GoldenEagle Posted May 20, 2014 Group: Royal Member Followers: 4 Topic Count: 764 Topics Per Day: 0.18 Content Count: 7,626 Content Per Day: 1.81 Reputation: 1,559 Days Won: 44 Joined: 10/03/2012 Status: Offline Author Share Posted May 20, 2014 Luke 6:37 - Do not judge, and you will not be judged; Do not condemn, and you will not be condemned. Forgive, and you will be forgiven. It is all about position. Just look at the "Prodigal Son:, He never was not his fathers son, he always was one. Yet he was separated from his father. The HS convicts us, reminds us, prompts us when we drift. Sometimes He uses other people to show us our fault. He (the HS) is our comforter, our counciler. Only when we are brought back into fellowship are we again comforted. 1 John 1:9 - If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just and will forgive us our sins and purify us from all unrighteousness. It looks like confession of sins is a major factor in reconciliation. The penalty of our sins has been removed, yet we are still under the curse. In Christ Montana Marv I would agree the Holy Spirit reminds us and prompts us when we drift. I'm just not sure if convicts is the right term. Please explain more "Only when we are brought back into fellowship are we again comforted." Please explain more "The penalty of our sins has been removed, yet we are still under the curse." God bless, GE Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoldenEagle Posted May 20, 2014 Group: Royal Member Followers: 4 Topic Count: 764 Topics Per Day: 0.18 Content Count: 7,626 Content Per Day: 1.81 Reputation: 1,559 Days Won: 44 Joined: 10/03/2012 Status: Offline Author Share Posted May 20, 2014 Here are the three P's. We have been saved from the penalty of sin. Justification - It is a done deal We are being saved from the power of sin. Sanctification - on going, we are not there yet We shall be saved from the presence of sin. Glorification. When we receive our new Glorified Body and when Death and Hades is thrown into the Lake of Fire. In Christ Montana Marv Good stuff. I agree with you and well said. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoldenEagle Posted May 20, 2014 Group: Royal Member Followers: 4 Topic Count: 764 Topics Per Day: 0.18 Content Count: 7,626 Content Per Day: 1.81 Reputation: 1,559 Days Won: 44 Joined: 10/03/2012 Status: Offline Author Share Posted May 20, 2014 Satan condemns us for our sins. It is destructive like being stabbed to kill us. He brings up the past and accuses us for a life long forgiven and forgotten by God. There is a difference between this and the "conviction" of the Holy Spirit. God points out our sin so that we can acknowledge it and have it removed from our lives. It is like surgery. It brings healing and wholeness. It brings relief like having an infected splinter or a painful boil removed. 1 John 1:8 If we say we have no sin, we deceive ourselves and the truth is not in us. There are many sins in my life that I am completely oblivious to. The blood of Jesus continually cleanses me from all sin as I stay in fellowship with God and other Christians. As I am washed by the water of the Word, little by little God reveals them to remove them for my own well being. Yes I was forgiven at the cross once for all sinfulness as I turned from that life to Jesus as Savior. Yes God sanctified me to Himself and for His use. I have no need to try to be more righteous. The Holy Spirit conforms me to the likeness of Christ without my labor by changing the desires of my heart. And should I willfully commit a sin, there is also room for repentance and confession of that trangression. God restores me to fellowship as Jesus intercedes for me as my advocate. The blood of Jesus has assured me of that forgiveness. I inherit eternal life, I do not earn it. Should a person return to habitual sin and refuse to repent, or should they change religions so denying their Savior, there is fear of eternal judgement and doubt that the person was ever truely saved. God keeps His own and chastens those He loves to yield the peacable fruit of righteousness. So I also have to disagree that the Holy Spirit does not reveal to us a sin for its removal. We are supposed to examine and judge ourselves prior to communion so there will be no need of the Lord chastening us. We are to confess our tresspasses to one another and pray for one another that we should be healed. I agree that our true nature in Christ is a life of righteousness, and He shows us that by sinning we are being a hippocrit to our true nature. l also agree that He empowers us to live a godly life. We can enter the rest of the completed work of Christ and cease from our own works as God did from His. Heb. 4:10 We can allow Christ to live in us. AMENl We often used different words to arrive at the same idea. Very well put sister. I believe there's a difference between being accused of sin as the Enemy does... and what the Holy Spirit does which is calling us to remember Whose we are and that sin no longer has power over us. I'm not sure if convict is the right term. But it is what we as Believers commonly refer to as the Holy Spirit pointing out sin in our lives. In Jesus we are set free from the slavery of sin and serve a Good Master - Jesus. I do agree that we as Believers sometimes use different words to arrive at the same idea. Here's the defition below. What do you think? Convict verb (used with object) 1. to prove or declare guilty of an offense, especially after a legal trial: to convict a prisoner of a felony. 2. to impress with a sense of guilt. noun 3. a person proved or declared guilty of an offense. 