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JohnD

Understanding Hebrew Roots means...

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Yes, but not the kind of distinction you are trying to make.  You are trying to make "spriitual Jew" refer to a believing Gentile and the Bible doesn't make that kind of distinction.

 

 

That is why your teachings are so deceptive.  The most successful and pernicious deceptions are the ones that use the Bible.   Paul is telling ethnic Jews that their true Jewishness inwardly and not found in their ethnicity, Torah observance or ceremonies.

 

The TRUE Jew is not a Gentile believer.  The TRUE Jew is the Jew who let's his life become a praise to the Lord. 

 

 

Well said. I agree.

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Shiloh357

 

Not the Jewish people per se, but it comes of them in the sense that they are vehicle through which God is bringing salvation to the world in the Person of the Jewish Messiah, Jesus. 

 

No God is not and this smacks of universalism, God ONLY brings salvation to the Israelites, the entire purpose of Jesus dying on the cross was to redeem Israel ONLY and NOT the whole world. The fact you state the Jewish people as a "vehicle" of this salvation, makes the Jews a corporate saviour of the world in other words a corporate messiah, which is false teaching and completely foreign to the bible.

 

No where in the Bible does God make any other covenants even with the new covenant of Jesus with any other race of people but only with Israel, they alone are promised eternal life, resurrection and the inheritance of a heavenly kingdom here on earth.

 

Paul is telling ethnic Jews that their true Jewishness inwardly and not found in their ethnicity, Torah observance or ceremonies

 

This needs to be further cleared and is in reference to the debate around the circumcision, Paul was arguing with the fact that the "gentiles" who by the way where actually the dispersed gentile Israelites (Big difference between ETHNO and HELLEN) and not a debate about the Hellenistic non - Israelite gentiles..as there is much confusion with the word gentile being used. Those Greek speaking dispersed Israelites lost there traditions, religion and so forth, the ones who wanted to come back to the fold where uncircumcised and the debate was for them not to be considered "gentile" they would need to be circumcised, however Paul was reminding them this OLD Covenant was now done away with and they no longer need to be circumcised.

 

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Shiloh357

 

Not the Jewish people per se, but it comes of them in the sense that they are vehicle through which God is bringing salvation to the world in the Person of the Jewish Messiah, Jesus. 

 

No God is not and this smacks of universalism, God ONLY brings salvation to the Israelites, the entire purpose of Jesus dying on the cross was to redeem Israel ONLY and NOT the whole world. The fact you state the Jewish people as a "vehicle" of this salvation, makes the Jews a corporate saviour of the world in other words a corporate messiah, which is false teaching and completely foreign to the bible.

 

No where in the Bible does God make any other covenants even with the new covenant of Jesus with any other race of people but only with Israel, they alone are promised eternal life, resurrection and the inheritance of a heavenly kingdom here on earth.

You are misreading what I said.  I said nothing about universalism.   The Jews were the means God used to bring Jesus into the world and thus make salvation available to all.  How is that "universalism?"  Universalism is the notion that all people will be saved and I never said that.

 

I didn't say that Jews are corporate Messiah.  I am saying that they were God's vehicle or "means" by which He brought Jesus into the world.  You need slow down and read instead of making these silly accusations. 

 

Paul is telling ethnic Jews that their true Jewishness inwardly and not found in their ethnicity, Torah observance or ceremonies

 

This needs to be further cleared and is in reference to the debate around the circumcision, Paul was arguing with the fact that the "gentiles" who by the way where actually the dispersed gentile Israelites (Big difference between ETHNO and HELLEN) and not a debate about the Hellenistic non - Israelite gentiles..as there is much confusion with the word gentile being used. Those Greek speaking dispersed Israelites lost there traditions, religion and so forth, the ones who wanted to come back to the fold where uncircumcised and the debate was for them not to be considered "gentile" they would need to be circumcised, however Paul was reminding them this OLD Covenant was now done away with and they no longer need to be circumcised.

