Who is The 7th Kingdom Beast (and 8th) of Rev?

[other one]

1 hour ago, WilliamL said:

Whaddya expect from a Vulcan!

But to get back to the subject, all this searching around for 8 human kings/rulers is totally missing the point, as I and Last Daze and others have already pointed out. The 7 kings are spiritual rulers/powers over human kingdoms, and are not human kings at all. The 8th is fallen spirit that will "ascend out of the Abyss" (Rev. 17:8), because fallen angels are the ones bound there, as 2 Peter 2:4, Jude 6, and the Book of Enoch have told us.

 

I wish I could tell you why, but we can't go down that demonic rabbit hole here.

I agree that they are spiritual rulers over human kingdoms and they are actually the top seven fallen angels who corrupted the world before the flood.   Each of them has had a turn since the flood.   Azazel was the first during the time of Nimrod and Egypt....    and he will be the 8th.   He is also known as Osiris....   The Hebrews loosed the goat into the wilderness with the sins of the Israelite's attached for Azazel is ascribed to be the cause of all sin.  God help us when he is released on us again.

And for what he has done to planet earth, no fire will ever do him justice in my personal point of view.

[WilliamL]

2 hours ago, other one said:

I agree that they are spiritual rulers over human kingdoms and they are actually the top seven fallen angels who corrupted the world before the flood. 

Disagree in part: the first 6 are the rebellious heavenly angelic Powers over Egypt, Assyria, Chaldeo-Babylonia, Persia, Greece, and Rome = the 6 past empires that have dominated the world, and particularly the Holy Land and people, since the Flood. They all still freely exist and dominate their respective peoples, although each of them is much diminished in strength. All derived their rebellious natures from the spirit that was in Nimrod of Babylon. The 7th, the one that is only to "continue [for] a short time" (Rev. 17:10),  I presume to be the UN, but could be wrong.

2 hours ago, other one said:

Azazel was the first during the time of Nimrod and Egypt....    and he will be the 8th.   ...   The Hebrews loosed the goat into the wilderness with the sins of the Israelite's attached for Azazel is ascribed to be the cause of all sin.  God help us when he is released on us again.

Azazel was one of the angels who unlawfully came down before the Flood, therefore before the time of Nimrod, who was the first man to rebel after the Flood. But is is grimly true that Azazel will be the 8th, when the Abyss is opened at the 5th Trumpet, because he is indeed the baddest of all the angels that descended to corrupt and abuse mankind. He and his cohorts were later cast into the Abyss(es) by God's archangels at the Flood.

Enoch 87:5; 10:15, 9 [The archangels] cast them into the cavities of the earth... even to the day of judgment…and in the great day of judgment let [them] be cast into the fire.”

Enoch 9:5-6 “You have seen what Azazel has done, how he has taught every species of iniquity upon Earth… Semhazai has also taught sorcery…” 10:12 “All the earth has been corrupted by the effects of the teaching of Azazel. To him therefore ascribe the whole crime.”

“[A]ll the iniquities of the children of Israel, and all their transgressions concerning all their sins, put…on the head of the goat” sent “to/for Azazel.” Lev. 16:21, 8

“[T]he goat designated for Azazel was given to the kohen [priest] assigned to lead it away into the wilderness. And when this kohen came to the designated ravine…he pushed the goat into the ravine.” The Rabbinical Assembly, Machzor for Rosh Hashanh and Yom Kippur, 611. This act at the ravine, which is not included in the instructions of Leviticus 16, was a custom added to commemorate Azazel’s being cast into the Abyss in the days of Noah's Flood.

 

Edited September 19, 2016 by WilliamL

[Spock]

The UN is number 7!!!!!!  Say what? 

where do you come up with something like that? 

How can you say 6 bad angels ruling over 6 historical empires are 1-6, and then you say the UN is 7?  Couldn't you at least assign a fallen angel ruling over the UN instead of just the UN? 

What are your thoughts on Mohammed being number 7? 

