wingnut- Posted March 13, 2018 Group: Royal Member Followers: 39 Topic Count: 101 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 7,673 Content Per Day: 1.31 Reputation: 7,358 Days Won: 67 Joined: 04/22/2008 Status: Offline Share Posted March 13, 2018 4 hours ago, Da Puppers said: Who are those that participate in the FIRST RESURRECTION? Matthew 27:50 And Jesus cried out again with a loud voice and yielded up his spirit. 51 And behold, the curtain of the temple was torn in two, from top to bottom. And the earth shook, and the rocks were split. 52 The tombs also were opened. And many bodies of the saints who had fallen asleep were raised, 53 and coming out of the tombs after His resurrection they went into the holy city and appeared to many. That would be your Old Testament saints. Paul elaborates on this. Ephesians 4:8 Therefore it says, “When He ascended on high He led a host of captives, and He gave gifts to men.” 9 (In saying, “He ascended,” what does it mean but that He had also descended into the lower regions, the earth? 10 He who descended is the one who also ascended far above all the heavens, that He might fill all things.) Also Peter. I Peter 3:18 For Christ also suffered once for sins, the righteous for the unrighteous, that he might bring us to God, being put to death in the flesh but made alive in the spirit, 19 in which he went and proclaimed to the spirits in prison, 20 because they formerly did not obey, when God's patience waited in the days of Noah, while the ark was being prepared, in which a few, that is, eight persons, were brought safely through water. Now that we have properly identified the firstfruits, it should clear up who takes part in the first resurrection John writes of in Revelation, which is specifically about that time, not the past. I Corinthians 15:23 But each in his own order: Christ the firstfruits, then at His coming those who belong to Christ. God bless Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wingnut- Posted March 13, 2018 Group: Royal Member Followers: 39 Topic Count: 101 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 7,673 Content Per Day: 1.31 Reputation: 7,358 Days Won: 67 Joined: 04/22/2008 Status: Offline Share Posted March 13, 2018 1 minute ago, naominash said: I was wondering earlier what exactly was Jesus proclaiming to the spirits in prison. Was he giving them a chance to be saved as well? If not, what was He proclaiming? The gospel. He was offering them the kingdom, just as He had done for the living during His ministry. Those who accepted Him as Messiah were saved, and Abraham's bosom was emptied out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wingnut- Posted March 13, 2018 Group: Royal Member Followers: 39 Topic Count: 101 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 7,673 Content Per Day: 1.31 Reputation: 7,358 Days Won: 67 Joined: 04/22/2008 Status: Offline Share Posted March 13, 2018 15 minutes ago, Da Puppers said: 1 Peter 3 is about Jesus preaching to the souls of men who's thoughts were evil continually. It says "in the days when the ark was preparing". I think you are missing the context, so let's break it down and look at what Peter says and follow his line of thought. I Peter 3:18 For Christ also suffered once for sins, the righteous for the unrighteous, that he might bring us to God, being put to death in the flesh but made alive in the spirit, So for one, this is talking about the Spirit being made alive. I Peter 3:19 in which he went and proclaimed to the spirits in prison, In the Spirit, He went and proclaimed to the spirits. I Peter 3:20 because they formerly did not obey, when God's patience waited in the days of Noah, while the ark was being prepared, in which a few, that is, eight persons, were brought safely through water. Formerly, they were alive, and they did not obey. Peter isn't talking about Noah and his family here, Noah obeyed, which is why he built the ark. He is talking about those who perished, as in, dead people. Their prison was Sheol, also referred to as Abraham's bosom. What you failed to address, is what is stated in Matthew, Paul and Peter are simply confirming something that was already revealed to us, scripture confirming scripture. From the time the veil was torn in two, things changed. Where do you believe you go when you die? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wingnut- Posted March 13, 2018 Group: Royal Member Followers: 39 Topic Count: 101 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 7,673 Content Per Day: 1.31 Reputation: 7,358 Days Won: 67 Joined: 04/22/2008 Status: Offline Share Posted March 13, 2018 18 minutes ago, Da Puppers said: To answer your last question first. There are 4 places reserved for the spirits of dead men. Paradise, death, hell, and perdition, also known as the bottomless pit. Where is this found in scripture? 20 minutes ago, Da Puppers said: Why do you keep bringing up Matt? These people came out of the graves, after his resurrection as the firstfruits of the resurrection. They were not raised by Jesus in the likeness as Lazarus. It does not say that they died again. So what's the problem? Paradise is beneath the altar that is before the throne. This is the point, they did not die again, they were raised as the firstfruits. They were seen, and moved about Jerusalem appearing to people before they ascended. The problem with what you propose is this, one cannot be before the throne if they have not accepted Jesus. People who lived and died before He came had not heard the gospel, UNTIL He descended and proclaimed it to them. Those that accepted Him, then came out of their tombs. 