 

That is complete nonsense.

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shiloh357

Interesting....I read carefully what you said, you just didn't like my answer.

 

I am saying that they were God's vehicle or "means" by which He brought Jesus into the world.

 

Nope that's not true. The sole reason for Jesus coming into the world was to ONLY redeem Israel. Which I'll show in a bit.

 

Have a look here and this is where the challenge is with your statement

Hebrews 8:8-10: "Behold, the days come, saith the LORD, when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah: Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day when I took them by the hand to lead them out of the land of Egypt; because they continued not in my covenant, and I regarded them not, saith the LORD. For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, saith the LORD; I will put my laws into their mind, and write them in their hearts: and I will be to them a God, and they shall be to me a people."

 

As per your statement where does it say in Hebrews 8:8-10 God is to bring salvation to the world? And the Jews are to be used as a vehicle for this? I don't see anywhere where the world is to partake of this new covenant of salvation? When this world never partook in the Old Covenant of Salvation to begin with.

 

The notion that Israel has become a vehicle or means to which God could bring Jesus to the world, explicitly makes Israel a corporate Savior to the world, which is not the case. Jesus came to Redeem Israel and that's it. Jesus is a personal savior He does not need a means or vehicle or any form of other corporateness to save the world.

 

The sole reason why Jesus came and had to die on the cross was, without going into too much detail and legal side of things was God issued a certificate of divorce to the house of Israel, remember God married Israel at Mt Sinai. Now in order for God to get his beloved ex wife back he needs to first redeem her. God would need to find a legal way to do so

 

"After he is sold he may be redeemed again. One of his BROTHERS may redeem him; or his uncle or his uncle's son may redeem him; or anyone who is NEAR OF KIN to him in his family may redeem him or if he is able he may redeem himself" (Leviticus 25:48-49).

 

This was what Jesus role was, lawful redeemer. God was buying by this legal statute with the price of blood his wife back, his property....there is nothing that shows or even suggest or indicates Israel was to be used instead as a vehicle or some sort of means to bring salvation to the world, its simply not true.

 

That is complete nonsense.

 

If you could be kind to show where I have spoken complete nonsense, it would help me to reply back with an answer to justify you responding to my post as well as clarity. However I suspect you find the notion of an Israelite can be referred to as gentile nonsense?

 

Well lets have a look:

 

In the OT the Hebrew word for "Gentiles"  is gowy

Strongs Concordance of the bible

 

01471 gowy {go'-ee} rarely (shortened) goy {go'-ee} apparently from the same root as 01465; TWOT -- 326e AV -- nation 374, heathen 143, Gentiles 30, people 11; 558 n m 1) nation, people 1a2) OF DESCENDANTS OF ABRAHAM 1a3) OF ISRAEL 1b) pf swarm of locusts, other animals (fig. n pr m 1c) Goyim? = "nations"

 

So Gowy can mean nation, people and even very interesting Descendants of Abraham and Israel

 

So if we for example look at Gen 12:2 I will make thee a great gowy / I will make thee a great gentile / I will make thee a great nation

 

Lets look at the greek word for Gentile

Ethnos:  1484 ethnos {eth'-nos} probably from 1486; TDNT 2: 364, 201; n n AV -- Gentiles 93, nation 64, heathen 5, people 2; 164

 

As you can see it's the exact same word, the exact GREEK equivalent of the Hebrew word Gowy which also means people or nation

 

but wait there is another greek word for Gentile and its used only 27 times in the bible

Hellen 1672 Hellen {hel'-lane} from 1671; TDNT -- 2: 504, 277; n m AV -- Greek 20, Gentile 7; 27

1) a Greek either by nationality, whether a native of the main land or of the Greek islands or colonies 2) in a wider sense the name embraces all nations not Jews that made the language, customs, and learning of the Greeks their own; the primary reference is to a difference of religion and worship.

