Who is The 7th Kingdom Beast (and 8th) of Rev?

[angels4u]

On 2/29/2016 at 6:13 PM, Spock said:

 

REV 17: This calls for a mind with wisdom. The seven heads are seven hills on which the woman sits. 10They are also seven kings. Five have fallen, one is, the other has not yet come; but when he does come, he must remain for only a little while. 11The beast who once was, and now is not, is an eighth king. He belongs to the seven and is going to his destruction.

Notice, 7 heads= 7hills= 7 kingdoms

Rev 13:  The dragon gave the beast his power and his throne and great authority. 3One of the heads of the beast seemed to have had a fatal wound, but the fatal wound had been healed. The whole world was filled with wonder and followed the beast.

Most prophecy buffs say this:

THE 5 WHO HAVE FALLEN:

1. Egypt

2. Assyria

3. Babylon

4. Media- Persia

5 Greece

THE ONE WHO IS: 

6. Rome

THE ONE WHO HAS YET TO COME:

7.  ?????????   I assume this beast empire already has come, and it appears he will return in some form or fashion.  Did you notice that the beast that "now is not" also will be the 8th!  The fatal head would has been healed!!!! 

So who do you think fits the description?  Who has had their day once (persecuted Israel) and will once again rise up to persecute Israel and be the 8th (fatal head would healed)? 

A.   The Turks or Muslims.  The Ottoman Turks did rule over the Mid East for over 400 years until WWI.  They certainly persecuted Israel, just like everyone else on this list. 

B.  Nazi Germany:  Hitlers Third Reich certainly persecuted the Jews, and isn't there  something in the Bible that says the 7th will rule for a short time?  Is it possible that the demon spirit that ruled over Hitler might be released from the Abyss to rule over the 7th? 

C.  A revived EU?  I'm not sure where 10 kings will come from Europe, but I'm sure some of you have answers. 

D. A revived Roman Empire:  this seems unlikely to me because that means they would be the 6th, 7th, and 8th empire. 

E.   ??????  Fill in the blank.  

Dont forget, the 8th is of the 7th, so how do you see this play out?  

Thanks,

spock

 

 

 

http://shoebat.com/2015/06/01/erdogan-announces-the-ottoman-caliphate-the-fourth-kingdom-of-daniel-2-is-resurrecting-again/

What do you think?

[firestormx]

32 minutes ago, angels4u said:

http://shoebat.com/2015/06/01/erdogan-announces-the-ottoman-caliphate-the-fourth-kingdom-of-daniel-2-is-resurrecting-again/

What do you think?

Very interesting read

[angels4u]

On 2/29/2016 at 6:13 PM, Spock said:

 

REV 17: This calls for a mind with wisdom. The seven heads are seven hills on which the woman sits. 10They are also seven kings. Five have fallen, one is, the other has not yet come; but when he does come, he must remain for only a little while. 11The beast who once was, and now is not, is an eighth king. He belongs to the seven and is going to his destruction.

Notice, 7 heads= 7hills= 7 kingdoms

Rev 13:  The dragon gave the beast his power and his throne and great authority. 3One of the heads of the beast seemed to have had a fatal wound, but the fatal wound had been healed. The whole world was filled with wonder and followed the beast.

Most prophecy buffs say this:

THE 5 WHO HAVE FALLEN:

1. Egypt

2. Assyria

3. Babylon

4. Media- Persia

5 Greece

THE ONE WHO IS: 

6. Rome

THE ONE WHO HAS YET TO COME:

7.  ?????????   I assume this beast empire already has come, and it appears he will return in some form or fashion.  Did you notice that the beast that "now is not" also will be the 8th!  The fatal head would has been healed!!!! 

So who do you think fits the description?  Who has had their day once (persecuted Israel) and will once again rise up to persecute Israel and be the 8th (fatal head would healed)? 

A.   The Turks or Muslims.  The Ottoman Turks did rule over the Mid East for over 400 years until WWI.  They certainly persecuted Israel, just like everyone else on this list. 

B.  Nazi Germany:  Hitlers Third Reich certainly persecuted the Jews, and isn't there  something in the Bible that says the 7th will rule for a short time?  Is it possible that the demon spirit that ruled over Hitler might be released from the Abyss to rule over the 7th? 

C.  A revived EU?  I'm not sure where 10 kings will come from Europe, but I'm sure some of you have answers. 

D. A revived Roman Empire:  this seems unlikely to me because that means they would be the 6th, 7th, and 8th empire. 

E.   ??????  Fill in the blank.  

Dont forget, the 8th is of the 7th, so how do you see this play out?  

