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Woman , Man Child, dragon


justfaith

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I have read that some thinks that after Rev. chapter 5 everything is future, after the rapture.

so chapter 12 would be all future then

The child could not be Jesus because has already came.

or a war in heaven for Satan to fall from still in the future ?

So we will be up there together with Satan after the rapture is done ? 

 

Who wants to go to heaven if the Devil is up there with you.

Its suppose to a lovely place waiting for us right ?

 

If Rev.12 woman is Israel - have they not already been in the wilderness during the dark ages, scattered all over the place ?

Seem like if we read it this way - The Devil did go after her and persecuted her thru the time by the Catholics, Germany, Russia, Spain, Muslims, ....

 

The moon - consider -the Old Testament Laws was a foundation to bring them to Christ.

The sun - the better promises - Jesus is the sun or son.

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- Always Remember The Woman John Seen Go Into The Wilderness. - Rev.12

- Is The Woman John Went Into The Wilderness To See The Judgment Of. - Rev.17

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Revelation 12:14-17

14 And to the woman were given two wings of a great eagle, that she might fly into the wilderness, into her place, where she is nourished for a time, and times, and half a time, from the face of the serpent.

15 And the serpent cast out of his mouth water as a flood after the woman, that he might cause her to be carried away of the flood.

16 And the earth helped the woman, and the earth opened her mouth, and swallowed up the flood which the dragon cast out of his mouth.

17 And the dragon was wroth with the woman, and went to make war with the remnant of her seed, which keep the commandments of God, and have the testimony of Jesus Christ.

According to these scriptures the woman is good, she has children(man child) keeping the commandments of God.

This happens at a later time, after 3 1/2 times.

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1) Who is the woman ?

2) What does clothed in the sun , moon under feet and 12 crowns mean ?

3) When did this happen ?

4) Where is the wilderness ?

5) What is meant by thousand two hundred and threescore days ?

 

3) When. Jesus told John,

 

Write the things which thou hast seen [past], and the things which are [present], and the things which shall be hereafter [future]. Rev. 1:19

 

“The things seen” are told in 1:20. “The things which are” are told in Rev. 2-3: the letters to the 7 churches of John's time. Then, beginning in Rev. 4:1, John is told:

 

After this I looked, and, behold, a door [was] opened in heaven: and the first voice which I heard [was] as it were of a trumpet talking with me; which said, Come up hither, and I will shew thee things which must be hereafter. Rev. 4:1

 

Everything John was shown from 4:1 onward is future from his day: this includes everything in chapter 12. The birth and ascent of the Manchild seen in verse 5 is future (although the birth and ascent of Jesus was of the same pattern and type). Jesus himself tells us who the Manchild shall be:

 

[H]e that overcometh, and keepeth my works unto the end, to him will I give power over the nations: And he shall rule them with a rod of iron; as the vessels of a potter shall they be broken to shivers: even as I received of my Father. Rev. 2:26-27

 

The Manchild, a collective body of the elect-of-the-elect overcomers, will participate in the casting down of Satan and his angels from heaven, 12:7-11.

 

And they overcame him [satan] by the blood of the Lamb, and by the word of their testimony; and they loved not their lives unto the death. 12:11

 

This cannot refer to Michael and his angels, only to men.

 

1) Who is the Woman? Like the Manchild, the Woman-with-child is a mystical body. Not the Church, which is a Virgin Bride. And not the race of Israel, which is flesh-and-blood.

Western left-brain Protestant Christianity has largely ignored any concept of the Feminine Divine, even though the Adamic race was “made in Elohim's image, male and female.” Catholicism has carnalized the Feminine Divine into the person of Mary. Only mystical Judaism, and to some extent mystical Christianity, have spoken of the Feminine Divine.

Hebraic tradition says that one of the attributes of the One God is the emotional desire to form, gestate, bring forth and nurture living creatures. This tradition also says that when Adam and Eve were cast out of God's garden into the earthly wilderness, this Divine Feminine either went with them or regularly visited them, in order to nurture her children as any mother would. The most well-known name for her is the Shekhinah, the feminine Presence/form of the Divine.

This mystical Woman/mother – emotionally bound to the nurturing of her children, and to their upbringing in wisdom, righteousness, and maturity – is spoken of in Ezekiel:

 

What [is] thy mother? A lioness: she lay down among lions, she nourished her whelps among young lions. … Thy mother [is] like a vine in thy blood, planted by the waters: she was fruitful and full of branches by reason of many waters. And she had strong rods for the sceptres of them that bare rule, and her stature was exalted among the thick branches, and she appeared in her height with the multitude of her branches. But she was plucked up in fury, she was cast down to the ground, and the east wind dried up her fruit: her strong rods were broken and withered; the fire consumed them. And now she [is] planted in the wilderness, in a dry and thirsty ground. 19:2, 10-13

 

Notice here how she again goes into the wilderness when her offspring are cast down/out.

 

4) Where is the wilderness? The wilderness is always a place apart from the comforts of civilization, wherein God tries and tests his people. There he separates and rejects the rebels, and teaches the obedient his torah/doctrine/Way. The wilderness is an unpopulated or sparsely populated place, generally a desert and/or mountainous region. (In our land, many visionaries have foreseen it to be the Intermountain West, which is just such a place.)