 

"Hellen" as you can see has a different meaning to ETHNOS and GOWY

 

So when Paul speaks of the gentiles which one is he speaking about the the Hellen NON Israelite gentile or Ethnos/Gowy (israelite gentile)

 

Two tests for you. WHO is a Gentile

 

No 1 WHO is a Gentile?

"For when Gentiles, who do not have the law, BY NATURE do the things contained in the law, these, although not having the law, are a law to themselves, who show the work of the law WRITTEN IN THEIR HEARTS, their conscience also bearing witness, and between themselves their thoughts accusing or else excusing them."

 

Hebrews 8:10: "For this is the COVENANT that I will make with the HOUSE OF ISRAEL after those days, says the Lord: I will put My laws in their mind and write them on their hearts; and I will be their God, and they shall be My people."

 

Is the gentile a non israelite gentile or a israelite gentile that Paul refers to?

 

NO 2 WHo is the Gentile?

Cornelius the Roman

 

A Israelite or a Gentile?

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shiloh357

Interesting....I read carefully what you said, you just didn't like my answer.

 

I am saying that they were God's vehicle or "means" by which He brought Jesus into the world.

 

Nope that's not true. The sole reason for Jesus coming into the world was to ONLY redeem Israel. Which I'll show in a bit.

 

The Bible says it very plainly:  "For God so loved THE WORLD that He gave His only begotten Son that WHOSOEVER believes upon Him will have eternal life." John 3:16.

 

that is, in Christ God was reconciling THE WORLD to himself, not counting their trespasses against them, and entrusting to us the message of reconciliation. II Cor 5:19

 

He is the propitiation for our sins, and not for ours only but also for the sins of the whole world. I John. 2:2

 

The next day he saw Jesus coming toward him, and said, "Behold, the Lamb of God, who takes away the sin of THE WORLD  I John 1:29

 

They said to the woman, "It is no longer because of what you said that we believe, for we have heard for ourselves, and we know that this is indeed the Savior of THE WORLD."  John 4:42

 

Sorry, but the Bible says that Jesus is the Savior of the world and I have plenty biblical witnesses for that.  Your teaching is false.  All TRUE followers of Jesus will reject what you teach.

 

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shiloh357

Interesting....I read carefully what you said, you just didn't like my answer.

 

I am saying that they were God's vehicle or "means" by which He brought Jesus into the world.

 

Nope that's not true. The sole reason for Jesus coming into the world was to ONLY redeem Israel. Which I'll show in a bit.

 

Have a look here and this is where the challenge is with your statement

Hebrews 8:8-10: "Behold, the days come, saith the LORD, when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah: Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day when I took them by the hand to lead them out of the land of Egypt; because they continued not in my covenant, and I regarded them not, saith the LORD. For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, saith the LORD; I will put my laws into their mind, and write them in their hearts: and I will be to them a God, and they shall be to me a people."

 

As per your statement where does it say in Hebrews 8:8-10 God is to bring salvation to the world? And the Jews are to be used as a vehicle for this? I don't see anywhere where the world is to partake of this new covenant of salvation? When this world never partook in the Old Covenant of Salvation to begin with.

 

The notion that Israel has become a vehicle or means to which God could bring Jesus to the world, explicitly makes Israel a corporate Savior to the world, which is not the case. Jesus came to Redeem Israel and that's it. Jesus is a personal savior He does not need a means or vehicle or any form of other corporateness to save the world.

 

The sole reason why Jesus came and had to die on the cross was, without going into too much detail and legal side of things was God issued a certificate of divorce to the house of Israel, remember God married Israel at Mt Sinai. Now in order for God to get his beloved ex wife back he needs to first redeem her. God would need to find a legal way to do so

 

"After he is sold he may be redeemed again. One of his BROTHERS may redeem him; or his uncle or his uncle's son may redeem him; or anyone who is NEAR OF KIN to him in his family may redeem him or if he is able he may redeem himself" (Leviticus 25:48-49).

