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*Zion*

A little freaked out

167 posts in this topic

I just came upon a site trying to attack a man of God because he preaches Lordship Salvation:

 

 

 

LORDSHIP SALVATION is the false doctrine that a sinner MUST be willing to stop living a sinful lifestyle or to give up the sinful world to be saved.  In sharp contrast, the Bible, God's Word, teaches that a sinner's faith in Christ alone is sufficient for salvation.  Salvation is receiving, not giving.  Eternal life is a gift.

 

 

 

I could post the site link but I don't know if it'll do any good.  If people want it then I will.  Clearly this person hsa not read through the four gospels enough.  What do people expect the gospel to be???  Except:  Repent!  For the Kingdom of God is at hand!  If that isn't God declaring His Lordship and demanding we submit to it in order to be saved, then what else is it?  Why would we not accept that the Lord is God if we truly believe in Him?

 

I'm concerned because there are people out there who believe some other gospel and hold the true one as false.  How many, I don't know, but I suspect a significant amount.  I did feel bad for the man of God and his reputation, but I soon felt wrse for those upholding this lie and the judgement they will come under.  That is what freaks me out.  Am I on my own here???????

 

 

 

Ephesians 2:8-9

For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:

Not of works, lest any man should boast.

 

 

Not faith alone, but grace through faith! 

 

 

Acts 20:24

But none of these things move me, neither count I my life dear unto myself, so that I might finish my course with joy, and the ministry, which I have received of the Lord Jesus, to testify the gospel of the grace of God.
 
 
Grace from the LORD Jesus!
 
 
 
 
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You don't think God saves us unless we stop sinning first?

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I do not think that unregenerate man, the unsaved, has a chance at not sinning, so no one is saved becuase they stopped sinning. On the other hand . . .

8For by grace you have been saved through faith; and that not of yourselves, it is the gift of God; 9not as a result of works, so that no one may boast. 10For we are His workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand so that we would walk in them.

That passage seems like we are saved and then do the works that please God. 1 Cor 10:13 sounds almost as though for those who have been indwelt by the spirit, the saved, it might be possible to resist temptation:

13No temptation has overtaken you but such as is common to man; and God is faithful, who will not allow you to be tempted beyond what you are able, but with the temptation will provide the way of escape also, so that you will be able to endure it.

Just thoughts.

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No no, unless there is repentance first.  God gives us grace through faith to save us from sin, not so that we could continue in sin.  It is an ongoing work, and culminates in spiritual perfection.

 

Do you believe that there is no need for repentance?

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Romans 10: says we must believe with the Heart that God hath raised Him from the dead and confess with our mouth Him, Lord.

the problem with Lordship salvation is one gets the cart in front of the horse. and preach that there is something we can do to get saved or there is things we have to do to keep ourselves saved. if either were possible then Jesus would not had to die, there would had been another way. When God said when I see the travail of His soul, I shall be satisfied. What else is there for man to do to add to that satisfaction , but believe/faith. My righteousness at It's best is filthy rags, I must take on His righteousness, unless my righteousness exceeds the righteousness of the scribes, I must take on His righteousness. It is His works That I depend on, not that of myself least I boast. You can't work a good work for anything unless you are attached to the true vine. Romans 12 :1 says we need to present our bodies a living sacrifice Holy and acceptable, for this is our reasonable service, that is addressed to the Brethren, because we are to do these works because we are saved not to get saved. A reasonable service for what God did for us. not  to get saved. With Lordship salvation, one has to depend on what they can do. their faith is in their works and not in Christ alone. He is the foundation and corner stone of our faith. as the ones that were not allowed in, and they cried look at the works WE DID in your name! Many will be deceived. if we are saved they will know us by our fruits. If we are saved we will bear the fruit of the Spirit that dwells in us. that is why some thought they were saved but had not ministered to those sick, those in prison, those that were naked or hungered.  those that had done those things had done them For Christ and not for themselves. If I receive any Glory for my works, I will lay that glory at His Feet one day, for it is him that All glory is due. 

 

1 John 2:1-2

2 My little children, these things write I unto you, that ye sin not. And if any man sin, we have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous:

2 And he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world.

KJV

Lordship salvation makes salvation something we have earned. and not that of a Gift of God.

Rom 6:19-23

19 I speak after the manner of men because of the infirmity of your flesh: for as ye have yielded your members servants to uncleanness and to iniquity unto iniquity; even so now yield your members servants to righteousness unto holiness.