[Marilyn C]

6 hours ago, Spock said:

I could buy this interpretation but Islam has ruled over Middle East for a very long time.  Yet, Rev 17 says the 7th King will rule for a "short space."

i wonder......could this be talking about MOHAMMED?  He ruled for a short space. I believe from 620-632 and then he dies.  If Rev 17 are talking about KINGS (individual people, not empires) could it be Mohammed?  Could he be considered a KING? 

And then the 8th King will be of the seven, he will be Islamic, which makes him of the 7th. 

What do you think? 

Spock

 

Hi Spock,

Obviously I couldn`t resist coming in on this thread, ay. Glad to see you again, to stir us all up.

OK let`s get a bit of reality & a NOW focus. So much conjecture & history.

I believe, the 7th king (leader of the NOW Global Government - beastly character, lion, leopard, bear) is just before the 10 other kings,( leaders of the controlling Federation).

`And the 10 horns which you saw are 10 kings who have received no kingdom as yet, but receive authority for one hour (short time) as kings, (leaders) with the beast, (beastly leader of the beastly Global Government.).

This leader (king) is just not going to pop up one day & control the world. His rise will be step by step. And I will go out on a limb here & say that in the next couple of years we will see an ISIS leader begin to work with the West. Thus there will be a time of peace in the Middle East. And of course that ISIS leader, I believe will eventually become the 7th leader, (7th king) of the beastly Global Government - the anti-Christ.

regards, Marilyn.

Edited September 20, 2016 by Marilyn C

[BlindSeeker]

On 11/9/2016 at 5:15 PM, Abdicate said:

The subject of verse eight isn't Israel, but the beast. While your logic seems fine, I must decline to agree. God didn't forget them. Study the events of 9 Av on the Jews since their departure from the Land and you'll see how much God still dealt with them while in exile. He even gave Jews prophecy that all, so far, have come true. 

As to the next part, I submit this verse:

2 Peter 1:20 (KJV)
Knowing this first, that no prophecy of the scripture is of any private interpretation. 

The 400-year belief is that from the Catholic church the antichrist will come. Back then, they were chosen as the focus because of the power they had at the time, but in the end, Catholics still believe Jesus is the Son of God, born of a virgin, died on the cross and rose from the dead. This focus is to keep our eyes off current events. I don't judge the interpreters because we are to seek out and look up for Jesus' return. The Catholic church is but a shell of what it once was and isn't the religion of the end times.

Just my two cents.

 

Yes, the verse is not directly about Israel...

But as I stated, "The beast, which is the eighth, that rises out of the sea in Revelation’s chapter 13, is directly connected to Israel, which also “was, and is not, and yet is.”

Clearly you see how prophecy is related to Israel in these last days?? Right?

[Bible_Gazer]

So if Rev. 13 two beasts and Rev. 17 one beast is all future then there is going to be 3 different beast coming or 2 if the eighth is the 7th revived.

1. from the sea 2. from the earth 3. from the bottomless pit

The Harlot sits on the waters, mountains, and the beast.

The sea beast has 10 horns.

The earth beast has 2 horns.

Rev.17 The bottomless pit beast has 10 horns - no crowns at all - maybe the woman is the power. She does rules the 10 kings.

guess the crowns in revelation represent the one who is ruling at certain time.

The eighth revived, 10 horns must not be the one in charge different arrangement from the sea beast.

Horn usually mean power.  The 10 kings do give their power to the Harlot, she becomes their head.

 

Just throwing some stuff out here.

[Spock]

1 hour ago, Marilyn C said:

Hi Spock,

Obviously I couldn`t resist coming in on this thread, ay. Glad to see you again, to stir us all up.

OK let`s get a bit of reality & a NOW focus. So much conjecture & history.

I believe, the 7th king (leader of the NOW Global Government - beastly character, lion, leopard, bear) is just before the 10 other kings,( leaders of the controlling Federation).

`And the 10 horns which you saw are 10 kings who have received no kingdom as yet, but receive authority for one hour (short time) as kings, (leaders) with the beast, (beastly leader of the beastly Global Government.).