Thanks,

spock

 

 

 

 

It is interesting !

I posted a link about Turkey:

I

[douggg]

2 hours ago, angels4u said:

http://shoebat.com/2015/06/01/erdogan-announces-the-ottoman-caliphate-the-fourth-kingdom-of-daniel-2-is-resurrecting-again/

What do you think?

Hi angels4u, the article is treating the mortally wounded head and recovered head as a kingdom.    The text, however, in Revelation 17 says the heads are kings not kingdoms.     So the basis is wrong to start with.    And even if kingdoms is applied, Egyptian and Assyrian are not parts of either the Daniel 2 dream or the Daniel 7 vision.

Regarding the entire notion of the Mahdi being the beast is problematic on several levels.  First, in Islam theology the Mahdi is just a man who is not worshiped.    So any muslim who begins demanding worship - is violating one of the fundamental principles of Islam.   

Also in Ezekiel 39, Gog/Magog invasion, and defeat of Gog's army - it is the end of Islam as a religion, God's judgment on Islam for all the violence and lies it has done claiming to do so in his name, also a lie, of Allah.   

The timing of Gog/Magog is just preceding the 7 years, that begin when the person who becomes the Antichrist confirms the Mt. Sinai covenant for the 7 year cycle, a law Moses made in Deuteronomy 31:9-13 of all future generations.    The confirming is the reading of the law to the nation of Israel, from the place of God's choosing (the Jews take to be the temple mount) on the feast of Tabernacles.    The catch and why it hasn't been done in 2000 years is that the religious Jews have not had control of the temple mount.    The present problem that the muslim won't even let the Jews pray on the temple mount.

Following the destruction of Gog's army in Ezekiel 39 is 7 years of burning the remains of Gog's army weapons instead of wood.    It would appear to me to be the fuel left in the vehicles.     For the first half of the 7 years in the false messianic age, this will be done openly.    In the second half of the 7 years, as the Jews have fled to mountains during the time of the beast, the fuel will be scavenged from the vehicles scattered there, and there is also the canned rations that will be available in the various vehicles.

There are two feasts in Ezekiel 39,  and it is very important to note that they are not the same feasts.    One is in Ezekiel 39:4, the feast on Gog's army.    The cleanup of the land and discussion of Gog's army end in verse 39:16.... with thus they shall cleanse the land.   End of the prophecy regarding Gog/Magog,  39:16

And then insertion of the 7 years is between the lines of 39:16 and 39:17, before Ezekiel is told to prophesy about another feast in Ezekiel 39:17-20, the Armageddon feast,  which is followed by the Lord making his presence among the heathen here on earth.      The remainder of Ezekiel 39 is from the perspective of Jesus having returning and in retrospect of the 2000 years since his first coming.

Here is a brief of how Ezekiel 39 is structured.

Ezekiel 39:1 -16   Destruction of Gog's army, end of Islam as a religion

Between the lines of verses 16 and 17 - the 7 years,  the time of the Antichrist begin, first half; then the time of the person as the beast of Revelation 13,  the second half, ending with Jesus's return.

Ezekiel 39:17-20 the Armageddon feast, at the end of the 7 years.

Ezekiel 39:21-29 Jesus has returned and begins ruling the heathen, the nations, with a rod of iron, and the Lord reflects back over the past 2000 years since his first coming in 39:22-29.

 

 

Ezekiel 39:17-20 talks about another feast, larger in scope

 

 

 

Edited May 19, 2016 by douggg

[douggg]

1 hour ago, angels4u said:

C.  A revived EU?  I'm not sure where 10 kings will come from Europe, but I'm sure some of you have answers. 

D. A revived Roman Empire:  this seems unlikely to me because that means they would be the 6th, 7th, and 8th empire. 

E.   ??????  Fill in the blank.  

Dont forget, the 8th is of the 7th, so how do you see this play out?

It is not kingdoms to begin with in Revelation 17, but 7 kings associated with the place the woman sits...   Rome.

 I would not say a revived EU.     I would label the EU as the Roman Empire end times.    The ten kings, leaders, of the EU will be dependent upon the final form of the EU government over there.    We will know more as things develop.

The Roman Empire is the fourth empire (kingdom), the legs of iron.    The feet of iron and clay is the same fourth empire kingdom, but it is highlighted that some parts of it weak by the clay.     That the iron and clay don't cleave to one another, is that the cultures in the EU some don't mix well, such as, the Greeks and the Germans.

The king 8 is king 7 after he has been killed and brought back to life.    Those things are future of us, and will take place in the middle part of the 7 years.

