Our Body is our Soul and our Soul is our Body.

[Fran C]

On 9/15/2019 at 6:27 AM, Retrobyter said:

Shalom, HAZARD.

Or, so goes the theological rhetoric! Where does it say "our souls go to Heaven if we are in Christ"?

Regarding the book by Yhudah ("Jude," which in Greek, "Ioudas" would be pronounced "ee-oo-das'"), here's more of the passage:

Jude 11-16 (KJV)

11 Woe unto them! for they have gone in the way of Cain (Greek: Ka-in pronounced "kah'-in"), and ran greedily after the error of Balaam (Greek: Bala-am pronouced "bal-ah-am'") for reward, and perished in the gainsaying of Core (Greek: Kore pronounced "kor-eh'"). 12 These are spots in your feasts of charity, when they feast with you, feeding themselves without fear: clouds they are without water, carried about of winds; trees whose fruit withereth, without fruit, twice dead, plucked up by the roots; 13 Raging waves of the sea, foaming out their own shame; wandering stars, to whom is reserved the blackness of darkness for ever.

14 And Enoch also, the seventh from Adam, prophesied of these, saying,

"Behold, the Lord cometh with ten thousands of his saints, 15 To execute judgment upon all, and to convince all that are ungodly among them of all their ungodly deeds which they have ungodly committed, and of all their hard speeches which ungodly sinners have spoken against him." (A quote from the First Book of Chanokh [Enoch], a Jewish work of the 1st Century A.D.)

16 These are murmurers, complainers, walking after their own lusts; and their mouth speaketh great swelling words, having men's persons in admiration because of advantage.

Of course, both Jude 14-15 and this "First Book of Chanokh" may be alluding to Deuteronomy 33:1-5:

Deuteronomy 33:1-5 (KJV)

1 And this is the blessing, wherewith Moses the man of God blessed the children of Israel before his death. 2 And he said,

"The LORD came from (Mount) Sinai, and rose up from Seir unto them; he shined forth from mount Paran, and he came with ten thousands of saints: from his right hand went a fiery law for them. 3 Yea, he loved the people; all his saints are in thy hand: and they sat down at thy feet; every one shall receive of thy words."

4 Moses commanded us a law, even the inheritance of the congregation of Jacob. 5 And he was king in Jeshurun, when the heads of the people and the tribes of Israel were gathered together.

However, if we accept that this phrase is about a future time (instead of when Mosheh ["Moses"] was leading the children of Israel from Mount Sinai), we're not told when or where He should "pick them up!"

You're suggesting that He shall pick them up from this mythical place called "Heaven" and bring them here to earth with Him. 

I believe that He shall pick them up on the Day of the First Resurrection from wherever they are currently buried, and they shall return to the Land of Israel with Him!

Definitions make a WORLD of difference!

"Soul," in both the Hebrew word "nefesh" or the Greek "psuchee," means "an air-breathing creature."

"Heaven," in both the Hebrew word "shaamayim" or the Greek word "ouranos," means "the sky."

There's another Greek word that Paul used (or the translator of Paul's works used) for things "above the sky," "epouranios." This word was used for the "sun, moon, and stars" in 1 Corinthians 15 above. This word is the adjective form of "ouranos" combined with the word "epi" which means "over, upon, or above." (The Hebrew uses the phrase "shaameey hashaamayim," or the "heavens of the heavens.")

Hi R,

You and @Hazard are having too much fun and I hate to break in.

But I do agree with Hazard.

Here would be two questions for you, which I probably missed since I just got here.

1.  What is the soul?

2.  Do you believe in soul sleep?

I admire your knowledge of Greek and wonder why, if you use outside sources (from the bible), why you're so intent on using ONLY the bible to explain the dichotomy or trichotomy of man.

Just curious,,,you'll find that I don't debate indefinitely.

[Retrobyter]

10 hours ago, Fran C said:

Hi R,

You and @Hazard are having too much fun and I hate to break in.

But I do agree with Hazard.

Here would be two questions for you, which I probably missed since I just got here.

