Someone said, The Bible says that God has no form, no image.

[post]

12 hours ago, HAZARD said:

I can quote dozens of Scriptures where God has appeared before men and was seen by them with the naked eye.

i believe every one of them, and i also believe that this is true, too: 

No one has ever seen God. The One and Only Son — the One who is at the Father's side -- He has revealed Him. 
(John 1:18)

and what Jesus Himself said is true as well: 

It is written in the Prophets, ‘And they will all be taught by God.’
Everyone who has heard and learned from the Father comes to me — 
not that anyone has seen the Father except he who is from God; he has seen the Father.
(John 6:45-46)

i don't believe that these two passages (nor others that express the same) are contrary to the dozens of things you could also quote. but this reveals a mystery: that no one has seen the face of God, but He spoke with Moses as 'face to face' -- and no one has seen God at any time, but Moses, Aaron, Nadab, Abihu and the 70 elders all saw Him on the mountain. 

He is more than what has been revealed to any man. 

[Guest shiloh357]

11 hours ago, other one said:

Well, Jesus has a body now and it appears to me that he has these same attributes, so I don't think I can agree with you.....    but we don't have direct information to disagree with you either......    but I don't follow your logic in this post.

 

I also find that some people use anthropomorphism tag on things to prove something they believe that may not be the case just because it is used somewhere else....

 

We use the "anthropomorphism "tag"  as you call it because it is appropriate when talking about God's incommunicable attributes in the Bible.   It's what the writers of the Bible use to express God's indescribable attributes in terms that human being can comprehend.

Jesus has a body, but God the Father does not and God the Father is a formless Spirit, like it or not.   So He doesn't have literal eyes or legs or arms or any of that.  Maybe that offends some people's shallow, simplistic, backwoods, approach to the Bible.  I guess that is something that can't be fixed.

[Guest shiloh357]

13 hours ago, HAZARD said:

John 4:24; God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth.

 

Not the sun, moon, stars; not an image of wood, stone, or metal; and not a beast or man. He is not the air, wind, mother earth, a universal mind, love or some impersonal quality.
He is a person with a personal spirit body, a personal soul, and a personal spirit, like that of angels, and like that of man, who He made in His image and likeness, except His body is of a spirit substance instead of flesh and bone (Job 13:8; Hebrew 1:3). 
 
Job 13:8, Will ye accept his person? will ye contend for God?
 
Hebrew 1:  3, Who being the brightness of his glory, and the express image of his person, and upholding all things by the word of his power, when he had by himself purged our sins, sat down on the right hand of the Majesty on high;

 

Phillip asked Jesus a pertinent question; In John. 14:8;

 

 John 14:8, Philip saith unto him, Lord, shew us the Father, and it sufficeth us. 

 

Jesus replied;

V. 9, Jesus saith unto him, Have I been so long time with you, and yet hast thou not known me, Philip? he that hath seen me hath seen the Father; and how sayest thou then, Shew us the Father?

 

Jesus was the Word who had a spirit body (John 1:1) and He divested Himself of this body and became flesh and bone so that He, as a man, in a physical finite body could die for our sins. As God in a spirit body He could not possibly die, but as a man He could. He told Phillip, look at me, I look just like my Father. Jesus was an image of His Father just as we are made in God's image and likeness.

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God does not sit on a throne?

 

Rev 4:2, "And immediately I was in the spirit: and, behold, a throne was set in heaven, and one sat on the throne."

 

Rev 4:3, And he that sat was to look upon like a jasper and a sardine stone: and there was a rainbow round about the  throne, in sight like unto an emerald.

Rev 4:4, And round about the throne were four and twenty seats: and upon the seats I saw four and twenty elders sitting, clothed in white raiment; and they had on their heads crowns of gold.

Rev 4:5, And out of the throne proceeded lightnings and thunderings and voices: and there were seven lamps of fire burning before the throne, which are the seven Spirits of God.

Rev 4:6, And before the throne there was a sea of glass like unto crystal: and in the midst of the throne, and round about the throne, were four beasts full of eyes before and behind.

 

Rev 4:9, And when those beasts give glory and honour and thanks to him that sat on the throne who liveth for ever and ever,

Rev 4:10, The four and twenty elders fall down before Him that sat on the throne, and worship him that liveth for ever and ever, and cast their crowns before the throne, saying,

Rev 5:1, And I saw in the RIGHT HAND OF HIM that sat on the throne a book written within and on the backside, sealed with seven seals.

