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Why rewards if heaven is the assured goal?


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It is so sad that people believe what the so called Reformers preached. People want to believe their false understanding of Paul's writings which are leading people away from God.

Can't people see that it did not take God almost sixteen hundred years to bring people to the true understanding of what Jesus taught?

John taught that if one sins he or she has never known God. Yet the Reformers say it is work to not sin.

To live God's Word is not one's work, but God's work in and through him or her.

(1 John 3:5-6) “Now you know that he appeared in order to abolish sin, and that in him there is no sin; anyone who lives in God does not sin, and anyone who sins has never seen him or known him.”

So just for clarity's sake ... you are saying you do not sin? Love, Steven
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You’re asking me that question tells me you can’t believe it is possible to not ever sin.

Yet you most likely will say that the bible is God’s written Word, and hold all truth.

John tells us if one sins he or she has never seen God/Jesus or knows Jesus. That is the written Word of God.

I witness that I have seen Jesus and know him.

(1 John 3:5-6) “Now you know that he appeared in order to abolish sin, and that in him there is no sin; anyone who lives in God does not sin, and anyone who sins has never seen him or known him.”

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You think clever to not answer the question... but that cleverness lies only in your own being!

We are not without sight and know by your proclamation of subject the answer! Love, Steven

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One Light,

 

Your scripture in 2 Peter Ch. 1 is so relevant esp. v. 4.

 

`For by these He has granted to us His precious & magnificent promises in order that by them you might become partakers of the divine nature.....`

 

That to me is so awesome. Not only will we have a amazing body like Christ`s, able to go through dimensions, but we will also have in us Christ`s divine nature, as we submit daily to His workings in us. No other group of people besides the Body of Christ has been promised this or was able to have it prior to Christ`s death, resurrection, ascension & glorification at the right hand of the Father on high.

 

Concerning the `fire ` of Christ`s holy presence, that will expose the hidden motives of our hearts & the judgment seat of Christ. Rewards or loss will be determined by the criteria as to what was accomplished for God under the anointing & guidance of the Holy Spirit; or whether the underlying motive was solely for the self-aggrandizement of the person.

 

Makes one continually check their motives, as Kwik posted on `Let`s Post,` by Hippie333.

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It must be remembered that Peter (2Peter 1) is NOT implying heaven but life as we presently experience it. Jesus said "i came that [you] might have life, and that [you] might have it more abundantly". John 10:10 (KJV)

 

"For if these things be in you, and abound, they make you that ye shall neither be barren nor unfruitful in the knowledge of our Lord Jesus Christ.
 But he that lacketh these things is blind, and cannot see afar off, and hath forgotten that he was purged from his old sins.
 Wherefore the rather, brethren, give diligence to make your calling and election sure: for if ye do these things, ye shall never fall:
 For so an entrance shall be ministered unto you abundantly into the everlasting kingdom of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ.

Wherefore I will not be negligent to put you always in remembrance of these things, though ye know them, and be established in the present truth." 2 Peter 1:8-12 (KJV)

 

{emphasis mine]
 

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On Topic:

 

Why should we care about rewards if heaven is the secured goal? Why should rewards be any sort of motivation? However, without "works", can we really come into the fullness of the reason set in the purposes of God for having created us __given to us as commands that only intimacy with Him can perfect in us the obedience of Jesus Christ?

 

Why should we care about rewards if heaven is the secured goal?

 

This sentence is a complete contradiction and makes no sense. To clear this confusion we dont go to Heaven...If anyone can please find me scriptures saying we go to heaven please show me??

 

However our rewards are in Heaven but only because its kept save there presently

I Peter 1 :3-4 ..."kept safe for you in heaven"

 

Then this is what Jesus does with our rewards

Revelation 22: 12 ... "I am coming soon, and my rewards are with me" to give to each person according to what he has done"

 

Heaven is not our assured goal...God never promised us Heaven.

 

Therefore our rewards are our assured Goals which is by faith and by works which we receive here on earth when Jesus comes as He brings the rewards with him as He just stated in Rev 22:12

 

James 2:20-24 - 20 How foolish! Can’t you see that faith without good deeds is useless?

21 Don’t you remember that our ancestor Abraham was shown to be right with God by his actions when he offered his son Isaac on the altar? 22 You see, his faith and his actions worked together. His actions made his faith complete. 23 And so it happened just as the Scriptures say: “Abraham believed God, and God counted him as righteous because of his faith.”[a] He was even called the friend of God.[b] 24 So you see, we are shown to be right with God by what we do, not by faith alone

 

Works and Faith go together like hand in glove

 

You need to tell all that to the OSAS crowd __ my inspiration for posting. . . . ;)

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How do we find out what it is if we have no "intimacy" with Him?