King 7 is the little horn, who after a stint as the King of Israel, the Antichrist, is killed and comes back to life as the beast.     There is two components to the beast: the end times persons (the little horn) and the ancient person who is in the bottomless pit now - as a disembodied spirit, Nimrod imo.    My opinion is based upon Nimrod having become a nephillim as having the nephillim gene in him passed down (albeit his father was Cush), who when the Nephillim die become a demon.  

I was challenged by Diaste to prove that the nephillim become the demons from the bible.    There is not a direct source in the bible, but in Jude 1:14, there is reference to Enoch prophesying, which in the bible there is nothing containing a prophecy by Enoch.    So the source of that prophesy was probably the book of Enoch.    In the book of Enoch there are specific reference that the nephillim became the unclean spirits, the demons.    This is my understanding.    I am not that knowledgeable on the book of Enoch myself.

Anyway, king 7 is killed and comes back to life and is possessed by the beast, a demon, ascending out of the bottomless pit.   Come back to life, king 7 thus becomes king 8.

The reason I suspect Nimrod is because he lead the world in rebellion against God at the tower of Babel, and it is said that all false religions go back to that time, mainly from Semiramis, Nimrod's wife.

 

 

 

 

Edited May 19, 2016 by douggg

[douggg]

2 hours ago, BlindSeeker said:

and "five are FALLEN" is a pastense....

Yes.   And the "one is" ...... that's the present tense.

10 And there are seven kings: five are fallen, and one is, and the other is not yet come; and when he cometh, he must continue a short space.

The five fallen

1.   Julius Caesar

2.   Augustus Caesar

3.   Tiberius Caesar

4.   Caligula Caesar

5.    Claudius Caesar

The one is

6.   Nero Caesar - the last of the historic Julio-Claudian Caesar clan.

the other is not yet come

7.    the end times little horn

 

 

 

 

Edited May 19, 2016 by douggg

[BlindSeeker]

1 hour ago, douggg said:

Yes.   And the "one is" ...... that's the present tense.

10 And there are seven kings: five are fallen, and one is, and the other is not yet come; and when he cometh, he must continue a short space.

The five fallen

1.   Julius Caesar

2.   Augustus Caesar

3.   Tiberius Caesar

4.   Caligula Caesar

5.    Claudius Caesar

The one is

6.   Nero Caesar - the last of the historic Julio-Claudian Caesar clan.

the other is not yet come

7.    the end times little horn

 

 

 

 

uh, didn't 1-6 all sit upon the same mountain??

Revelation 17:9 = And here is the mind which hath wisdom. The seven heads are seven mountains, on which the woman sitteth. 10 And there are seven kings: five are fallen, and one is, and the other is not yet come; and when he cometh, he must continue a short space.

[BlindSeeker]

The visions given to Daniel were concerning the rise and fall of nations, the coming of Messiah, and definite end time events; all of which deal with “thy people and upon thy holy city.” we are given the specific account of the woman sitting on “seven mountains” to denote those empires which will have had a direct correlation with Israel leading up to the rise of the Eighth.

The fact that in Chapter 17 the woman is riding the Eight Beast reveals that the authority and power of another mountain, or empire, has once again been completely usurped by this woman through her seductive Jezebelian spirit; for she is now shown to be controlling the beast through her enchantments and manipulations. And just as Jezebel plotted to “war with the” righteous to kill them and steal their inheritance, so will the Eighth and the Mother of Harlots make war with those “which keep the commandments of God, and have the testimony of Jesus Christ.” However, just as Jezebel was thrown down and died, so will be the fate of this latter day spiritual Babylon.

Revelation 17:9 - And here is the mind which hath wisdom. The seven heads are seven mountains, on which the woman sitteth. 10 And there are seven kings: five are fallen, and one is, and the other is not yet come; and when he cometh, he must continue a short space. 11 And the beast that was, and is not, even he is the eighth, and is of the seven, and goeth into perdition.

Only by acknowledging the historic rise and fall of those empires which have had direct correlation with Israel will we be able to follow the presence of this prophetic seven-headed beast through history so as to accurately discern the final Eighth Empire which bears the red dragon’s mark, (Revelation 12:3). For “the beast” in Revelation 13 continues to serve as a prophetic representation of those fallen angels and demonic powers here on earth that are manipulating the wicked in power to wage war against Israel and true Christians in these last days.

Revelation 12:3 - And there appeared another wonder in heaven; and behold a great red dragon, having seven heads and ten horns, and seven crowns upon his heads. 4 And his tail drew the third part of the stars of heaven, and did cast them to the earth: and the dragon stood before the woman which was ready to be delivered, for to devour her child as soon as it was born.