This leader (king) is just not going to pop up one day & control the world. His rise will be step by step. And I will go out on a limb here & say that in the next couple of years we will see an ISIS leader begin to work with the West. Thus there will be a time of peace in the Middle East. And of course that ISIS leader, I believe will eventually become the 7th leader, (7th king) of the beastly Global Government - the anti-Christ.

regards, Marilyn.

Hi Marilyn,

So, the ruler of the 10 nations that are given power for one hour makes up the 8th King?

 The Word says the 8th is of the SEVEN.  Could this Isis leader (the 7th=AC) also be the 8th King after he is assassinated and possessed by Satan or Some fallen angel (from the Abyss) and resurrected for all the world to see and marvel, "who can make war with this dude?" 

[Spock]

On May 18, 2016 at 10:32 PM, douggg said:

Hi angels4u, the article is treating the mortally wounded head and recovered head as a kingdom.    The text, however, in Revelation 17 says the heads are kings not kingdoms.     So the basis is wrong to start with.    And even if kingdoms is applied, Egyptian and Assyrian are not parts of either the Daniel 2 dream or the Daniel 7 vision.

Regarding the entire notion of the Mahdi being the beast is problematic on several levels.  First, in Islam theology the Mahdi is just a man who is not worshiped.    So any muslim who begins demanding worship - is violating one of the fundamental principles of Islam.   

Also in Ezekiel 39, Gog/Magog invasion, and defeat of Gog's army - it is the end of Islam as a religion, God's judgment on Islam for all the violence and lies it has done claiming to do so in his name, also a lie, of Allah.   

The timing of Gog/Magog is just preceding the 7 years, that begin when the person who becomes the Antichrist confirms the Mt. Sinai covenant for the 7 year cycle, a law Moses made in Deuteronomy 31:9-13 of all future generations.    The confirming is the reading of the law to the nation of Israel, from the place of God's choosing (the Jews take to be the temple mount) on the feast of Tabernacles.    The catch and why it hasn't been done in 2000 years is that the religious Jews have not had control of the temple mount.    The present problem that the muslim won't even let the Jews pray on the temple mount.

Following the destruction of Gog's army in Ezekiel 39 is 7 years of burning the remains of Gog's army weapons instead of wood.    It would appear to me to be the fuel left in the vehicles.     For the first half of the 7 years in the false messianic age, this will be done openly.    In the second half of the 7 years, as the Jews have fled to mountains during the time of the beast, the fuel will be scavenged from the vehicles scattered there, and there is also the canned rations that will be available in the various vehicles.

There are two feasts in Ezekiel 39,  and it is very important to note that they are not the same feasts.    One is in Ezekiel 39:4, the feast on Gog's army.    The cleanup of the land and discussion of Gog's army end in verse 39:16.... with thus they shall cleanse the land.   End of the prophecy regarding Gog/Magog,  39:16

And then insertion of the 7 years is between the lines of 39:16 and 39:17, before Ezekiel is told to prophesy about another feast in Ezekiel 39:17-20, the Armageddon feast,  which is followed by the Lord making his presence among the heathen here on earth.      The remainder of Ezekiel 39 is from the perspective of Jesus having returning and in retrospect of the 2000 years since his first coming.

Here is a brief of how Ezekiel 39 is structured.

Ezekiel 39:1 -16   Destruction of Gog's army, end of Islam as a religion

Between the lines of verses 16 and 17 - the 7 years,  the time of the Antichrist begin, first half; then the time of the person as the beast of Revelation 13,  the second half, ending with Jesus's return.

Ezekiel 39:17-20 the Armageddon feast, at the end of the 7 years.

Ezekiel 39:21-29 Jesus has returned and begins ruling the heathen, the nations, with a rod of iron, and the Lord reflects back over the past 2000 years since his first coming in 39:22-29.