 

We need to grow in our personal relations with Christ through faith to have any "intimacy"  How does one grow in faith? 

Romans 10:17

 

So then faith comes by hearing, and hearing by the word of God.

Keep in mind that hearing is the only means which scripture used to be passed from one to another in those days., Today, we have His word provided for us to read, study and meditate on.

What does this faith produce? We find that answer in 2 Peter 1:5-11

 

But also for this very reason, giving all diligence, add to your faith virtue, to virtue knowledge, to knowledge self-control, to self-control perseverance, to perseverance godliness, to godliness brotherly kindness, and to brotherly kindness love. For if these things are yours and abound, you will be neither barren nor unfruitful in the knowledge of our Lord Jesus Christ. For he who lacks these things is shortsighted, even to blindness, and has forgotten that he was cleansed from his old sins.

Therefore, brethren, be even more diligent to make your call and election sure, for if you do these things you will never stumble; for so an entrance will be supplied to you abundantly into the everlasting kingdom of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ.

 

Paul wrote that he lived "by the faith of the Son of God", cf Gal.2:20. Might we see that that is the enabling gift of intimacy intended to be made fast to us by the Holy Spirit, per 2 Pet 1:5-11?

 

*[not one's elementary "saving faith" here __ and yet it could be if that was the actuality of his salvation]

 

Galatians states: "I have been crucified with Christ; it is no longer I who live, but Christ lives in me; and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by faith in the Son of God, who loved me and gave Himself for me." I will agree that without Christ in us, living through us, there would be no intimacy, but I do not equate this to 2 Peter. 2 Peter is a lesson on how to grow in Him, one step upon another, so we will know what our calling and election is. Even a baby in Christ can have a far more intimate relationship with Christ than someone who has read scripture all their lives, building one upon another so not to stumble. A relationship derives from the heart, not the actions. The actions can reveal what is in the heart, for we will know them by their fruits, but we cannot know how their relationship with Christ is by their fruits, only if they are His or not..

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How do we find out what it is if we have no "intimacy" with Him?

 

We need to grow in our personal relations with Christ through faith to have any "intimacy"  How does one grow in faith? 

Romans 10:17

 

So then faith comes by hearing, and hearing by the word of God.

Keep in mind that hearing is the only means which scripture used to be passed from one to another in those days., Today, we have His word provided for us to read, study and meditate on.

What does this faith produce? We find that answer in 2 Peter 1:5-11

 

But also for this very reason, giving all diligence, add to your faith virtue, to virtue knowledge, to knowledge self-control, to self-control perseverance, to perseverance godliness, to godliness brotherly kindness, and to brotherly kindness love. For if these things are yours and abound, you will be neither barren nor unfruitful in the knowledge of our Lord Jesus Christ. For he who lacks these things is shortsighted, even to blindness, and has forgotten that he was cleansed from his old sins.

Therefore, brethren, be even more diligent to make your call and election sure, for if you do these things you will never stumble; for so an entrance will be supplied to you abundantly into the everlasting kingdom of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ.

 

Paul wrote that he lived "by the faith of the Son of God", cf Gal.2:20. Might we see that that is the enabling gift of intimacy intended to be made fast to us by the Holy Spirit, per 2 Pet 1:5-11?

 

*[not one's elementary "saving faith" here __ and yet it could be if that was the actuality of his salvation]

 

Galatians states: "I have been crucified with Christ; it is no longer I who live, but Christ lives in me; and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by faith in the Son of God, who loved me and gave Himself for me." I will agree that without Christ in us, living through us, there would be no intimacy, but I do not equate this to 2 Peter. 2 Peter is a lesson on how to grow in Him, one step upon another, so we will know what our calling and election is. 

 

Paul, in effect, is saying he has arrived at that "fulfillment" he exhorts all to progress to by his writings, especially Romans 8 which can viewed as the Christian's spiritual "promised land". Try to keep that in mind when you read him __ and John's letters . [1 John 2 in particular.]

 

2 Peter 1 is addressed to those living in the "promise" who have not yet attained the fulfillment of it. Think of it in the natural as the children of Israel who had the promise but had to be proven before entering it. In the NT spiritual it is the new born who begins his journey culminating in Romans 8 and from that point on, never ending if he remains grounded and settled in the faith. cf Col 1:1-23.

