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What is salvation? Being saved.


Remnantrob

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17 hours ago, woundeddog said:

the natural state of man is to live in rebellion from God and leads us into living a life that pleases us not God, and that separates us from God. We can not be with him on an eternal basis which translates to hell after death.

When we are "Saved" our rebellion is cancelled ( sin is our rebellion) the punishment for our rebellion is paid by Jesus shed blood.

Salvation is then a 3 part process.

1) we are freed from the punishment from sin.

2) we are freed from the power of sin, meaning we no longer have to choose it- we have the liberty to reject sin in our live. This is a life long process also called sanctification.

3) then when we die and shed our fleshly bodies we are saved from the presence of sin- because with out our fleshly bodies we can exist totally free from sin

Amen brother.  So we can have victory over sin(the power of it over our lives)? If so why do we make it not that big of a deal to our brothers and sisters and just cover it under grace all the time?  I'm not talking about sin that isn't habitual, I'm speaking of a cherished sin that someone struggles with and isn't willing to let go of.

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2 hours ago, Remnantrob said:

cherished sin

that is what causes a Child of the King to live like a pauper---- when we hold on to a sin its like an anchor in our Life of faith- it holds us back from having the abundant life that Jesus wants us to have. So many of us live like beggars because of our one or two cherished sins when we should be living like conquerers like God intended us to. I am not talking about monetary blessing- I am talking about a close fellowship with the Lord-- that sin will keep us 6 feet away from the Lord when we should be in his arms~~~~~ 

Edited by woundeddog
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2 Corinthians 4:4King James Version (KJV)

In whom the god of this world hath blinded the minds of them which believe not, lest the light of the glorious gospel of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine unto them.

It is the lifting of the veil that you were blinded by to see the Light  of the GLORIOUS GOSPEL OF CHRIST.   Now you can see clearly, the entirety of the whole gospel which entails, death, fear, future and promises. 

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On 10/20/2016 at 9:11 PM, Ezra said:

Salvation means both redemption and deliverance.  The Bible does not so much "defines" salvation as "describes" salvation.

But it goes significantly beyond that. Christians are not only saved "from" some things, but also saved "unto" many things.  So, in effect, salvation is complex. 

Sinners are saved from:

1. The wrath of God.

2. Judgment for sins.

3. Hades.

4. Eternal Hell (the Lake of Fire).

5. The power of Satan (and his evil spirits).

6. The power of death, decay, and corruption.

7. The power of sin.

8. The power of guilt.

 

The power of salvation to me means being set free.  We are bought with a price and the blood of Jesus is the payment.  We now have power of sin, pasts, and most of all death and hell.  We have Heaven to look forward to and an eternity with Christ.

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Was salvation offered to the people of God before Jesus died on the cross?  

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On 21/10/2016 at 5:57 AM, Remnantrob said:

The title is pretty self explanatory. I think a lot of people say the same words and have a different understanding of what it means.  How does the bible define salvation?  What were you saved from?  Thanks for the texts in advance.

 

Salvation consists of water and of fire (John 3:5). Though many are called to Christ, yet only a few are chosen, for not everyone who says Lord Lord will enter the Kingdom of Heaven, but only those that do the will of the Father.

The will of God is solely connected to how God dispenses his Grace and scripture states that the law came  by Moses, but truth and Grace came by Jesus Christ. The dispensation of God is tied to the SEED OF PROMISE Jesus Christ. Jesus Christ becomes our rest day, that is God's Sabbath.

How we were saved from, is from the point of reference where we were kicked out of God's rest day, in the Garden of Eden, where Adam and Eve fell from God's Grace, taking with them the whole human family. Yet within the same event, God promised that a SEED would come to crush the head of the serpent and to usher in God's rest day all over gain. This means that the breach in the garden would be once again repaired, as evidenced by the chronology of scriptural dispensations that led to the SEED Christ Jesus.

 

Salvation is defined........

If you declare with your mouth, “Jesus is Lord,” and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved. 10For it is with your heart that you believe and are justified, and it is with your mouth that you profess your faith and are saved. 11As Scripture says, “Anyone who believes in him will never be put to shame.” (Romans 10:9-11)

 

With reference to the above versus, there are many who have been called to Christ, yet only a few are saved. Hence the saying.....

22Many will say to me on that day, ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name and in your name drive out demons and in your name perform many miracles?’ 23Then I will tell them plainly, ‘I never knew you. Away from me, you evildoers!’ (Matthew 7:22-23)

God sees in the secret compartment of the heart and when people are called to Christ, many like the Pharisees choose to delve into religiocity and by doing so focus on a religious institution as if the institution through itself is dispensing God's grace, when in fact the institution becomes the worldly temple, modelled after the church of Jesus time, that was headed by a Patriarchal figure and that instituted a heavy yoke that it policed. Jesus would say to the samiritan women at the well, this model would be made obsolete, that no longer will people look towards the temple in Jerusalem, or the mountain where Moses received the commandments. Jesus would say one must be born again of the Spirit of God and that the Kingdom of God doesn't come by observation, rather the Kingdom of God is within you. The temple moved from the Old Testament church model with its patriarchal figure, to the New Testament church model that has the temple residing in us, whereby Jesus becomes our temple and our one and only Patrairchal figure in the Holy of Holies, who intercedes on our behaves.

So the temple being moved, the church model being changed and the patriarchal high priest figure being changed, points to the will of the Father tied to his dispensation which solely is tied to Jesus Christ, our rest day. That is why scripture states, that with the new covenant, the laws will be written in our hearts and that no longer will they teach one another to know thy God, for all from the smallest to the greatest will know the Lord. Jesus said ask and it shall be answered, knock and the door will be opened.

 

It is obvious that not everyone that is called to Christ will live according to the dispensations of God, rather they will cling onto a religious model, that is modelled after the first beast of John's revelation, that gave life to his image by establishing itself in its footsteps. The first religious beast Babylon the Great where our Lord was crucified, was the Old Testament church that Jesus charged with the blood of Abel right through to the blood of Zechariah, who was the last Old Testament prophet. The second lamb/Christ like beast that comes to encompass the world is made up of many daughters who take after the harlot, who is the original Judaic religious system that fell in 70AD. It is clear that religiosity is another model based on the persecuting authority of the first beast. If you look at history many of these religious institutions have done crimes in the name of religion, believing that they were doing God's will. Hence the statement, have we not preached in your name,  cast out demons in your name is a tell tell sign of a wrong fellowship.

It is clear that John 3:5 presents the formulae for salvation, that us we must be baptised by water for our justification, but salvation isn't only about being justified in Christ, for it must entail the final leg of fighting the good fight of faith and by individually finishing our race. This is where Jesus says be faithful even unto death and I will give you a crown of righteousness. So salvation requires justification and sanctification. Sanctification is a life long rehabilitation process that God the Holy Ghost oversees throughout an individual's born again faithful life, right up until their very deaths, where they finish their race and keep the faith. The fire is the purging of our old self, where we slowly are being made Holy/complete in Christ and according to all his eight beatitudes and come to the fullness of Christ.

 

No longer will they tell one another to know thy God, comes down to each and every born again believer being instrinsically motivated to own their faith and to become life long learners of the faith through a real and tangible relationship with Jesus Christ as their wonderful counsellor. Paul says we must become prisoners of Christ. So the Old model of church was based on transmission teaching and was policed and legislated by statutes that extrinsically motivated people to toe the line or else.

 

In the new church, there no longer is that policing authority and it requires individuals to instrinsically be motivated to own their faith and to come to Christ as willing prisoners and not under obligation or peer group pressure. Many are called to Christ by religiosity and their Old Testament modelled institutions, yet only a few will work it out and come to Christ individually and be saved. Humans like their comfort zones and many who cling to each other and their religious institutions are practicing religiosity and not doing the Father's will.

 

Sure we need a community of believers, but that community of believers doesn't need to be modelled on the first beast Babylon the great, the harlot that declared itself as the only path to salvation and enforced its rule of religious law as it pleased, under its Pontiv/patriarchal figure.

Since those who embrace a patriarchal or Pontic figure in place of Christ and revert to the Old Testament temple centred worship and practices, they are seeking to please God through obedience to a religious system, along with its patriarch/pontiv that had been made obsolete. These people believe it or not fall under the old covenant and have not part in dispensation of Grace through Christ Jesus, for that is why Jesus rejects them, because they are not doing the will of the Father.

To be saved you must come individually to Christ your one and only Patrairchal King and establish a one to one relationship that binds you to him only. As Jesus would say you in me and I in you. You must come to Christ with a broken snd contrite heart that places you in his hands and his hand shall only. 

 

 

 

 

Edited by Defending the Name
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On 10/20/2016 at 2:57 PM, Remnantrob said:

The title is pretty self explanatory. I think a lot of people say the same words and have a different understanding of what it means.  How does the bible define salvation?  What were you saved from?  Thanks for the texts in advance.

Shalom, Remnantrob.

As has been noted above, the word "salvation" means "deliverance" or "rescue." In context, it is frequently a quotation in the B'rit Chadashah (New Testament) from prophecies in the Tanakh (Old Testament) regarding the rescue that the Messiah will provide when He comes (returns).

A case in point is Romans 10:13:

Romans 10:3-13
3 For they being ignorant of God's righteousness, and going about to establish their own righteousness, have not submitted themselves unto the righteousness of God.
4 For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to every one that believeth.
5 For Moses describeth the righteousness which is of the law, That the man which doeth those things shall live by them.
6 But the righteousness which is of faith speaketh on this wise, Say not in thine heart, Who shall ascend into heaven? (that is, to bring Christ down from above:)
7 Or, Who shall descend into the deep? (that is, to bring up Christ again from the dead.)
8 But what saith it? The word is nigh thee, even in thy mouth, and in thy heart: that is, the word of faith, which we preach;
9 That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.
10 For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.
11 For the scripture saith, Whosoever believeth on him shall not be ashamed.
12 For there is no difference between the Jew and the Greek: for the same Lord over all is rich unto all that call upon him.
13 For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved.
KJV

Here's the passage in the Complete Jewish Bible:

Romans 10:1-13
10:1 Brothers, my heart’s deepest desire and my prayer to God for Isra’el is for their salvation; 2 for I can testify to their zeal for God. But it is not based on correct understanding; 3 for, since they are unaware of God’s way of making people righteous and instead seek to set up their own, they have not submitted themselves to God’s way of making people righteous. 4 For the goal at which the Torah aims is the Messiah, who offers righteousness to everyone who trusts. 5 For Moshe writes about the righteousness grounded in the Torah that the person who does these things will attain life through them. (Lev. 18:5)  6 Moreover, the righteousness grounded in trusting says:

“Do not say in your heart, ‘Who will ascend to heaven?’” — 
that is, to bring the Messiah down —  

7 or, “‘Who will descend into Sh’ol?’” — 
that is, to bring the Messiah up from the dead.

8 What, then, does it say?

“The word is near you, in your mouth and in your heart.” (Deut. 30:11-14) —

that is, the word about trust which we proclaim, namely, 9 that if you acknowledge publicly with your mouth that Yeshua is Lord and trust in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be delivered. 10 For with the heart one goes on trusting and thus continues toward righteousness, while with the mouth one keeps on making public acknowledgement and thus continues toward deliverance. 11 For the passage quoted says that everyone who rests his trust on him will not be humiliated. (Isa. 28:16)  12 That means that there is no difference between Jew and Gentile — Adonai is the same for everyone, rich toward everyone who calls on him, 13 since everyone who calls on the name of Adonai will be delivered. (Joel 2:32 {or Joel 3:5 in the Tanakh}) 
CJB

And, to investigate the passage in Joel 2:32, we find,

Joel 2:23-32
23 Be glad then, ye children of Zion, and rejoice in the LORD your God: for he hath given you the former rain moderately, and he will cause to come down for you the rain, the former rain, and the latter rain in the first month.
24 And the floors shall be full of wheat, and the fats shall overflow with wine and oil.
25 And I will restore to you the years that the locust hath eaten, the cankerworm, and the caterpiller, and the palmerworm, my great army which I sent among you.
26 And ye shall eat in plenty, and be satisfied, and praise the name of the LORD your God, that hath dealt wondrously with you: and my people shall never be ashamed.
27 And ye shall know that I am in the midst of Israel, and that I am the LORD your God, and none else: and my people shall never be ashamed.
28 And it shall come to pass afterward, that I will pour out my spirit upon all flesh; and your sons and your daughters shall prophesy, your old men shall dream dreams, your young men shall see visions:
29 And also upon the servants and upon the handmaids in those days will I pour out my spirit.
30 And I will shew wonders in the heavens and in the earth, blood, and fire, and pillars of smoke.
31 The sun shall be turned into darkness, and the moon into blood, before the great and the terrible day of the LORD come.
32 And it shall come to pass, that whosoever shall call on the name of the LORD shall be delivered: for in mount Zion and in Jerusalem shall be deliverance, as the LORD hath said, and in the remnant whom the LORD shall call.
KJV

So, what we REALLY have here in Romans 10 are TWO thoughts: the justification of an individual that leads one to God's acceptance and the rescue that is to follow when Yeshua` returns!

However, it is GOD'S JUSTIFICATION of an individual that is unconditional, NOT "salvation!" So, it should not be worded "once saved, always saved," but rather "once justified by God, always justified by God!" And, since that is "by God," then it is NOTHING that we do or don't do! It's all of HIM!

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1Pe 1:6  In this you greatly rejoice, though now for a little while, if need be, you have been grieved by various trials,  1Pe 1:7  that the genuineness of your faith, beingmuch more precious than gold that perishes, though it is tested by fire, may be found to praise, honor, and glory at the revelation of Jesus Christ,  1Pe 1:8  whom having not seen you love. Though now you do not see Him, yet believing, you rejoice with joy inexpressible and full of glory,  1Pe 1:9  receiving the end of your faith—the salvation of your souls.

1Pe 1:22  Since you have purified your souls in obeying the truth through the Spirit in sincere love of the brethren, love one another fervently with a pure heart,  1Pe 1:23  having been born again, not of corruptible seed but incorruptible, through the word of God which lives and abides forever.

We were saved from sin for the salvation of our souls.  But there was a purpose.  We are to allow Christ in us to bless others.  We are saved to love others fervently, especially our brothers and sisters in Christ.  Instead of being a bless me bunch, we are suppose to bless you.

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On 10/28/2016 at 7:47 PM, Defending the Name said:

 

Salvation consists of water and of fire (John 3:5). Though many are called to Christ, yet only a few are chosen, for not everyone who says Lord Lord will enter the Kingdom of Heaven, but only those that do the will of the Father.

The will of God is solely connected to how God dispenses his Grace and scripture states that the law came  by Moses, but truth and Grace came by Jesus Christ. The dispensation of God is tied to the SEED OF PROMISE Jesus Christ. Jesus Christ becomes our rest day, that is God's Sabbath.

How we were saved from, is from the point of reference where we were kicked out of God's rest day, in the Garden of Eden, where Adam and Eve fell from God's Grace, taking with them the whole human family. Yet within the same event, God promised that a SEED would come to crush the head of the serpent and to usher in God's rest day all over gain. This means that the breach in the garden would be once again repaired, as evidenced by the chronology of scriptural dispensations that led to the SEED Christ Jesus.

 

Salvation is defined........

If you declare with your mouth, “Jesus is Lord,” and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved. 10For it is with your heart that you believe and are justified, and it is with your mouth that you profess your faith and are saved. 11As Scripture says, “Anyone who believes in him will never be put to shame.” (Romans 10:9-11)

 

With reference to the above versus, there are many who have been called to Christ, yet only a few are saved. Hence the saying.....

22Many will say to me on that day, ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name and in your name drive out demons and in your name perform many miracles?’ 23Then I will tell them plainly, ‘I never knew you. Away from me, you evildoers!’ (Matthew 7:22-23)

God sees in the secret compartment of the heart and when people are called to Christ, many like the Pharisees choose to delve into religiocity and by doing so focus on a religious institution as if the institution through itself is dispensing God's grace, when in fact the institution becomes the worldly temple, modelled after the church of Jesus time, that was headed by a Patriarchal figure and that instituted a heavy yoke that it policed. Jesus would say to the samiritan women at the well, this model would be made obsolete, that no longer will people look towards the temple in Jerusalem, or the mountain where Moses received the commandments. Jesus would say one must be born again of the Spirit of God and that the Kingdom of God doesn't come by observation, rather the Kingdom of God is within you. The temple moved from the Old Testament church model with its patriarchal figure, to the New Testament church model that has the temple residing in us, whereby Jesus becomes our temple and our one and only Patrairchal figure in the Holy of Holies, who intercedes on our behaves.

So the temple being moved, the church model being changed and the patriarchal high priest figure being changed, points to the will of the Father tied to his dispensation which solely is tied to Jesus Christ, our rest day. That is why scripture states, that with the new covenant, the laws will be written in our hearts and that no longer will they teach one another to know thy God, for all from the smallest to the greatest will know the Lord. Jesus said ask and it shall be answered, knock and the door will be opened.

 

It is obvious that not everyone that is called to Christ will live according to the dispensations of God, rather they will cling onto a religious model, that is modelled after the first beast of John's revelation, that gave life to his image by establishing itself in its footsteps. The first religious beast Babylon the Great where our Lord was crucified, was the Old Testament church that Jesus charged with the blood of Abel right through to the blood of Zechariah, who was the last Old Testament prophet. The second lamb/Christ like beast that comes to encompass the world is made up of many daughters who take after the harlot, who is the original Judaic religious system that fell in 70AD. It is clear that religiosity is another model based on the persecuting authority of the first beast. If you look at history many of these religious institutions have done crimes in the name of religion, believing that they were doing God's will. Hence the statement, have we not preached in your name,  cast out demons in your name is a tell tell sign of a wrong fellowship.

It is clear that John 3:5 presents the formulae for salvation, that us we must be baptised by water for our justification, but salvation isn't only about being justified in Christ, for it must entail the final leg of fighting the good fight of faith and by individually finishing our race. This is where Jesus says be faithful even unto death and I will give you a crown of righteousness. So salvation requires justification and sanctification. Sanctification is a life long rehabilitation process that God the Holy Ghost oversees throughout an individual's born again faithful life, right up until their very deaths, where they finish their race and keep the faith. The fire is the purging of our old self, where we slowly are being made Holy/complete in Christ and according to all his eight beatitudes and come to the fullness of Christ.

 

No longer will they tell one another to know thy God, comes down to each and every born again believer being instrinsically motivated to own their faith and to become life long learners of the faith through a real and tangible relationship with Jesus Christ as their wonderful counsellor. Paul says we must become prisoners of Christ. So the Old model of church was based on transmission teaching and was policed and legislated by statutes that extrinsically motivated people to toe the line or else.

 

In the new church, there no longer is that policing authority and it requires individuals to instrinsically be motivated to own their faith and to come to Christ as willing prisoners and not under obligation or peer group pressure. Many are called to Christ by religiosity and their Old Testament modelled institutions, yet only a few will work it out and come to Christ individually and be saved. Humans like their comfort zones and many who cling to each other and their religious institutions are practicing religiosity and not doing the Father's will.

 

Sure we need a community of believers, but that community of believers doesn't need to be modelled on the first beast Babylon the great, the harlot that declared itself as the only path to salvation and enforced its rule of religious law as it pleased, under its Pontiv/patriarchal figure.

Since those who embrace a patriarchal or Pontic figure in place of Christ and revert to the Old Testament temple centred worship and practices, they are seeking to please God through obedience to a religious system, along with its patriarch/pontiv that had been made obsolete. These people believe it or not fall under the old covenant and have not part in dispensation of Grace through Christ Jesus, for that is why Jesus rejects them, because they are not doing the will of the Father.

To be saved you must come individually to Christ your one and only Patrairchal King and establish a one to one relationship that binds you to him only. As Jesus would say you in me and I in you. You must come to Christ with a broken snd contrite heart that places you in his hands and his hand shall only. 

 

 

 

 

Is it possible for a justified person to reject sanctification ? and if they do would it effect their salvation ? 

Edited by Remnantrob
Add 2nd question
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4 minutes ago, Remnantrob said:

Is it possible for a justified person to reject sanctification ? and if they do would it effect their salvation ? 

Yes to the first question. It is like a prisoner on parole breaking their bail bond conditions.

Paul says we are prisoners of Christ and must stay in him and not stray. If we stray from Christ we are rejecting sanctification.

Yes to the second question. If we refuse to be rehabilitated/sanctified, then we don't come into the fullness of Christ. God wants us moulded into the personage of his only begotten Son, for that is the will of the Father.  

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