Why America MUST fall

[Bold Believer]

It's becoming pretty obvious that there are forces, spiritual, internal and external, which want the United States to fall. While on the surface these forces appear each to have their own agendas, they are in fact united in goal. What is that goal? To destroy the last Christian nation. Some will argue that we are no longer a Christian nation, or that we never were. HOGWASH. It is obvious that the US was in fact founded upon the Christian precepts practiced in the world at the time of her inception.

Now, some 234 years later, the last vestiges of Christian precept are being challenged by humanist precept that elevates man to god-like status. Why? Because once America is out of the way with her Christian precepts and beliefs, the floodgates will be open for Gog to march. America is the cork in the bottle. If you pull the cork, ANYTHING can get into the bottle and pollute the wine.

[MorningGlory]

It's becoming pretty obvious that there are forces, spiritual, internal and external, which want the United States to fall. While on the surface these forces appear each to have their own agendas, they are in fact united in goal. What is that goal? To destroy the last Christian nation. Some will argue that we are no longer a Christian nation, or that we never were. HOGWASH. It is obvious that the US was in fact founded upon the Christian precepts practiced in the world at the time of her inception.

Now, some 234 years later, the last vestiges of Christian precept are being challenged by humanist precept that elevates man to god-like status. Why? Because once America is out of the way with her Christian precepts and beliefs, the floodgates will be open for Gog to march. America is the cork in the bottle. If you pull the cork, ANYTHING can get into the bottle and pollute the wine.

This is interesting. The first government of 1776 to 1788 was founded on good solid foundation and Bible prinicipals. The constitutional government had a fairly good start with a lot of hope. However; it has been estimated that fewer then ten percent were Christian and a big thing was Church - State separation not unity. So, although we were somewhat a religious nation I would not call it Christian. During the great revialist period in the 1880's to WW1 it has been estimated that Christianity may have reisen to ~22%. A large percentage IMHO.

In the beginning of this nation it would not be a good idea to let your personal beliefs out of the closet if they were not of a christian nature. Ben Franklin was a prime example. No doubt he was a smart man. But Christian; no way - he was a member of the HellFire Club (a satanic lot) that I believe can still be found today. There are a lot of character references of our founding fathers that would lead them not to be accepted in a Christian body of believers if their life were made known.

Many subscribe to the Stone of Scone theroy and make the claims of those installed governments as 'Christian'.

But when you read of early settlements and their attitude to one another it was not Christian. Roger Williams was Baptist and as such was beaten as he would not change his belief and exiled to the wilderness to die. Instead he made friends with the Indians and they accepted Christ and the follow winter saved the colonist that we willing to kill him. There are a lot (huge amount) of such history in our land of one group of so-called Christians beating and killing another group and the catholics weren't even here yet. The five major goups did not all practice Christianity.

Our country has been in almost constant war since 1860 and started Imperialism in ~1898 with the invasion of the Phillipines only to have to go to China and war or have a conflict there. William Gennings Bryan threw a cold towel on their parade; but, where are those great men today? Who is standing in the hedges and crying aloud - it is wrong.

I've asked you twice, in other threads, for your sources for this alternate history you keep posting. Will the third time asking produce an answer? What I read above is straight from a History Channel program I watched a few months ago and bears little relation to actual events.

[other one]

I would disagree that the United States of America is or was ever a Christian Nation. It is and always was a secular nation full of Christian People..... Much more so when it began that now I might add.

Our founding fathers did not want to have the country a theocracy, however did tell and teach that our form of government would not sustain the country unless the people were of high moral character...... be that Christians or whatever.

Our own government has more than one document that states this is not a Christian Nation, and that our laws were built on the seven Noahide laws which come from the Talmud and not the Bible. I'm not saying that those laws are bad, just not Christian background specifically.

Our copy of the treaty of Tripoli that is signed by our legislators specifically states in writing that the United States of America is not a Christian Nation.

However this country was settled by a population that were very dedicated followers of Christ. The thought process of much of the population were believers and it is that moral steadfastness that made this country what it is. Many of our founding fathers were not Christians, but were good people. Many were Masons, and while I can not follow the Masonic teachings, they do teach a high moral standing for our communities, and that carried out nation for some time.

