall be great, and Son of the Highest he shall be called, and the Lord God shall give him the throne of David his father, 33and he shall reign over the house of Jacob to the ages; and of his reign there shall be no end.’ 34And Mary said unto the messenger, ‘How shall this be, seeing a husband I do not know?’ 35And the messenger answering said to her, ‘The Holy Spirit shall come upon thee, and the power of the Highest shall overshadow thee, therefore also the holy-begotten thing shall be called Son of God; 36and lo, Elisabeth, thy kinswoman, she also hath conceived a son in her old age, and this is the sixth month to her who was called barren; 37because nothing shall be impossible with God.’ 38And Mary said, ‘Lo, the maid-servant of the Lord; let it be to me according to thy saying,’ and the messenger went away from her. Luke 2:8And there were shepherds in the same region, lodging in the field, and keeping the night-watches over their flock, 9and lo, a messenger of the Lord stood over them, and the glory of the Lord shone around them, and they feared a great fear. 10And the messenger said to them, ‘Fear not, for lo, I bring you good news of great joy, that shall be to all the people — 11because there was born to you to-day a Saviour — who is Christ the Lord — in the city of David, 12and this [is] to you the sign: Ye shall find a babe wrapped up, lying in the manger.’ 13And suddenly there came with the messenger a multitude of the heavenly host, praising God, and saying, 14‘Glory in the highest to God, and upon earth peace, among men — good will.’ 15And it came to pass, when the messengers were gone away from them to the heavens, that the men, the shepherds, said unto one another, ‘We may go over indeed unto Bethlehem, and see this thing that hath come to pass, that the Lord did make known to us.’ 16And they came, having hasted, and found both Mary, and Joseph, and the babe lying in the manger, 17and having seen, they made known abroad concerning the saying spoken to them concerning the child. 18And all who heard, did wonder concerning the things spoken by the shepherds unto them; 19and Mary was preserving all these things, pondering in her heart; 20and the shepherds turned back, glorifying and praising God, for all those things they heard and saw, as it was spoken unto them. ================================== One of my all time favorite Carols of the birth of Jesus:

Where did the doctrine of eternal "hell"originate from? There is only 1 Bible version that does not use that word, YLT. Rather it uses the actual Greek word the 1st century OC Hebrew Jews would have been familiar with, "Gehenna". http://www.eliyah.com/lexicon.html https://www.blueletterbible.org/search/search.cfm?Criteria=hell&t=YLT#s=s_primary_0_1 There are no concordance results for "hell" in the YLT. See results of "hell" from these other Bibles: 54 results in the KJV 32 results in the NKJV 17 results in the NLT 13 results in the NIV 14 results in the ESV 11 results in the CSB 13 results in the NASB 16 results in the NET 13 results in the RSV 13 results in the ASV 12 results in the DBY 49 results in the WEB You can also browse through the various dictionaries. https://www.blueletterbible.org/search/search.cfm?Criteria=gehenna&t=YLT&ss=1#s=s_primary_0_1 "gehenna" occurs 12 times in 12 verses in the YLT. =================================== https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gehenna Gehenna is a small valley in Jerusalem. In the Hebrew Bible, Gehenna was initially where some of the kings of Judah sacrificed their children by fire.[1] Thereafter, it was deemed to be cursed (Book of Jeremiah 7:31, 19:2–6).[2] In rabbinic literature, Gehenna is a destination of the wicked.[3] This is different from the more neutral Sheol/Hades, the abode of the dead, although the King James Version of the Bible usually translates both with the Anglo-Saxon word "hell". In the King James Version of the Bible, the term appears 13 times in 11 different verses as Valley of Hinnom, Valley of the son of Hinnom or Valley of the children of Hinnom. The Valley of Hinnom is the modern name for the valley surrounding Jerusalem's Old City, including Mount Zion, from the west and south. It meets and merges with the Kidron Valley, the other principal valley around the Old City, near the southeastern corner of the city. ================================================

Hello. I don't believe the Rich Man is a Christian but rather a Jew under the old covenant Mosaic Law, maybe a type of High Priest? He is not only a person, but a People, as seen with the use of the plural "us and ye" in verse 26. Also the Greek word for "ferrying" is used in the latter part of the verse which I never noticed until I started looking more at the Greek of this passage: 26 And in all of these, between US[Abraham/Jesus/Faith/Life] and YE[Moses/Law/Death] a great chasm<5490> hath been established<4741>, so that those willing to cross-over<1224> hence toward ye no may be able<1410>, neither those thence toward us may be ferrying<1276> Christians are of the Faith of both Abraham and Jesus, which the OC Jewish rulers were not as the author of Hebrews explains: Hebrews 11:29 By Faith they crossed-over/diebhsan <1224> (5627) the Red Sea as thru Dry, which the Egyptians assaying to do were drowned. ==================================== The Song of Moses is also shown in Revelation. Coincidentally, the chapter numbers are the same............. Revelation 15:3 [Exodus 15:1-2] and They are singing the Song of Mosheh, the bond-servant of the God, and the song of the Lambkin, saying, `Great and marvelous the works of Thee, Lord! the God, the Almighty, just and true the ways of Thee, the king of the [*Ages/Saints/Nations''] Exodus 15: [Revelation 15:3] 1 Then sang Mosheh and the Sons of Yisra'el this song unto Yahweh, and they spake saying,--"I will sing to Yahweh for He is exalted exalted,--The horse and his rider hath He cast into the Sea. 2 My might and melody is Yah<3050>, and He became mine salvation/y@shuw'ah.--This is my 'El and I will glorify Him, 'Elohim of my father and I will set Him on high". ' 21 And Miriam is responding to them: "Sing ye to Yahweh that to be triumphant He is triumphant. Horse and his rider He heaved into Sea.