 

This was what Jesus role was, lawful redeemer. God was buying by this legal statute with the price of blood his wife back, his property....there is nothing that shows or even suggest or indicates Israel was to be used instead as a vehicle or some sort of means to bring salvation to the world, its simply not true.

 

That is complete nonsense.

 

If you could be kind to show where I have spoken complete nonsense, it would help me to reply back with an answer to justify you responding to my post as well as clarity. However I suspect you find the notion of an Israelite can be referred to as gentile nonsense?

 

Well lets have a look:

 

In the OT the Hebrew word for "Gentiles"  is gowy

Strongs Concordance of the bible

 

01471 gowy {go'-ee} rarely (shortened) goy {go'-ee} apparently from the same root as 01465; TWOT -- 326e AV -- nation 374, heathen 143, Gentiles 30, people 11; 558 n m 1) nation, people 1a2) OF DESCENDANTS OF ABRAHAM 1a3) OF ISRAEL 1b) pf swarm of locusts, other animals (fig. n pr m 1c) Goyim? = "nations"

 

So Gowy can mean nation, people and even very interesting Descendants of Abraham and Israel

 

So if we for example look at Gen 12:2 I will make thee a great gowy / I will make thee a great gentile / I will make thee a great nation

 

Lets look at the greek word for Gentile

Ethnos:  1484 ethnos {eth'-nos} probably from 1486; TDNT 2: 364, 201; n n AV -- Gentiles 93, nation 64, heathen 5, people 2; 164

 

As you can see it's the exact same word, the exact GREEK equivalent of the Hebrew word Gowy which also means people or nation

 

but wait there is another greek word for Gentile and its used only 27 times in the bible

Hellen 1672 Hellen {hel'-lane} from 1671; TDNT -- 2: 504, 277; n m AV -- Greek 20, Gentile 7; 27

1) a Greek either by nationality, whether a native of the main land or of the Greek islands or colonies 2) in a wider sense the name embraces all nations not Jews that made the language, customs, and learning of the Greeks their own; the primary reference is to a difference of religion and worship.

 

"Hellen" as you can see has a different meaning to ETHNOS and GOWY

 

So when Paul speaks of the gentiles which one is he speaking about the the Hellen NON Israelite gentile or Ethnos/Gowy (israelite gentile)

 

Two tests for you. WHO is a Gentile

 

No 1 WHO is a Gentile?

"For when Gentiles, who do not have the law, BY NATURE do the things contained in the law, these, although not having the law, are a law to themselves, who show the work of the law WRITTEN IN THEIR HEARTS, their conscience also bearing witness, and between themselves their thoughts accusing or else excusing them."

 

Hebrews 8:10: "For this is the COVENANT that I will make with the HOUSE OF ISRAEL after those days, says the Lord: I will put My laws in their mind and write them on their hearts; and I will be their God, and they shall be My people."

 

Is the gentile a non israelite gentile or a israelite gentile that Paul refers to?

 

NO 2 WHo is the Gentile?

Cornelius the Roman

 

A Israelite or a Gentile?

 

 

The term Goy means nation or people group. Gentile means not-Israel or non-Jew. Israel is a nation/goy. Egyptians are a nation/goy. Any people group is a goy. In scripture, most of the time, the scripture refers to goy(im) which are non-Israel people groups. Goyim is plural for Goy. But in one or two places, Israel is also called a nation/goy.  Just because Israel is a nation/goy, does not mean that other goyim/nations are Israel.

 

Earlier, on another thread, I posted that one of the mysteries was that Gentiles would be fully included in the New Covenant. It is a mystery because it is hinted at in the OT, but made very plain in the NT.  

 

Concerning Peter's visit to the house of Cornelius:

 

Acts 10:45 All the circumcised believers who came with Peter were amazed, because the gift of the Holy Spirit had been poured out on the Gentiles also.

 

Acts 11:17 Therefore if God gave to them the same gift as He gave to us also after believing in the Lord Jesus Christ, who was I that I could stand in God’s way?” 18 When they heard this, they quieted down and glorified God, saying, “Well then, God has granted to the Gentiles also the repentance that leads to life.”

