Sign in to follow this  
Followers 0
Peteeeer

Before sin and thus before death, would the world have became too full

94 posts in this topic

 

 

 

 

 

When the world was perfect (before sin), there was obviously no death; so wouldn't the world have became too full eventually?

No, because there was more dry land than there is now.  The topography of the earth was completely different than it is now.  Much of what was dry land before Noah's flood is now under water. So there would be plenty of land for people to live on had man never sinned.

 

The Earth would still become full, it would just take longer in that case.

 

God is wiser and smarter than you give him credit for.  Look at the earth today,  We are no where near over-crowding that is with only 30% dry land.  Imagine when most of the earth wasn't covered by water.  There would be hundreds of times more land than what we have now.  Overcrowding isn't an issue.

 

He does have a point, though. If nobody died ever, the population would have grown much faster than it does now.  And the Earth may be really big, but eventually it would fill up, even if it was 100% land.

 

Yes and that fact would not take an all-knowing God by surprise would it??    God knew the future and created our planet just they way it needed to be to accommodate all of the life it needed to accommodate.  So even if God knew that man would not have ever sinned and thus never died, He would have prepared a planet commiserate with that reality as well.

 

 

Of course it wouldn't take God by surprise.  Nobody is suggesting that.

 

  The OP was a hypothetical "What if..." There is no way for us to actually know the answer to this, so we are all speculating here.

 

If the fall of man (and the curse of death) never happened, the population of humans and animals would increase far more rapidly then they do now.  The earth as it was in the beginning would have filled up rapidly.  However, our knowledge and understanding of the universe would increase as well from our time spent walking with God and, you know, not dying.  I think space travel and expansion to other planets would be entirely plausible.  Might possibly be the purpose for those distant planets.

 

I think you're suggesting here that God would have designed a different world if things had gone different in Eden.  I don't see how that's really necessary.  Also, does that mean this world wasn't good enough?

 

Food for thought. ;)

1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Of course it wouldn't take God by surprise.  Nobody is suggesting that.

 

  The OP was a hypothetical "What if..." There is no way for us to actually know the answer to this, so we are all speculating here.

 

If the fall of man (and the curse of death) never happened, the population of humans and animals would increase far more rapidly then they do now.  The earth as it was in the beginning would have filled up rapidly.  However, our knowledge and understanding of the universe would increase as well from our time spent walking with God and, you know, not dying.  I think space travel and expansion to other planets would be entirely plausible.  Might possibly be the purpose for those distant planets.

 

No, outer space was really meant to show us His glory.  We ignored its real purpose in exchange for humanistic sci-fi nonsense.

 

I think you're suggesting here that God would have designed a different world if things had gone different in Eden.  I don't see how that's really necessary.  Also, does that mean this world wasn't good enough?

 

If God knew that man would never sin, the of course we would have a planet that would accommodate that reality.  That is just commonsense.  God prepared an earth to accommodate what he knew would be.  It would still be just as perfect as this earth was originally for the reality it would face in terms of population growth.

 

Food for thought. ;)

 

Not hardly.

1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

When the world was perfect (before sin), there was obviously no death; so wouldn't the world have became too full eventually?

 

:thumbsup:

 

Evidently

 

And Enoch walked with God: and he was not; for God took him. Genesis 5:34

 

Not

 

Nothing will hurt or destroy in all my holy mountain, for as the waters fill the sea, so the earth will be filled with people who know the LORD.  Isaiah 11:9 (NLT)

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

....Also, does that mean this world wasn't good enough...

 

~

 

Beloved, Good

 

Do not love the world or anything in the world. If anyone loves the world, love for the Father is not in them.

 

For everything in the world—the lust of the flesh, the lust of the eyes, and the pride of life—comes not from the Father but from the world.

 

The world and its desires pass away, but whoever does the will of God lives forever. 1 John 2:15-17 (NIV)

 

Enough?

 

Then I saw a great white throne and him who was seated on it.

 

The earth and the heavens fled from his presence,

 

and there was no place for them. Revelation 20:11 (NIV)

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

Of course it wouldn't take God by surprise.  Nobody is suggesting that.

 

  The OP was a hypothetical "What if..." There is no way for us to actually know the answer to this, so we are all speculating here.

 

If the fall of man (and the curse of death) never happened, the population of humans and animals would increase far more rapidly then they do now.  The earth as it was in the beginning would have filled up rapidly.  However, our knowledge and understanding of the universe would increase as well from our time spent walking with God and, you know, not dying.  I think space travel and expansion to other planets would be entirely plausible.  Might possibly be the purpose for those distant planets.

No, outer space was really meant to show us His glory.  We ignored its real purpose in exchange for humanistic sci-fi nonsense.

