Vickilynn

Amen and amen Sister! We each contend for the faith, each from our own backgrounds and challenges and we each are a miracle of Yeshua's salvation! Thank you for your excellent postings.

Oh yes, the Rabbi and leadership often teach about this very thing, and yet, some still believe their works and strict adherence to the Law of Moses is pleasing G-d. One couple said they still "love Yeshua" and are not leaving Him, but they believe we (all Believers in Yeshua) are to walk as an Orthodox Jew, as Yeshua did. I did not know about these people and what they were doing until they left. I wish I had. But, our Rabbi did try to dissuade them, to no avail. I am Jewish, by birth, raised in the Jewish faith, and I found freedom and salvation in Yeshua. It grieves me SO much to see Gentiles worship Jews and Judaism and get caught up in such deception. The Hebrew Roots error is so insidious because, as all error, it sounds good. It sounds pious. It sounds as if this is pleasing to G-d, ESPECIALLY if one dismisses the writing of Paul who warned of this very thing as you said. This is one reason when I encounter Hebrew Roots or other similar errors on message boards etc., I always confront the errors with Scripture. This is how I got into a discussion with this gal who refused to acknowledge Paul's authority since it exposes her doctrinal errors.

And unfortunately, it has also caused a sort of "worship" of Jews and all things Jewish, including traditional Judaism, as you said above. We had some people in our Messianic Synagogue leave and convert to Orthodox Judaism! I see this in Messianic circles, Gentiles who say they are Jews and dress the part and become enamored with Judaism and they leave Yeshua and the truth. This is why their error is so great and does so much damage.

Absolutely and amen.

I so agree and it's heartbreaking! I see so much division, pride, ego, fighting and most of all a lack of reaching the Jewish people for the Gospel, from the Hebrew Roots folks.

Shalom y'all, I am engaged in a discussion with a gal who is posting Hebrew Roots false teaching that Paul is not an Apostle and his writings are not Scripture. This is mainly because Paul's letters expose the error in the Torah Observance groups who elevate works and Torah adherence. So, to eliminate that little glitch, it is essential to try to eliminate Paul and his truth. My question is, how prevalent is this dogma that Paul is a false Apostle? Do we see it outside of the Hebrew Roots / Torah Observance groups?

Thanks!

Shalom John, What is the source of this post please? URL?

Shalom, Worth reading:

Shalom, In answer to the OP, how should we use the Word when witnessing? Romans 10: 9because, if you confess with your mouth that Jesus is Lord and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved. 10For with the heart one believes and is justified, and with the mouth one confesses and is saved. 11For the Scripture says, "Everyone who believes in him will not be put to shame." 12 For there is no distinction between Jew and Greek; for the same Lord is Lord of all, bestowing his riches on all who call on him. 13For "everyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved." 4How then will they call on him in whom they have not believed? And how are they to believe in him of whom they have never heard? And how are they to hear without someone preaching? 15And how are they to preach unless they are sent? As it is written, "How beautiful are the feet of those who preach the good news!" 16But they have not all obeyed the gospel. For Isaiah says,"Lord, who has believed what he has heard from us?" 17So faith comes from hearing, and hearing through the word of Christ. We are to witness being led of the Holy Spirit and speaking the truth from the Word.

Shalom Suzanne, No one is dismissing anything, but it does not specifically apply to witnessing as you are trying to make it. It is how we are to LIVE, not rules for witnessing. You are taking Scripture *out of context* and applying it where it was never intended. That is how false doctrine gets started. The verse you pulled out of that letter has nothing to do with witnessing and you cannot make it apply. That is not the correct intent, audience or meaning of the Scripture. It is imperative that we *rightly divide the Word of truth* and taking Scripture out of context and misapplying it is not rightly dividing the Word of truth. Apply that verse to your OP and you will see that saying this verse has anything to do with witnessing is NOT "correctly handles the word of truth. " That would be not misapplying Scripture to mean something it was never intended to mean.

Shalom Alan, Not the point and actually a Straw Man fallacy! The point is, the letters to Timothy are TO Timothy, about how to be a church leader. They do not apply to all Christians in how to witness. It's not even ABOUT witnessing so to use it to make a doctrinal stand about witnessing is not correct.