20 For when ye were the servants of sin, ye were free from righteousness.

21 What fruit had ye then in those things whereof ye are now ashamed? for the end of those things is death.

22 But now being made free from sin, and become servants to God, ye have your fruit unto holiness, and the end everlasting life.

23 For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.

KJV

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You don't think God saves us unless we stop sinning first?

 

That's like telling someone they have to get cleaned up before taking a bath. :)

 

The miracle of God's salvation is that "While we were yet sinners, Christ died for us."

 

Sure, we confess that we are sinners, but we acknowledge we cannot save ourselves. As for repenting of sins, there are many sins we commit that we are not even aware of (i.e. attitude sins).

 

"If salvation cold be granted through the Law [our ability to stop sinning], then Christ died for nothing."

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I agree with Zion in that there has to be a change in the person's life.  Faith without works is dead.  True salvation will bring about a change in lifestyle.  It is not that you stop sinning an then accept Jesus.  You accept Jesus, and then quit living a lifestyle of willful sin.  I can't really say what I think about a web-site or ministry I haven't looked into, so this is just a general observation based on what has been posted in the OP.

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No no, unless there is repentance first.  God gives us grace through faith to save us from sin, not so that we could continue in sin.  It is an ongoing work, and culminates in spiritual perfection.

 

Do you believe that there is no need for repentance?

2 Cor 13:5-9

5 Examine yourselves, whether ye be in the faith; prove your own selves. Know ye not your own selves, how that Jesus Christ is in you, except ye be reprobates?

6 But I trust that ye shall know that we are not reprobates.

7 Now I pray to God that ye do no evil; not that we should appear approved, but that ye should do that which is honest, though we be as reprobates.

8 For we can do nothing against the truth, but for the truth.

9 For we are glad, when we are weak, and ye are strong: and this also we wish, even your perfection.

KJV

Paul said for that what I should do, I do not. and that what I should not do. that I do. Let me share a story. right after I got married, I saw an elderly friend of the family, that I hadn't saw in awhile. he said that he had heard that I got Married and wanted to know if I had any kids yet. I said Lord< I can't afford any kids. His response was. Let me tell you this, young man, If you wait until you can afford to have kids, to have kids. You will never have any kids. so let me tell you this to all the Lordship salvation people, if you wait until you are righteous enough to call upon the name of the Lord, then you will never be able to call upon the name of the Lord. If by repenting first, you make yourself presentable to the Lord, Then it is no Longer Grace that you are saved by, and you are in no need of Mercy. For you have made yourself ready for salvation, again let me say this with all the love of Christ I can, if we are saved by Grace, but that grace is dependent upon what we do, then your faith is not in Christ and Him crucified, but faith is in US! and what we can do. very scary doctrine of Grace, if I earn my Grace then it is no more unmerited Love, for I have earned it. to believe that salvation can be earned by repenting is the same to believe that one can buy or earn the Gift of God.

Acts 8:20

20 But Peter said unto him, Thy money perish with thee, because thou hast thought that the gift of God may be purchased with money.

KJV

Scriptures says to "WORK OUT' your salvation. not "WORK FOR" V. McGee says that lordship salvation spells salvation different than Faith alone salvation. they spell it "DO" Christ left us something to do, we spell it "DONE" He done it all!

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The crux of it is that if we are to deny the Lordship of God Most High, what are we doing claiming to be His followers, as Christians are supposed to be?   This is what must be settled once and for all.

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We grow in grace while accepting ALL of God's grace to us in that, as Nebula already expressed, Christ died for us while we were still sinners.

 

The Bible is clear that one who is truly born again will not continue to live a deliberate lifestyle of sin as they did before they believed.

 

Sometimes people argue over semantics as though salvation depended on just the right combination of words.

 

That being said, no once stops sinning in order to be saved and being saved does not mean you automatically stop sinning.  The Holy Spirit deals with each of us and we are not all off an assembly line.

 

I've never heard of 'Lordship Salvation' and to be honest, I am almost exhausted with reading and hearing about new terms and phrases that cannot be found in scripture.

 

While the work of the Holy Spirit is profound and even above all we understand, the gospel itself is very simple as Christ declared salvation complete in Him when He declared

"It is finished" at the time He surrendered His life into God's hands.

 

I would say we all surrender our lives in much the same way as we do not know and cannot see the road before us that God will place our feet upon as we give our lives to Him.

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