 

What's wrong with science fiction...? :huh:  And how is my suggestion of space travel humanistic or nonsensical?  I merely suggested that they were more than just cosmic wallpaper.

 

Sure, the heavens declare His glory, but so do we. So do the trees and the animals and the oxygen atom and the dirt.   Doesn't meant that's their only purpose.

 

 

 

I think you're suggesting here that God would have designed a different world if things had gone different in Eden.  I don't see how that's really necessary.  Also, does that mean this world wasn't good enough?

If God knew that man would never sin, the of course we would have a planet that would accommodate that reality.  That is just commonsense.  God prepared an earth to accommodate what he knew would be.  It would still be just as perfect as this earth was originally for the reality it would face in terms of population growth.

 

I really don't see how you could know that for sure.  Your guess is just as good as mine. :)

 

 

 

Food for thought. ;)

Not hardly.

 

Um...what exactly was the point of this other than belittling my opinion? :huh:

 

'Tis funny.  I think I joined this conversation by agreeing with you.  What happened?

1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

....Also, does that mean this world wasn't good enough...

 

~

 

Beloved, Good

 

Do not love the world or anything in the world. If anyone loves the world, love for the Father is not in them.

 

For everything in the world—the lust of the flesh, the lust of the eyes, and the pride of life—comes not from the Father but from the world.

 

The world and its desires pass away, but whoever does the will of God lives forever. 1 John 2:15-17 (NIV)

 

Enough?

 

Then I saw a great white throne and him who was seated on it.

 

The earth and the heavens fled from his presence,

 

and there was no place for them. Revelation 20:11 (NIV)

 

 

I wasn't referring to the state of the world now, but before the fall.  The one that God said was good.  It has been suggested that it wasn't good enough.  I was just clarifying. :)

1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
What's wrong with science fiction...? :huh:  And how is my suggestion of space travel humanistic or nonsensical?

 

My point is that science fiction is rooted in a humanistic worldview.  Star Trek is one of the most humanistic series around.

 

 

I merely suggested that they were more than just cosmic wallpaper.

 

Sure, the heavens declare His glory, but so do we. So do the trees and the animals and the oxygen atom and the dirt.   Doesn't meant that's their only purpose.

 

Our location in the galaxy places us in the ideal location to see the universe, hence to see God's glory in all he made.  The end purpose of all things is to glorify God.  That is why we were made.

 

I really don't see how you could know that for sure.  Your guess is just as good as mine. :)

 

I am not guessing at all.  I don't have to.  We serve an all-knowing God who made a universe and planet perfect for our survival.  He thought of everything and it was perfect the first day it was made.   He made it fully capable of handling what it needs to handle   Had things turned out differently, had man not sinned, God would have had this planet prepared for that eventuality as well.  How does one even suggest that to be guesswork.  I guess you just have to know Him.

 

Um...what exactly was the point of this other than belittling my opinion?

 

You claimed that I suggested that the previous earth wasn't good enough which I never said.  You said your response was "food for thought."   And it wasn't.  It was rather poor theology and  a misrepresentation of what I said.

1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

What's wrong with science fiction...? :huh:  And how is my suggestion of space travel humanistic or nonsensical?

My point is that science fiction is rooted in a humanistic worldview.  Star Trek is one of the most humanistic series around.

 

You know it's fiction, right?  As in 'not true'.  Like most fiction, there's a deeper meaning below the surface.

 

I had one of my greatest spiritual epiphanies watching Star Trek.  The one with Patrick Stewart, not the original ('twas before my time).  I was about five years old in my pajamas, watching TV with my dad.  I asked him a million questions about singularities, and Klingons and why did they just call the sun a star?  I remember one day he explained to me what a galaxy was.  Blew my inquisitive little mind.  Then he took me out to the backyard and we looked at Andromeda and the Milky Way together.  "You mean galaxies are REAL?!  And God made all that?!  Whoa..."

 

:)

 

 

I merely suggested that they were more than just cosmic wallpaper.

 

Sure, the heavens declare His glory, but so do we. So do the trees and the animals and the oxygen atom and the dirt.   Doesn't meant that's their only purpose.

Our location in the galaxy places us in the ideal location to see the universe, hence to see God's glory in all he made.  The end purpose of all things is to glorify God.  That is why we were made.

 

 

I didn't disagree that all of creation was intended to reveal His Glory.    However, trees have other purposes, like turning Carbon Dioxide into Oxygen.  Oxygen's purpose (one of many) is to sustain us.  Dirt supports the trees and other vegetation, which feeds the animals...need I go on?

 

I don't see the problem with suggesting that distant planets (that we can't even see, by the way) might possibly have another purpose. 

