NickyLouse

I believe the antichrist will come out of Magog (Turkey) (Ezekiel 38:2). I believe that those who are beheaded in the tribulation are both those who believed prior to the tribulation but were not repentant in addition to those who come to believe during the tribulation. I do not believe that the whole of the church will be at the marriage supper of the Lamb. There will be some believers locked out. They will go through the first half of the tribulation. I agree. However, there will be some believers that will go through the first half of the tribulation. I do not believe repentance is required for salvation - only the faith of God that is given to us by grace is required for salvation. To place any requirement upon men for salvation eliminates grace. How do you suppose that some people believe in earnest and trust that they are secure in Christ, but do not follow Him? To them He will respond 'I never knew you', but they will be saved as through fire (Matthew 7:21-23, 22:1-14, 25:1-30, 1 Corinthians 3:11-15). They will go through the first half of the tribulation while believers who follow will be sanctified and will be raptured before the tribulation as a firstfruit and enter the kingdom. The others will be killed in the tribulation or go into the millennial reign with the other survivors. We are saved by virtue of the fact that Jesus was sacrificed on our behalf. There is nothing for us to do. However, just as the priests who served in the temple had to wash at the brazen laver, we must also be washed with the Word and sanctified by our repentance in order to go into the holy place.

Please do not chastise me. I am only trying to learn.

Thank you very much. This is food for thought. I will need to get back to you after I spend some time on it. God bless you.

Incidentally, one of your own quotes mentions that a body will raised... imperishable, yes, but still a body; i.e. flesh.

Aren't you referring to the ones who do not have eternal life here? The ones with eternal life surely do not come to an end.

I cannot say that I agree with you if I understand you correctly. I believe that we will be resurrected bodily. I have never been told otherwise by anyone over the past 15 years that I have been studying God's word.

Yes, GREAT... and terrible

Good word, Brother.

Do you believe in a place that those who are in Christ go when they die (whether in spirit or in body)? Do you believe that we will be physically resurrected with new imperishable bodies some day? Or do you believe we have Heaven now? I think there is vast support for the bodily resurrection.

We worship in spirit and in truth - neither on Mt Gerizim or Jerusalem necessarily. What I do personally on Passover is remember the sacrifice that was made when Yeshua was killed. The moedim are dress rehearsals for the real act. Passover had been observed and practiced for 1500 before the reality in the slaughter of Yeshua occurred. Now that the reality has passed, there is no longer any need for the dress rehearsals. However, in remembrance of the crucifixion, we do observe Passover, but not as a dress rehearsal for what is to come. I am less adamant about Passover and Unleavened Bread as I am Shavuot* and the Fall moedim. We are still awaiting the complete fulfillment of those dress rehearsals. As for the future sacrifices, I will ask my rabbi what passages support his belief that the temple and the sacrifices will return. Praise God that you seek only what is truth and follow Elohim. That is my desire as well. *My rabbi believes that Acts 2 was only a partial fulfillment of Joel 2:28-29 and that a pre-trib rapture of some believers may occur on some future Shavuot/Pentecost as it the waving of the leavened loaves represents the Father's acceptance of us as our High Priest Yeshua waves us before Him.

Thanks so much for your reply, Jostler. I don't want to take your reply out of context, but I wanted to comment on one thing in particular. I believe that this cannot be completely fulfilled on earth before the return of Christ. I see in Revelation 11 after the 7th trumpet that this kingdom has become His kingdom (and He will reign forever and ever - Hallelujah!). I believe that is the ONLY way His kingdom will come and His will is done on earth. I want to be in His kingdom, but I do not believe that everyone who believes in Him will be in it - at least not during the Millennial Reign. I refer to the parable of the ten virgins and those who have done works in His name but are cast into outer darkness (that I do not believe is the Lake of Fire). So, my question becomes: What does it take to enter His kingdom? Jesus says that our righteousness must exceed that of the scribes and Pharisees. That may seem pretty easy seeing that they were the ones calling for His death. But I don't know. We must repent. Okay. We must be poor in spirit. Alright. We must keep and teach the commandments. Umm, I would say okay to the best of my ability. Do the Father's will. Again, the same. And the parables about the kingdom leave me scratching my head a bit. Do I not have ears to hear or eyes to see? Well, thanks again and God bless you.

I did a quick query of the word "kingdom" in the NASB and found 119 occurrences in the Gospels. I am most interested in what Jesus had to say about the kingdom of God or of Heaven. "Kingdom of God" appears 51 times and "Kingdom of Heaven" appears 31 times (all in Matthew and most of all in chapter 13). I would like to know what others may have concluded about it. I am not very good at understanding subtleties so I have a hard time with parables and metaphors and such.

I belong to a Messianic Congregation and have been watching Mike Winger who I think is a great apologist. He has a few videos out now concerning the HRM and it is worth watching whether you agree with him or not. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QR7xTYhXEbo https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vhn6Mn9jESo https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mI5wiDTHpgE

It was in response and in agreement about Yeshua observing the law.

John the Baptist appeared in the wilderness, preaching a baptism of repentance for the forgiveness of sins. Jesus replied, “Let it be so now; it is proper for us to do this to fulfill all righteousness.” Mark 1:4, Matthew 3:15

Yeshua was also baptized by John to fulfill all righteousness, but not for repentance for the forgiveness of His sins.

You have some very good questions and I appreciate your stretching my mind about them. I cannot give too good of a defense about why we do not follow the feasts exactly. For example, I have asked myself (and my rabbi) whether I should live in actual booths made from palm fronds for an entire week. Our congregation does build a makeshift booth from palm fronds since they are in abundance here, but we only have a sermon under them and then they are taken down. I would suspect that if I wanted to live in one, my rabbi would encourage it. Incidentally, it is the feasts that draw me to learn more about Hebraic roots. If we could possibly all agree that the Spring feasts were about His first coming, then perhaps it follows that the Fall feasts are about His return. So if the feasts were to be abandoned after His first coming, why did God give us the Fall feasts. Did He change His mind about that when Israel rejected Christ? Would they have continued in observing them if they had accepted Him? I have also questioned the teaching about animal sacrifices returning. His sacrifice was ABSOLUTELY SUFFICIENT FOR ALL. It was explained to me that we who believe without seeing do so according to faith, but when He returns there will be no need for faith since they will see Him in the flesh. Those who believed God before the crucifixion believed by faith. After the cross, we believe by faith that He did come and die for our sins. Even those who walked with Jesus believed by faith (granted it was probably easy to do). However, after He returns and displays His glory for all to see, faith in Him will be moot. Therefore, they will be judged according to their obedience. I cannot explain it too much better than that. Perhaps I can find some passages that support all of this. I have only been studying it for about a year so I still feel that I have much to understand. I will say that if I do not see clearly whether what some call the ceremonial law should be followed, I will certainly drop the belief because it is my only desire to listen and pay heed to what God says. Blessings Brother

Well here's the problem loverofhumanity, there is no need to sacrifice yourself for Jesus. The Bible states that sinners need to make atonement for their sins. However, a sinner cannot atone for their sin. It also states that we have all sinned and therefore we all need atonement. Atonement simply means that we have reconciliation with God. Now Jesus' sacrifice was the ultimate sacrifice and we should all be so very grateful for it. However, He only asks one thing for our salvation and that is to believe that His sacrifice did indeed take away our sin so that we can be reconciled to God. One other minor point that you will want to remember is that Jesus wasn't merely "of" God... He "is" God.

A person can believe as loverofhumanity wrote and yet not accept that the atoning sacrifice of Jesus is sufficient for salvation.

Our congregation, Arrowhead Messianic Congregation in Peoria, AZ, does not want to put stumbling blocks before anyone and so it is only to our edification to follow certain laws (and I admit wholeheartedly that I do not know where the line is drawn on each one). We do still observe the moedim (feasts), but not precisely as it is prescribed. We are asked not to bring shellfish or pork to our onegs (potlucks). Of course, we teach that all of the commandments given at Mount Sinai should be followed to the best of our ability and we also know that to love Adonai and to love our neighbor will accomplish those requirements. We believe that the animal sacrifices have been suspended until the temple in Heaven comes when the New Jerusalem is established in the millennial reign at which time the sacrifices will be re-instituted. The reason that it will be required then is for the nations that have made it through the great tribulation and whereas faith has become sight of Yeshua and it is no longer possible to simply have faith by believing. Faith will be recognized by what is done. I am not an official representative of our congregation and I am not certain that I hold to all that is taught, but I think this is partly what is believed by the teachers and elders there.

Okay. I think I see the parable as when believers are called to the marriage supper of the Lamb. However, it seems odd that they would be called to it since they are the bride too. Interesting discussion.

Has anyone been taught of multiple raptures? My rabbi teaches that there will be a firstfruits (pretrib) rapture and an ongoing rapture for those who are martyred (re: Revelation 6:9-11) as well as a rapture/resurrection that occurs at the last trumpet (re: Rev 11, 1 Corinthians 15:51-52) in addition to the resurrection at the end of the millennium (re: Rev 20:5). It may be difficult for me to convey all that he teaches. If you have heard of this and have found insight one way or another, I appreciate your response.

Does He return "with" His bride or "for" His bride?

https://hebrew4christians.com/Names_of_G-d/Adonai/adonai.html has a thorough explanation of "Adonai". I would copy and paste, but their site does not allow it. You can also find the other names you inquired about.

With the exception of the word "obeys" in number 2, our congregation agrees with all of that. Shema is misunderstood to mean "obey" when it really means to listen and give careful consideration. Of course, once a thought is given careful consideration and there is no real chance of misunderstanding, then we would naturally follow to the best of our ability.