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Cobalt1959 last won the day on September 22

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About Cobalt1959

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  • Birthday 10/31/1959

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    St. Joseph, MO.
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    Christ, Family, Church, and computers, in that order.

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  1. Cobalt1959

    Jesus will return in 2040

    So in other words, it's OK for you to have double standards.
  2. Cobalt1959

    Jesus will return in 2040

    You can't give a "reasoned" debate when what you are propagating violates clear scripture on the subject. No one is shooting the messenger, so no victim status for you. We are saying that scripturally, you are wrong. There is no credible debate otherwise.
  3. Cobalt1959

    Jesus will return in 2040

    A new thread does not change the fact that scripture clearly says we are not to set dates. There is no end-run around that.
  4. Cobalt1959


    I am not your friend. You cannot separate Mosaic Law and the 10 Commandments. That is just another Sabbath-keeping tactic. The Sabbath is part of Mosaic Law and the Old Testament gives specific rules for how it is to be kept, if one is going to attempt to go down that road. It's pretty convenient to try and place a dividing line there that does not exist. You have to do that because virtually the only component of the Sabbath you are keeping is the day itself. You do not keep any of the other Sabbath requirements. This is why you cannot explain how you are "keeping" the Sabbath beyond vague generalities. This is why you will not deal with the examples I gave of how you actually violate the Sabbath while claiming you are keeping it. You go to church on Saturday. That is not keeping the Sabbath.
  5. Cobalt1959

    Jesus will return in 2040

    Evidently, you are unaware of the biblical prohibition of date-setting: Matthew 24:31-39 31 And he will send his angels with a loud trumpet call, and they will gather his elect from the four winds, from one end of the heavens to the other. 32 "Now learn this lesson from the fig tree: As soon as its twigs get tender and its leaves come out, you know that summer is near. 33 Even so, when you see all these things, you know that it is near, right at the door. 34 I tell you the truth, this generation will certainly not pass away until all these things have happened. 35 Heaven and earth will pass away, but my words will never pass away. 36 "No one knows about that day or hour, not even the angels in heaven, nor the Son, but only the Father. 37 As it was in the days of Noah, so it will be at the coming of the Son of Man. 38 For in the days before the flood, people were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, up to the day Noah entered the ark; 39 and they knew nothing about what would happen until the flood came and took them all away. That is how it will be at the coming of the Son of Man. The fact that you would say it was in 2040 virtually guarantees it will not be in 2040. If God says no man can know the time, He means exactly that.
  6. Cobalt1959