 

 

Ezekiel 39:17-20 talks about another feast, larger in scope

 

 

 

Hi dougg,

Are you sure the timing of the Gog War is BEFORE the false peace covenant that begins Daniels 70th week?  Because I sure am not.

The more I study the timing of Gog (Ez 38/39) the more I see this war as Armageddon, toward the END of the 70th week. 

I know people get hung up about burying  or burning the weapons for 7 years, but clearly that has to be done in the Millenial Kimgdom because only then will Israel not need those weapons. If the Gog War  was before the 70th week, it would be foolish for Israel to dispose of weapons they may someday need. 

[Spock]

On May 19, 2016 at 8:48 AM, Diaste said:

I think it interesting that many of just continue to repeat what we have learned from end time preachers. I was in the same predicament for quite a few years until I started actually checking out the history. For instance, I looked at the history of the Diadochi and compared it to Dan 11. The reason for this was simple, it was clear that certain chapters of Daniel were a progression from Babylon to the Beast. It was interesting to see some of what Daniel writes about in chapter 11 happened between the warring Diadochi. Since the progression of Daniel shows us the acts of these generals and the lineage of the beast it can be determined from whence the beast cometh. And it ain't Greece. He must hail from the former Seleucid empire. Only the Seleucid Empire had it's capitol in Babylon and ruled in that region. This is where the beast comes from. Not only does Dan 11 show this but  so does the Dan 2 statue. The first 3 kingdoms all ruled the same area, the fourth will do the same. That would be Babylon, Persia, Greece and then Islam. Rome did not cover the same area and in fact almost fell to the ruling power of the time, Islam. Islam was the dominant empire in the same region as the Statue Kingdoms and they are in fact the Iron Kingdom.

Even if 'is' is present tense that still leaves the question of which one 'is'.  Did John pen revelation in 65 AD or 90 AD? Is the 'one is' Nero or Domitian? Most scholars think the 90 AD date is accurate. If that's true then your premise is wrong as there were 12 Caesars before Domitian.

I did not say it was from the Greek empire. I said the beast came from one of the divisions of the Greek empire. You said it's going to be Greece in the first sentence of the above quote.

Are you saying the transgressors are only the EU? It's can't be China? Or Brazil? Maybe the whole earth are the transgressors? Are you saying that Islam could never be viewed as transgressors and so never could be full of transgressions? What scripture is there that proves the EU is the focus? The EU has many more than 10 leaders. And you're missing the truth. The 10 kings in question have no power but receive power with the beast.  So that rules out any current leadership on earth. The scripture says the beast comes first, then the 10 Kings receive power.

What do I care about theology? I care about what's written in scripture and history. Theologians can be, and are often, wrong about prophecy. Scripture never errs.

I do grasp the concept that you think the person goes through stages. I reject that notion.

I agree with you.....it cannot be a revived ROMAN EMPIRE that is basically European.  

Here is a simple explanation to disprove Europe as an end time player.....name one European nation that God identifies will absorb his wrath during the time of the end? I don't think you can.

But you can name many Islamic nations that will be absorbing God's wrath during the end times, and it is written all throughout the OT prophets. If you only want to read one prophet, read Isaiah, it is all over those chapters.  God will be smiting many Islamic nations in due time, not European. 

And, I believe the Gog War in Ezekiel 38'is Armageddon, which are all Islamic nations. 

[Marilyn C]

2 hours ago, Spock said:

Hi Marilyn,

So, the ruler of the 10 nations that are given power for one hour makes up the 8th King?

 The Word says the 8th is of the SEVEN.  Could this Isis leader (the 7th=AC) also be the 8th King after he is assassinated and possessed by Satan or Some fallen angel (from the Abyss) and resurrected for all the world to see and marvel, "who can make war with this dude?" 

Hi Spock,

Yes, the ruler of the 10 nation federation that are given power for one hour, is, I believe, the 7th Global leader. The 8th I believe is Satan & `possesses` the 7th. The 7th is the Assyrian. Thus I see we are now in the count down of the 7 human global leaders of the global government.

Marilyn.