Donibm Posted May 2, 2014 Group: Removed from Forums for Breaking Terms of Service Followers: 0 Topic Count: 14 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 246 Content Per Day: 0.07 Reputation: 44 Days Won: 0 Joined: 01/11/2014 Status: Offline Birthday: 06/09/1974 Share Posted May 2, 2014 MOSES / ELIJAH: Most people think that it's these two, because of the nature of the miracles that are worked, and because of the visitation on the mount when Jesus was transfigured. MOSES / ENOCH: Some believe Moses is definate, not only due to the nature of the miracles, but also because of the mystery of Satan arguing over the dead body of Moses. Like, why would Satan even care about a lifeless corpse? They add Enoch because he was raptured, and didn't experience death. NOTE: the key with Enoch is that he was "seventh from Adam". Raptured. As if this is a sign from God that at around the 7,000th (7 days) year of mankind is when the Rapture would occur. There are other passages, and maybe I'll create a thread on it one day. ELIJAH / ENOCH: Some believe this is the combination because neither Elijah nor Enoch tasted death. Both were raptured, and Heaven is not made up of flesh and blood. However, Scriptures also say that we are to be changed, and Elijah was clearly changed and reappeared with Moses when Jesus was transfigured. So, those are the theories. But, I have my own ... which most have not been told or considered themselves. First, I want you to know that I'm not so big on "tradition." Church traditions are often times, wrong. Furtunately, they do not effect Salvation. So, I don't promote tradition just because mommy and daddy believed it, or pastor so-n-so taught it. Keep in mind, Scriptures do not say who the two witnesses are, your Chruch tradition tries to suggest who they are. But, I know that none of these men worked miracles. Not a one of them. It is GOD who works miracles through His people. It is all Gods power. So, why would Moses be sent back into flesh just to die all over again? That doesn't make sense to me. Same for Elijah and Enoch. Is God so short of servants that he needs to send whom he already used? And why are they both from the Old Covenant instead of the New Covenant (ie - Peter or Paul)? Is this because the Dispensation of Grace is over? And so what? The Dispensation of the Law was long over before it. So neither apply. My point is, it could be anyone. It could be the old prophets, or an apostle of the New Covenant, or anyone else. Again, since the power is of God, God can use whomever He will. Right, or wrong? Since the true Church is raptured, maybe God does send two souls back (since there will no longer be any real saints on earth post the Rapture). Again, there are just my thoughts. Not asking any of you to adopt them. And for me, they are just thoughts, not doctrine. It could be Moses and me for all I know, lol. doesn't really matter. I'm just no pigeon-holed by a "tradition" that has been passed down and it ultimately the "only" option due to it being taught over and over again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
missmuffet Posted May 2, 2014 Group: Royal Member Followers: 34 Topic Count: 1,990 Topics Per Day: 0.48 Content Count: 48,688 Content Per Day: 11.83 Reputation: 30,343 Days Won: 226 Joined: 01/11/2013 Status: Offline Share Posted May 2, 2014 My guess is Elijah/Enoch because they did not experience death.If God took them to heaven without experiencing death it seems like it would have been for a purpose. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Willa Posted May 2, 2014 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 68 Topic Count: 185 Topics Per Day: 0.04 Content Count: 14,224 Content Per Day: 3.33 Reputation: 16,647 Days Won: 30 Joined: 08/14/2012 Status: Offline Share Posted May 2, 2014 Jesus did say that Elijah would come back. He said that John the Baptist was an Elijah, but that he would come again. Matt. 11:14. So he should be included among the suspects. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Butch5 Posted May 3, 2014 Group: Senior Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 0 Topics Per Day: 0 Content Count: 559 Content Per Day: 0.14 Reputation: 136 Days Won: 2 Joined: 09/09/2013 Status: Offline Birthday: 03/01/1962 Share Posted May 3, 2014 MOSES / ELIJAH: Most people think that it's these two, because of the nature of the miracles that are worked, and because of the visitation on the mount when Jesus was transfigured. MOSES / ENOCH: Some believe Moses is definate, not only due to the nature of the miracles, but also because of the mystery of Satan arguing over the dead body of Moses. Like, why would Satan even care about a lifeless corpse? They add Enoch because he was raptured, and didn't experience death. NOTE: the key with Enoch is that he was "seventh from Adam". Raptured. As if this is a sign from God that at around the 7,000th (7 days) year of mankind is when the Rapture would occur. There are other passages, and maybe I'll create a thread on it one day. ELIJAH / ENOCH: Some believe this is the combination because neither Elijah nor Enoch tasted death. Both were raptured, and Heaven is not made up of flesh and