Revelation 12:12 - …Woe to the inhabiters of the earth and of the sea! For the devil is come down unto you, having great wrath, because he knoweth that he hath but a short time. 13 And when the dragon saw that he was cast unto the earth, he persecuted the woman which brought forth the man child.

Remember, the seven-headed beast with ten horns imagery is a multi-faceted prophetic symbolism which does not represent just one thing and one thing only. However, that doesn’t mean when employing the imagery of either the dragon or the beast in certain places of Revelation, that the imagery isn’t being used to focus in upon one thing in particular, such as “Satan” in chapter 12 or the eighth empire which rises out of the sea later in chapter 13.  There, the seven headed beast is meant to represent the rise of a particular and final kingdom that is spiritually connected to Israel, referred to as “the eighth… [which] is of the seven, and goes into perdition.” Nonetheless, the overall prophetic imagery surrounding the seven headed beast contains multiple symbols intended to represent those key biblical players mentioned in the last chapter; each of which need to be identified if one is to gain a correct understanding of John’s vision.

Here are some scriptures to confirm what is being prophetically implied through the angel’s use of the word “mountain” in his explanation of the seven heads to John.

Jeremiah 51:24 - And I will render unto Babylon and to all the inhabitants of Chaldea all their evil that they have done in Zion in your sight, saith the LORD. 25 Behold, I am against thee, O destroying mountain, saith the LORD, which destroyest all the earth: and I will stretch out mine hand upon thee, and roll thee down from the rocks, and will make thee a burnt mountain. 

Zechariah 4:7 - Who art thou, O great mountain? before Zerubbabel thou shalt become a plain: and he shall bring forth the headstone thereof with shoutings, crying, Grace, grace unto it. 

Daniel 2:35 - Then was the iron, the clay, the brass, the silver, and the gold, broken to pieces together, and became like the chaff of the summer threshing floors; and the wind carried them away, that no place was found for them: and the stone that smote the image became a great mountain, and filled the whole earth. 

Daniel 2:45 - Forasmuch as thou sawest that the stone was cut out of the mountain without hands, and that it brake in pieces the iron, the brass, the clay, the silver, and the gold; the great God hath made known to the king what shall come to pass hereafter: and the dream is certain, and the interpretation thereof sure.

Amos 4:1 - Hear this word, ye kine of Bashan, that are in the mountain of Samaria, which oppress the poor, which crush the needy, which say to their masters, Bring, and let us drink.

Amos 6:1 - Woe to them that are at ease in Zion, and trust in the mountain of Samaria, which are named chief of the nations, to whom the house of Israel came!

So all that remains to properly interpret the beast’s seven heads is to determine just who the “seven mountains” nations are that were represented by the beast’s seven heads. Until that is done it’s all speculation as far as I can see so far…

[douggg]

5 hours ago, BlindSeeker said:

uh, didn't 1-6 all sit upon the same mountain??

 

Revelation 17:9 = And here is the mind which hath wisdom. The seven heads are seven mountains, on which the woman sitteth. 10 And there are seven kings: five are fallen, and one is, and the other is not yet come; and when he cometh, he must continue a short space.

 

No, not one mountain.

The seven mountains where the woman sitteth is a reference to Rome - the city of the seven hills.

The woman is also said to sit on many waters.   So there is the double condition of where the woman sits.

imo, the woman pragmatically speaking is the RCC, worldwide in every nation;

and her headquarters the Vatican, which Catholics themselves often refer to as "Rome"  in reference to the Vatican.

The seven kings are tied to that location, Rome. 

Quote

1 And there came one of the seven angels which had the seven vials, and talked with me, saying unto me, Come hither; I will shew unto thee the judgment of the great whore that sitteth upon many waters:

15 And he saith unto me, The waters which thou sawest, where the whore sitteth, are peoples, and multitudes, and nations, and tongues.

 

 

[douggg]

4 hours ago, BlindSeeker said:

The visions given to Daniel were concerning the rise and fall of nations, the coming of Messiah, and definite end time events; all of which deal with “thy people and upon thy holy city.” we are given the specific account of the woman sitting on “seven mountains” to denote those empires which will have had a direct correlation with Israel leading up to the rise of the Eighth.