1.  What is the soul?

2.  Do you believe in soul sleep?

I admire your knowledge of Greek and wonder why, if you use outside sources (from the bible), why you're so intent on using ONLY the bible to explain the dichotomy or trichotomy of man.

Just curious,,,you'll find that I don't debate indefinitely.

Shalom, Fran C.

1. The soul is one's "air breather." That's what the Hebrew word means. Does an "immaterial part of man" breathe air? I don't think so. Therefore, the soul CEASES to exist at death. So,...

2. No, I don't believe in "soul sleep"; I believe in "temporary soul annihilation!" This, more than anything, can convince an atheist of our authenticity. We don't "go" anywhere after death; we WAIT in the ground, totally oblivious to the passage of time, for our redemption! When the Lord Yeshua` returns, we are awakened and raised to new life QUITE LITERALLY.

I am totally convinced and believe in the principle of "Sola Scriptura." That is, only the Scriptures have absolute truth. Anything else has error because they are products of fallible men (and women). THEREFORE, if one wants to get to the truth of a topic, one MUST go back to the Scriptures - the Bible. The outside sources are merely to confirm our understanding of what we are reading in the Scriptures, especially as we delve into the modern English versions and compare them to their Greek and Hebrew sources.

That's what I thoroughly believe.

[Fran C]

12 hours ago, Retrobyter said:

Shalom, Fran C.

1. The soul is one's "air breather." That's what the Hebrew word means. Does an "immaterial part of man" breathe air? I don't think so. Therefore, the soul CEASES to exist at death. So,...

2. No, I don't believe in "soul sleep"; I believe in "temporary soul annihilation!" This, more than anything, can convince an atheist of our authenticity. We don't "go" anywhere after death; we WAIT in the ground, totally oblivious to the passage of time, for our redemption! When the Lord Yeshua` returns, we are awakened and raised to new life QUITE LITERALLY.

I am totally convinced and believe in the principle of "Sola Scriptura." That is, only the Scriptures have absolute truth. Anything else has error because they are products of fallible men (and women). THEREFORE, if one wants to get to the truth of a topic, one MUST go back to the Scriptures - the Bible. The outside sources are merely to confirm our understanding of what we are reading in the Scriptures, especially as we delve into the modern English versions and compare them to their Greek and Hebrew sources.

That's what I thoroughly believe.

I also believe that Scripture is our only authority...and that it holds the truth.

I also do not believe in soul sleep.

I used to believe that we went in the ground (sheoul) where we awaited the resurrection of our body and soul.

But what about our Spirit?  What happens to our Spirit?

I will say that it does take some serious study to know exactly what the bible teaches since there are some subjects that are complex and cannot be easily understood.

One example from the O.T. is the idea of the soul and the spirit.  It was spoken of in different way...The soul and spirit were spoken of interchangeably and the spirit was even used to mean the spirit of God.

In the N.T. justification and sanctification are sometimes spoken of interchangeably and this causes some confusion.

So...

Following is an image of how I understand man to be made, or composed of....Body, Soul, Spirit.  This is the trichotomy of man.

Some believe we are Body, Soul/Spirit combined..this is the dichotomy model.

You probably do not accept this, but its roots are biblical...the body, soul and spirit are spoken of in the N.T.

1 Thessalonians 5:23

Now may the God of peace Himself sanctify you entirely; and may your spirit and soul and body be preserved complete, without blame at the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ.

As to soul annihilation....I do believe we go to be immediately where we belong at death...but that would be another thread.

 

 

 

 

 

Edited November 10, 2019 by Fran C

[Retrobyter]

10 hours ago, Fran C said:

I also believe that Scripture is our only authority...and that it holds the truth.

Shalom, Fran C.

I'll make this short because I have to get to bed for work tomorrow.

This much is good.

10 hours ago, Fran C said:

I also do not believe in soul sleep.

I used to believe that we went in the ground (sheoul) where we awaited the resurrection of our body and soul.

But what about our Spirit?  What happens to our Spirit?