Shalom, Christians should witness using the Word. They need not be "experts" or "proficient" but be willing vessels of the Holy Spirit. And to WHOM was this letter addressed? To Timothy, a church leader. Paul was instructing Timothy and charging him in his duties. You cannot create a doctrine applicable to all Christians and how they are to witness by using 2 Timothy 2:15, that is not the intent or meaning of the verse or to whom it was written.

Shalom Suzanne, I'll try this again. No, I don't agree that we can "mishandle" G-d's Word if our heart is right. I don't believe we need to be experts in the Word to witness. I believe we need to be willing vessels of the Holy Spirit and not speak our own opinions, but G-d's Word. THAT is what that verse speaks to me. If we look at the Apostles (other than Paul), none were scholars. They learned from Jesus and became willing vessels, as we should. There is nothing wrong with learning all we can about the Bible, but if we are waiting to witness until we become "proficient" in the Word, many, many people will die without hearing the simple truth from G-d's Word that they can be saved by grace through faith in Jesus the Messiah. Even baby Christians can witness what they know - how Jesus saved them and what He has done in their lives! One not be an expert ion theology to share this: Romans 10:9-10 9because, if you confess with your mouth that Jesus is Lord and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved. 10For with the heart one believes and is justified, and with the mouth one confesses and is saved. 11For the Scripture says, "Everyone who believes in him will not be put to shame." 12 For there is no distinction between Jew and Greek; for the same Lord is Lord of all, bestowing his riches on all who call on him. 13For "everyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved." Ephesians 2:8-9 For by grace you have been saved through faith. And this is not your own doing; it is the gift of God, 9 not a result of works so that no one may boast.

Shalom, WOW. What an awesome post. Thank you brother for sharing.

Minorities??? I see more white kids wearing those ugly things than black kids. That may be true, at least in your area. But the fact is that it started within a minority sub-culture, and banning sagging pants can be seen as an attempt to suppress that which is perceived as "not white". Shalom Willing, Strawman Argument. Race has nothing to do with the issue. Droopy pants are droopy pants, no matter what race the wearer is. Turning this into a race argument is ridiculous.

Shalom, Support it? You bet!! Problem is, who is gonna enforce it and what criteria will they use for how low is "too" low? It would have to be specific and worthy of being enforced or it's an empty action.

Shalom KarenMarie, Amen and amen. Thank you.

Shalom Bibs, Exactly! Spot on! (I learned that from a Brit). And thank you for the welcome back. 'Tis good to take a walkabout sometimes. (I learned that from an Aussie.)

If having a tattoo makes you sinful, would not having one make you righteous? Shalom Bib, Ahhh, but that wasn't the question. She is ALREADY righteous since she is a Christian. She was asking if now that she IS a Christian, would it be a sin for her to get a tattoo according to G-d. Some people answered no. Some people answered yes. Some people chose to attack the ones who answered yes. And that is that, as they say.

I must have attempted at least 5 times to clarify this. And you still don't get it? And I'm supposed to beleive that you are sincerely trying to understand my position? Shalom Artsy, Honestly, it doesn't matter to me WHAT you believe. You have personally attacked and judged peoples hearts in here for simply sharing their beliefs on this topic as you are. You refuse to allow people to have the same rights you demand. You can believe what you want, it makes no difference to me. You have refused to clarify your comments when I sincerely tried to get your position concerning them. So, I guess we'll move on.

Something to consider. Shalom, Yes, I agree. Something to consider.

When I think you are sincerely trying to understand what I'm trying to say, I'll continue. Shalom Artsy, That's OK, you've already stated this isn't important to you. Your comments reflect that. And, since you don't know my heart, you aren't capable of knowing when I'm sincere. Your comments have nothing to do with my stand. Your comments need clarification as they lend themselves to the questions I sincerely asked you. But since you are unwilling to clarify and have a real interactive gracious discussion, but would rather toss out incomplete and out of context references and refuse to clarify, well then, I guess we'll just move on.

Shalom Brother, Ya know, I just love you!! "Scrabbly" or not.

Shalom Eric, If you read the OP, it is asked by a CHRISTIAN, asking a question. There is no mention of non-Christian's actions and what was done before getting saved etc. NO one said you should be ashamed of it. And the only finger-pointing has been from people who don't want to hear differing views which were asked for by the OP. THAT'S what the fuss is all about. As for "getting a life", :whistling: