Isaiah 6:8 Posted December 5, 2013 Group: Royal Member Followers: 2 Topic Count: 426 Topics Per Day: 0.07 Content Count: 3,633 Content Per Day: 0.58 Reputation: 222 Days Won: 13 Joined: 03/23/2007 Status: Offline Birthday: 08/26/1978 Author Share Posted December 5, 2013 The question cannot be understood outside of how this scripture in picture relates to us concerning Christ in us, and the process of this truth. Gen 21:10 Wherefore she said unto Abraham, Cast out this bondwoman and her son: for the son of this bondwoman shall not be heir with my son, even with Isaac. Paul goes a little ways into this in his letter to the Galatians. ummm...I don't think so. Brother will betray brother kind of rings a bell...I'm not saying I necessairly disagree with you, but I think there is often a practical understanding to the 'spiritual' truths... we still flesh and blood after all Interesting question BTW thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sevenseas Posted December 5, 2013 Group: Royal Member Followers: 3 Topic Count: 30 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 3,373 Content Per Day: 0.76 Reputation: 683 Days Won: 22 Joined: 02/28/2012 Status: Offline Share Posted December 5, 2013 Sure! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
x141 Posted December 5, 2013 Group: Members Followers: 2 Topic Count: 2 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 42 Content Per Day: 0.01 Reputation: 10 Days Won: 0 Joined: 11/12/2013 Status: Offline Birthday: 12/05/1959 Share Posted December 5, 2013 The question cannot be understood outside of how this scripture in picture relates to us concerning Christ in us, and the process of this truth. Gen 21:10 Wherefore she said unto Abraham, Cast out this bondwoman and her son: for the son of this bondwoman shall not be heir with my son, even with Isaac. Paul goes a little ways into this in his letter to the Galatians. ummm...I don't think so. Brother will betray brother kind of rings a bell...I'm not saying I necessairly disagree with you, but I think there is often a practical understanding to the 'spiritual' truths... we still flesh and blood after all Interesting question BTW Joseph was a picture of Christ as a seed (and all the things surrounding it which I won't go into), as it is this seed in us as an earthen vessel that this treasure is hid, but the story depicts the same truth from Genesis to the cross, that we don't labor by thought to become, but it is the liberty of one born in his Father's house, and to which we are partakers of through faith (to know where we come from, or where we are going, so is everyone born of the spirit/God). This mentality (seen in Sarah that through a bondwoman she would bring about the promise of God) which is a product of the seed/thought of a serpent, is what hung truth on a tree, and becomes the image (Flesh/Egypt) one must overcome by the Word of God and the testimony of Jesus Christ as something we have, and to which everyone bows their knee to. The Bible is one cohesive narrative. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Isaiah-smiles Posted December 5, 2013 Group: Members Followers: 1 Topic Count: 4 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 84 Content Per Day: 0.01 Reputation: 0 Days Won: 0 Joined: 04/06/2006 Status: Offline Birthday: 11/21/1959 Share Posted December 5, 2013 God's plan or man's wicked acts?? God's Providence/Sovereignty or man's responsibility for his own wicked acts??.....BOTH!!! (Genesis 45) 4 Joseph said to his brothers, "Come near to me, please." They came near. "He said, I am Joseph, your brother, whom you sold into Egypt. 5 Now don't be grieved, nor angry with yourselves, that you sold me here, for God sent me before you to preserve life. 6 For these two years the famine has been in the land, and there are yet five years, in which there will be neither plowing nor harvest. 7 God sent me before you to preserve for you a remnant in the earth, and to save you alive by a great deliverance. 8 So now it wasn't you who sent me here, but God, and he has made me a father to Pharaoh, lord of all his house, and ruler over all the land of Egypt. 