Our "spirit," "ruwach" in Hebrew, "pneuma" in Greek, is our "BREATH!" (Technically, our "WIND!") It often refers to our words and consequently to the thoughts we have behind those words. (The Greek word, btw, is the root of our word "pneumatic.") When one "gives up his spirit," he or she is "giving up his last breath." Realistically, our breath simply dissipates into the atmosphere to join God's winds. It is simply the physical energy that is expelled by the dying person. When the person is resurrected and begins to be an air-breather (a "soul") again, he is given his breath (his "spirit") again. 

10 hours ago, Fran C said:

I will say that it does take some serious study to know exactly what the bible teaches since there are some subjects that are complex and cannot be easily understood.

One example from the O.T. is the idea of the soul and the spirit.  It was spoken of in different way...The soul and spirit were spoken of interchangeably and the spirit was even used to mean the spirit of God.

When you look at the Tanakh (the "O.T."), put the words "air-breather" and "breath" (or "wind") in place of the words "soul" and "spirit," and read the passage again. I think you'll be surprised at how easily these words fit in the passage you're reading. It also gives you a much better understanding of what is going on and what the people at that time believed.

10 hours ago, Fran C said:

In the N.T. justification and sanctification are sometimes spoken of interchangeably and this causes some confusion.

Actually, "justification" is "making someone just" or "making someone justified," and "sanctification" is "making someone holy" or "making someone clean." "Holy" is a word that is often MISUNDERSTOOD; which is why some use it improperly in speech. It doesn't mean that one is "righteous" or justified"; it means that one is ceremonially "clean" for God's use. God has specially chosen that person for a particular task. There's nothing special about the person; the "specialness" of that person is in the attention that God gives that person!

10 hours ago, Fran C said:

So...

Following is an image of how I understand man to be made, or composed of....Body, Soul, Spirit.  This is the trichotomy of man.

Sorry, but I can't see your image.

10 hours ago, Fran C said:

Some believe we are Body, Soul/Spirit combined..this is the dichotomy model.

You probably do not accept this, but its roots are biblical...the body, soul and spirit are spoken of in the N.T.

1 Thessalonians 5:23

Now may the God of peace Himself sanctify you entirely; and may your spirit and soul and body be preserved complete, without blame at the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ.

 

Check the Greek of this verse. You will find that the correct definitions of these three words fit fine within this verse and its context.

10 hours ago, Fran C said:

As to soul annihilation....I do believe we go to be immediately where we belong at death...but that would be another thread.

I agree.

[Fran C]

On 11/11/2019 at 5:31 AM, Retrobyter said:

Shalom, Fran C.

I'll make this short because I have to get to bed for work tomorrow.

This much is good.

Our "spirit," "ruwach" in Hebrew, "pneuma" in Greek, is our "BREATH!" (Technically, our "WIND!") It often refers to our words and consequently to the thoughts we have behind those words. (The Greek word, btw, is the root of our word "pneumatic.") When one "gives up his spirit," he or she is "giving up his last breath." Realistically, our breath simply dissipates into the atmosphere to join God's winds. It is simply the physical energy that is expelled by the dying person. When the person is resurrected and begins to be an air-breather (a "soul") again, he is given his breath (his "spirit") again. 

When you look at the Tanakh (the "O.T."), put the words "air-breather" and "breath" (or "wind") in place of the words "soul" and "spirit," and read the passage again. I think you'll be surprised at how easily these words fit in the passage you're reading. It also gives you a much better understanding of what is going on and what the people at that time believed.

Actually, "justification" is "making someone just" or "making someone justified," and "sanctification" is "making someone holy" or "making someone clean." "Holy" is a word that is often MISUNDERSTOOD; which is why some use it improperly in speech. It doesn't mean that one is "righteous" or justified"; it means that one is ceremonially "clean" for God's use. God has specially chosen that person for a particular task. There's nothing special about the person; the "specialness" of that person is in the attention that God gives that person!

Sorry, but I can't see your image.

Check the Greek of this verse. You will find that the correct definitions of these three words fit fine within this verse and its context.