Rev 5:6, And I beheld, and, lo, in the midst of the throne and of the four beasts, and in the midst of the elders, stood a Lamb as it had been slain, having seven horns and seven eyes, which are the seven Spirits of God sent forth into all the earth.

 

Rev 5:7, And he came and took the book out of the right hand of the right hand of Him that sat upon the throne.

Rev 5:11, And I beheld, and I heard the voice of many angels round about the  throne and the beasts and the elders: and the number of them was ten thousand times ten thousand, and thousands of thousands;

Rev 5:13, And every creature which is in heaven, and on the earth, and under the earth, and such as are in the sea, and all that are in them, heard I saying, Blessing, and honour, and glory, and power, be unto Him that sitteth upon the throne, and unto the Lamb for ever and ever.

Rev 6:16, And said to the mountains and rocks, Fall on us, and hide us from the FACE of Him that sitteth on the throne and from the wrath of the Lamb:

 

Rev 7:9, After this I beheld, and, lo, a great multitude, which no man could number, of all nations, and kindreds, and people, and tongues, stood before the throne and before the Lamb, clothed with white robes, and palms in their hands;

Rev 7:10, And cried with a loud voice, saying, Salvation to our God which sitteth upon the throne, and unto the Lamb.

Rev 7:11, And all the angels stood round about  the throne, and about the elders and the four beasts, and fell before the throne on their faces, and worshipped God,

Rev 7:15, Therefore are they before the throne of God, and serve him day and night in his temple: AND HE THAT SITTETH ON THE THRONE shall dwell among them.

 

How many more Scriptures do you need to get the point that God has a throne and God must have a spirit body to sit on His throne?

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.

 

God personally dwells in Heaven, not everywhere. Jesus addressed His Father and referred to Him as being IN HEAVEN, EIGHTEEN TIMES. Jesus said, "Father which is in Heaven" (Matt. 5:16, 45, 48; 6:1-9, 7:11, 21.)

Are we to conclude that you are right and Jesus did not know what He was talking about?  Not one time does one Scripture refer to God as being bodily everywhere. God is Omni-present but not Omni-body, that is He presence can be felt by moral agents who are everywhere, but His body cannot be seen by them everyplace at the same time. God has a body and goes from place to place like anybody else.

God has a throne, but that throne symbolically represents his authority.  "Sitting" on the that throne only symbolizes the permanence of his authority.

God dwells in Heaven and everywhere else.   There is no place that God is not.   Sorry but he is boundless, formless and is everywhere at once. That is basic theology, but you are a student of that godless heretic Finis Dake, so good theology is lost on you.  

[kwikphilly]

Blessings post,,,,

    Thank you for that & for your display of sincerity & humility,,,,,,& in no way am I saying that no one else is humble or sincere,it is just very refreshing to hear someone else say "I don't know",,,,,,it seems to me that is a very uncommon statement made these days,,,,,,,,

    Personally ,I know without a shadow of doubt that I have only been given a finite mind(for now) & without the Holy Spirit Revealing the "Mysteries of God" to me,,,,,,"I simply cannot know",,,,,,,I believe much of the Word is Given us in a WAY that WE can comprehend & relate to,for our benefit & by the Grace & Love of our Almighty Father,,,,,,,,,as Jesus said:

Quote

If I have told you earthly things, and ye believe not, how shall ye believe, if I tell you of Heavenly things?         John 3:12

    They can call it what they will "anthropomorphism",,,,,,that may very well be true & maybe not,as I said & we both agree,,,,,,that is all very good "reason",a very educated & intellectual perspective,,,,,,& what else can we say? I just don't have the need to say"I know the correct interpretation" of everything Written,,,,,,it is a very good assumption here,there are many good assumptions,both ways,,,,,but neither knows for sure,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,lol,it is the Truth            Love<Kwik    Glory to God!! His Ways are so much Higher than ours,,,,,,,,,,,,,,

[WilliamL]

1 Pet 1:10 Of this salvation the prophets have inquired and searched carefully, who prophesied of the grace that would come to you, 11 searching what, or what manner of time, the Spirit of Christ who was in them was indicating when He testified beforehand the sufferings of Christ and the glories that would follow.

Rom. 8:9 But you are not in the flesh but in the Spirit, if indeed the Spirit of God dwells in you. Now if anyone does not have the Spirit of Christ, he is not His.

There are not three Spirits, but one Spirit, the Spirit of Christ, which is the Spirit of God, which is the Holy Spirit. Peter tells us that this Spirit of Christ was the Holy Spirit of the OT that came upon the prophets. There is only One God and one Holy Spirit, the Spirit of Christ, which has a spirit-body.