Hello wingnut. I tried to find the equivalent Hebrew word for parable in the OT and came up with H4812, which is used mostly in Ezekiel of the Prophets concerning the people of Israel and Judah. https://www.blueletterbible.org/lang/lexicon/lexicon.cfm?Strongs=H4912&t=NKJV 4912 mashal apparently from 4910 in some original sense of superiority in mental action; properly, a pithy maxim, usually of metaphorical nature; hence, a simile (as an adage, poem, discourse):--byword, like, parable, proverb. I can look at this as Jesus actually talking: Eze 12:22 “Son of man/adam, what is this proverb<4912> that you people have about the land of Israel, which says, ‘The days are prolonged, and every vision fails’? Eze 20:49 Then I said, “Ah, Yahweh Elohim ! They say of me, ‘Does he not speak parables<4912>?’ ” ========================= https://www.blueletterbible.org/lang/lexicon/lexicon.cfm?Strongs=G3850&t=NKJV 3850. parabole from 3846; a similitude ("parable"), i.e. (symbolic) fictitious narrative (of common life conveying a moral), apothegm or adage:--comparison, figure, parable, proverb. G3850 παραβολή (parabolē) occurs 50 times in 48 verses MATTHEW 13: 13 Therefore I speak to them in parables<3850>, because seeing they do not see, and hearing they do not hear, nor do they understand. 14 And in them the prophecy of Isaiah is fulfilled, which says: 'Hearing you will hear and shall not understand, and seeing you will see and not perceive; 15 for the hearts of this people have grown dull. Their ears are hard of hearing, and their eyes they have closed, lest they should see with their eyes and hear with their ears, lest they should understand with their hearts and turn, so that I should heal them.' " =============================== I find the view of this commentator quite interesting, as he implies the previous parables, along withe this one, are as 1 complet parable. Also it should be noted the audience Jesus was speaking to, the common Jews along with the corrupt Jewish Rulers listening, primarily the Pharisees. This parable is only in Luke and Lazarus is only used in Luke 16 and 2 chapters of John. http://www.kingdombiblestudies.org/abraham/abrahams_bosom.htm The story of the rich man and Lazarus is without doubt one of the most misunderstood of all the stories in the Bible. Is it a parable, or an actual statement of facts concerning life beyond the grave? It is strenuously denied by most evangelists that this story, as told by Christ, could be a parable. They hold that this is not a parable because it starts out in narrative form. It is argued, because it reads, “There was a certain rich man, which was clothed in purple and fine linen, and fared sumptuously every day,” that Christ is speaking here of an actual incident that took place. But in the parable of the prodigal son, in the fifteenth chapter of Luke, the narrative introduction is found also, for it says, “A certain man had two sons...” Yet it is generally conceded that the story of the prodigal son is a parable and all the fundamentalist preachers love to preach from its beautiful figures, thus applying it as a parable.

Good post. Genesis 22:9 uses "slaughter", the same word used in Revelation 5:6 concerning Jesus as the Passover Lamb. Just thought that was interesting. Unlike Isaac, who was saved from death, Jesus suffered death on the cross but was raised from the dead and ascended to the right hand of God in Acts. Genesis 22: 9 And they come in unto the place of which 'Elohim hath spoken to him, and there Abraham buildeth the altar, and arrangeth the wood<06086>, and he bindeth Yitschaq his son, and placeth him upon the altar above the wood<06086>. 10 And Abraham putteth forth his hand, and taketh the knife--to slaughter his son. 13 And Abraham is lifting his eyes and behold a ram behind being held in thicket, in horns of him and Abraham is going and and he is taking the ram and he is offering up him as ascent offering instead of his son. 6086 `ets from 6095; a tree (from its firmness); hence, wood (plural sticks):--+ carpenter, gallows, helve, + pine, plank, staff, stalk, stick, stock, timber, tree, wood. H6086 עֵץ (`ets), occurs 328 times in 288 verses =============================================== Act 1:9 Now when He had spoken these things, while they watched, He was taken up, and a cloud received Him out of their sight. G286>amnós, am-nos'; apparently a primary word; a lamb:—lamb. Acts 8:32 The place in the Scripture which he read was this: “He was led as a sheep to the slaughter; And as a lamb<286> before its shearer is silent, So He opened not His mouth. Acts 13:29 and when they did finish all the things written about Him, having taken down from the wood/xulou<3586>, they laid Him in a tomb; Revelation 1:18 and the living One! And I became dead, and behold, I am living into the Ages of the Ages. And I am having the Keys of the Hades and of the Death ============================================= I noticed when I was doing a Greek study on Revelation, that the word G721 is used instead of G286. 721. arnion ar-nee'-on diminutive from 704; a lambkin:--lamb. Revelation 5:6 And I saw and behold! in midst of the throne and of the four living-ones and in midst of the elders a lambkin/arnion <721> standing, as having been slaughtered =================================