 

Acts 13:47  For so the Lord has commanded us,

‘I have placed You as a light for the Gentiles,

That You may bring salvation to the end of the earth.’”

 

So, does the OT mention that the Gentiles will come to the Messiah as a prophesy? The simple answer is yes.

 

Isaiah 11:10 And in that day there shall be a root of Jesse, which shall stand for an ensign of the people; to it shall the Gentiles seek: and his rest shall be glorious.

 

Isaiah 42:6 I the Lord have called thee in righteousness, and will hold thine hand, and will keep thee, and give thee for a covenant of the people, for a light of the Gentiles;

 

Isaiah 60:3 And the Gentiles shall come to thy light, and kings to the brightness of thy rising.

Jeremiah  16:19 O Lord, my strength, and my fortress, and my refuge in the day of affliction, the Gentiles shall come unto thee from the ends of the earth, and shall say, Surely our fathers have inherited lies, vanity, and things wherein there is no profit.

 

So, scripture does prophesy that the Gentiles would come to the Messiah. What is not shown is the status of the Gentiles when they come to the Messiah (a mystery), but in the minds of the Apostles, that Gentiles received the Holy Spirit meant that they were accepted as equals in the New Covenant with the same blessings offered in the New Covenant.   Gentiles are not Israel, and Israel is not Gentile. Both become part of something new, One New Man. Again, a mystery until is was revealed fully in the NT.  

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shiloh357

Interesting....I read carefully what you said, you just didn't like my answer.

 

I am saying that they were God's vehicle or "means" by which He brought Jesus into the world.

 

Nope that's not true. The sole reason for Jesus coming into the world was to ONLY redeem Israel. Which I'll show in a bit.

 

The Bible says it very plainly:  "For God so loved THE WORLD that He gave His only begotten Son that WHOSOEVER believes upon Him will have eternal life." John 3:16.

 

that is, in Christ God was reconciling THE WORLD to himself, not counting their trespasses against them, and entrusting to us the message of reconciliation. II Cor 5:19

 

He is the propitiation for our sins, and not for ours only but also for the sins of the whole world. I John. 2:2

 

The next day he saw Jesus coming toward him, and said, "Behold, the Lamb of God, who takes away the sin of THE WORLD  I John 1:29

 

They said to the woman, "It is no longer because of what you said that we believe, for we have heard for ourselves, and we know that this is indeed the Savior of THE WORLD."  John 4:42

 

Sorry, but the Bible says that Jesus is the Savior of the world and I have plenty biblical witnesses for that.  Your teaching is false.  All TRUE followers of Jesus will reject what you teach.

 

 

 

We need to make one thing very clear it is YOUR teaching I am testing.

 

The logical next step was to present the "world" concept. So lets test this.

 

From who's prospective is "THE WORLD" being viewed from? Yours or from God's view, which is an Israelite view, an Israelite world?

 

Your view of all nations and all races to be saved contradicts Hebrew 8:8-10 as well as the following:

 

John 17:9-10: "I pray for them: I pray not for the world, but for them which thou hast given me; for they are thine. And all mine are thine, and thine are mine; and I am glorified in them."

 
Jesus does'nt pray for the world to be saved but for Israel because Israel glorifies God and Jesus, how do I know this 
 

 

Isaiah 48:10-12: "I have chosen thee in the furnace of affliction. For mine own sake, even for mine own sake, will I do it: for how should my name be polluted? and I will not give my glory unto another. Hearken unto me, O Jacob and Israel, my called; I am he; I am the first, I also am the last."

 
Lets have a look at Paul when he prayed
Brethren, my heart’s desire and prayer to God for Israel is, that they might be saved”  -- (Romans 10:1).
Paul prays for Israel to be saved not "THE WORLD"  from your prospective but the world of Israel
 
Acts 26:6-7: "And now I stand and am judged for the hope of the promise made of God unto our fathers: Unto which promise our twelve tribes, instantly serving God day and night, hope to come."
 