I agree.

You must have seen the image elsewhere.  I'll try to post it again.

I agree with all you've said;  good on justification and sanctification.  To be honest, it's rather frustrating at times when Christians don't understand, or believe, this simple difference between the two concepts, or get them mixed up or think they're the same.

Also, yes, in the O.T. we could understand soul/spirit to be our inner "breath"...but don't you believe in progressive revelation?  This breath idea does not work as well in the N.T.  Here I see GOD as having this quality.   God Father is A spirit.  God Son is the Word of God and God Spirit is the "breath" of God.

Hope you could see the image.

It shows:

BODY  This is our physical self...anything pertaining to the body we have.

SOUL  Our soul is what makes each one of us be unique and be "us".  It is comprised of our mind, will and emotions.  It is not tangible.

SPIRIT  This is the part of us that connects to God...it is our "God part".

Also, I won't pursue this forever....I don't like discussing stuff ad infinitum...but would like your understanding re the image.  (I understand how you feel about soul and spirit)

[enoob57]

As the inner man died (spirit) one can see the only connection we had left was sensual (body)
and that directly tied to the world that we gave control of to satan...

Eph 3:16

16 That he would grant you, according to the riches of his glory, to be strengthened with might by his Spirit in the inner man;
KJV
 

[Retrobyter]

On 11/13/2019 at 4:30 AM, Fran C said:

You must have seen the image elsewhere.  I'll try to post it again.

I agree with all you've said;  good on justification and sanctification.  To be honest, it's rather frustrating at times when Christians don't understand, or believe, this simple difference between the two concepts, or get them mixed up or think they're the same.

Also, yes, in the O.T. we could understand soul/spirit to be our inner "breath"...but don't you believe in progressive revelation?  This breath idea does not work as well in the N.T.  Here I see GOD as having this quality.   God Father is A spirit.  God Son is the Word of God and God Spirit is the "breath" of God.

Hope you could see the image.

It shows:

BODY  This is our physical self...anything pertaining to the body we have.

SOUL  Our soul is what makes each one of us be unique and be "us".  It is comprised of our mind, will and emotions.  It is not tangible.

SPIRIT  This is the part of us that connects to God...it is our "God part".

Also, I won't pursue this forever....I don't like discussing stuff ad infinitum...but would like your understanding re the image.  (I understand how you feel about soul and spirit)

Shalom, Fran C.

I can see that having similar language can lead to what SOUNDS like agreement, but without common definitions, we really have some disagreement. (It's a little like trying to talk with a Mormon; common usage of terms can SOUND like agreement, but subtle differences in the definitions of the words being used by both will actually reveal how far apart the discussion truly is.)

In looking at the diagram, I disagree with the dividing of the body and the soul at all. The "will, mind, and emotions," which comprise your circle labeled "Soul," are ramifications and  complex relationships within your brain. God has made our brains very intricately; we have self-awareness and a perspective that allows us to project our thoughts and feelings to others for empathy and sympathy. Because of the complex connections within our brains, we can learn indefinitely as our sleep cycles arrange our thoughts and knowledge into a readily accessible hierarchy into which we can hang other pieces of information, often triggered by some of our senses, like smell. A particular smell, for instance, can trigger a memory you thought was long buried.

Your "Spirit" circle doesn't exist at all because the "Spirit Realm" doesn't exist, either. That's a totally fabricated notion based upon the poor interpretations of the words "ruwach" and "pneuma."

Our "God part" is our entire self. The way that we are designed bleeds into our thoughts and recognitions of our Creator's ability, just as it did with David:

Psalm 139:14 (KJV)

14 I will praise thee; for I am fearfully and wonderfully made: marvellous are thy works; and that my soul (air-breather) knoweth right well.