 

2) Clothed with the sun.

his [Jesus'] countenance was as the sun shineth in his strength. Rev. 1:16

In him was life; and the life was the light of men. …the true Light, which lighteth every man that cometh into the world. John 1:4, 9

For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ. Gal. 3:27

let us put on the armour of light. Rom. 13:12

 

2) the moon under her feet… The moon is symbolic of the types and shadows of the Mosaic Law. All of the OT feast days derive their times from the position of the moon.

“Under her feet”: the symbolism appear to be twofold. First, the Mosaic Law represents an earthly level of spirituality. Second, it represents a foundation/basis for upper levels of wisdom and sanctification.

 

2) on her head a crown/stephanos of 12 stars. In the NT, a stephanos invariably symbolizes honors and authority achieved through overcoming, gaining the victory: a “stephanos of rejoicing,” “of righteousness,” “of life,” “of glory.” 1 Thes. 2:19; 2 Tim. 4:8; James 1:12; 1 Pet. 5:4 This type of victory only became possible after the advent of Christ, through the reception of the Holy Spirit. Therefore, the 12 stars in the stephanos represent Apostolic authority to overcome the world, pride, and the flesh.

The other NT word for crown, diadema, refers to regal authority-by-descent. Only Satan, the Beast, and Christ wear diadems. The Beast will receive his crowns and throne from Satan (Rev. 13:1-2). Satan gained his from Adam, to whom it was originally authorized (Gen. 1:26, 28), before Adam submitted himself to the serpent's word. Christ overcame Satan, thus earning back regal authority over Earth. (Only Christ is able to wear both stephanos and diadema.)

 

5) What is meant by 1260 days? 1260 literal days. While there have been day-for-a-year fulfillments of this period in type, these are now past. The 1260 days/42 months/3½ times take place during the period of the 7 Trumpets, and the Mouth of the Beast (Rev. 13:5) = Daniel's Little Horn (Dan. 7:25), and the Two Witnesses (Rev. 11:3). Jeremiah 30:7 calls it “the time of Jacob's trouble.” This is “the remnant of Jacob” spoken of in many OT prophecies.

 

When Christ appears in the clouds to take up the elect/chosen of his Church, “every eye shall see him.” Rev. 1:7 At that time, all of earthly Israel will see their true Messiah. Many of them will undergo 1260 days of wilderness trials, to become either submissive and sanctified, or separated and purged. At the 7th Trumpet, Christ will then begin to establish his earthly kingdom. So, beginning at the 7th Trumpet,

 

the remnant of Jacob shall be among the Gentiles in the midst of many people as a lion among the beasts of the forest, as a young lion among the flocks of sheep: who, if he go through, both treadeth down, and teareth in pieces, and none can deliver. Thine hand shall be lifted up upon thine adversaries, and all thine enemies shall be cut off. Micah 5:8-9

 

And he [the Little Horn] shall speak [great] words against the most High, and shall wear out the saints of the most High, and think to change times and laws: and they shall be given into his hand until a time and times and the dividing of time [= 1260 days]. But the judgment shall sit, and they shall take away his dominion, to consume and to destroy [it] unto the end. And the kingdom and dominion, and the greatness of the kingdom under the whole heaven, shall be given to the people of the saints of the most High, whose kingdom [is] an everlasting kingdom, and all dominions shall serve and obey him. Dan.7:25-27

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Revelation 12 King James Version (KJV)

12 And there appeared a great wonder in heaven; a woman clothed with the sun, and the moon under her feet, and upon her head a crown of twelve stars:

And she being with child cried, travailing in birth, and pained to be delivered.

And there appeared another wonder in heaven; and behold a great red dragon, having seven heads and ten horns, and seven crowns upon his heads.

And his tail drew the third part of the stars of heaven, and did cast them to the earth: and the dragon stood before the woman which was ready to be delivered, for to devour her child as soon as it was born.

And she brought forth a man child, who was to rule all nations with a rod of iron: and her child was caught up unto God, and to his throne.

And the woman fled into the wilderness, where she hath a place prepared of God, that they should feed her there a thousand two hundred and threescore days.

 

 

Who is the woman ?

What does clothed in the sun , moon under feet and 12 crowns mean ?

When did this happen ?

where is the wilderness?

what is meant by thousand two hundred and threescore days. ?

Just faith.

 

The woman is Zion, God's holy woman.  Not a real woman, but his doctrine from heaven is symbolised as a woman because women give birth and multiply.

This Woman (God's doctrine) is clothed in "Truth"  depicted as the sun because it's bright.  The truth is full of light.

The moon under her feet shows God''s woman (his doctrine) is from above, not below.  It's heavenly, not earthly.

The wilderness is the world, Satan's domain.  Just to give you a couple of examples here;

 

 Job 39:6   Whose house I have made the wilderness, and the barren land his dwellings.

Psalms 74:14   Thou brakest the heads of leviathan in pieces, and gavest him to be meat to the people inhabiting the wilderness.