25 minutes ago, Da Puppers said: These 4 compartments are identified in the book of Enoch and are confirmed in scripture. The book of Enoch doesn't sell here and is not part of scripture. The SoF for the site states that we hold to the canon of the 66 books found in the Holy Bible. Enoch is not amongst them, so it holds no weight in the discussion. 30 minutes ago, Da Puppers said: Did you get that? Death and Hell. The abodes of the wicked. Revelation 6:7 When he opened the fourth seal, I heard the voice of the fourth living creature say, “Come!” 8 And I looked, and behold, a pale horse! And its rider's name was Death, and Hades followed him. And they were given authority over a fourth of the earth, to kill with sword and with famine and with pestilence and by wild beasts of the earth. So, let me get this straight, one abode of the dead is going to be riding the pale horse, and another abode of the dead is following the first abode of the dead? And these two abodes of the dead are going to be given authority over 1/4 of the earth to kill by all these means? Pretty talented abodes. Sorry, but no, I don't get that. God bless Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daniel 11:36 Posted March 13, 2018 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 2 Topic Count: 10 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 1,957 Content Per Day: 0.56 Reputation: 295 Days Won: 0 Joined: 10/17/2014 Status: Offline Share Posted March 13, 2018 One goes back to God who will keep the spirits of all people for future involvement .... no person has gone back to God except Jesus Christ who has always lived past, present, and future Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OneLight Posted March 13, 2018 Group: Royal Member Followers: 22 Topic Count: 1,294 Topics Per Day: 0.21 Content Count: 31,762 Content Per Day: 5.24 Reputation: 9,760 Days Won: 115 Joined: 09/14/2007 Status: Offline Share Posted March 13, 2018 23 minutes ago, Daniel 11:36 said: One goes back to God who will keep the spirits of all people for future involvement .... no person has gone back to God except Jesus Christ who has always lived past, present, and future Makes one wonder where Enoch and Elijah went ... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daniel 11:36 Posted March 13, 2018 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 2 Topic Count: 10 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 1,957 Content Per Day: 0.56 Reputation: 295 Days Won: 0 Joined: 10/17/2014 Status: Offline Share Posted March 13, 2018 (edited) "Makes one wonder where Enoch and Elijah went" They are both waiting for the Lord's next move to immortalize them There is no time extent for those who have died .... so they will be awakened at the Lord's call just as if no time has passed Edited March 13, 2018 by Daniel 11:36 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OneLight Posted March 14, 2018 Group: Royal Member Followers: 22 Topic Count: 1,294 Topics Per Day: 0.21 Content Count: 31,762 Content Per Day: 5.24 Reputation: 9,760 Days Won: 115 Joined: 09/14/2007 Status: Offline Share Posted March 14, 2018 1 hour ago, Daniel 11:36 said: "Makes one wonder where Enoch and Elijah went" They are both waiting for the Lord's next move to immortalize them There is no time extent for those who have died .... so they will be awakened at the Lord's call just as if no time has passed You have to admit Daniel, that is pure assumption. I am sure if you asked 100 different people to guess, you will get 100 different answers. I admit I just don't know. I woudl hope God took them for a good reason, not just so they can "soul sleep". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daniel 11:36 Posted March 14, 2018 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 2 Topic Count: 10 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 1,957 Content Per Day: 0.56 Reputation: 295 Days Won: 0 Joined: 10/17/2014 Status: Offline Share Posted March 14, 2018 "You have to admit Daniel, that is pure assumption" I don't think so Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
inchrist Posted March 15, 2018 Group: Non-Trinitarian Followers: 3 Topic Count: 0 Topics Per Day: 0 Content Count: 3,490 Content Per Day: 0.96 Reputation: 88 Days Won: 1 Joined: 04/29/2014 Status: Offline Share Posted March 15, 2018 On 13/03/2018 at 11:14 PM, Da Puppers said: . I never said nor believed that these people didn't believe in Jesus. Those are your ideas not mine. At least you agree that these people are the firstfruits of the resurrection of life, and reject the idea of an en masse only resurrecting of the righteous. I don't ascribe to any kind of empty compartment no longer occupied. Interesting yet you subscribe to words that don't exist in the bible? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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