Unfortunately, our people as a whole are not followers of the ways of our Lord. It's not my place to judge a person individually, but corporately our society has gone to hell in a hand basket.

To come to the place I am concerning this, you would have to read many books and go through papers left by our early politicians. Unfortunately there isn't a single place one can go to for information on them all.

One mistake that many people make is in thinking they must either be Deists or Christians when they talk of God..... A good friend just got me a book "Sacred Fire" which is supposed to convince me that George Washington was a Christian even though he refused to take communion.... It's about a thousand pages long and is just an example of what one must go through to make informed ideas of how this country was formed. There have been other books just as large and just as documented that make me believe otherwise, but as I am always open to learn, I'll read the book with an open mind.

[Leonard]

Is ANYBODY here aware that the Supreme Court gave the opinion that 'this is a Christian nation'?

A whole bunch of you need to read the diaries, journals and personal letters which passed between the Founders. If any of you can then doubt that nearly all of them were genuine Christians, then you simply don't have good reading comprehension.

[other one]

LoL....... It's not the first time the Surpreme Court has been wrong Leonard....... they also said it perfectly ok to kill healthy unborn babies....

[oldzimm]

Other one wrote this in a post.

However this country was settled by a population that were very dedicated followers of Christ. The thought process of much of the population were believers and it is that moral steadfastness that made this country what it is. Many of our founding fathers were not Christians, but were good people. Many were Masons, and while I can not follow the Masonic teachings, they do teach a high moral standing for our communities, and that carried out nation for some time.

Other one, you make it sound like Masons is a different religion, believe me we are not. I have been a Mason for 27 years and in my lodge I wouldn't be afraid to say all of our members are Christian. When inducted into the fraternity we are ask one question. When are met with an ordeal or a trying time in our lives, who do we put our trust in? The only answer to that question is "God", anything else and you will not be a Mason.

The Masons do not put one church denomination over another and the Masons don't really have teachings, but during our ceremonies most of the material used is referenced to the Holy Bible.

Believe me over the years I have heard it all from non masons, most of which isn't true, they let their opinion of what they think is true get the best of them. I've heard masons are evil, which is not true, but if I ever go to a lodge meeting and if there is anything but the Holy Bible opened up on the table or if they pray to anything else but God, I will be out of there and they will never see me again.

[Bold Believer]

It's becoming pretty obvious that there are forces, spiritual, internal and external, which want the United States to fall. While on the surface these forces appear each to have their own agendas, they are in fact united in goal. What is that goal? To destroy the last Christian nation. Some will argue that we are no longer a Christian nation, or that we never were. HOGWASH. It is obvious that the US was in fact founded upon the Christian precepts practiced in the world at the time of her inception.

Now, some 234 years later, the last vestiges of Christian precept are being challenged by humanist precept that elevates man to god-like status. Why? Because once America is out of the way with her Christian precepts and beliefs, the floodgates will be open for Gog to march. America is the cork in the bottle. If you pull the cork, ANYTHING can get into the bottle and pollute the wine.

This is interesting. The first government of 1776 to 1788 was founded on good solid foundation and Bible prinicipals. The constitutional government had a fairly good start with a lot of hope. However; it has been estimated that fewer then ten percent were Christian and a big thing was Church - State separation not unity. So, although we were somewhat a religious nation I would not call it Christian. During the great revialist period in the 1880's to WW1 it has been estimated that Christianity may have reisen to ~22%. A large percentage IMHO.

In the beginning of this nation it would not be a good idea to let your personal beliefs out of the closet if they were not of a christian nature. Ben Franklin was a prime example. No doubt he was a smart man. But Christian; no way - he was a member of the HellFire Club (a satanic lot) that I believe can still be found today. There are a lot of character references of our founding fathers that would lead them not to be accepted in a Christian body of believers if their life were made known.

Many subscribe to the Stone of Scone theroy and make the claims of those installed governments as 'Christian'.

But when you read of early settlements and their attitude to one another it was not Christian. Roger Williams was Baptist and as such was beaten as he would not change his belief and exiled to the wilderness to die. Instead he made friends with the Indians and they accepted Christ and the follow winter saved the colonist that we willing to kill him. There are a lot (huge amount) of such history in our land of one group of so-called Christians beating and killing another group and the catholics weren't even here yet. The five major groups did not all practice Christianity.