 

The 1260 days is just short of three and a half years.  After Jesus death and resurrection, Jesus returned and was here teaching the apostles for 40 days. 

Having the holy spirit now, they were well instructed by Christ and the doctrine was solid.

After Jesus left, the apostles went in hiding.  They were instructed to go to Antioch.  They were kept protected there from persecutions, although some were killed, but the true doctrine was preserved

They wrote letters to the churches, and would of made copies preserving the word.  All this was done in the world (wilderness) but in hiding from the world.  The truth was preserved. So Antioch was their headquarters, and they came and went, and returned.

 

Acts 11:26   And when he had found him, he brought him unto Antioch. And it came to pass, that a whole year they assembled themselves with the church, and taught much people. And the disciples were called Christians first in Antioch.

Acts 11:27   And in these days came prophets from Jerusalem unto Antioch.

Acts 13:1   Now there were in the church that was at Antioch certain prophets and teachers; as Barnabas, and Simeon that was called Niger, and Lucius of Cyrene, and Manaen, which had been brought up with Herod the tetrarch, and Saul.

 

 Acts 14:21   And when they had preached the gospel to that city, and had taught many, they returned again to Lystra, and to Iconium, and Antioch,

 Acts 14:26   And thence sailed to Antioch, from whence they had been recommended to the grace of God for the work which they fulfilled.

 Acts 15:22   Then pleased it the apostles and elders, with the whole church, to send chosen men of their own company to Antioch with Paul and Barnabas; namely, Judas surnamed Barsabas, and Silas, chief men among the brethren:

 Acts 15:23   And they wrote letters by them after this manner; The apostles and elders and brethren send greeting unto the brethren which are of the Gentiles in Antioch and Syria and Cilicia:

  Acts 15:30   So when they were dismissed, they came to Antioch: and when they had gathered the multitude together, they delivered the epistle:

  Acts 15:35   Paul also and Barnabas continued in Antioch, teaching and preaching the word of the Lord, with many others also.

 

 

This is the 1260 days that they fled into the wilderness and she was fed, meaning God's true doctrine was being fed and preached amongst themselves and to the Jews & gentiles. 

 

The crown of 12 stars on the woman's head depicts the 12 tribes of Israel.  God chose them from the beginning, and this is when he first showed himself with his likes and dislikes, revealing himself to this people first.

This is true history, and God will use Israel again during the millennium when he heals them.

The heavenly Jerusalem coming down during the millennium in Rev 21, you will notice that the 12 gates are named after the 12 tribes of Israel.

God has not forgotten them, and the world will know who they are.

They will be grafted on to the tree in the millennium, but they are only flesh.  The gentiles will now have to go through them as Israel will be taught by Christ and the saints, in the kingdom on earth, for knowledge to cover the earth.

 

So you see the woman can not be Israel, for she has them on her head.  Israel will be resting on God's true doctrine.  This is a prophecy.  Israel was and will be. 

 

Sister - you have given me a number of keys with this insight. Thanks. 

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This is much too complicated for me to try and put into my own words, but it get my interest when I was looking at that will be in the sky that might look like what Revelation talks about......       I cycled through about 200 years until I landed on September 23rd, 2017....

 

After doing some googling to see if anyone else had come to this conclusion I ran across this site and it sounds rather intrieging.

 

http://watchfortheday.org/1260tetrad.html

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This is much too complicated for me to try and put into my own words, but it get my interest when I was looking at that will be in the sky that might look like what Revelation talks about......       I cycled through about 200 years until I landed on September 23rd, 2017....

 

After doing some googling to see if anyone else had come to this conclusion I ran across this site and it sounds rather intrieging.

 

http://watchfortheday.org/1260tetrad.html

 

Not much of a stargazer but its an interesting connection.

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Edited by Watching for Jesus
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It is plain, of course, that Beauty is a mother,

for all have drunk from her breast.

I have seen the long line of convinced sinners turned around by her caress.

Oh, I too have felt her sacred smile.

It was poured, poured into my own abyss

when just a small apocalypse ago

she mercifully entered in. …

 

Wisdom too is a woman – but old and plain.

At first glance she is a maiden aunt.

Few desire her.

Few have discovered her great secret, the sweetness of her glance. …

 

It is the elder you should court.

In time of locusts and brittle twigs,

when bushes of holy fire refuse to ignite,

and your heart is a bowl emptied by cold wind,

all your grain scattered and your soul become sterility,

she will sit by the void where you have been planted,

where no word, no voice, is heard.

Where only an absurd wind contradicts the bad news,

she will be your companion, for she is the patroness of all inhospitable soil. 

 

[-- that is, wilderness.]

 

Sophia House, pp. 204-5; a 2005 novel by Michael D. O'Brien, Catholic writer/painter/mystic.

 

It is brought forth in the novel, as in Rev. 12 and Ezek. 19, that Beautiful mother and plain Wisdom are really the same woman, depending upon whether her children are living in glory, or are living in barren wilderness. That is, whether in heaven, or on earth. Rev. 12 shows us that it will be both.

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