Sevenseas Posted January 3, 2013 Group: Royal Member Followers: 3 Topic Count: 30 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 3,373 Content Per Day: 0.76 Reputation: 683 Days Won: 22 Joined: 02/28/2012 Status: Offline Share Posted January 3, 2013 OK. So, are you saying that as long as you have a bible and Holy Spirit, then you need nothing else? You always hear the Spirit, and understand it, and obey instantly? You are so blessed and that's wonderful. But most Christians are not so confident and they need help from others, and if gifted Spirit-inspired people do not help, then the people who are Flesh-inspired certainly will. Most Christians are a battlefield between the Spirit and the Flesh and the battle rages on constantly as the process of Sanctification. And when you are fighting a war of attrition, it is always good to have some reinforcements ride in to help us out. That is the purpose of the church to us: to give us allies who care and in whom we can trust. uh...that's not what I said. Are you getting a little cheeky here? Please don't do that. Just ask questions. I think I know exactly how and what I believe and it is nothing like what you wrote. Um...I tend to like less generalities and more specifics. Thanks...pleased to continue to discuss with you, but let's just stick to what we actually know or ask questions Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest bryanw92 Posted January 3, 2013 Share Posted January 3, 2013 OK. So, are you saying that as long as you have a bible and Holy Spirit, then you need nothing else? You always hear the Spirit, and understand it, and obey instantly? You are so blessed and that's wonderful. But most Christians are not so confident and they need help from others, and if gifted Spirit-inspired people do not help, then the people who are Flesh-inspired certainly will. Most Christians are a battlefield between the Spirit and the Flesh and the battle rages on constantly as the process of Sanctification. And when you are fighting a war of attrition, it is always good to have some reinforcements ride in to help us out. That is the purpose of the church to us: to give us allies who care and in whom we can trust. uh...that's not what I said. Are you getting a little cheeky here? Please don't do that. Just ask questions. I think I know exactly how and what I believe and it is nothing like what you wrote. Um...I tend to like less generalities and more specifics. Thanks...pleased to continue to discuss with you, but let's just stick to what we actually know or ask questions I was not being "cheeky". I was asking a question. Note the question mark. Your post seemed to imply that you do not accept prayers from strangers, or from people you don't know well, or from people you don't consider worthy to pray over you. That's a pretty isolated life for a Christian. You also seemed to imply that any prophecy was "christian fortune telling" which is not Christian at all. That seemed to imply that you believed that the gift of prophecy is a sham. Perhaps you meant something entirely different, but all I had to work with was your words as you wrote them. I was only questioning those words. As far as generalities vs specifics, you seem to imply that, despite my specific descriptions of what a NT prophet is in several posts, you persist in insulting the gift by calling it fortune-telling. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bader Posted January 3, 2013 Group: Members Followers: 0 Topic Count: 0 Topics Per Day: 0 Content Count: 27 Content Per Day: 0.01 Reputation: 3 Days Won: 0 Joined: 12/16/2012 Status: Offline Share Posted January 3, 2013 You are getting warm bryan and you are right there are two distinct functions, one being an office, the fact so many are confused reflects the state of the church.Jesus supplied these for his in bride to be perfected for his wedding, but dont think anyone God will allow him to be cheated and get a madonna,scripture shows god is very jealous of his Son and in this gospel age he is to be glorified and that includes in the wedding, if the guy who was not properly dressed was sent into outer darkness the church better believe jesus and the specially sellected writings that compile the New testament. This is as valid as any measure to base the great apostacy on of the church on as warned about. I liked danielzk's point about israel rejeting god as their king, the church leaders have done in this Era ( error) PUN INVITED, The church in the main has settled for a one size fits all pastorship or ministerhood and rejected what Jesus provided. {{{ Removed attack on Moderators please follow the ToS. }}} there is no wasted space in the parables. We dont live by every word do we? We all have gone astray. (Disclaimer: I'm using male pronouns, but I certainly do mean "he or she" in every case.) The NT prophet should be a lot more low-key than the OT prophet. He doesn't have to walk into church, march up to the front during a service, bang his staff on the ground, and begin with "Thus saith the Lord..." Most of the "prophets" that you see (or read on the internet) believe that they are an OT prophet with plenty of "new" revelations and such. They set themselves apart with their "secret knowledge" and dole it out for maximum shock value. The NT prophet is more like a Guidance Counselor. They observe behavior and trends, compare them to scripture, synthesize possible outcomes using their Gift, and report those outcomes to the people involved. They are a lot more Christlike than their OT counterparts, telling stories to explain and using gentleness to admonish most of the time, but being capable of bluntly pointing out what they know if that is necessary to reach people's hardened hearts. A NT prophet isn't a hermit with a hair shirt either. He has to be deeply involved with people as a brother so those people learn to trust his "intuitions". A good NT prophet rarely gives anyone a prophecy. He just gives his brothers and sisters good advice with scriptural backing. He also shouldn't be bashful about what he knows. A small nudge early might be all that is necessary to correct some behavior, rather than waiting for the problem to become so serious that only a very harsh rebuke will work. Holding your prophecy in, and warning people with statements like "You can't handle what I know." does not serve God's Kingdom at all. In fact, it is counter-productive. A NT prophet doesn't announce to the world that he has the gift of prophecy. It should just be obvious that he has powerful insight to the extent that people will quietly ask him "why are you so wise?" Then, you can explain the NT gift and how he came to believe that he has that gift. The NT gift of prophecy is one of the highest in the heriarchy of gifts, and as Peter Parker (Spiderman) tells us, "With great power comes great responsibility." FRom what i see in the O.T prophets do what they are told to do and one was instructed to marry a prostitute, the worldly wise believer would reject him for that if he didnt like his messge. so all those who know what a prophet is and does, must have been one to know, becaue they are not all the same to make up a predictable programme, some sound like they are making a defence screen before hand to rejct any prophet for an excus to please themslves. The prophet is vindicated by the lord who recruited him and broke him down and rebuilt him. we defy the vinidication at our peril obviously. If someone makes a prophcy to help someone that is th gift not the office and even a good teacher could expound scripture to the point of being thought more highly of.Somone mentioned watchman nee as a pophet on another thread, I can not agree. The obvious check is what what he said came to pass or someone with a git confirms it. The samaritan woman knew jesus wasa great pophet because he told he details of her personal life, she had married set of brothers one after an otherand the exact number, as was the israel tradition and because the lord lead her out there with a bucket in the mid-day heat looking like an idiot, she took a bucket and jesus told he about rivers of living water, she couldn't miss could she, unless she had s presumption? God vinicatd her calling by using Jesus, how many in the city had thought she was a crank? other tell tale may be discerning thoughts and the condition of the heart beware presumption. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sevenseas Posted January 3, 2013 Group: Royal Member Followers: 3 Topic Count: 30 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 3,373 Content Per Day: 0.76 Reputation: 683 Days Won: 22 Joined: 02/28/2012 Status: Offline Share Posted January 3, 2013 OK. So, are you saying that as long as you have a bible and Holy Spirit, then you need nothing else? You always hear the Spirit, and understand it, and obey instantly? You are so blessed and that's wonderful. But most Christians are not so confident and they need help from others, and if gifted Spirit-inspired people do not help, then the people who are Flesh-inspired certainly will. Most Christians are a battlefield between the Spirit and the Flesh and the battle rages on constantly as the process of Sanctification. And when you are fighting a war of attrition, it is always good to have some reinforcements ride in to help us out. That is the purpose of the church to us: to give us allies who care and in whom we can trust. uh...that's not what I said. Are you getting a little cheeky here? Please don't do that. Just ask questions. I think I know exactly how and what I believe and it is nothing like what you wrote. Um...I tend to like less generalities and more specifics. Thanks...pleased to continue to discuss with you, but let's just stick to what we actually know or ask questions I was not being "cheeky". I was asking a question. Note the question mark. Your post seemed to imply that you do not accept prayers from strangers, or from people you don't know well, or from people you don't consider worthy to pray over you. That's a pretty isolated life for a Christian. You also seemed to imply that any prophecy was "christian fortune telling" which is not Christian at all. That seemed to imply that you believed that the gift of prophecy is a sham. Perhaps you meant something entirely different, but all I had to work with was your words as you wrote them. I was only questioning those words. As far as generalities vs specifics, you seem to imply that, despite my specific descriptions of what a NT prophet is in several posts, you persist in insulting the gift by calling it fortune-telling. What's up? Didn't you understand? You are still telling me what I believe and you are still as wrong as could be. I actually stated in my post I agree with what you wrote concerning prophets so how did you form the opinion I call that gift fortune telling? Anyway, this thread is not about me and this type of dialogue never ends well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted January 5, 2013 Share Posted January 5, 2013 What exactly would a new prophecy be that a "NT Prophet" has to give which has not already been given in Scripture? Didn't the New Testament end with the Book of Revelation? That is what NT stands for, isn't it? New Testament? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnD Posted January 5, 2013 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 0 Topic Count: 905 Topics Per Day: 0.19 Content Count: 9,644 Content Per Day: 2.02 Reputation: 5,831 Days Won: 9 Joined: 04/07/2011 Status: Offline Share Posted January 5, 2013 The Bible is its own best commentary. Prophecy is the word of God which sometimes speaks of future... sometimes of the present... sometimes of the past. A prophet is the tool God uses. It's not about the prophet, but about the God who uses the prophet to speak his word... ...even reading from the Bible and teaching / expounding / exposition the prophecy we have right under our very noses. Love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy strength, and with all thy mind; and thy neighbor as thyself Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnD Posted January 5, 2013 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 0 Topic Count: 905 Topics Per Day: 0.19 Content Count: 9,644 Content Per Day: 2.02 Reputation: 5,831 Days Won: 9 Joined: 04/07/2011 Status: Offline Share Posted January 5, 2013 How hard is it to prophesy about America, for example? As hard as reading in the Old Testament what happened to ancient Israel every time they did what America has been doing for 50-75 years. I have read this does not align with the way one or more of you feels... But in the biblical formula for testing all things proving what is true and good, I never saw even once consulting how you or I or anyone else feels... 