gdemoss Posted January 19, 2013 Group: Royal Member Followers: 8 Topic Count: 59 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 4,402 Content Per Day: 0.99 Reputation: 2,154 Days Won: 28 Joined: 02/10/2012 Status: Offline Birthday: 04/26/1971 Share Posted January 19, 2013 1 Tim 3:2 A bishop then must be blameless, the husband of one wife, temperate, sober-minded, of good behavior, hospitable, able to teach; 1 Tim 3:12 Let deacons be the husbands of one wife, ruling their children and their own houses well. If the qualification to be blameless for a bishop or a deacon is to be the husband of one wife then that is the qualification for every saint to have only one spouse. To wiggle from the principle is not scriptural because there is no scripture that says that one can have two wives and still be blameless on this issue. Each is accountable for their own actions. Your adding to the word of God using human reasoning. You say that if it is what God would have for bishops and deacons then it is what God would have for all. I do not go past what is written. The bible does not say that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sevenseas Posted January 19, 2013 Group: Royal Member Followers: 3 Topic Count: 30 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 3,373 Content Per Day: 0.76 Reputation: 683 Days Won: 22 Joined: 02/28/2012 Status: Offline Share Posted January 19, 2013 David was a man after God's own heart. David was a polygamist. David had what was necessary to satisfy all the righteous requirements of having more than one wife. The only issue God had with David, according to God himself, is the issue with Uriah. Debate the issue all you want. The Word of God stands sure. It is true. Bishops and deacons should be the husband of one wife, not polygamists. A righteous man who is in the congregation of the living will never multiply wives unto himself for the purpose of multiplying wives unto himself. The difficulty we run into is truly understanding and discerning that which is the righteous thing to do in any given situation. I have no issue with a righteous man who is in the congregation of the living having multiple wives or multiple slaves as I am a wife unto Christ of many as well as his slave of many. Light shown in the darkness and the darkness comprehended it not. I speak from experience. I once was blind but now I see and it is getting clearer by the day since the day dawned and the daystar arose in my heart. David was an adulterer and he paid for that sin the rest of his life. David was also a murderer by proxy. God had to send the prophet in order for David to hear God's voice. David's sin separated him from God so that the voice that had once been clear, no longer was. Does God have to continually use a prophet even though that which is written is already made clear to those who have eyes to see and ears to hear? Yes, David was a man after God's heart...apparently though, it was not his heart that was the issue Your personal experience is not the experience of many other other people. At any rate, scripture is the guide, as agreed upon by those who are filled with the Spirit of God. Personal experience is never the measuring rule from which another should take their cue David, is a case in point. I am sure he would be the first to say that if he could. He died cold in his bed even though a young woman had been sent in to 'warm' him...I doubt there was anything sexual in that contact. There is no one in darkness that agrees that God made one man and one woman and did so from the first. The sinful nature of mankind who excuses their sin is what allowed polygamy and slavery and many other ills that have plagued the course of God's creation from A to long awaited Z Do what seems good unto you and serve God as you are led. Reject what I say and believe as you will. The truth remains the truth. sorry...I do not do what seems good to me. That, is not a New Testament concept and this is not the book of Judges. As you say, so it will be, as you say to yourself and not to others. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sevenseas Posted January 19, 2013 Group: Royal Member Followers: 3 Topic Count: 30 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 3,373 Content Per Day: 0.76 Reputation: 683 Days Won: 22 Joined: 02/28/2012 Status: Offline Share Posted January 19, 2013 1 Tim 3:2 A bishop then must be blameless, the husband of one wife, temperate, sober-minded, of good behavior, hospitable, able to teach; 1 Tim 3:12 Let deacons be the husbands of one wife, ruling their children and their own houses well. If the qualification to be blameless for a bishop or a deacon is to be the husband of one wife then that is the qualification for every saint to have only one spouse. To wiggle from the principle is not scriptural because there is no scripture that says that one can have two wives and still be blameless on this issue. Each is accountable for their own actions. Your adding to the word of God using human reasoning. You say that if it is what God would have for bishops and deacons then it is what God would have for all. I do not go past what is written. The bible does not say that. Perhaps, they have a different leading then you do. Just take your own advice and ignore them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sevenseas Posted January 19, 2013 Group: Royal Member Followers: 3 Topic Count: 30 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 3,373 Content Per Day: 0.76 Reputation: 683 Days Won: 22 Joined: 02/28/2012 Status: Offline Share Posted January 19, 2013 Butero, you are right about the prophet, David and his wives...told to him after the Bathsheba incident And why did God say that? He said that because polygamy was accepted and He knew David already had more than one wife as was the custom...Nathan was telling David, in effect, 'yuh know, you could have had anyone you wanted...God would have allowed you to do that...but you took what was not yours. Nathan was pointing out David's sin and the fact that if David had gone to God rather than sin, God would have provided. Let's be outrageous here, who is to say that Bathsheba would not have been made a widow by war anyway as Abigail was made a widow? We can't say that, but what we can say, is that David sinned, the prophet announced God's judgement and the sword never left David after that and it was nothing but heartache and heartbreak. I know what scripture states regarding multiple wives, however, again, as I and several others have tried to get across here, it is not the ideal. It is not what God created. It is, however, what God allowed and it seems it may yet again be allowed by the law of the land..if you follow the case currently before the courts. The point, is, is a man with 4 wives or even just 2, really God's best? I do not believe the Bible indicates that it is. David is a very poor example as he basically destroyed his own family because of his lust and little harem and his son followed suit with a much larger collection. I have a hard time understanding why anyone is anxious to prove that God condones polygamy. It is not something He invented. He also did not invent slavery. Yet, both exist. Does anyone think slavery will come into vogue? Perhaps it may....but who in good conscience would begin that campaign? However, the thought of more than one wife would appeal to many many men. A man who has more than one wife will always have at least one wife who is jealous. For whatever reason. There are several narratives in scripture that illustrate this very point in painful detail How can a man love two wives as he loves himself? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fez Posted January 19, 2013 Group: Royal Member Followers: 3 Topic Count: 683 Topics Per Day: 0.12 Content Count: 11,128 Content Per Day: 2.00 Reputation: 1,352 Days Won: 54 Joined: 02/03/2009 Status: Offline Birthday: 12/07/1952 Share Posted January 19, 2013 Sigh...I'm old, I'm tired, I got one wife who for some miracle loves me. She's also very cute, and I love her lots. God knows what He is doing......... Otherwise I would be a grouchy old pain in the neck, instead of being a married grouchy old pain in the neck..... Sigh.... Not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
enoob57 Posted January 19, 2013 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 35 Topic Count: 100 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 41,154 Content Per Day: 7.98 Reputation: 21,444 Days Won: 76 Joined: 03/13/2010 Status: Offline Birthday: 07/27/1957 Share Posted January 19, 2013 Perhaps one more reasoning in all this is the non-continuace of sex and procreation.... it has been so greatly abused by myself and the world that I am in ... I for one say and though ladies you are by far the greatest of God's creation even so to much value and importance has been placed upon you... Love, Steven Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gdemoss Posted January 19, 2013 Group: Royal Member Followers: 8 Topic Count: 59 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 4,402 Content Per Day: 0.99 Reputation: 2,154 Days Won: 28 Joined: 02/10/2012 Status: Offline Birthday: 04/26/1971 Share Posted January 19, 2013 Going back to Sevenseas question about is there some reason we should consider polygamy, the only reason I am discussing it is because someone asked about it when they started this thread. It is not just a question of whether or not God allows it, but whether or not he condones it? He does because it is written in the law. Kings were not to multiply wives, but that didn't mean they couldn't have more than one. It meant they weren't to do as Solomon did. This is rather easy to prove. Look at what the prophet told David after he sinned in 2 Samuel 12:8. And I gave thee thy master's house, and thy master's wives into thy bosom, and gave thee the house of Israel and of Judah: and if that had been too little, I would moreover have given unto thee such and such things. God actually told David through the prophet he had given him more than one wife, and would have given him more wives if they had not been sufficient, but rebuked him for his adultery and murder. That led to his condition at the time of his death that you described, where he was cold and with one concubine. Excellent insight. +1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
allofgrace Posted January 20, 2013 Group: Advanced Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 0 Topics Per Day: 0 Content Count: 158 Content Per Day: 0.04 Reputation: 26 Days Won: 0 Joined: 10/30/2012 Status: Offline Share Posted January 20, 2013 The ones who care about submitting to the government are those who want to obey the Lord's commands, render to Caesar that which is Caesar is a command just as having one wife or one husband and sexual relations outside of that is sin, so is not yielding to the authority of government. And the government does say it is against the law to have two wives at the same time. As does every church group in America. You may get a few to agree with you on here, but the two will be one cannot be true if there are three, four or more trying to be one and no scripture authorizes more than one wife no matter how you try to wiggle around it. Rom 13:1-7 Let every soul be subject to the governing authorities. For there is no authority except from God, and the authorities that exist are appointed by God. 2 Therefore whoever resists the authority resists the ordinance of God, and those who resist will bring judgment on themselves. 3 For rulers are not a terror to good works, but to evil. Do you want to be unafraid of the authority? Do what is good, and you will have praise from the same. 4 For he is God’s minister to you for good. But if you do evil, be afraid; for he does not bear the sword in vain; for he is God’s minister, an avenger to execute wrath on him who practices evil. 5 Therefore you must be subject, not only because of wrath but also for conscience’ sake. 6 For because of this you also pay taxes, for they are God’s ministers attending continually to this very thing. 7 Render therefore to all their due: taxes to whom taxes are due, customs to whom customs, fear to whom fear, honor to whom honor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ayin jade Posted January 20, 2013 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 44 Topic Count: 6,178 Topics Per Day: 0.88 Content Count: 43,795 Content Per Day: 6.21 Reputation: 11,243 Days Won: 58 Joined: 01/03/2005 Status: Offline Share Posted January 20, 2013 Perhaps the question would be better asked if God allowed it, as He 'allowed' divorce, or, did He say "Oh...good idea....should be entertaining." This had me thinking .... If polygamy was acceptable to Him, then why was marriage to another considered a sin after a divorce? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ayin jade Posted January 20, 2013 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 44 Topic Count: 6,178 Topics Per Day: 0.88 Content Count: 43,795 Content Per Day: 6.21 Reputation: 11,243 Days Won: 58 Joined: 01/03/2005 Status: Offline Share Posted January 20, 2013 The only issue God had with David, according to God himself, is the issue with Uriah. Actually David committed several sins if you read the bible accounts. Not just "the issue with Uriah". The bible says that God explicitly forbade marriage with multiple women by Israelite kings. David was most definitely in sin there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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