Our "spirit," our "breath" is within us while we are still breathing. When we exhale our last time, our "spirit" is gone, not to be reclaimed until the Resurrection. It goes back to the Creator of all as a part of the rest of His Creation. When He re-creates us within the Resurrection, He will once again breathe life into our new bodies, and we will be air-breathers again; better, we'll be air-BLASTERS, able to give life to other bodies, just as He can. I believe that's what Paul was implying in 1 Corinthians 15:

1 Corinthians 15:42-49 (KJV)

42 So also is the resurrection of the dead.

It is sown in corruption;
it is raised in incorruption: 

43 It is sown in dishonour;
it is raised in glory (literal brightness):

it is sown in weakness;
it is raised in power: 

44 It is sown a natural (Greek: psuchikon = air-breathing) body;
it is raised a spiritual (Greek: pneumatikon = air-blasting) body.

There is a natural body, and there is a spiritual body. 45And so it is written,

"The first man Adam was made a living soul"; (Gen. 2:7)
the last Adam was made a quickening spirit (Greek: pneuma zoo-opoioun = "a life-giving blaster"). 

46 Howbeit that was not first which is spiritual, but that which is natural; and afterward that which is spiritual. 

47 The first man is of the earth, earthy:
the second man is the Lord from heaven (Greek ek tou ouranou = "from/out of-the sky"). 

48 As is the earthy, such are they also that are earthy:
and as is the heavenly (Greek: epouranios = "the-One-from-above-the-sky"), such are they also that are heavenly (Greek: epouranioi = "those-from-above-the-sky"). 

49 And as we have borne the image of the earthy,
we shall also bear the image of the heavenly (Greek: epouraniou = "of-the-above-the-sky").

I can't say this for sure, but it's a thought: Since the word "aggelos" (commonly transliterated as "angel") means "messenger," and was even used of John the Baptist in Mark 1:2, ...

Mark 1:1-4 (KJV)

1 The beginning of the gospel of Jesus Christ, the Son of God;

2 As it is written in the prophets,

Behold, I send my messenger before thy face, which shall prepare thy way before thee.
3 The voice of one crying in the wilderness, Prepare ye the way of the Lord, make his paths straight.

4 John did baptize in the wilderness, and preach the baptism of repentance for the remission of sins.

... it's possible that WE might be the "messengers" - the "angels" - that are sent out into all the world to resurrect the rest! Think about it; we might be resurrected by those who were responsible for our "salvation" (justification), and we are the instruments to resurrect those whom we led to the Lord! I don't know if that's true or not, but it's ... a fun possibility to imagine, isn't it?

[Fran C]

On 11/15/2019 at 4:51 AM, Retrobyter said:

Shalom, Fran C.

I can see that having similar language can lead to what SOUNDS like agreement, but without common definitions, we really have some disagreement. (It's a little like trying to talk with a Mormon; common usage of terms can SOUND like agreement, but subtle differences in the definitions of the words being used by both will actually reveal how far apart the discussion truly is.)

In looking at the diagram, I disagree with the dividing of the body and the soul at all. The "will, mind, and emotions," which comprise your circle labeled "Soul," are ramifications and  complex relationships within your brain. God has made our brains very intricately; we have self-awareness and a perspective that allows us to project our thoughts and feelings to others for empathy and sympathy. Because of the complex connections within our brains, we can learn indefinitely as our sleep cycles arrange our thoughts and knowledge into a readily accessible hierarchy into which we can hang other pieces of information, often triggered by some of our senses, like smell. A particular smell, for instance, can trigger a memory you thought was long buried.

Your "Spirit" circle doesn't exist at all because the "Spirit Realm" doesn't exist, either. That's a totally fabricated notion based upon the poor interpretations of the words "ruwach" and "pneuma."

Our "God part" is our entire self. The way that we are designed bleeds into our thoughts and recognitions of our Creator's ability, just as it did with David:

Psalm 139:14 (KJV)

14 I will praise thee; for I am fearfully and wonderfully made: marvellous are thy works; and that my soul (air-breather) knoweth right well.

