Question on obedience/submission to authority

[kwikphilly]

Thats right Pat,like those signs they import from California,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,               just kidding!             Love,Kwik

[The_Patriot21]

13 minutes ago, kwikphilly said:

Thats right Pat,like those signs they import from California,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,               just kidding!             Love,Kwik

Lol

[The_Patriot21]

I've been thinking about it, and another way of approaching it is this, we are to obey authority right? Well both the state government bamd the federal government is above us. Well, if the feds say it's legal to do this, but you don't have to if you don't want to, then your ok either way. But since the state says it's illegal, then you would be disobeying scripture to do it. After all one authority says it's wrong the other your good either way, then the "safe" approach is to just not do it.

 

Now, if it was one authority says you HAVE to do it one way and the other authority says you HAVE to do it a different way, then I would say you should either follow the head authority-or the one that has the most direct impact on your life if you disobey.

[RustyAngeL]

On 5/22/2016 at 0:44 PM, kwikphilly said:

Thats right Pat,like those signs they import from California,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,               just kidding!             Love,Kwik

Let's face it California has it's share of nuts per ca pita and I live here. 

[CATerri]

On May 23, 2016 at 0:41 PM, The_Patriot2016 said:

I've been thinking about it, and another way of approaching it is this, we are to obey authority right? Well both the state government bamd the federal government is above us. Well, if the feds say it's legal to do this, but you don't have to if you don't want to, then your ok either way. But since the state says it's illegal, then you would be disobeying scripture to do it. After all one authority says it's wrong the other your good either way, then the "safe" approach is to just not do it.

I'm with ThePatriot on this one.  If the federal give you a right that the state takes away, you don't have that right anymore.  Follow state law, move to another state, or work towards changing the state law.  Unless it is like one of the biblical examples like Daniel praying three times a day or Peter and the apostles preaching.

I'm very interested to see what your "details" are.  The only thing popping into my head right now would be gay marriage.

[Larry 2]

Act 5:29  Then Peter and the other apostles answered and said, We ought to obey God rather than men.

And then we read:

Rom 13:1  Let every soul be subject unto the higher powers. For there is no power but of God: the powers that be are ordained of God.

Rom 13:2  Whosoever therefore resisteth the power, resisteth the ordinance of God:  . . .

Rom 13:4  For he is the minister of God to thee for good. . .

Rom 13:6  For this cause pay ye tribute also: for they are God's ministers, attending continually upon this very thing. Jesus paid taxes to Capernaum of Palestine, a region under control of Rome if I’ve got it right, but regardless according to Rom 3:23 all have sinned and come short of the glory of God and Jesus was in effect supporting those godless governments.

What of something that goes against all that God is?  Let’s take Shadrach, Meshach, and Abednego in Dan 3:5.  That at what time ye hear the sound of the cornet, flute, harp, sackbut, psaltery, dulcimer, and all kinds of musick, ye fall down and worship the golden image that Nebuchadnezzar the king hath set up: They didn’t, and were thrown into the furnace, but Jesus went into the fire with them (Dan 3:25), and no harm came to them.

Daniel was to not pray to God for thirty days (Dan 6:7), but id (Dan 6:10) he went, opened his windows, and prayed as he always did. Next in Dan 6:16 we see Daniel thrown into a den of Lions, but probably the most comfortable pillows he ever had.

God has said in Heb 13:5, . . . I will never leave thee, nor forsake thee.

In Dan 3:15 Nebuchadnezzar asked who is that God that shall deliver you out of my hands?

Dan 3:16  Shadrach, Meshach, and Abednego, answered and said to the king, O Nebuchadnezzar, we are not careful to answer thee in this matter.

Dan 3:17  If it be so, our God whom we serve is able to deliver us from the burning fiery furnace, and he will deliver us out of thine hand, O king.

Dan 3:18  But if not, be it known unto thee, O king, that we will not serve thy gods, nor worship the golden image which thou hast set up.

[enoob57]

On ‎5‎/‎11‎/‎2016 at 0:50 PM, Guest said:

Thank you Ezra. Excellent point. An appeal to the highest authority over which God presides. how simple. That is what Paul did. He took his argument to the highest authority to decide the matter.

The interesting fact is that Caesar was as debauched as an individual could be yet Paul in
submission to this knowing God was above him....