9 Hurry, and go up to my father, and tell him, 'This is what your son Joseph says, "God has made me lord of all Egypt. Come down to me. Don't wait. (Acts 2) 22 "Men of Israel, hear these words! Jesus of Nazareth, a man approved by God to you by mighty works and wonders and signs which God did by him in the midst of you, even as you yourselves know, 23 him, being delivered up by the determined counsel and foreknowledge of God, you have taken by the hand of lawless men, crucified and killed; Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sevenseas Posted December 6, 2013 Group: Royal Member Followers: 3 Topic Count: 30 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 3,373 Content Per Day: 0.76 Reputation: 683 Days Won: 22 Joined: 02/28/2012 Status: Offline Share Posted December 6, 2013 The question cannot be understood outside of how this scripture in picture relates to us concerning Christ in us, and the process of this truth. Gen 21:10 Wherefore she said unto Abraham, Cast out this bondwoman and her son: for the son of this bondwoman shall not be heir with my son, even with Isaac. Paul goes a little ways into this in his letter to the Galatians. ummm...I don't think so. Brother will betray brother kind of rings a bell...I'm not saying I necessairly disagree with you, but I think there is often a practical understanding to the 'spiritual' truths... we still flesh and blood after all Interesting question BTW Joseph was a picture of Christ as a seed (and all the things surrounding it which I won't go into), as it is this seed in us as an earthen vessel that this treasure is hid, but the story depicts the same truth from Genesis to the cross, that we don't labor by thought to become, but it is the liberty of one born in his Father's house, and to which we are partakers of through faith (to know where we come from, or where we are going, so is everyone born of the spirit/God). This mentality (seen in Sarah that through a bondwoman she would bring about the promise of God) which is a product of the seed/thought of a serpent, is what hung truth on a tree, and becomes the image (Flesh/Egypt) one must overcome by the Word of God and the testimony of Jesus Christ as something we have, and to which everyone bows their knee to. The Bible is one cohesive narrative. I don't think you understood me...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dak Posted December 6, 2013 Group: Advanced Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 27 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 493 Content Per Day: 0.10 Reputation: 53 Days Won: 1 Joined: 05/14/2010 Status: Offline Share Posted December 6, 2013 I was reading the other day in Genesis and noticed that Joseph was sold to the Ishmaelites, and/or the Midianites and controversy aside of which of them it was, they both trace back to Abraham. Ishmael and the Midianites trace back to Abraham's son Midian, who was born to him to his wife Keturah after Sarah died. Knowing there is little without meaning in the Bible, I was wondering what the significance to Joseph being sold to close family, if any... Any thoughts? Perhaps the answer is as simple as this: Because we know that Joseph should have been brought to Egypt, so that the family of Israel could be saved from the famine later on, could it be that God had entrusted this delicate and necessary task to family members only? Perhaps, because of free will, God had not "trusted" other peoples this task? At least the Ishmaelites or the Midianites came from Abraham himself. Perhaps God could exercise some control over them? Who knows might have happened to Joseph then if he was sold to people other than his relatives? Perhaps he would have been killed, or perhaps he would not have been brought to Egypt at all, and so history would be very different from what it is today. Or, could it be that the Ishmaelites/Midianites had only been in the right place and at the right time and going in the right direction? And that them being distant relatives of Joseph had nothing to do with it? The Bible says: ESV > Genesis:37:25 Then they [Joseph's brothers] sat down to eat. And looking up they saw a caravan of Ishmaelites coming from Gilead, with their camels bearing gum, balm, and myrrh, on their way to carry it down to Egypt.37:26 Then Judah said to his brothers, "What profit is it if we kill our brother and conceal his blood?37:27 Come, let us sell him to the Ishmaelites, and let not our hand be upon him, for he is our brother, our own flesh." And his brothers listened to him.Note: Emphasis is mine. ~ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted December 6, 2013 Share Posted December 6, 2013 I was reading the other day in Genesis and noticed that Joseph was sold to the Ishmaelites, and/or the Midianites and controversy aside of which of them it was, they both trace back to Abraham. Ishmael and the Midianites trace back to Abraham's son Midian, who was born to him to his wife Keturah after Sarah died. Knowing there is little without meaning in the Bible, I was wondering what the significance to Joseph being sold to close family, if any... Any thoughts? Beloved, A Few Now these are the generations of Ishmael, Abraham's son, whom Hagar the Egyptian, Sarah's handmaid, bare unto Abraham: And these are the names of the sons of Ishmael, by their names, according to their generations: the firstborn of Ishmael, Nebajoth; and Kedar, and Adbeel, and Mibsam, And Mishma, and Dumah, and Massa, Hadar, and Tema, Jetur, Naphish, and Kedemah: These