The fact that in Chapter 17 the woman is riding the Eight Beast reveals that the authority and power of another mountain, or empire, has once again been completely usurped by this woman through her seductive Jezebelian spirit; for she is now shown to be controlling the beast through her enchantments and manipulations. And just as Jezebel plotted to “war with the” righteous to kill them and steal their inheritance, so will the Eighth and the Mother of Harlots make war with those “which keep the commandments of God, and have the testimony of Jesus Christ.” However, just as Jezebel was thrown down and died, so will be the fate of this latter day spiritual Babylon.

Revelation 17:9 - And here is the mind which hath wisdom. The seven heads are seven mountains, on which the woman sitteth. 10 And there are seven kings: five are fallen, and one is, and the other is not yet come; and when he cometh, he must continue a short space. 11 And the beast that was, and is not, even he is the eighth, and is of the seven, and goeth into perdition.

Only by acknowledging the historic rise and fall of those empires which have had direct correlation with Israel will we be able to follow the presence of this prophetic seven-headed beast through history so as to accurately discern the final Eighth Empire which bears the red dragon’s mark, (Revelation 12:3). For “the beast” in Revelation 13 continues to serve as a prophetic representation of those fallen angels and demonic powers here on earth that are manipulating the wicked in power to wage war against Israel and true Christians in these last days.

Revelation 12:3 - And there appeared another wonder in heaven; and behold a great red dragon, having seven heads and ten horns, and seven crowns upon his heads. 4 And his tail drew the third part of the stars of heaven, and did cast them to the earth: and the dragon stood before the woman which was ready to be delivered, for to devour her child as soon as it was born.

Revelation 12:12 - …Woe to the inhabiters of the earth and of the sea! For the devil is come down unto you, having great wrath, because he knoweth that he hath but a short time. 13 And when the dragon saw that he was cast unto the earth, he persecuted the woman which brought forth the man child.

Remember, the seven-headed beast with ten horns imagery is a multi-faceted prophetic symbolism which does not represent just one thing and one thing only. However, that doesn’t mean when employing the imagery of either the dragon or the beast in certain places of Revelation, that the imagery isn’t being used to focus in upon one thing in particular, such as “Satan” in chapter 12 or the eighth empire which rises out of the sea later in chapter 13.  There, the seven headed beast is meant to represent the rise of a particular and final kingdom that is spiritually connected to Israel, referred to as “the eighth… [which] is of the seven, and goes into perdition.” Nonetheless, the overall prophetic imagery surrounding the seven headed beast contains multiple symbols intended to represent those key biblical players mentioned in the last chapter; each of which need to be identified if one is to gain a correct understanding of John’s vision.

Here are some scriptures to confirm what is being prophetically implied through the angel’s use of the word “mountain” in his explanation of the seven heads to John.

Jeremiah 51:24 - And I will render unto Babylon and to all the inhabitants of Chaldea all their evil that they have done in Zion in your sight, saith the LORD. 25 Behold, I am against thee, O destroying mountain, saith the LORD, which destroyest all the earth: and I will stretch out mine hand upon thee, and roll thee down from the rocks, and will make thee a burnt mountain. 

Zechariah 4:7 - Who art thou, O great mountain? before Zerubbabel thou shalt become a plain: and he shall bring forth the headstone thereof with shoutings, crying, Grace, grace unto it. 

Daniel 2:35 - Then was the iron, the clay, the brass, the silver, and the gold, broken to pieces together, and became like the chaff of the summer threshing floors; and the wind carried them away, that no place was found for them: and the stone that smote the image became a great mountain, and filled the whole earth. 

Daniel 2:45 - Forasmuch as thou sawest that the stone was cut out of the mountain without hands, and that it brake in pieces the iron, the brass, the clay, the silver, and the gold; the great God hath made known to the king what shall come to pass hereafter: and the dream is certain, and the interpretation thereof sure.

Amos 4:1 - Hear this word, ye kine of Bashan, that are in the mountain of Samaria, which oppress the poor, which crush the needy, which say to their masters, Bring, and let us drink.

Amos 6:1 - Woe to them that are at ease in Zion, and trust in the mountain of Samaria, which are named chief of the nations, to whom the house of Israel came!

So all that remains to properly interpret the beast’s seven heads is to determine just who the “seven mountains” nations are that were represented by the beast’s seven heads. Until that is done it’s all speculation as far as I can see so far…

If it were kingdoms in Revelation 17:10, it would have been quiet easy to have written "kingdoms" and not kings.

The other problem is that the heads have "crowns" in Revelation 12, which indicates kings, not kingdoms.  

Likewise, the ten horns are kings as well, and have crowns in Revelation 13.   And in the text of Revelation 17:17 give their "kingdom" singular to the the beast.    Which those ten kings, thus, are not of ten kingdoms.

Edited May 19, 2016 by douggg