4. a person serving a prison sentence. God bless, GE Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoldenEagle Posted May 20, 2014 Group: Royal Member Followers: 4 Topic Count: 764 Topics Per Day: 0.18 Content Count: 7,626 Content Per Day: 1.81 Reputation: 1,559 Days Won: 44 Joined: 10/03/2012 Status: Offline Author Share Posted May 20, 2014 The Holy Spirit does convict us of our sins. He dont do so in a waythat belittles you, instead its done in love. If you are not having little revelations here and there of sinfull things you do that you need to stop doing God isnt working in your life which more than likely means either you arent saved or you are not paying attention. The Holy Spirit works this out thru your very own conscience. Perhaps convict or conviction isnt the best word to use in this topic as it can have different meanings as I read in one post above the enemy convicts us. And yes thats true but the way God convicts us isnt the same. It may be better to say He sheds light on our sins. The Holy Spirit dosent point a finger or make you feel guilty about it. But He does tell you to stop doing it. Whatever it is. Perhaps it is better to say that the Holy Spirit sheds light on our sins as you say... Perhaps much like a room where the light is turned off... And suddenly a flashlight gets turned on and things become clearer? The Holy Spirit's role isn't to simply make us feel guilty about sin but to restore us to fellowship with God. So the purpose of the Holy Spirit isn't to accuse to but to restore. At least that's how I've understood it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoldenEagle Posted May 20, 2014 Group: Royal Member Followers: 4 Topic Count: 764 Topics Per Day: 0.18 Content Count: 7,626 Content Per Day: 1.81 Reputation: 1,559 Days Won: 44 Joined: 10/03/2012 Status: Offline Author Share Posted May 20, 2014 We are coming from entirely different belief systems. I don't believe in unconditional eternal security, so I am the most at odds with the OP. I believe that if we fail to walk in the Spirit, we are under the curse of the law. That means that the Spirit is very active in revealing to us our sins. Then there are those who believe in eternal security, but they also believe that the Spirit convicts us of sin. The Bible states that God chastises his children. The OP is the most extreme version of unconditional eternal security. This is based on the notion that when you get saved, all past, present and future sins are automatically covered by the blood, and God can't even see when you sin. That would mean I could commit adultery, steal, kill, bear false witness, anything, and God can't see it. I have been inoculated from sin. God can't see through the blood line. The problem with that doctrine is that if that were so, how can God chastise you? How can he chastise a person for doing something he can't see? So far, we are seeing reactions from three schools of thought. 1. Those who reject unconditional eternal security completely. 2. Those who believe in unconditional eternal security, but believe God sees our sins and leads us to do better. 3. Those who believe that God can't see through the blood line, so he doesn't know when a Christian sins. I am in the first camp. The OP is in the third camp. If I had to choose I probably would be in the second camp. But I have a hunch perhaps there's more categories than the 3 presented brother. I'm not sure if the OP is the most extreme version of unconditional eternal security... Where did you get the idea that God doesn't see the sin from the OP? Perhaps I missed it but what is described is an internal conflict when we sin which doesn't mesh with our new nature in Christ. If the Holy Spirit makes us aware that we're not acting according to our new nature then I'd say that Bas (author) is saying that God does in fact see our sin. He shows you that you are acting like someone else when you sin by convicting you of who you really are. There is a reason you sense an internal conflict when you sin. It is the Holy Spirit reminding you of who you are. Making you aware of the fact that you are not acting according to your righteous nature. At least that's how I read it. I could be off. God bless, GE Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Montana Marv Posted May 20, 2014 Group: Royal Member Followers: 4 Topic Count: 19 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 3,135 Content Per Day: 0.69 Reputation: 1,091 Days Won: 2 Joined: 11/03/2011 Status: Offline Share Posted May 20, 2014 GE Some questions you asked of me: I would agree the Holy Spirit reminds us and prompts us when we drift. I'm just not sure if convicts is the right term. Please explain more "Only when we are brought back into fellowship are we again comforted." Please explain more "The penalty of our sins has been removed, yet we are still under the curse." God bless, GE 1st; you've been married, I am - anything ever come between you and your wife (money, trip, dinner, relatives, kids). Any agitation between two parties results in conflict. Conflict is separation, space, gap (not being together). Only when united again is there comfort. As long as one strays there is division. Only when the lost lamb was returned to the fold with the Shepard was it in comfort. 2nd: Does one age, go to the doctor, takes meds, develop a belly; Hair turn gray, white, fallout, cut or pluck eyebrow horns a couple times a month instead of once or twice a year. What gives? Anyone close to you who has not died, or will not die. We are all under the fall of Adam. We toil to make a living, we sweat, women have pain in childbirth. Thorns infest the ground. This is the curse put on Adam and all his descendants. You shall surely die. A Physical Death. Yet we have Eternal Live through Jesus Christ our Lord, Spiritual Life. In Christ Montana Marv Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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