blood. However, Scriptures also say that we are to be changed, and Elijah was clearly changed and reappeared with Moses when Jesus was transfigured. So, those are the theories. But, I have my own ... which most have not been told or considered themselves. First, I want you to know that I'm not so big on "tradition." Church traditions are often times, wrong. Furtunately, they do not effect Salvation. So, I don't promote tradition just because mommy and daddy believed it, or pastor so-n-so taught it. Keep in mind, Scriptures do not say who the two witnesses are, your Chruch tradition tries to suggest who they are. But, I know that none of these men worked miracles. Not a one of them. It is GOD who works miracles through His people. It is all Gods power. So, why would Moses be sent back into flesh just to die all over again? That doesn't make sense to me. Same for Elijah and Enoch. Is God so short of servants that he needs to send whom he already used? And why are they both from the Old Covenant instead of the New Covenant (ie - Peter or Paul)? Is this because the Dispensation of Grace is over? And so what? The Dispensation of the Law was long over before it. So neither apply. My point is, it could be anyone. It could be the old prophets, or an apostle of the New Covenant, or anyone else. Again, since the power is of God, God can use whomever He will. Right, or wrong? Since the true Church is raptured, maybe God does send two souls back (since there will no longer be any real saints on earth post the Rapture). Again, there are just my thoughts. Not asking any of you to adopt them. And for me, they are just thoughts, not doctrine. It could be Moses and me for all I know, lol. doesn't really matter. I'm just no pigeon-holed by a "tradition" that has been passed down and it ultimately the "only" option due to it being taught over and over again. Here is how the Old Testament ends. 5 Behold, I will send you Elijah the prophet before the coming of the great and dreadful day of the LORD: 6 And he shall turn the heart of the fathers to the children, and the heart of the children to their fathers, lest I come and smite the earth with a curse. (Mal 4:5-6 KJV) I believe the other witness will be the apostle John. 9 And I went unto the angel, and said unto him, Give me the little book. And he said unto me, Take it, and eat it up; and it shall make thy belly bitter, but it shall be in thy mouth sweet as honey. 10 And I took the little book out of the angel's hand, and ate it up; and it was in my mouth sweet as honey: and as soon as I had eaten it, my belly was bitter. 11 And he said unto me, Thou must prophesy again before many peoples, and nations, and tongues, and kings. (Rev 10:9-11 KJV) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Enoch2021 Posted May 4, 2014 Group: Royal Member Followers: 11 Topic Count: 19 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 3,396 Content Per Day: 0.90 Reputation: 730 Days Won: 4 Joined: 12/21/2013 Status: Offline Birthday: 12/26/1963 Share Posted May 4, 2014 ============================================================================= I'm thinking the OT ended with John The Baptist..... (Matthew 11:13) " For all the prophets and the law prophesied until John." (Matthew 11:11) " Verily I say unto you, Among them that are born of women there hath not risen a greater than John the Baptist: notwithstanding he that is least in the kingdom of heaven is greater than he." I believe the other witness will be the apostle John. I've heard this before but this is the issue. John was Literally Transported in Time to The Day of the Lord. All The Things he wrote speaking to... (Revelation 1:19) " Write the things which thou hast seen, and the things which are, and the things which shall be hereafter;" (Revelation 4:1) "After this I looked, and, behold, a door was opened in heaven: and the first voice which I heard was as it were of a trumpet talking with me; which said, Come up hither, and I will shew thee things which must be hereafter." John is viewing and "Witnessing" everything. He also "witnesses" the Two Witnesses? How can he be a Witness to and of Himself? As it has been said, they are not identified and its pretty much speculation. I feel the miracles are the "witness" but nothing to be dogmatic about. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted May 4, 2014 Share Posted May 4, 2014 Actually, my bigger question is: "Why is this under apologetics?" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1x1is1 Posted May 7, 2014 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 8 Topic Count: 2 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 1,146 Content Per Day: 0.27 Reputation: 732 Days Won: 1 Joined: 10/30/2012 Status: Offline Birthday: 04/10/1950 Share Posted May 7, 2014 I think it is a waist of time to wonder who the anti-christ will be. But it is fascinating to ponder on the two witnesses. I wonder if, we will elbow each other in the ribs (and say, I told you so) when we learn their identities once the rapture happens and we are with the Lord? My personal vote is for Moses and Elijah. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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