    I never said Jesus carried those OT rules forward to the New Testament. You are inferring that He did by telling everyone they have to observe a Saturday Sabbath. The Mosaic Sabbath was given to Israel. No one else. Every command of Mosaic Law in Exodus, Leviticus, Numbers and Deuteronomy was given to Israel. Exodus 31:16-18 16 The Israelites are to observe the Sabbath, celebrating it for the generations to come as a lasting covenant. 17 It will be a sign between me and the Israelites forever, for in six days the LORD made the heavens and the earth, and on the seventh day he abstained from work and rested.' " 18 When the LORD finished speaking to Moses on Mount Sinai, he gave him the two tablets of the Testimony, the tablets of stone inscribed by the finger of God. Jesus re-affirms every single commandment of the original 10, except one. The Sabbath. Paul never told anyone to keep the Sabbath. Peter never told anyone to keep the Sabbath. Matthew, Mark, Luke, James, none of those Apostles told anyone to keep the Sabbath. Surely if the Sabbath was so important, at least one of the Apostles would have told someone they needed to be keeping it. Any such admonition is missing from the entirety of the New Testament. Paul plainly says not to judge people in regards to these things: Colossians 2:13-17 13 When you were dead in your sins and in the uncircumcision of your sinful nature, God made you alive with Christ. He forgave us all our sins, 14 having canceled the written code, with its regulations, that was against us and that stood opposed to us; he took it away, nailing it to the cross. 15 And having disarmed the powers and authorities, he made a public spectacle of them, triumphing over them by the cross. 16 Therefore do not let anyone judge you by what you eat or drink, or with regard to a religious festival, a New Moon celebration or a Sabbath day. 17 These are a shadow of the things that were to come; the reality, however, is found in Christ. When you call people disobedient for not "keeping" the Sabbath, you are doing exactly what Paul says above, not to do. You are judging people and you are judging them from a position of telling them they need to do something that a believer in Christ is never commanded to do. Later in the same chapter, Paul says this. Colossians 2:20-23 20 Since you died with Christ to the basic principles of this world, why, as though you still belonged to it, do you submit to its rules: 21 "Do not handle! Do not taste! Do not touch!"? 22 These are all destined to perish with use, because they are based on human commands and teachings. 23 Such regulations indeed have an appearance of wisdom, with their self-imposed worship, their false humility and their harsh treatment of the body, but they lack any value in restraining sensual indulgence. See a theme here? Acts 15:7-20 7 After much discussion, Peter got up and addressed them: "Brothers, you know that some time ago God made a choice among you that the Gentiles might hear from my lips the message of the gospel and believe. 8 God, who knows the heart, showed that he accepted them by giving the Holy Spirit to them, just as he did to us. 9 He made no distinction between us and them, for he purified their hearts by faith. 10 Now then, why do you try to test God by putting on the necks of the disciples a yoke that neither we nor our fathers have been able to bear? 11 No! We believe it is through the grace of our Lord Jesus that we are saved, just as they are." 12 The whole assembly became silent as they listened to Barnabas and Paul telling about the miraculous signs and wonders God had done among the Gentiles through them. 13 When they finished, James spoke up: "Brothers, listen to me. 14 Simon has described to us how God at first showed his concern by taking from the Gentiles a people for himself. 15 The words of the prophets are in agreement with this, as it is written: 16 " 'After this I will return and rebuild David's fallen tent. Its ruins I will rebuild, and I will restore it, 17 that the remnant of men may seek the Lord, and all the Gentiles who bear my name, says the Lord, who does these things' 18 that have been known for ages. 19 "It is my judgment, therefore, that we should not make it difficult for the Gentiles who are turning to God. 20 Instead we should write to them, telling them to abstain from food polluted by idols, from sexual immorality, from the meat of strangled animals and from blood. No mention of the Sabbath here. Peter is clear that the Gentile Church attempting to yoke itself to the Law is a huge mistake. Not one single person under the Law ever actually kept it. If they could have kept it, Jesus' sacrifice would not have been necessary. So outside of the fact that it has been demonstrated that you do not actually "keep" the Sabbath because you only keep one single Sabbath requirement, (Saturday) you also cannot be keeping it because not one single person, except Jesus, ever could. With Jesus' substitutionary sacrifice available to anyone who wishes to receive it, trying to mix Mosaic Law and grace thru faith is not advisable. Once again, you are contradictory with your own statements on this subject. If it is your position that Jesus did not carry any of these requirements forward into the Age of Grace for the Church, then why are you adamant that people need to keep a Saturday Sabbath, which is an integral component of Mosaic Law? Why are you unable to explain to us exactly how you keep the Sabbath?
  7. Cobalt1959


    She told you how she "keeps" the Sabbath in this quote: It's a little vaguer than a couple of other answers I've gotten before, but they always follow the same basic pattern. They go to church on Saturday. They try not to work. They study and read the Bible. They do family activities. There is nothing wrong with what she is doing, and there is nothing wrong with doing it on Saturday. Or Sunday. Or Monday. But it does not meet the requirements of actually keeping the Mosaic Sabbath. Exodus, Leviticus, Numbers and Deuteronomy lay out very specific and very strict commands when it comes to how the Sabbath is to be kept. There isn't any wiggle room within those laws, and if you miss obeying one single one of them, including any of the 613 Mosaic laws you violate all of them. That is specifically why Jesus instituted a new covenant. Jesus fulfilled and closed the old covenant and replaced it with a superior covenant. The entire purpose of Mosaic Law was that it literally could not be kept perfectly by mankind. That a perfect sacrifice was required. People clinging to the Law demonstrate they don't understand the purpose of Jesus' death and resurrection. They also only keep one single component of the Sabbath. They do stuff on Saturday instead of Sunday. That ain't keeping the Sabbath.
  8. Cobalt1959