 

 

 

I really don't see how you could know that for sure.  Your guess is just as good as mine. :)

I am not guessing at all.  I don't have to.  We serve an all-knowing God who made a universe and planet perfect for our survival.  He thought of everything and it was perfect the first day it was made.   He made it fully capable of handling what it needs to handle   Had things turned out differently, had man not sinned, God would have had this planet prepared for that eventuality as well.  How does one even suggest that to be guesswork.  I guess you just have to know Him.

 

Bible verses or it didn't happen. :D

 

Otherwise it's purely speculation.  But, you know what, there is nothing wrong with a little speculation. :)

 

IMHO, I think God had both possibilities planned for in this creation.  As in, creation as it was in the beginning was good for both scenarios. 

 

 

 

Um...what exactly was the point of this other than belittling my opinion?

You claimed that I suggested that the previous earth wasn't good enough which I never said.  You said your response was "food for thought."   And it wasn't.  It was rather poor theology and  a misrepresentation of what I said.

 

Thanks for clarifying.  My apologies for the misunderstanding.

 

Why didn't you just say that instead of belittling my opinion?

1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
You know it's fiction, right?  As in 'not true'.  Like most fiction, there's a deeper meaning below the surface.

 

But the worldview in which they couch the story is based on humanism.  it's a lesson in humanism in the form of entertainment.  That is especially true with Star Trek TNG.

 

I didn't disagree that all of creation was intended to reveal His Glory.    However, trees have other purposes, like turning Carbon Dioxide into Oxygen.  Oxygen's purpose (one of many) is to sustain us.  Dirt supports the trees and other vegetation, which feeds the animals...need I go on?

 

But all of that serves the purpose of glorifying God by revealing the mind and the power and the genius of an all-knowing Creator.  All of the universe was designed to glorify God.  It has no other purpose.  The chief end of everything God made it glorify Him and it does so in being exactly what He created it to be and doing what He created it to do.  It's not the case that they glorify God and also do "x, y, z."   They glorify God as they do those things. 

 

I thought you said you went to a Bible college.  You should have known that.

 

Bible verses or it didn't happen. :D

 

Otherwise it's purely speculation.  But, you know what, there is nothing wrong with a little speculation. :)

 

IMHO, I think God had both possibilities planned for in this creation.  As in, creation as it was in the beginning was good for both scenarios.

 

I am not speculating.  You clearly are not theologically equipped to understand what I am talking about.  I am talking about the sovereignty and foreknowledge of God.  God created a planet perfectly suited to us.   How is that something I need to defend to a Christian??? 

 

How could God have two possibilities planned???  That is inconsistent with the fact that God is all-knowing. He knows the future because He is the architect of it.  He knew the future and He made the earth commiserate with that future.  God doesn't need two plans.   I guess that Bible college was rather weak on theology.

1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

You know it's fiction, right?  As in 'not true'.  Like most fiction, there's a deeper meaning below the surface.

 

But the worldview in which they couch the story is based on humanism.  it's a lesson in humanism in the form of entertainment.  That is especially true with Star Trek TNG.

 

I didn't disagree that all of creation was intended to reveal His Glory.    However, trees have other purposes, like turning Carbon Dioxide into Oxygen.  Oxygen's purpose (one of many) is to sustain us.  Dirt supports the trees and other vegetation, which feeds the animals...need I go on?

 

But all of that serves the purpose of glorifying God by revealing the mind and the power and the genius of an all-knowing Creator.  All of the universe was designed to glorify God.  It has no other purpose.  The chief end of everything God made it glorify Him and it does so in being exactly what He created it to be and doing what He created it to do.  It's not the case that they glorify God and also do "x, y, z."   They glorify God as they do those things. 

 

I thought you said you went to a Bible college.  You should have known that.

 

Bible verses or it didn't happen. :D

 

Otherwise it's purely speculation.  But, you know what, there is nothing wrong with a little speculation. :)

 

IMHO, I think God had both possibilities planned for in this creation.  As in, creation as it was in the beginning was good for both scenarios.

 

I am not speculating.  You clearly are not theologically equipped to understand what I am talking about.  I am talking about the sovereignty and foreknowledge of God.  God created a planet perfectly suited to us.   How is that something I need to defend to a Christian??? 

 

How could God have two possibilities planned???  That is inconsistent with the fact that God is all-knowing. He knows the future because He is the architect of it.  He knew the future and He made the earth commiserate with that future.  God doesn't need two plans.   I guess that Bible college was rather weak on theology.

 

I think some of your comments are a little rude and condescending. Just sayin'.

2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Sign in to follow this  
Followers 0