are the sons of Ishmael, and these are their names, by their towns, and by their castles; twelve princes according to their nations. And these are the years of the life of Ishmael, an hundred and thirty and seven years: and he gave up the ghost and died; and was gathered unto his people. And they dwelt from Havilah unto Shur, that is before Egypt, as thou goest toward Assyria: and he died in the presence of all his brethren. Genesis 2512-18 Thoughts In that day shall there be a highway out of Egypt to Assyria, and the Assyrian shall come into Egypt, and the Egyptian into Assyria, and the Egyptians shall serve with the Assyrians. In that day shall Israel be the third with Egypt and with Assyria, even a blessing in the midst of the land: Whom the LORD of hosts shall bless, saying, Blessed be Egypt my people, and Assyria the work of my hands, and Israel mine inheritance. Isaiah 19:23-25 ~ As Joseph Blessed The Precious Peoples Of Hagar So Shall The LORD Of Hosts (Jesus) Bless The Peoples Of Hagar As I See It Is God Gracious Or What~! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
x141 Posted December 6, 2013 Group: Members Followers: 2 Topic Count: 2 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 42 Content Per Day: 0.01 Reputation: 10 Days Won: 0 Joined: 11/12/2013 Status: Offline Birthday: 12/05/1959 Share Posted December 6, 2013 (edited) The question cannot be understood outside of how this scripture in picture relates to us concerning Christ in us, and the process of this truth. Gen 21:10 Wherefore she said unto Abraham, Cast out this bondwoman and her son: for the son of this bondwoman shall not be heir with my son, even with Isaac. Paul goes a little ways into this in his letter to the Galatians. ummm...I don't think so. Brother will betray brother kind of rings a bell...I'm not saying I necessairly disagree with you, but I think there is often a practical understanding to the 'spiritual' truths... we still flesh and blood after all Interesting question BTW Joseph was a picture of Christ as a seed (and all the things surrounding it which I won't go into), as it is this seed in us as an earthen vessel that this treasure is hid, but the story depicts the same truth from Genesis to the cross, that we don't labor by thought to become, but it is the liberty of one born in his Father's house, and to which we are partakers of through faith (to know where we come from, or where we are going, so is everyone born of the spirit/God). This mentality (seen in Sarah that through a bondwoman she would bring about the promise of God) which is a product of the seed/thought of a serpent, is what hung truth on a tree, and becomes the image (Flesh/Egypt) one must overcome by the Word of God and the testimony of Jesus Christ as something we have, and to which everyone bows their knee to. The Bible is one cohesive narrative. I don't think you understood me...... As far as his brothers betraying him/us ? (this is included in my (all things surrounding him, as to not go into any detail so the post does not become to long) this is the scripture about Joesph having the preeminence, being separated from his brethren which as Dak and FresnoJoe showed the same truth concerning the purpose of God as Joseph himself also stated as being of the order of God. Edited December 6, 2013 by x141 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dak Posted December 6, 2013 Group: Advanced Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 27 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 493 Content Per Day: 0.10 Reputation: 53 Days Won: 1 Joined: 05/14/2010 Status: Offline Share Posted December 6, 2013 Hey, x141, you got my username wrong. That's not my real name (it's just a phrase from my native language), so don't make a capital P to stand for a nonexistent middle initial. Dakilang P. Asa indeed. Yuck! As someone has recently suggested, just call me Dak ~ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Isaiah 6:8 Posted December 6, 2013 Group: Royal Member Followers: 2 Topic Count: 426 Topics Per Day: 0.07 Content Count: 3,633 Content Per Day: 0.58 Reputation: 222 Days Won: 13 Joined: 03/23/2007 Status: Offline Birthday: 08/26/1978 Author Share Posted December 6, 2013 By the way I do understand the big picture and how many of the events in Joseph's life were foreshadows of Christ, and the work he did, as some of you have pointed out. However I am interested in this one point, why did the Bible mention that it was Ishmaelite / Mindianite Traders by name, not just that some random traders, coming by. It mentions there nationality, instead of just saying they were spice merchants. So I am more of the specific meaning to this, not the broad meaning of Joseph's life. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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