Does God know what He will be doing a trillion years from now?

[TruthFirst]

 

 

 you must be one of the few on this board

We have many members who don't believe in predestination, as well as many who do. From what I can see, it's a pretty even distribution of both.

 

Maybe it's the non predestination crowd that is silent. 

[TruthFirst]

Blessings Truth

     Twisted logic? Actually,I use no logic at all nor common sense,nor rationality..................the God I serve is beyond anything I can comprehend,He is able to do ALL things & that would include be anywhere,be everywhere in any time,,,,He is without limits or constraint......just my opinion.......Glory to God!!

                                                                                                                                                          With love-in Christ,Kwik

No logic? no common sense? No rationality? That's scary. All faculties given by God. How do you manage to interpret the Bible?

[kwikphilly]

Blessed Truth

     I don't,the Holy Spirit does..........................Praise & Glory to God      A long time ago I found out that knowledge gets in the way of Wisdom!

                                                                                                                            With love-in Christ,Kwik

[TruthFirst]

 

God doesn't ever change his mind.  He just says things in a way thought scripture where we can understand.  Let me give you an example.  God didn't change is mind about destroying Ninevah.  He knew the people there would repent.  He would have destroyed them had they not repented, but he already knew they would believe Jonah.  It appears God repented of the evil he was going to do, but since he knew how the people of Ninevah would react before hand, it wasn't really that God changed his mind.

 

He just says things in a way thought scripture where we can understand ?????? You want to elaborate on that.

 

He would have destroyed them had they not repented. Not at all, this is not an option because you believe God already knew.There are no options when God knows everything in advance, in terms of moral choices.

It appears God repented of the evil... I will assume this is a slip of the tongue. God cannot create, engender, do, force, etc. EVIL. Everything God does is according to His character which is loving and good. James 3:11 Doth a fountain send forth at the same place sweet water and bitter? God judges sin, He does not do evil.

 

The decision of the Ninevites was impossible to know until Jonah actually came to them to announce judgement. It is at that point that the fear of God gripped them and they chose to repent. God then truly changed His mind on His judgement when He saw their repentant hearts. This is the only true scenario of free will.

[TruthFirst]

Blessed Truth

     I don't,the Holy Spirit does..........................Praise & Glory to God      A long time ago I found out that knowledge gets in the way of Wisdom!

                                                                                                                            With love-in Christ,Kwik

 

Touché! I expected that response.

But you would be hard pressed to convince me that you don't use any of your intellectual faculties. Their is a reason you were given them.

Anyway let's not get off on this tangent.

[TruthFirst]

there is no time in heaven so the question really doesn't have a valid answer.

.

 

Not time in human terms that is for sure, but some kind of progression in God's terms. HE says He WAS (Past), IS (Present) and IS TO COME (Future). Call that God's PPF. Mind you none of it makes any difference to Him. He doesn't grow older or wiser.

[TruthFirst]

Before I go any further, let me make it clear that I have never been a follower of John Calvin, or ever been part of a church that was influenced by Calvin.  Every church I have ever been part of taught Wesleyan doctrine.  I have read some of Calvin's teachings, and have a lot of problems with it.  I came to my own conclusions on pre-destination through personal study of scripture.  For example, Peter had no choice but to deny Christ three times.  Jesus wasn't 99.9 percent sure of anything.  He was 100 percent sure what would happen.  Judas Iscariot was created to be the betrayer.  There was no chance he would be saved.  God wasn't 99.9 percent sure what he would do.  He was 100 percent sure.  The Apostle John wasn't going to die a martyr, as many of the disciples did, but on the isle of Patmos after writing Revelation.  God wasn't 99.9 percent sure of this.  He was 100 percent sure.

 

You truly believe that God created Judas to go to hell. Your God is a tyrant. I am grieved you would think God would do such a thing.

[Mcgyver]

Interesting...it's been quite a while since I've seen an Inherent Omniscience vs. Total Omniscience debate...and of course predestination vs. "free will" (for lack of a better term) must come into play.

 

If we really want to "think outside the box", perhaps the interplay between the sovereignty of God and the free will of man is what needs to be discussed?

[Mcgyver]

 

Before I go any further, let me make it clear that I have never been a follower of John Calvin, or ever been part of a church that was influenced by Calvin.  Every church I have ever been part of taught Wesleyan doctrine.  I have read some of Calvin's teachings, and have a lot of problems with it.  I came to my own conclusions on pre-destination through personal study of scripture.  For example, Peter had no choice but to deny Christ three times.  Jesus wasn't 99.9 percent sure of anything.  He was 100 percent sure what would happen.  Judas Iscariot was created to be the betrayer.  There was no chance he would be saved.  God wasn't 99.9 percent sure what he would do.  He was 100 percent sure.  The Apostle John wasn't going to die a martyr, as many of the disciples did, but on the isle of Patmos after writing Revelation.  God wasn't 99.9 percent sure of this.  He was 100 percent sure.

 

You truly believe that God created Judas to go to hell. Your God is a tyrant. I am grieved you would think God would do such a thing.

 

 

John 17:11-12 Now I am no longer in the world, but these are in the world, and I come to You. Holy Father, keep through Your name those whom You have given Me, that they may be one as We are. While I was with them in the world, I kept them in Your name. Those whom You gave Me I have kept; and none of them is lost except the son of perdition, that the Scripture might be fulfilled. (NKJV)

 

How do you read this?

 

Personally I see this as a great stumbling block in the Inherent Omniscience point of view, in that:

 

1) One of the twelve was certain to be doomed in order that scripture would be fulfilled. (Ps 41:9, Zech.11:12, et.al)

 

2) That this plan was put into place from the time that man fell in the garden (Gen 3:15)

 

3) That God Himself ordained that Messiah would be betrayed and given over to the executioner

 

4) That the cross was necessary and unavoidable in order to complete His redemptive plan for mankind. (Ps 22, Isaiah 53, et.al)

 

5) And all this from the "foundation of the world" (1 Peter 1:19-22)

 

How then is God a tyrant, when "The son of perdition" as Jesus put it was chosen to fulfill God's perfect plan?

[Izzel]

 

 

 

 you must be one of the few on this board

We have many members who don't believe in predestination, as well as many who do. From what I can see, it's a pretty even distribution of both.

 

Maybe it's the non predestination crowd that is silent. 

 

Isaiah 46:9-10

King James Version (KJV)

9 Remember the former things of old: for I am God, and there is none else; I am God, and there is none like me,

10 Declaring the end from the beginning, and from ancient times the things that are not yet done, saying, My counsel shall stand, and I will do all my pleasure: