Evidence for God

[Guest]

My belief is that the universe, wondrous though it is, is fully natural in all its aspects, including its beginning. I am convinced of this because I have not a scrap of evidence to think otherwise. I may not understand how the universe or life began, but I don’t have any reason to jump to the conclusion that those beginnings must be supernatural.

So What Are The Scraps Of Evidence That Convinced You Creation Came About By Nature

The heavens declare the glory of God; and the firmament sheweth his handywork. Psalms 19:1

And By What Evidence Can You Know That Nature Is Not Supernatural

Thus saith the LORD, thy redeemer, and he that formed thee from the womb, I am the LORD that maketh all things; that stretcheth forth the heavens alone; that spreadeth abroad the earth by myself; Isaiah 44:24

And That The Word Of The God Of Abraham, Isaac And Jacob

By the word of the LORD were the heavens made; and all the host of them by the breath of his mouth. Psalms 33:6

Is Not The Reason For The Beginning

In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. The same was in the beginning with God. All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made. John 1:1-3

And The End Of It All

And I saw a great white throne, and him that sat on it, from whose face the earth and the heaven fled away; and there was found no place for them. Revelation 20:11

Inquiring Minds Want To Know

For I desired mercy, and not sacrifice; and the knowledge of God more than burnt offerings. Hosea 6:6

Is Logic Really What You Worship?

And they said, There is no hope: but we will walk after our own devices, and we will every one do the imagination of his evil heart. Jeremiah 18:12

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Believe

For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life. John 3:16

And Be Blessed Beloved

Love, Joe

[Guest]

Wisdom

Now when Jesus was born in Bethlehem of Judaea in the days of Herod the king, behold, there came wise men from the east to Jerusalem, Saying, Where is he that is born King of the Jews? for we have seen his star in the east, and are come to worship him. Matthew 2:1-2

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Possibly my biggest problem in life is that I respect wisdom. I find virtue in being able to avoid violence, find amiable compromise using super human acts of intellect and diplomacy. The ablility to see a path to peace through a seemingly impenatrable maze of discord. I respect this. All powerful beings capable of eradicating whole civiliations with a single word.... Not so much.

The Problem

There is no fear of God before their eyes. Romans 3:18

The Solution

But God commendeth his love toward us, in that, while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us. Romans 5:8

And The Christ

And I saw a great white throne, and him that sat on it, from whose face the earth and the heaven fled away; and there was found no place for them.

And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works.

And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works.

And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.

And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire. Revelation 20:11-15

The Problem

There is no fear of God before their eyes. Romans 3:18.....

[Believer112]

Having said that many believers might hold the general view that God could make it hail if he wanted to but I am certain most take the view that the vast majority of hail storms are natural events. If someone wanted to take the position that a particular storm was a direct result of God’s activity they would have to hold that view as a matter of faith. There would be absolutely no way to prove God’s involvement.

We may understand, absolutely, that certain things are no longer true (ie. “storehouses” in Heaven), but absolute understanding still eludes us in most things. I agree with you, “real science” does not claim to hold absolute truth.

I think God could make it hail if HE wanted to.

Rev 16 ¹⁷ The seventh angel poured out his bowl into the air, and out of the temple came a loud voice from the throne, saying, “It is done!” ¹⁸ Then there came flashes of lightning, rumblings, peals of thunder and a severe earthquake. No earthquake like it has ever occurred since mankind has been on earth, so tremendous was the quake. ¹⁹ The great city split into three parts, and the cities of the nations collapsed. God remembered Babylon the Great and gave her the cup filled with the wine of the fury of his wrath. ²⁰ Every island fled away and the mountains could not be found. ²¹ From the sky huge hailstones, each weighing about a hundred pounds,^[a] fell on people. And they cursed God on account of the plague of hail, because the plague was so terrible.

[Guest]

Whether Or Not You Will Weather The Storm

Therefore whosoever heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them, I will liken him unto a wise man, which built his house upon a rock: And the rain descended, and the floods came, and the winds blew, and beat upon that house; and it fell not: for it was founded upon a rock.

And every one that heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them not, shall be likened unto a foolish man, which built his house upon the sand: And the rain descended, and the floods came, and the winds blew, and beat upon that house; and it fell: and great was the fall of it. Matthew 7:24-27

Depends On Who

All things are delivered unto me of my Father: and no man knoweth the Son, but the Father; neither knoweth any man the Father, save the Son, and he to whomsoever the Son will reveal him. Matthew 11:27

You Will

For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life. John 3:16

Worship

God is jealous, and the LORD revengeth; the LORD revengeth, and is furious; the LORD will take vengeance on his adversaries, and he reserveth wrath for his enemies.

The LORD is slow to anger, and great in power, and will not at all acquit the wicked: the LORD hath his way in the whirlwind and in the storm, and the clouds are the dust of his feet. He rebuketh the sea, and maketh it dry, and drieth up all the rivers: Bashan languisheth, and Carmel, and the flower of Lebanon languisheth. The mountains quake at him, and the hills melt, and the earth is burned at his presence, yea, the world, and all that dwell therein.

Who can stand before his indignation? and who can abide in the fierceness of his anger? his fury is poured out like fire, and the rocks are thrown down by him.

The LORD is good, a strong hold in the day of trouble; and he knoweth them that trust in him.

But with an overrunning flood he will make an utter end of the place thereof, and darkness shall pursue his enemies. What do ye imagine against the LORD? he will make an utter end: affliction shall not rise up the second time. Nahum 1:2-9

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I am certain most take the view that the vast majority of hail storms are natural events. If someone wanted to take the position that a particular storm was a direct result of God’s activity they would have to hold that view as a matter of faith. There would be absolutely no way to prove God’s involvement....