Our "spirit," our "breath" is within us while we are still breathing. When we exhale our last time, our "spirit" is gone, not to be reclaimed until the Resurrection. It goes back to the Creator of all as a part of the rest of His Creation. When He re-creates us within the Resurrection, He will once again breathe life into our new bodies, and we will be air-breathers again; better, we'll be air-BLASTERS, able to give life to other bodies, just as He can. I believe that's what Paul was implying in 1 Corinthians 15:

1 Corinthians 15:42-49 (KJV)

42 So also is the resurrection of the dead.

It is sown in corruption;
it is raised in incorruption: 

43 It is sown in dishonour;
it is raised in glory (literal brightness):

it is sown in weakness;
it is raised in power: 

44 It is sown a natural (Greek: psuchikon = air-breathing) body;
it is raised a spiritual (Greek: pneumatikon = air-blasting) body.

There is a natural body, and there is a spiritual body. 45And so it is written,

"The first man Adam was made a living soul"; (Gen. 2:7)
the last Adam was made a quickening spirit (Greek: pneuma zoo-opoioun = "a life-giving blaster"). 

46 Howbeit that was not first which is spiritual, but that which is natural; and afterward that which is spiritual. 

47 The first man is of the earth, earthy:
the second man is the Lord from heaven (Greek ek tou ouranou = "from/out of-the sky"). 

48 As is the earthy, such are they also that are earthy:
and as is the heavenly (Greek: epouranios = "the-One-from-above-the-sky"), such are they also that are heavenly (Greek: epouranioi = "those-from-above-the-sky"). 

49 And as we have borne the image of the earthy,
we shall also bear the image of the heavenly (Greek: epouraniou = "of-the-above-the-sky").

I can't say this for sure, but it's a thought: Since the word "aggelos" (commonly transliterated as "angel") means "messenger," and was even used of John the Baptist in Mark 1:2, ...

Mark 1:1-4 (KJV)

1 The beginning of the gospel of Jesus Christ, the Son of God;

2 As it is written in the prophets,

Behold, I send my messenger before thy face, which shall prepare thy way before thee.
3 The voice of one crying in the wilderness, Prepare ye the way of the Lord, make his paths straight.

4 John did baptize in the wilderness, and preach the baptism of repentance for the remission of sins.

... it's possible that WE might be the "messengers" - the "angels" - that are sent out into all the world to resurrect the rest! Think about it; we might be resurrected by those who were responsible for our "salvation" (justification), and we are the instruments to resurrect those whom we led to the Lord! I don't know if that's true or not, but it's ... a fun possibility to imagine, isn't it?

Interesting that you should mention about how we should have the same language.  Another member here also believes this is very important and dreams of having a Christian Dictionary! @JLB

As to the rest, I fear this will be my last post because I can see that you understand the function of many using ONLY the biblical verses available, but this has been explained very well theologically by putting together all of the ideas of the O.T. and the N.T. and arriving at an explanation of the make-up of man.

This is from a book that was used for study regarding the above.  The highlighted is directly from the book:

 

Understanding the Trichotomy (or dichotomy) of man helps us to understand our human nature and what it means to be saturated with the Word of God.

1. God's written or spoken Word may be taken in through your soul functions: i.e., mind, will and emotions -- by hearing, reading, studying or memorizing.

[the Word of God affects our mind, our emotions and our will, which make up the soul]

2. The ultimate purpose is to feed your spirit which was created in God's own image and longs to have that image of God fulfilled.
However, at this point, there are two interesting factors to consider:

A. Even if the Word of God, written or spoken, is rejected, it still has an effect on the soul and spirit.
Hebrews 4:12

B. When the Word of God, written or spoken, is accepted, it not only affects the spirit, but also helps to bring the soul function into meaning and balance.

God's Word not only enters from the external into the internal, but also Christ Himself, the Incarnate Living Word, living in the heart of every born-again Christian, finds expression and fulfillment as He lives His life through the spirit, the soul, and the body of every believer.
 

[as we can see, the Spirit of the person affects the soul, which is comprised of mind, emotions, will.]

source: Dynamics of Discipling
Arts Publications.