1 Thessalonians 5:21 (NIV) 21 Test everything. Hold on to the good. 1 John 4:1 (NIV) 1 Dear friends, do not believe every spirit, but test the spirits to see whether they are from God, because many false prophets have gone out into the world. Acts 17:11 (NIV) 11 Now the Bereans were of more noble character than the Thessalonians, for they received the message with great eagerness and examined the Scriptures every day to see if what Paul said was true. 2 Timothy 3:16-17 (NIV) 16 All Scripture is God-breathed and is useful for teaching, rebuking, correcting and training in righteousness, 17 so that the man of God may be thoroughly equipped for every good work. 2 Timothy 2:15 (NIV) 15 Do your best to present yourself to God as one approved, a workman who does not need to be ashamed and who correctly handles the word of truth. 2 Timothy 2:15 (KJV) 15 Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted January 5, 2013 Share Posted January 5, 2013 What exactly would a new prophecy be that a "NT Prophet" has to give A New Testament Prophet Speaks The Word Of God And he saith unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Hereafter ye shall see heaven open, and the angels of God ascending and descending upon the Son of man. John 1:51 Just Like A First Testament Prophet Does And he dreamed, and behold a ladder set up on the earth, and the top of it reached to heaven: and behold the angels of God ascending and descending on it. And, behold, the LORD stood above it, and said, I am the LORD God of Abraham thy father, and the God of Isaac: the land whereon thou liest, to thee will I give it, and to thy seed; And thy seed shall be as the dust of the earth, and thou shalt spread abroad to the west, and to the east, and to the north, and to the south: and in thee and in thy seed shall all the families of the earth be blessed. And, behold, I am with thee, and will keep thee in all places whither thou goest, and will bring thee again into this land; for I will not leave thee, until I have done that which I have spoken to thee of. And Jacob awaked out of his sleep, and he said, Surely the LORD is in this place; and I knew it not. Genesis 28:12-16 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
damo1 Posted January 5, 2013 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 2 Topic Count: 29 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 1,822 Content Per Day: 0.29 Reputation: 19 Days Won: 0 Joined: 05/23/2007 Status: Offline Birthday: 11/16/1967 Share Posted January 5, 2013 I heard a prophet speak at a men"s camp i went to the men that new him looked up to this guy with in a month news got around he ended up getting involved with a married women which lead to marriage brake down what"s worse he lived in a small community everyone knew who he was was well known and respected . This is what i picked up at the men"s camp if he did not have a word for the men who had traveled from all over the place just to attend this men"s camp they got very up set why get up set if a man who says he is gods chosen one and proclaims he is a prophet and when he has nothing to say or speak over your life from what i have observed several well known Australian prophets have dropped like fly"s Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fez Posted January 5, 2013 Group: Royal Member Followers: 3 Topic Count: 683 Topics Per Day: 0.12 Content Count: 11,128 Content Per Day: 2.00 Reputation: 1,352 Days Won: 54 Joined: 02/03/2009 Status: Offline Birthday: 12/07/1952 Share Posted January 5, 2013 What exactly would a new prophecy be that a "NT Prophet" has to give which has not already been given in Scripture? Didn't the New Testament end with the Book of Revelation? That is what NT stands for, isn't it? New Testament? It is basically about being able to go around telling people you are a prophet. A person who is really a prophet, if the office still exists, is going to be obvious. He/she is not going to have to tell anyone they are a prophet, those with discernment will know. The same goes with any of the gifts. That is why it always amuses me when you hear anyone in Pentecostal circles bragging about the gifts they have, or rattling them off like a shopping list. "I have the gift of prophecy!" "I have the gift of tongues!" "I have the gift of interpretation!" How nice for you. Paul doesn't tell us that we should go around wearing little tags that list our spiritual gifts, or shout them out at every service. If you have spiritual gifts, it is going to be obvious, and people will know. You won't have to tell anyone. If you have to brag about which spiritual gifts you have, it says a great deal about you, your motivations, and also implies that you either actually do not have that gift or don't exercise it well, or you would not need to be pimping that gift(s) out. A person may be gifted with something once, say an interpretation, and never be gifted in that way again, simply because the Spirit wishes to prove a point, or because it was needed by the Body, for some reason, at that particular point and someone with that gift was not in attendance. If you have been in a Pentecostal church for 20 years and have spoken in tongues once, does that mean you have the gift of tongues? Not so much. Right! Usually when you have to tell people there is a reason......... I love the example of an Hawaiian pastor I listened to some time back He went to a tent crusade thing and was met at the door by a couple of young men wearing name tags. One of the young men walked up to him stuck his hand out and said "Hi I am prophet John, and you are?". The pastor replied "You're the prophet, you tell me". Worthy is of course different, and it is time and posts that tell. Often a post will be a bit off because of our mood, or reaction on the day, but time usually sorts out who is who here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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