Authority of Scripture

[five]

Jesus many times quoted scripture against the Devil and the truth kept him free. Scripture is incorruptible. Satan cannot cross the line of a believer who correctly uses the Word of God in faith.

1Pe 1:23 KJV Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever.

Eph 6:10-17 KJV Finally, my brethren, be strong in the Lord, and in the power of his might. (11) Put on the whole armour of God, that ye may be able to stand against the wiles of the devil. (12) For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places. (13) Wherefore take unto you the whole armour of God, that ye may be able to withstand in the evil day, and having done all, to stand. (14) Stand therefore, having your loins girt about with truth, and having on the breastplate of righteousness; (15) And your feet shod with the preparation of the gospel of peace; (16) Above all, taking the shield of faith, wherewith ye shall be able to quench all the fiery darts of the wicked. (17) And take the helmet of salvation, and the sword of the Spirit, which is the word of God:

Edited June 29, 2010 by five

[hayahtowb]

From cover to cover it's all about Christ; Psalms 40.7 is written again in: Hebrews 10.7 'Then said I, Lo, I come in the volume of the book it is written of Me to do Thy will, O God'.

[Guest man]

Scripture is incorruptible

If that were true, the devil would not be able to use it. But he does.

2 Corinthians 11

12 But what I do, I will also continue to do, that I may cut off the opportunity from those who desire an opportunity to be regarded just as we are in the things of which they boast.

13 For such are false apostles, deceitful workers, transforming themselves into apostles of Christ.

14 And no wonder! For Satan himself transforms himself into an angel of light.

15 Therefore it is no great thing if his ministers also transform themselves into ministers of righteousness, whose end will be according to their works.

2 Peter 3

16 as also in all his epistles, speaking in them of these things, in which are some things hard to understand, which untaught and unstable people twist to their own destruction, as they do also the rest of the Scriptures.

[hayahtowb]

So now the thread starts to go somewhere?

Scripture is incorruptible

If that were true, the devil would not be able to use it. But he does.

2 Corinthians 11

12 But what I do, I will also continue to do, that I may cut off the opportunity from those who desire an opportunity to be regarded just as we are in the things of which they boast.

13 For such are false apostles, deceitful workers, transforming themselves into apostles of Christ.

14 And no wonder! For Satan himself transforms himself into an angel of light.

15 Therefore it is no great thing if his ministers also transform themselves into ministers of righteousness, whose end will be according to their works.

2 Peter 3

16 as also in all his epistles, speaking in them of these things, in which are some things hard to understand, which untaught and unstable people twist to their own destruction, as they do also the rest of the Scriptures.

Scriptures and text that are authorative are one thing. However; there are corrupted text but using a play on words - God's word stands. His true word stands and has been perserved and will be perserved. His authority is above all and yes the devil or satan is a whipped puppy.

There are many corrupted text and manuscripts and codex. Manuscripts like the LXX and Hexpla are not to be take as authorative. Codex like the 1010 AD, 1488 and 1844 are corrupted books. Aboved mentioned were not accepted by the early Christians but that is not to say that they were not accepted by some.

I very much like: 2nd Timothy2.15 'Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth.'

Thanks to all.

[Isaiah 6:8]

here we go again! *Sigh*

[Joshua-777]

Hebrews 4:11-13 Let us therefore be diligent to enter that rest, lest anyone fall according to the same example of disobedience. 12 For the word of God is living and powerful, and sharper than any two-edged sword, piercing even to the division of soul and spirit, and of joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart. 13 And there is no creature hidden from His sight, but all things are naked and open to the eyes of Him to whom we must give account.

[Isaiah 6:8]

I think the KJV is just fine as a Bible, but not one that I choose to read. It is also not one that is easy to comprehend for the every day American. This is getting even harder and harder as each generation is losing understanding many even more common words let alone the Thees and Thous.

In my other thread, Which as I even pointed out, that if you believe that the only accurate texts are the ones used to produce the KJV, then I would be happy to have a version of the Bible that used the same texts, but in more modern language, one that the teens in my youth group would be able to read and understand.

A brief history of my Bible and me. I started off with an NIV growing up. As a child and young adult this was easy for me to grasp, and understand the most important basics of Gods word. Later in life I attempted to follow the KJV and I was able to, but with much headaches and trouble figuring out old English terms. I have lately settled into the NKJV I like its ease of reading and its retention of poetic style and flow.

I keep seeing in these posts and others that the NIV leaves out things that the KJV does not. This bugs me, to no end as I have a habit of seeing both sides of any equation or argument. Could it not be argued that since the KJV used newer texts that were copies of older texts, that it perhaps, added to the Bible, to as some people accuse the NIV of? Thereby putting a slant to its meaning? Perhaps that it is in reality that the KJV is the inaccurate one and not the other way around. Maybe I watch way to much CSI, but one thing is this. You form the theory around the facts. You do not twist the facts to fit your theory. Here are the facts I'll let you make your decision. By the way I am not saying that the KJV is inaccurate or not. I have seen one thing though I have seen people seeking HIM decide against it by trying to interpret the old English and give up as the English in the book can be very confusing and God is not the author of confusion.

Fact: All translations, are exactly that. Translations of ancient texts, not the actual texts themselves. If you want to be the most accurate you need to go read those texts in the original language

Fact: These ancient texts are actually copies of ancient texts, as far as I know, there are no original letters left written by Paul. We have no books written by the actual hand of Moses, Isaiah, Or the others. Yes they were copied down word for word intensely and with as much integrity as possible. But copies none the less.

Fact: Humans are not infallible.The sad truth is this. Every copy, and every translation = a human behind it therefore it gets filtered through them no matter how hard they try not to.

Fact: The ancients texts delete and add things. They themselves are different. I have seen in notations things like "This text adds this, this text omits that"

Fact: The KJV is a translation of "newer" ancient texts that are copies of copies of copies. This means by definition the ancient texts that were used were not as accurate as the older ones. Its like a copy of a copy of a key. Each time you copy a door key not from the original one you lose something. Eventually a copy of a copy of a copy of a key will not work anymore.

Fact: Punctuation changes things. Some of the the main differences may simply be in punctuation. Punctuation can change the whole meaning of a paragraph or even a sentence.

Fact: Language changes. Many, many words do not mean the same thing as written as they do now. For instance the word gay. It now means homosexual man. It used to mean happy.

Fact: There are other translations in other languages. Norway has its Norwegian translation, there is a Spanish translation, Gaelic, French, German etc.

Fact: There are people in countries where having any form of the Bible is illegal and as long as they can read it, even one page is food for them in a starving church.

Here is my thoughts as summation. Just because the KJV is an older translation, does not mean it is more accurate. Just because the NIV or the NKJV is a newer translation does not mean it is more, or less accurate. Man is the translator there will be differences. I am not saying at all that we should disregard the KJV as old and unreliable, However I am defending the NIV as most of the arguments against this and other translations ring hollow to me. Like the one stating that since you have to pay for a NIV that its not the word of God. Please, really? I have paid for and seen for sale Authorized Versions. Are we not to pay for the work or material's cost? The Bible does say that the laborer is worthy of his wages. The NIV has a copyright on the book that's very open, but that is paying for the cost of translation etc. The KJV has old words, their meanings are no longer relevant. This changes the meaning of the book to those who do not know the meaning of the words used. Also the omissions or additions are listed in my Bible. So because one translation uses one word from one text, and not the same word from a different text is it any more or less accurate then the text it was translated from?

I am not not anti-KJV I am anti KJV only crowd. This is because I have seen a lack of good fruit. From what I have seen the differences between the translations are minor. If these knock you off your christian walk then you have other bigger issues at hand. I actually have seen the opposite on this one. I have seen more people who are KJV only people lose sight of what is really important, being the cross and salvation and leading souls to the Lord. Like I said, I had one who said that if you did not read the KJV when you came to know the Lord you are not really saved!? Is this profitable? Do you have to learn English if you speak another language and live in another country to be truly saved or have true religion? Of course not but yet this is what has often been put forth.

I feel that you should pick the one that you understand best for daily reading. For when you do major study I use many translations to try to understand what the Lord is really trying to say. I also know that when Jesus quoted scripture to Satin in the wilderness he did not say "The King James Said" or "The New International Version Said" he said "It is written". I will say that none of the modern translations are 100% accurate. We will know all the truth in heaven. Now there are obvious translations that have been messed with and tweaked so they do lead people down the wrong paths. Be wise in what translations you do use. Read it, look to see if its a simple different translation from the text or a direct misleading of the truth. For instance the Mormon Bible has been purposely edited to prove there cult. The direct misleading is obvious when you read through it.

-Isaiah-

[Shiloh62]

amen to that 5

[Joshua-777]

Scripture is incorruptible

If that were true, the devil would not be able to use it. But he does.

2 Corinthians 11

12 But what I do, I will also continue to do, that I may cut off the opportunity from those who desire an opportunity to be regarded just as we are in the things of which they boast.

13 For such are false apostles, deceitful workers, transforming themselves into apostles of Christ.

14 And no wonder! For Satan himself transforms himself into an angel of light.

15 Therefore it is no great thing if his ministers also transform themselves into ministers of righteousness, whose end will be according to their works.

2 Peter 3

16 as also in all his epistles, speaking in them of these things, in which are some things hard to understand, which untaught and unstable people twist to their own destruction, as they do also the rest of the Scriptures.

Scriptures and text that are authorative are one thing. However; there are corrupted text but using a play on words - God's word stands. His true word stands and has been perserved and will be perserved. His authority is above all and yes the devil or satan is a whipped puppy.

There are many corrupted text and manuscripts and codex. Manuscripts like the LXX and Hexpla are not to be take as authorative. Codex like the 1010 AD, 1488 and 1844 are corrupted books. Aboved mentioned were not accepted by the early Christians but that is not to say that they were not accepted by some.

Yes, but when someone's trust is in the power of the Spirit rather than his own opinions on the word, the Spirit is a discerner, The NIV I don't like but I know many who the Lord use it in their lives who are well grounded. The NIV I personally don't like because It was written as a thought for thought, and has many upon many errors I've found, and missing verses. KJV is good but still contains translation errors, for example on the KJV errors,

NKJV

Hebrews 4:7-10 again He designates a certain day, saying in David,

[Joshua-777]

Since the KJV and the NIV say different things and both come from different sources who decides what's truly the Word of God and what isn't?

The Holy and precious Spirit.