[Openly Curious]

On 5/10/2016 at 11:23 PM, Omegaman 3.0 said:

Suppose with me for a moment, that there were legal challenges that have gone to the supreme court. Suppose with me that the court has ruled, that:

A certain behavior cannot be restricted to an individual, and that a state cannot require licensing for that behavior, because it is a fundamental right.

Suppose also, that the court explicitly has ruled, that there can be no special requirements to engage in this practice, such as mandatory insurance, or certificates of competency, etc.

Suppose the the court has also ruled that if a state enacts statutes, which require licenses, insurance, etc. in order to lawfully engage in said activities and behavior, that the citizen may ignore the state's requirements, as unlawful.

Finally, suppose that a citizen, is a Christian, and the citizen desires to engage in an activity, which his state denies to him, but the courts have held that it is that citizen's right to engage in, and is guaranteed to said citizen as a fundamental right.

Titus 3:1 says:
 
Remind them to be subject to rulers, to authorities,"to be"  obedient, "to be" ready for every good deed,  

Romans 13 says:

1 Every person is to be in subjection to the governing authorities. For there is no authority except from God, and those which exist are established by God. 2 Therefore whoever resists authority has opposed the ordinance of God; and they who have opposed will receive condemnation upon themselves. 3 For rulers are not a cause of fear for good behavior, but for evil. Do you want to have no fear of authority? Do what is good and you will have praise from the same; 4 for it is a minister of God to you for good. But if you do what is evil, be afraid; for it does not bear the sword for nothing; for it is a minister of God, an avenger who brings wrath on the one who practices evil. 5 Therefore it is "necessary" to be in subjection, "not only" because of wrath, "but also" for conscience’ sake.  

Now, sorry for the bakground, but here is the question:

How does one apply the scriptures in the above scenario? One the one hand, a legal authority says do not do "X". A higher legal authority says that it is okay to disregard the lower legal authority. Does the Christian go with the higher legal authority, or does he/she wave their legal right, in order to be submissive to a lower, yet still legitimate, legal authority?

What do you think? BTW, such a situation exists, but I did not include those details, because I did not want people's emotional attachments to one side or the other, influence what they thought the proper application should be.

 

I believe that no matter what the scenario may be as a Christian we would have to submit to the higher and the lower level of authorities even if they are in opposition to one another.  As an individual Christian or just a citizen we each have a choice to do the right thing by showing forth our good behavior or choosing to engage in bad behavior.  But as scripture says good behavior is no threat to any authority being the higher or lower authority.   But it is choosing to engage in bad behavior or evil things that is the threat to the authorities that are in power.  Being obedient "does not mean" we have to engage in ungodly behavior even if laws are made giving the citizens the right to do so. 

[Leonardo Von]

On 5/12/2016 at 9:07 AM, gods pilgrim said:

Children obey your parents in the Lord...for this is right

Dear sister Gods Pilgrim,

 

Grace and mercy and peace from God our Father and the Lord Jesus Christ.

I agree with you.

And that's not all! Have we ever thought that by resisting an authority we are resisting the Eternal Himself (Rom. 13:2)? After all, no one can have anything that, first of all, is not given to him from heaven (John 3:27). Jesus Himself told Pilate that he only had power to crucify or release Him because the Father granted him such power (John 19:10,11). Since ALL authority was ordained by the Eternal (Rom. 13:1), then whoever resists authority will go to condemn (Rom. 13:2).

May Jesus help us to fight in prayer for the authorities instead of fighting them.

[gods pilgrim]

6 hours ago, Leonardo Von said:

Dear sister Gods Pilgrim,

 

 

 

Grace and mercy and peace from God our Father and the Lord Jesus Christ.

 

I agree with you.

 

And that's not all! Have we ever thought that by resisting an authority we are resisting the Eternal Himself (Rom. 13:2)? After all, no one can have anything that, first of all, is not given to him from heaven (John 3:27). Jesus Himself told Pilate that he only had power to crucify or release Him because the Father granted him such power (John 19:10,11). Since ALL authority was ordained by the Eternal (Rom. 13:1), then whoever resists authority will go to condemn (Rom. 13:2).

 

May Jesus help us to fight in prayer for the authorities instead of fighting them.

 

Found you on my phone and wondered  who you were ..prayer is a good weapon  to use  in battle with the enemy may the Lord use you for his glory day by day  your strength is in him...Gods pilgrim