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xyluz

ARE WE RIGHTEOUS?

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I was in the chat room and a discussion came up, for clarity and to avoid any form of argument i was advised to bring it here...

 

Are we sinners?

 

Should a Christian still call himself a sinner?

 

Are we righteous?

 

My Opinion: 

 

Yes, we're not perfect, and yes we have no righteousness of our own... but if after the death of our lord, and after we accept him as Lord and Savior we still remain sinners... what then is the point of His death?

 

My illustration is this, we all go to the bank, and perform normal customer transactions... but none of us will claim to be a banker except we actually work in a bank... to me, the same applies to this issue... We might one time or another fall into iniquity, when we do... we recognize our fault and repent... and turn to our father for forgiveness.

 

My tentative conclusion is this (tentative because i am very open to corrections)...

 

As believers, we WERE sinners, but now, we ARE not sinners... 

 

I will really like to get your view on this, thank you.

Edited by xyluz

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Xy, 

I have moved your thread here as it was posted in the video forum, I have left a link. 

 

God Bless, 

Nigel.

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Guest shiloh357

I was in the chat room and a discussion came up, for clarify and to avoid any form of argument i was advised to bring it here...

 

Are we sinners?

 

Should a Christian still call himself a sinner?

 

Are we righteous?

 

My Opinion: 

 

Yes, we're not perfect, and yes we have no righteousness of our own... but if after the death of our lord, and after we accept him as Lord and Savior we still remain sinners... what then is the point of His death?

 

My illustration is this, we all go to the bank, and perform normal customer transactions... but none of us will claim to be a banker except we actually work in a bank... to me, the same applies to this issue... We might one time or another fall into iniquity, when we do... we recognize our fault and repent... and turn to our father for forgiveness.

 

My tentative conclusion is this (tentative because i am very open to corrections)...

 

As believers, we WERE sinners, but now, we ARE not sinners... 

 

I will really like to get your view on this, thank you.

  Righteousness is imputed to us.  We are not yet made rightesous.   We are redeemed sinners, but we are still  sinners and will be until sin is eradicated.

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I would say that a believer is a sinner saved by grace.

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Are we sinners still?  I refer to the above comment by Blue Moon: "I would say that a believer is a sinner saved by grace."

 

And to this one by Shiloh357: " Righteousness is imputed to us.  We are not yet made righteous."  

 

I can't form better responses than these two comments..

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I heard a preach the other day that we are to be broken sinners and servants in order to do great things. Kind of like a prerequisite.

 

Rubbish! 

 

I am not broken nor am I a servant. 

 

The very Spirit that raised Jesus from the grave is within me, from the day I was saved. I am not broken!

 

A servant does not inherit. A son or daughter does! I am a heir to everything that Jesus has to offer! I am a son not a servant! 

 

But I am a Spirit filled servant hearted sinner.

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Guest shiloh357

I think you might be misunderstanding what he means by being broken.  Brokenness is a state of complete surrender, of giving everything we have and are to the Lord.

 

We are servants.  Paul called himself a servant.   Jesus applied the term servant to Himself.  We cannot live on a higher moral or spiritual plain than either of them.  

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I think you might be misunderstanding what he means by being broken.  Brokenness is a state of complete surrender, of giving everything we have and are to the Lord.

 

We are servants.  Paul called himself a servant.   Jesus applied the term servant to Himself.  We cannot live on a higher moral or spiritual plain than either of them.  

In the context of the preach you may have agreed with me.

 

Can you show me a scripture describing broken as you define it?

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I think you might be misunderstanding what he means by being broken.  Brokenness is a state of complete surrender, of giving everything we have and are to the Lord.

 

We are servants.  Paul called himself a servant.   Jesus applied the term servant to Himself.  We cannot live on a higher moral or spiritual plain than either of them.  

In the context of the preach you may have agreed with me.

 

Can you show me a scripture describing broken as you define it?

 

 

Psalm 34:18 in context, could mean that. Psalm 51:17 is as clear as a bell.

 

 

Psalm 34:15-18English Standard Version (ESV)

The eyes of the Lord are toward the righteous

    and his ears toward their cry.

16 The face of the Lord is against those who do evil,

    to cut off the memory of them from the earth.

17 

When the righteous cry for help, the Lord hears

    and delivers them out of all their troubles.

 

18 

The Lord is near to the brokenhearted

    and saves the crushed in spirit.

 

Psalm 51:17English Standard Version (ESV)

17 The sacrifices of God are a broken spirit;

    a broken and contrite heart, O God, you will not despise.

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