Ezra correctly quoted above about the light-body of God. God also has a Spirit Body aka the Holy Spirit, and a soul-body aka the Son of God, and a human body aka Jesus, the Son of Adam/man. One God, many forms, depending upon the realm. Anything beyond that and you effectively get into polytheism, of which the Judaism has long accused Christianity.

    

 

[kwikphilly]

Quote

One God, many forms, depending upon the realm.                                                   posted by William

There ya have it,,,,,,,,,,,,,Amen,.anyone ever seem these?,,,,,,probably some,,,,,ALL? NO,absolutely not     Can we sit here & say "I know everything there is to know about ETERNITY & the ETERNAL(& what GOD does or does not look like,Body,no Body),,,,,,,,, ,NO

[HAZARD]

On ‎31‎/‎05‎/‎2016 at 10:04 PM, shiloh357 said:

We use the "anthropomorphism "tag"  as you call it because it is appropriate when talking about God's incommunicable attributes in the Bible.   It's what the writers of the Bible use to express God's indescribable attributes in terms that human being can comprehend.

Jesus has a body, but God the Father does not and God the Father is a formless Spirit, like it or not.   So He doesn't have literal eyes or legs or arms or any of that.  Maybe that offends some people's shallow, simplistic, backwoods, approach to the Bible.  I guess that is something that can't be fixed.

You need to pray to the Holy Spirit asking Him that God opens your eyes, your heart and your mind, as it seems that countless Scriptures doesn't seem to be doing it for you.

I suppose if you don't believe what God says about Himself by the hundreds of Scriptures He inspired, then He wont be in any hurry to help you in any way understanding them or Him either?

When God brings His city down to the earth, the New Jerusalem according to you, we will go up from year to year to worship a formless spirit?

Well , you might but we believers in Him and what He reveals about Himself will not be worshiping a formless spirit We will be worshiping our God who knows more about Himself than you ever will and who has revealed to us that He has a heart (Gen. 6:6; 8:21); so we can assume His heart pumps blood!, He also has hands and fingers (Exod. 31:18; Psalms 8:3-6; Rev. 5:1, 6-7); Nostrils (Ps. 18:8); mouth (Num. 12:8); lips and tongue (Isa. 30:27; feet (Ezek. 1:27; Exodus 24:10); eyes, eyelids, sight (Ps. 11:4; 18:24; 33:18); voice (Ps. 29; Rev. 10:3-4; Gen. 1); breath (Gen. 2:70; ears (Ps. 18:6); head, hair, face, arms (Dan. 7:9-14; 10:5-19; Rev. 5:1; loins (Ezek. 1:26:28; 8:1-4); bodily presence (Gen. 3:8; 18:1-22; Job 1:6-12; 2:1-7; Exodus 24:10-11); and many other bodily parts as required by Him to be a person with a body.

And JOHN heard a great voice out of heaven saying, Behold, the tabernacle of God is with men, and He will dwell with them, and they shall be His people and God Himself shall be with them, and be their God.

God clearly and Plainly reveal's to us that He has a spirit body with bodily parts like a man. This is proved by hundreds of Scriptures that do not need interpretation. God is a Spirit being, infinate, eternal, immutable, self-existent, omnipresent, omniscient, omnipotent, invisible, impartial, immortal, absolutely holy, full of wisdom, full of knowledge, and just in all things. God is known in Scripture by over two hundred names. He is described as being like any other person as to having a body, soul, and spirit (Job 13:8; Heb. 1:3; Dan. 7:9-14; 10:5-7). He is a spirit being with a body (Dan. 7:9-14; 10:5-6, 9-19, Exodus 24:11; Gen. 18' 32:24-32; Ezek. 1:26-28; Acts 7:54-59; Rev. 4:2-4; 5:1, 5-7; 22:4-5); shape (John 5:37); form (Phil. 2:5-7, same Greek word as in Mark 16:12, which refers to bodily form); and an image and likeness of a man (Gen. 1:26; 9:6; Ezek. 1:26-28; 1 Cor. 11:7; jas. 3:9; Dan. 7:9-14; 10:5-6).

Dan. 10:5, "Then I lifted up mine eyes, and looked, and behold a certain man clothed in linen, whose loins were girded with fine gold of Uphaz:
His body also was like the beryl, and His face as the appearance of lightning, and His eyes as lamps of fire, and His arms and His feet like in colour to polished brass, and the voice of his words like the voice of a multitude.