I think God could make it hail if HE wanted to....

Of course He could. What kind of god would He be if He could not?

From the sky huge hailstones, each weighing about a hundred pounds,^[a] fell on people. And they cursed God on account of the plague of hail, because the plague was so terrible....

Believer, I am a secularist and an atheist. If the writer says 100 pound hailstones fell from the sky I would call the claim hyperbole. Anyone can write anything in a book. It is not evidence. It is a claim you are taking on faith. My skeptical mind thinks it looks nothing like reality. As I mentioned earlier the author of Job took the view that God must have storehouses in Heaven filled with hail and ready to toss down. Surely you don't think God has a storehouse for hail in Heaven just because the Book of Job says He does? The author imagined storehouses in Heaven because he could not conceive of any other source for hail. The Book of Job spells out the way its author perceived nature. He was a man of his time living in what was likely the Bronze Age. Things were not a whole lot better in Paul's time when Ephesians was penned. The author had an important message to convey and he used language designed to capture the imagination. Obviously he captured yours....

So How

I Jesus have sent mine angel to testify unto you these things in the churches. I am the root and the offspring of David, and the bright and morning star. And the Spirit and the bride say, Come. And let him that heareth say, Come. And let him that is athirst come. And whosoever will, let him take the water of life freely. Revelation 22:16-17

Can You Believe

So then faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God. Romans 10:17

When You Are So Proudly Blinded

But if our gospel be hid, it is hid to them that are lost: In whom the god of this world hath blinded the minds of them which believe not, lest the light of the glorious gospel of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine unto them. 2 Corinthians 4:3-4

To The True Author

All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness: That the man of God may be perfect, throughly furnished unto all good works. 2 Timothy 3:16-17

Of Knowledge

The word of the LORD came again unto me, saying, Therefore prophesy and say unto them, Thus saith the Lord GOD; Behold, O my people, I will open your graves, and cause you to come up out of your graves, and bring you into the land of Israel. And ye shall know that I am the LORD, when I have opened your graves, O my people, and brought you up out of your graves, And shall put my spirit in you, and ye shall live, and I shall place you in your own land: then shall ye know that I the LORD have spoken it, and performed it, saith the LORD. Ezekiel 37:12-15

Even If You Should Read It In The News~!

[Believer112]

I am certain most take the view that the vast majority of hail storms are natural events. If someone wanted to take the position that a particular storm was a direct result of God’s activity they would have to hold that view as a matter of faith. There would be absolutely no way to prove God’s involvement.

I think God could make it hail if HE wanted to.

Of course He could. What kind of god would He be if He could not?

From the sky huge hailstones, each weighing about a hundred pounds,^[a] fell on people. And they cursed God on account of the plague of hail, because the plague was so terrible.

Believer, I am a secularist and an atheist. If the writer says 100 pound hailstones fell from the sky I would call the claim hyperbole. Anyone can write anything in a book. It is not evidence. It is a claim you are taking on faith. My skeptical mind thinks it looks nothing like reality. As I mentioned earlier the author of Job took the view that God must have storehouses in Heaven filled with hail and ready to toss down. Surely you don't think God has a storehouse for hail in Heaven just because the Book of Job says He does? The author imagined storehouses in Heaven because he could not conceive of any other source for hail. The Book of Job spells out the way its author perceived nature. He was a man of his time living in what was likely the Bronze Age. Things were not a whole lot better in Paul's time when Ephesians was penned. The author had an important message to convey and he used language designed to capture the imagination. Obviously he captured yours.

Yes, much of what i read has to be taken by Faith. Our fathers and grand fathers must have faced the same argument in regards to the two witnesses in revalation 11.

^{Rev 11 7} When they finish their testimony, the beast that ascends out of the bottomless pit will make war against them, overcome them, and kill them. ⁸ And their dead bodies will lie in the street of the great city which spiritually is called Sodom and Egypt, where also our^[c] Lord was crucified. ⁹Then those from the peoples, tribes, tongues, and nations will see their dead bodies three-and-a-half days, and not allow^[d] their dead bodies to be put into graves. ¹⁰ And those who dwell on the earth will rejoice over them, make merry, and send gifts to one another, because these two prophets tormented those who dwell on the earth.

Back then it would have been abusrd for everyone to see their dead bodies but with todays technology it's possible. Maybe there is some truth to the bible and i hope you come to realize the possibility. May the Lord Jesus Christ bless you.

[bornagain2011]

I think the storehouses he was refering to are clouds. They often called the sky and stars heaven as well.

Well, what about the springs of the deep God was talking about to Job? If the Bible is fake, then how would people back then or even a few hundred years ago know about springs at the bottom of the ocean?

I would like to know what positive things atheism and naturalism as contributed to society. What positive things can an atheist say on his deathbed?

http://www.nairaland.com/746723/famous-atheists-last-words-before

[MorningGlory]

I think the storehouses he was refering to are clouds. They often called the sky and stars heaven as well.

Well, what about the springs of the deep God was talking about to Job? If the Bible is fake, then how would people back then or even a few hundred years ago know about springs at the bottom of the ocean?

I would like to know what positive things atheism and naturalism as contributed to society. What positive things can an atheist say on his deathbed?

http://www.nairaland...st-words-before

They won't be saying much, positive or otherwise, because God will be doing the talking. It's very sad.....