    No one is having an argument. You accused people of being disobedient. So suddenly saying "if anyone wants to do different than what scripture says they are free to do so" rings hollow after we have already been called disobedient several times. I've kicked this ball back into the court for a long time. 12 years here. The threads always start exactly the same and they always end exactly the same. The script never varies. 1. Someone comes on and tells the board we still have to observe a Saturday Sabbath. (We are never commanded to do so.) 2. They then tell us we are replacing Saturday with Sunday as our observance of the Sabbath. (This is false because this is not what we believe.) 3. They then call us disobedient, claim we do not know scripture, and we might not even be saved if we do not observe a Saturday Sabbath. (We are not being disobedient. We are fulfilling the Sabbath, positionally, every single day of the week.) 4. When asked how they are "keeping" the Sabbath, they can never give a definitive answer. Saturday Sabbath keeping always fails at point 4. No one here, in the 12 years I have been a member here has ever given a detailed and definitive answer as to how they "keep" the Sabbath. Not one single time. Despite all of them claiming that they kept it, Surely if you believed you were actually keeping it, you would be able to explain exactly how you were doing so. But no one ever can. That is because you are not keeping the Sabbath. You will not give a definitive answer because you can't. You can't label someone else as disobedient when you can't explain to them how they are supposed to do something you claim to be doing. Keeping the Sabbath along biblical guidelines does not have optional components that can be used or taken away as a person sees fit. You can't say you're going to Church on Saturday so you are keeping the Sabbath. Because that's all that today's "Sabbath-keeping" actually is. Swapping out the days you go to church. That isn't keeping the Sabbath. The Sabbath was never about going to church. It was about resting form your work. This was the prototype for a person being able to rest from the work of trying to justify themselves to God through the law. Once Jesus was resurrected, we have rest from our work in His salvation and a Saturday observance of the Sabbath is moot. God gave the Israelites very strict commands in regards to the Sabbath. They were not optional. So if you say you are keeping the Sabbath, you chain yourself to every single one of them, and you have to adhere to every single one of them, or you violate the Sabbath every time you claim to be keeping it. In reality, so-called Sabbath keepers abandon every single command God gave Israel in regards to the Sabbath, except one, and that is the day. They abandon every other command about the Sabbath because they are either inconvenient, or literally impossible to perform. On the Sabbath, you could do no work. Not just almost none. None. You couldn't light a fire. You couldn't travel a certain distance from your home. You had to offer a morning and evening sacrifice at the Temple, in addition to the regular sacrifices. When it comes to the work component, the explanation there is always we try not to work. As Yoda says in The Empire Strikes back, “Do. Or do not. There is no try.” If you do any work, congratulations, you've just broken the Sabbath. If you drive your car you are lighting a fire every second. By driving the car to Church and keeping the Church open using utilities and also causing untold numbers of people to have to work on the Sabbath to patrol traffic, man hospitals, maintain the utilities, etc., you are again wreaking havoc all over the place. Congratulations. You've broken the Sabbath. You're travelling to church. Oops. You just broke the Sabbath. Got your morning and evening sacrifices ready to take to the Temple? No Temple? No Levitical priesthood? Looks like you've got a broken Sabbath. Funny that Sabbath keepers tell everyone else they are not obedient, but in reality, the Sabbath keepers are more disobedient that the people they are accusing of being disobedient. Because they claim to be keeping something but dismiss every single rule about it except one.
  9. Cobalt1959


    Thank you. . .
  10. Cobalt1959


    I've not seen any sound or orthodox doctrine from him yet. He makes a claim and when it is countered, he subtly changes it and then claims he never stated it the other way, even when he, himself is quoted on the issue. His original claim about repentance was that a person only has to repent of "unbelief," but he has progressively changed that claim since he made to original statement to appear more orthodox. But he still clearly does not understand that there are many more sins one has to repent of besides unbelief, and that repentance is not a one-time deal, scripturally-speaking, that it is an ongoing process which is part of progressive sanctification.
  11. Cobalt1959


    A link would be helpful here . . .
  12. Cobalt1959


    I see that you continue to forward the erroneous concept that people not going to church on Saturday are hinging observance of the Sabbath on Sunday. It is a false dichotomy that you impose on the subject, every time you attempt to use it. I don't think I am "keeping" the Sabbath by going to church on Sunday. It is merely a day that most Christians meet to worship, to fellowship, to be edified, and edify one another, and to receive and give instruction to one another. And that's all it is. Sunday isn't the Sabbath. No Christian think's it's the Sabbath except the Saturday Sabbath keepers who keep telling people who go to Church on Sunday what they believe, when that is not what they believe. It is a false parallel that has to be imposed so that Sabbath-keepers can claim other Christians are disobedient. I'm not being disobedient in regards to the Sabbath. I am being obedient by keeping the Sabbath every single day through my faith in Jesus' finished work on the Cross. I'm still waiting for you to explain, in detail, how we are supposed to follow God's plan that you talk about above. You keep telling us what we need to do, but you continually fail to tell us how to do it.
  13. Cobalt1959