Be sure, the day will come when you will be on your knees before the Ancient of days and you will see Him as He is, just as He describes Himself, and as He is described in many Scriptures, then you will realise it is you who has been shallow, simplistic, and have had a backwoods, approach to the Bible.

You have gone around in circles for some time now responding to my posts with hardly any Scriptures to backup what you believe and what you call truth, and you accuse me of teaching heresy, all the while avoiding my one simple question, regarding your statement, "God has no image, God has no form."

You still have not provided me with one Scripture where God says of Himself;

"I have no image, or I HAVE NO FORM,"  Your word's not mine.

I would like at least one so that I can investigate in what image your formless god created man who has form and image?

 

[HAZARD]

9 hours ago, post said:

i believe every one of them, and i also believe that this is true, too: 

No one has ever seen God. The One and Only Son — the One who is at the Father's side -- He has revealed Him. 
(John 1:18)

and what Jesus Himself said is true as well: 

It is written in the Prophets, ‘And they will all be taught by God.’
Everyone who has heard and learned from the Father comes to me — 
not that anyone has seen the Father except he who is from God; he has seen the Father.
(John 6:45-46)

i don't believe that these two passages (nor others that express the same) are contrary to the dozens of things you could also quote. but this reveals a mystery: that no one has seen the face of God, but He spoke with Moses as 'face to face' -- and no one has seen God at any time, but Moses, Aaron, Nadab, Abihu and the 70 elders all saw Him on the mountain. 

He is more than what has been revealed to any man. 

Hi post,

In John 6:46, " Not that any man hath seen the Father, save he which is of God, he hath seen the Father.

Greek, horao, meaning here to comprehend, fully understand with the mind; to see truth fully. It is used in this sense in amy places (John 8:38; 14:9; 15:24; 1 John 3:6)

In John 1:18, "No man hath seen God at any time; the only begotten Son, which is in the bosom of the Father, he hath declared him."

Again, Greek horao, like our English seen, means to see with the eyes and also see with the mind. That it means here to comprehend fully or understand is clear from the fact that men men have seen God with their eyes (Gen. 18:2, 33; 32:24-30; Ex. 24:10; 33:11; Josh. 5:13; Isa. 6; Ez. 1:26-28. Dan. 7:9-14; 10:5-6; Acts 7:56-59; Rev. 4:2-5; 5"1-7).

The verse could read, "No man has ever comprehended or experienced God at any time in all His fullness, save the only begotten son . . . . . . He hath declared Him." That Christ is the first to experience God in the fullness of the Holy Spirit is clear from John 3:34; Acts 10:38; Isa. 11:1-2; 61:1-2; Luke 4:16-18.

 

[other one]

more and more as a group it seems that we are promoting that no one can read an english Bible and understand the Gospel...    and that's kind of disturbing when you think of it.

[HAZARD]

9 hours ago, shiloh357 said:

God has a throne, but that throne symbolically represents his authority.  "Sitting" on the that throne only symbolizes the permanence of his authority.

God dwells in Heaven and everywhere else.   There is no place that God is not.   Sorry but he is boundless, formless and is everywhere at once. That is basic theology, but you are a student of that godless heretic Finis Dake, so good theology is lost on you.  

You have nothing to stand on so you attack the poster, like the scribes and Pharisees attacked Christ when they had no idea of what He was talking about.

Quote

"but you are a student of that godless heretic Finis Dake, so good theology is lost on you."

You are a heretic hunter and proud of it or you would not keep up your accusations against me.

You are lost in your hatred towards me and in so doing, all of the truth's revealed by God.

So you know more than Jesus Himself? Have you alone been given some divine revelation such as, "You may ignore the Scriptures, believe what you think, and try and convince others God is a mystical, mysterious, nothingness? We believers know where your thoughts, pet ideas theories and statements are coming from, and it isn't from God.

Scripture plainly and clearly teach that God personally dwells in Heaven, not everywhere.

Jesus addressed His Father and referred to Him as being IN HEAVEN, not in heaven, AND EVERYWHERE ELSE? EIGHTEEN TIMES Jesus said "Father which is in Heaven.

. Jesus said, "Father which is in Heaven" in these many Scriptures, did you even read them, and if so, you simply refuse to believe Jesus. (Matt. 5:16, 45, 48; 6:1-9, 7:11, 21.)

Are we to conclude that you are right and Jesus did not know what He was talking about?  Not one time does one Scripture refer to God as being bodily everywhere. God is Omni-present but not Omni-body, that is He presence can be felt by moral agents who are everywhere, but His body cannot be seen by them everyplace at the same time. God has a body and goes from place to place like anybody else.