 

[Retrobyter]

1 hour ago, Fran C said:

Interesting that you should mention about how we should have the same language.  Another member here also believes this is very important and dreams of having a Christian Dictionary! @JLB

Shabbat shalom, Fran C.

That IS interesting! Perhaps, that would be a good way to solidify what we are saying to one another. However, WHO decides the "correct" definitions of the terms within that "Christian Dictionary?"

This is going to be somewhat complicated, but I'll try it anyway:

I've learned that there are TWO different ways to show a definition for a word. There's the more complicated ...
1. UNION principle, which is showing EVERY way that a word can be used in common speech by every person in the world who speaks that language, ...

and there's the far less complicated ...

2. INTERSECTION principle, which shows what that word means in common to EVERY person in the world who speaks that language.

I'll try to use a diagram to make this more simple:

Here's a basic Venn diagram showing the Universal Set (U) and two intersecting sets, circles A and B. Their intersection is the area seen as C. The union is all three sections, A, B, and C. The intersection is C only.

Now, imagine a set (circles A, B, D, E, F, .....) for EVERY person who speaks that language. Assuming that the context of this word is the same for each individual (although it's NOT), then every person's circle should have some "C" intersection where they have a commonality of that word's usage within that context.

Context adds another "wrinkle" to the situation. See, in a living language, words typically in one context, may be BORROWED by individuals into a different context for a SIMILAR meaning within that context. One might even borrow a word from another language and "Anglicize" the word or use that word directly for a particular context. 

Take for instance, the word "file": In the typical UNION principle, the definitions are...
 

Quote

 

file1 | fīl | 

noun 
a folder or box for holding loose papers that are typically arranged in a particular order for easy reference: a file of correspondence. 

• the contents of a file folder or box. 

• Computing a collection of data, programs, etc., stored in a computer's memory or on a storage device under a single identifying name: do you want to save this file? | [as modifier] :  a file name. 

verb [with object] 

place (a document) in a cabinet, box, or folder in a particular order for preservation and easy reference: the contract, when signed, is filed | figurative :  he still had the moment filed away in his memory. 

• submit (a legal document, application, or charge) to be placed on record by the appropriate authority: criminal charges were filed against the firm | [no object] :  the company had filed for bankruptcy. 

• (of a reporter) send (a story) to a newspaper or news organization. 

PHRASES 

on file 

in a file or filing system. 

DERIVATIVES 

filer | ˈfīlər | noun 

ORIGIN 

late Middle English (as a verb meaning ‘string documents on a thread or wire to keep them in order’): from French filer ‘to string’, fil ‘a thread’, both from Latin filum ‘a thread’. Compare with file2.

 

Quote

 

file2 | fīl | 

noun 

a line of people or things one behind another: Plains Cree warriors riding in file down the slopes. 

• Military a small detachment of troops: a file of English soldiers had ridden out from Perth. 

• Chess each of the eight rows of eight squares on a chessboard running away from the player toward the opponent. Compare with rank1 (sense 2 of the noun) .

verb [no object, with adverbial of direction] 

(of a group of people) walk one behind the other, typically in an orderly and solemn manner: the mourners filed into the church. 

ORIGIN 

late 16th century: from French file, from filer ‘to string’.

 

Quote

 

file3 | fīl | 

noun 

a tool with a roughened surface or surfaces, typically of steel, used for smoothing or shaping a hard material: it is possible to make the necessary notch with a file. 

verb [with object] 

smooth or shape (something) with a file: when I have nothing else to do, I file my nails. 

• (file something away/off) remove something by grinding it off with a file: the engine numbers were filed away. 

DERIVATIVES 

filer | ˈfīlər | noun 

ORIGIN 

Old English fīl, of West Germanic origin; related to Dutch vijl and German Feile.

 

One can see from this set of definitions how complicated this can be!

Because certain words and usages of words come from other languages in other cultures and at other times in history, we also add TIME to this mix! 

Perhaps, one can lessen the complication: one might be able to group the definitions of certain individuals into a single definition for a particular denomination, and perhaps, each definition should have sections for each denomination(??? )

I've chosen the INTERSECTION principle and the BEST way to intersect is to go the origins of those words, their ETYMOLOGY!