"THE WORLD"  from your prospective of all races and all nations does'nt seem to be included 
 
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@Qnts2

 

The term Goy means nation or people group. Gentile means not-Israel or non-Jew. Israel is a nation/goy. Egyptians are a nation/goy. Any people group is a goy. In scripture, most of the time, the scripture refers to goy(im) which are non-Israel people groups. Goyim is plural for Goy. But in one or two places, Israel is also called a nation/goy.  Just because Israel is a nation/goy, does not mean that other goyim/nations are Israel

 

and yet the Hebrew word for gentile gowy also refers to the DESCENDANTS OF ABRAHAM and IRSAEL

01471 gowy {go'-ee} rarely (shortened) goy {go'-ee} apparently from the same root as 01465; TWOT -- 326e AV -- nation 374, heathen 143, Gentiles 30, people 11; 558 n m 1) nation, people 1a2) OF DESCENDANTS OF ABRAHAM 1a3) OF ISRAEL 1b) pf swarm of locusts, other animals (fig. n pr m 1c) Goyim? = "nations"

 

and yet the hebrew word for gentile gowy also refers to the DESCENDANTS OF ABRAHAM and IRSAEL ( Sorry for repeat but it needs to drummed in)

 

In scripture, most of the time, the scripture refers to goy(im) which are non-Israel people groups. Goyim is plural for Goy. But in one or two places, Israel is also called a nation/goy.  Just because Israel is a nation/goy, does not mean that other goyim/nations are Israel

 
That's not what I'm saying what I'm saying, whenever the words "nation" or "nations" appear in the Bible, its translated as "Gentiles." It means the same thing and is the SAME word. The translators of our Bibles used the word that was best suited for a particular scripture. The problem is we are all  programmed to think that the word"gentile" can never refer to Israelites and vise verse but yet as we can see the definition of "Gentiles" in Strong's Concordance (#01471) INCLUDED the physical seed-line of Abraham and Israel with non-Hebrew people. 
 
To deny this is simply one who does not want to seek the truth or refuse to accept the truth.
 
With regards to your interpretation Concerning Peter's visit to the house of Cornelius
 
You need to clearly define which "gentiles" are being addressed here in the verses you provided as either Ethnos or Hellen?
 
Acts 10:45 All the circumcised believers who came with Peter were amazed, because the gift of the Holy Spirit had been poured out on the Gentiles also. (Ethnos or Hellen?)
 
Acts 11:17 Therefore if God gave to them the same gift as He gave to us also after believing in the Lord Jesus Christ, who was I that I could stand in God’s way?” 18 When they heard this, they quieted down and glorified God, saying, “Well then, God has granted to the Gentiles also the repentance that leads to life.” (Ethnos or Hellen?)
 
Acts 13:47  For so the Lord has commanded us,

‘I have placed You as a light for the Gentiles, (Ethnos or Hellen?)
That You may bring salvation to the end of the earth.’” 

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shiloh357

Interesting....I read carefully what you said, you just didn't like my answer.

 

I am saying that they were God's vehicle or "means" by which He brought Jesus into the world.

 

Nope that's not true. The sole reason for Jesus coming into the world was to ONLY redeem Israel. Which I'll show in a bit.

 

The Bible says it very plainly:  "For God so loved THE WORLD that He gave His only begotten Son that WHOSOEVER believes upon Him will have eternal life." John 3:16.

 

that is, in Christ God was reconciling THE WORLD to himself, not counting their trespasses against them, and entrusting to us the message of reconciliation. II Cor 5:19

 

He is the propitiation for our sins, and not for ours only but also for the sins of the whole world. I John. 2:2

 

The next day he saw Jesus coming toward him, and said, "Behold, the Lamb of God, who takes away the sin of THE WORLD  I John 1:29

 

They said to the woman, "It is no longer because of what you said that we believe, for we have heard for ourselves, and we know that this is indeed the Savior of THE WORLD."  John 4:42

 

Sorry, but the Bible says that Jesus is the Savior of the world and I have plenty biblical witnesses for that.  Your teaching is false.  All TRUE followers of Jesus will reject what you teach.