 

"Even a baby in Christ can have a far more intimate relationship with Christ than someone who has read scripture all their lives, building one upon another so not to stumble. A relationship derives from the heart, not the actions. The actions can reveal what is in the heart, for we will know them by their fruits, but we cannot know how their relationship with Christ is by their fruits, only if they are His or not.."

 

For one thing the translation should read: "Wherefore the rather, brethren, give diligence to make your calling and election sure: for if ye do these things, ye shall never fall: 2 Peter 1:10 (KJV) All of this from Peter is preparatory for Col. 1:1-23.

 

Intimacy simply means : "Into me He sees". A baby cannot see into the Father until he "learns" the Father, to "know Him". That takes time and testing with the reward being eternally Great. cf John 17:3.

 

"but we cannot know how their relationship with Christ is by their fruits,"

 

Why not? Are we not to be conformed to His image? Again, John 17:3. It is the process of learning Him that God calls the end of His will for all who claim His Name..

 

What do you know concerning the baptism of Jesus Christ and its purpose? Can you  speak of it as something gifted in the afterwards of salvation?

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 Cross Reference

 

You need to tell all that to the OSAS crowd __ my inspiration for posting. . . .  ;)

 

I gathered as much, I thought I would be cheeky and bet you to the punch line :)

LOL!!!! <I love it, Bro.>

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Paul, in effect, is saying he has arrived at that "fulfillment" he exhorts all to progress to by his writings, especially Romans 8 which can viewed as the Christian's spiritual "promised land". Try to keep that in mind when you read him __ and John's letters . [1 John 2 in particular.]

All scripture flows together and is not centered in any one chapter, but on God. Try to keep this in mind when you study.

 

2 Peter 1 is addressed to those living in the "promise" who have not yet attained the fulfillment of it. Think of it in the natural as the children of Israel who had the promise but had to be proven before entering it. In the NT spiritual it is the new born who begins his journey culminating in Romans 8 and from that point on, never ending if he remains grounded and settled in the faith. cf Col 1:1-23.

2 Peter 1 instructs one in how to live and mature in Christ so when they do His will, which is their calling and election, they will not question if they are doing His will or not and will not stumble or fall.

 

"Even a baby in Christ can have a far more intimate relationship with Christ than someone who has read scripture all their lives, building one upon another so not to stumble. A relationship derives from the heart, not the actions. The actions can reveal what is in the heart, for we will know them by their fruits, but we cannot know how their relationship with Christ is by their fruits, only if they are His or not.."

 

For one thing the translation should read: "Wherefore the rather, brethren, give diligence to make your calling and election sure: for if ye do these things, ye shall never fall: 2 Peter 1:10 (KJV) All of this from Peter is preparatory for Col. 1:1-23.

The Greek word ptaiste means "ye-should-be-tripping". Call it stumbling or call it falling, makes no difference to me, though stumbling is more like tripping than falling is.

How can 2 Peter be preparatory for Colossians when it was written after Colossians?

 

Intimacy simply means : "Into me He sees". A baby cannot see into the Father until he "learns" the Father, to "know Him". That takes time and testing with the reward being eternally Great. cf John 17:3.

I am not sure what dictionary you are using, but that is not the meaning of intimacy.

 

in·ti·ma·cy

1. the state of being intimate.

2. a close, familiar, and usually affectionate or loving personal relationship with another person or group.

3. a close association with or detailed knowledge or deep understanding of a place, subject, period of history, etc.: an intimacy with Japan.

4. an act or expression serving as a token of familiarity, affection, or the like: to allow the intimacy of using first names.

5. an amorously familiar act; liberty.

A relationship with Christ is based on the second meaning: a close, familiar, and usually affectionate or loving personal relationship with CHrist

 

"but we cannot know how their relationship with Christ is by their fruits,"

 

Why not? Are we not to be conformed to His image? Again, John 17:3. It is the process of learning Him that God calls the end of His will for all who claim His Name..

 

What do you know concerning the baptism of Jesus Christ and its purpose? Can you  speak of it as something gifted in the afterwards of salvation?

One can see if they are His, but one cannot know the depth of their commitment with Him by their actions. Look around at all the false teachers and false prophets who claim the name of Christ and His anointing when they preach and teach. If we are to use their fruit, then their following would provide a reason to believe they are from God. We can know that they are not His, but how close or how far they are from Him we cannot know. Only God knows the hearts of men.

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