For instance, in the etymologies of the first two definitions, the word that stands out as a synonym is "string." Associated words would be "line," "list," and "queue." If you'll go through the first two definitions, replace the word "file" with "string" (or its past tense):

a string of correspondence
do you want to save this string [of data]?
the contract, when signed, is strung [with other contracts]?
he still had the moment strung away [with other moments] in his memory
criminal charges were strung against the firm
the company had strung [a case] for bankruptcy [with the courts]
on [a] string
on a string or a stringing system

For the second definition, let's substitute the word "line" instead:

Cree warriors riding in [a] line down the slopes
a line of English soldiers had ridden out from Perth
the mourners lined into the church

Finally, what the Greek and Hebrew words may lack in etymology, they gain in FAMILIES of words.  The commonalities between words within a family of Hebrew words, for instance, can explain the basic meaning of the root word for that family!

1 hour ago, Fran C said:

As to the rest, I fear this will be my last post because I can see that you understand the function of many using ONLY the biblical verses available, but this has been explained very well theologically by putting together all of the ideas of the O.T. and the N.T. and arriving at an explanation of the make-up of man.

This is from a book that was used for study regarding the above.  The highlighted is directly from the book:

 

Understanding the Trichotomy (or dichotomy) of man helps us to understand our human nature and what it means to be saturated with the Word of God.

1. God's written or spoken Word may be taken in through your soul functions: i.e., mind, will and emotions -- by hearing, reading, studying or memorizing.

[the Word of God affects our mind, our emotions and our will, which make up the soul]

2. The ultimate purpose is to feed your spirit which was created in God's own image and longs to have that image of God fulfilled.
However, at this point, there are two interesting factors to consider:

A. Even if the Word of God, written or spoken, is rejected, it still has an effect on the soul and spirit.
Hebrews 4:12

B. When the Word of God, written or spoken, is accepted, it not only affects the spirit, but also helps to bring the soul function into meaning and balance.

God's Word not only enters from the external into the internal, but also Christ Himself, the Incarnate Living Word, living in the heart of every born-again Christian, finds expression and fulfillment as He lives His life through the spirit, the soul, and the body of every believer.
 

[as we can see, the Spirit of the person affects the soul, which is comprised of mind, emotions, will.]

source: Dynamics of Discipling
Arts Publications.

 

No, my methodology may be different, but I'm putting together all of the CONTEXTS for those words in all of the verses of both the Tanakh (the O.T.) and the B'rit Chadashah (the N.T.), and coming up with the common meaning for those words in both Hebrew and Greek.

[JLB]

9 hours ago, Retrobyter said:

That IS interesting! Perhaps, that would be a good way to solidify what we are saying to one another. However, WHO decides the "correct" definitions of the terms within that "Christian Dictionary?"

 

The Bible defines many of the important words in the Bible by context.

 

Probably one of the most misused and most misunderstood words in the Bible is the word faith. 

 

Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen. Hebrews 11:1

 

Two more very important scriptures about faith -

 

But without faith it is impossible to please Him, for he who comes to God must believe that He is, and that He is a rewarder of those who diligently seek Him. Hebrews 11:6

 

• But without faith it is impossible to please Him

 

again

 

But he who doubts is condemned if he eats, because he does not eat from faith; for whatever is not from faith is sin. Romans 14:23

 

• for whatever is not from faith is sin.

 

The lexicons and Hebrew/Greek dictionary’s are a good place to start, however when the Bible defines for us the meaning of a word we need to keep that meaning as a foundation, and the man made meaning from the lexicons as a secondary meaning if it doesn’t violate the definition the scripture gives. 

 

Then, just as important, the scripture also defines the principle by which faith operates to produce the intended divine result, as well.

 

Once people begin to understand this word, and the “law” or principle by which faith functions or operates to produce the intended divine result, it will bring some clarity and unity to some of the major doctrinal divisions that reside within the body of Christ.

 

 

 

JLB