Our country has been in almost constant war since 1860 and started Imperialism in ~1898 with the invasion of the Phillipines only to have to go to China and war or have a conflict there. William Jennings Bryan threw a cold towel on their parade; but, where are those great men today? Who is standing in the hedges and crying aloud - it is wrong.

The US Supreme Court would've agreed with me that we are a Christian country. It doesn't mean that every single person was a Believer, nor does it mean that individuals in high office were necessarily all Believers. The principles and laws of the nation were Scripturally based. The guiding precepts had a Judeo-Christian base, not a humanist one.

[Bold Believer]

Is ANYBODY here aware that the Supreme Court gave the opinion that 'this is a Christian nation'?

A whole bunch of you need to read the diaries, journals and personal letters which passed between the Founders. If any of you can then doubt that nearly all of them were genuine Christians, then you simply don't have good reading comprehension.

Trinity vs US 1892 was the decision.

..."we are a religious people, we are a Christian nation."

The point is that there are still those in America, both individuals and leaders, who believe that the precepts which guide and shape our country must and should be Biblically based. It is THESE persons who are the stumblingblock to the Magogians who want America to follow humanism and are pushing the tenets of the Humanist Manifesto 2 into our legislation.

Sam..what in the WORLD are you babbling about? I can't even follow you.

[other one]

Other one wrote this in a post.

However this country was settled by a population that were very dedicated followers of Christ. The thought process of much of the population were believers and it is that moral steadfastness that made this country what it is. Many of our founding fathers were not Christians, but were good people. Many were Masons, and while I can not follow the Masonic teachings, they do teach a high moral standing for our communities, and that carried out nation for some time.

Other one, you make it sound like Masons is a different religion, believe me we are not. I have been a Mason for 27 years and in my lodge I wouldn't be afraid to say all of our members are Christian. When inducted into the fraternity we are ask one question. When are met with an ordeal or a trying time in our lives, who do we put our trust in? The only answer to that question is "God", anything else and you will not be a Mason.

The Masons do not put one church denomination over another and the Masons don't really have teachings, but during our ceremonies most of the material used is referenced to the Holy Bible.

Believe me over the years I have heard it all from non masons, most of which isn't true, they let their opinion of what they think is true get the best of them. I've heard masons are evil, which is not true, but if I ever go to a lodge meeting and if there is anything but the Holy Bible opened up on the table or if they pray to anything else but God, I will be out of there and they will never see me again.

I don't know what levels of masonry you've been and whether or not you've been invited into the darker side of masonry, but I do have relatives and old friends who either are or have been. This isn't the place for this discussion, so I'll just leave it at saying that for most you may be right but I know from personal experience that you are not correct for everyone in that brotherhood. May you never be involved.

It never works out very well to discuss it on these boards because of the emotions that "always" surface.

[MorningGlory]

I haven't produced alter history. It is there for all to read. Don't plan on finding it in you 10th grade American history class. TYPE IN YOUR GOOGLE SEARCH ENGINE: ARTICLES OF CONFEDERATIONS And see below:

These things are easy to find if you are interested: The Articles of Confederation

Articles of Confederation and

Perpetual Union...

Williamsburg: Va.

Printed by Alexander Purdie [1777].

Rare Book and Special Collections Division.

The Continental Congress adopted the Articles of Confederation, the first constitution of the United States, on November 15, 1777.

http://www.loc.gov/rr/program/bib/ourdocs/articles.html

There is too much to list:

Articles of Confederation - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

The Articles of Confederation and Perpetual Union, customarily referred to as ..... Uncertain that any government over so vast a domain as the United States ...

Background - Ratification - Article summaries - The end of the war

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Articles_of_Confederation - Cached - SimilarArticles of Confederation - Ben's Guide to US Government for Kids

bensguide.gpo.gov/9-12/documents/articles/index.html - SimilarArticles of Confederation: Primary Documents of American History ...

Includes an article from The Atlantic Monthly that examined the weaknesses of the U.S. government under the Articles of Confederation. ...

www.loc.gov