    I will point out, again, that it is not up to any person here, on this board to explain to you how we keep the Sabbath. That question has already been answered anyway. I gave you clear scripture from Hebrews on the subject and you ignored it. A believer in Christ enters their Sabbath rest the moment they accept Christ. It isn't about a day. The concept of the Sabbath has always been the prototype of resting from one's own work, when it comes to being reconciled with God. We achieve that rest once Jesus is our Savior, and wanting to still hang that rest on one certain day of the week mock's Christ's death. It isn't a hard road when we take comfort in grace through faith. Your concept is keeping the Sabbath on one day of the week. Hebrew's position is that a believer is keeping the Sabbath, both position-ally and spiritually every single day of the week. It isn't a hard road when we take comfort in grace through faith. Jesus tells us it isn't a hard road. Matthew 11:27-30 27 "All things have been committed to me by my Father. No one knows the Son except the Father, and no one knows the Father except the Son and those to whom the Son chooses to reveal him. 28 "Come to me, all you who are weary and burdened, and I will give you rest. 29 Take my yoke upon you and learn from me, for I am gentle and humble in heart, and you will find rest for your souls. 30 For my yoke is easy and my burden is light." People themselves make it a hard road when they burden themselves with things Jesus tells us we don't need to take on. Then, not happy with burdening themselves, they try and impose those same burdens on others. That isn't the way to go. Peter is very clear on the point: Acts 15:7-11 7 After much discussion, Peter got up and addressed them: "Brothers, you know that some time ago God made a choice among you that the Gentiles might hear from my lips the message of the gospel and believe. 8 God, who knows the heart, showed that he accepted them by giving the Holy Spirit to them, just as he did to us. 9 He made no distinction between us and them, for he purified their hearts by faith. 10 Now then, why do you try to test God by putting on the necks of the disciples a yoke that neither we nor our fathers have been able to bear? 11 No! We believe it is through the grace of our Lord Jesus that we are saved, just as they are." The Law does not save. The moment you try to pick up even one single component of the Law, you get all 613 of them at no extra cost. James 2:8-10 8 If you really keep the royal law found in Scripture, "Love your neighbor as yourself," you are doing right. 9 But if you show favoritism, you sin and are convicted by the law as lawbreakers. 10 For whoever keeps the whole law and yet stumbles at just one point is guilty of breaking all of it. Why are you advising people to do something Peter says we shouldn't do?
  14. Cobalt1959


    Here are some selected quotes from you from the beginning of the thread: In the beginning, you were very forceful when it comes to this issue. You presented yourself as an authority on the subject and not only an authority, an authority that knew so much about the subject you were wise enough to tell other people what they should do in regards to this issue. Suddenly, you want others to explain it to you. Why would I need to do that? You are the one who presented yourself as knowing all about it. So explain it to us. You talk about scripture in the above quotes, and scripture gives us clear guidelines for how the Sabbath was to be kept. So surely you can clearly delineate to all of us here what those scriptural dictates are. You are very clear that people not keeping the Saturday Sabbath are disobedient. So surely, as a believer concerned about your fellow brothers and sisters in Christ, you would want to explain to all of us here how we can all be obedient, according to your concept of the Sabbath. That's simple "own words" stuff, and it can't be that difficult for you to explain how you are keeping the Sabbath. Surely you would earnestly desire to do so so we can all be obedient, just like you. Since you claimed to be authority on the subject both in regards to scripture and personal observance of the Sabbath, it isn't up to me to explain to you how it is supposed to be kept. You've claimed you know very well how it is to be kept. But so far, you haven't been able to explain to us how you keep the Sabbath, real-world. I know what scripture says on this issue. You claim you do as well. So I am waiting for you to explain it to us. Surely that was your desire at the beginning of the thread? If you know what scripture says on this issue, it can't be that difficult to show all of us what it says. And if you think you are obedient when it comes to the Sabbath, it can't be that difficult to simply tell all of us how you are being obedient.
  15. No it is not, but that is not the issue. You have a person who is a moderator here openly ridiculing people who hold a different view of the end times than they do, and this person does so with impunity. The moment that happens, that person should not be a moderator anymore.