 

 

 

We need to make one thing very clear it is YOUR teaching I am testing.

 

The logical next step was to present the "world" concept. So lets test this.

 

From who's prospective is "THE WORLD" being viewed from? Yours or from God's view, which is an Israelite view, an Israelite world?

 

Your view of all nations and all races to be saved contradicts Hebrew 8:8-10 as well as the following:

 

John 17:9-10: "I pray for them: I pray not for the world, but for them which thou hast given me; for they are thine. And all mine are thine, and thine are mine; and I am glorified in them."

 
Jesus does'nt pray for the world to be saved but for Israel because Israel glorifies God and Jesus, how do I know this 
 

 

Isaiah 48:10-12: "I have chosen thee in the furnace of affliction. For mine own sake, even for mine own sake, will I do it: for how should my name be polluted? and I will not give my glory unto another. Hearken unto me, O Jacob and Israel, my called; I am he; I am the first, I also am the last."

 
Lets have a look at Paul when he prayed
Brethren, my heart’s desire and prayer to God for Israel is, that they might be saved”  -- (Romans 10:1).
Paul prays for Israel to be saved not "THE WORLD"  from your prospective but the world of Israel
 
Acts 26:6-7: "And now I stand and am judged for the hope of the promise made of God unto our fathers: Unto which promise our twelve tribes, instantly serving God day and night, hope to come."
 
"THE WORLD"  from your prospective of all races and all nations does'nt seem to be included 
 

 

Before I go any further let me explain to what I am hearing in your posts.   This is what I am taking away from what you are posting:  "God never intended to save anyone but ethnic Jews/Israelites.  The non-Jewish, non-Israelite Gentiles were never intended by God to be the recipients of salvation.   God is only interested in those people are ethnic members of the physical twelve tribes of Israel and the concept of "world" only extends to the physical, flesh and blood Israelites.  God doesn't love anyone else and salvation is not for anyone else outside of national. physical Israel."

 

That is what your teachings come off as.   Either you are clumsy and lack competence or you are teaching a grossly false doctrine.  So, before I report your posts to the moderators, I will give you one opportunity to publicly clarify your position.

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shiloh357

 

Interesting...

 

I have stated my position very clearly, I am testing your teaching

 

Your teaching seems to contradict the scriptures I have provided....at this stage you are more than welcome to treat me as someone who is "clumsy" and "incompetent", as a child of the world I don't profess to know everything and I am certainly humbled to learn.

 

If you could please explain the contradictions

John 17:9-10: "I pray for them: I pray not for the world, but for them which thou hast given me; for they are thine. And all mine are thine, and thine are mine; and I am glorified in them."

 

Brethren, my heart’s desire and prayer to God for Israel is, that they might be saved”  -- (Romans 10:1).
 
Acts 26:6-7: "And now I stand and am judged for the hope of the promise made of God unto our fathers: Unto which promise our twelve tribes, instantly serving God day and night, hope to come."
 
Trying to get this deleted or reported doesn't make these scriptures go away, what are we to do with these scriptures?
 
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"Before I go any further let me explain to what I am hearing in your posts.   This is what I am taking away from what you are posting:  "God never intended to save anyone but ethnic Jews/Israelites.  The non-Jewish, non-Israelite Gentiles were never intended by God to be the recipients of salvation.   God is only interested in those people are ethnic members of the physical twelve tribes of Israel and the concept of "world" only extends to the physical, flesh and blood Israelites.  God doesn't love anyone else and salvation is not for anyone else outside of national. physical Israel."
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No, unless God has chosen you individually or you are a chosen people (Israel) will have salvation
 
John 6:44: "No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him:"
 
 
You may also wish to report the bible is also Israelite
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