Lourdes

[SavedOnebyGrace]

Background: Lourdes and Lourdes and Fatima: True or False

Quote

Lourdes

As regards appearances of the Mother of God inside the Church, the Russian Church calendar commemorates over 600 of her wonderworking icons, many of which first appeared to individuals in visions. As for the Roman Catholic world, there are the famous visions of the Mother of God to a peasant girl in Lourdes in south-western France in 1858. As we have written elsewhere over the decades, there are four reasons why these visions may have been real. Firstly, they happened to an innocent and pious peasant girl, Bernadette Soubirous (1844-1879), who had no clerical axe to grind. Secondly, when Bernadette was asked about the exact outward appearance of the Mother of God and was shown a catalogue of images, she innocently but truthfully at once chose not the resemblance of a Roman Catholic statue, but that of an Orthodox icon.

Thirdly, there are the well-documented and numerous miraculous healings in Lourdes, which cannot be explained by modern medicine. Finally, and most importantly of all, as the French-based Patriarchal Russian Orthodox religious writer, A. Merzlyukin described in 1960 (2), at a time when the Vatican machine was intent on finding support for its unOrthodox dogma of the Immaculate Conception of 1854, the message received by Bernadette was fully Orthodox. The words she allegedly heard from the mouth of the Mother of God were, ‘I am the Immaculate Conception’, not, ‘I was born by an immaculate conception’. This plainly contradicted the novel and recent Vatican dogma. It is precisely the Conception of Christ by the Mother of God which is ‘Immaculate’, that is, Most Pure, which is why we call her ‘Most Pure’. This is the age-old belief of the Church – not a nineteenth-century invention.

Orthodoxy has nothing to do with the unfortunate exploitation of this statement by the Vatican to support its novel dogma. By this, I refer to the authorities’ deliberate deformation of the message of Lourdes to make out that it was the conception of the Virgin Herself that was ‘Immaculate’. This myth-making has taken place to such an extent that many simple Roman Catholics today actually believe that the Virgin was conceived not by Sts Joachim and Anna, as Orthodox are reminded at every great dismissal, but in the same way as Christ – through the Holy Spirit and a virgin-mother.

This popular belief is not the official belief of Roman Catholicism. This is that the Virgin was conceived by human agency but with a special dispensation, relieving her of what it calls ‘original sin’. All of this is connected with ‘Augustinian’ doctrines, developed by medieval Scholasticism out of philosophical speculations in the writings of Blessed Augustine. These doctrines, ‘Augustinianism’, suggest predestination, a God Who does not love mankind, and are thus alien to the Orthodox Church and Her theology that loves mankind.

Paul and the False Apostles (2 Corinthians 11:13-15)

…13 For such men are false apostles, deceitful workers, masquerading as apostles of Christ. 14 And no wonder, for Satan himself masquerades as an angel of light. 15 It is not surprising, then, if his servants masquerade as servants of righteousness. Their end will correspond to their actions.… [Berean Study Bible]

So we must always guard against the deception of the evil one.

Avoid Divisions (Romans 16:18-20)

…18 For such as these are not serving our Lord Christ, but their own appetites. By smooth talk and flattery they deceive the hearts of the naive. 19 Everyone has heard about your obedience, so I rejoice over you. But I want you to be wise about what is good and innocent about what is evil. 20 The God of peace will soon crush Satan under your feet. The grace of our Lord Jesus Christ be with you.… [Berean Study Bible]

 

[Guest BacKaran]

My mom was into padre pio and the Fatima Mary.

All Marian visions are false imho.

[SavedOnebyGrace]

1 minute ago, BacKaran said:

My mom was into padre pio and the Fatima Mary.

All Marian visions are false imho.

The list of Marian visions is quite staggering.  But wouldn't that be something Satan might do to take glory away from The Father and His Son, the Messiah?  I agree with you.  As for the healings, not everyone is healed; I wonder what the percent is? 

The human mind is a wondrous piece of creation.  It can also short circuit creating wonderful illusions outside of our normal dream world.  I have a strange form of epilepsy developed late in life.  I smell things that aren't there.  Hideous, horrible smells that cause me to search for their origin, only to have them go away unfound.  My neurologist has traced the origin of these smells (and they're all similar) to a section of my brain controlling my sense of smell.  I'm now on a low dose of an anti-epileptic med called Keppra, and have been for nearly 5 years.  The few seizures of had since have been mild, all smelling like the dust from a furnace duct on fire.  Very tolerable.

If something like that could happen to me,  couldn't there be another cause for all these apparitions?  The people seeing these visions could be innocent victims, or useful tools for Satan and his lackeys.

[TheMatrixHasU71]

2 hours ago, Saved.One.by.Grace said:

Background: Lourdes and Lourdes and Fatima: True or False

Paul and the False Apostles (2 Corinthians 11:13-15)

…13 For such men are false apostles, deceitful workers, masquerading as apostles of Christ. 14 And no wonder, for Satan himself masquerades as an angel of light. 15 It is not surprising, then, if his servants masquerade as servants of righteousness. Their end will correspond to their actions.… [Berean Study Bible]

So we must always guard against the deception of the evil one.

Avoid Divisions (Romans 16:18-20)

…18 For such as these are not serving our Lord Christ, but their own appetites. By smooth talk and flattery they deceive the hearts of the naive. 19 Everyone has heard about your obedience, so I rejoice over you. But I want you to be wise about what is good and innocent about what is evil. 20 The God of peace will soon crush Satan under your feet. The grace of our Lord Jesus Christ be with you.… [Berean Study Bible]

 

The problem here too is (have you ever noticed how often these demonic apparitions appear only to children?) Satan loves to take advantage of the innocent and inexperienced. Namely children. They don't know any better.

[SavedOnebyGrace]

2 minutes ago, TheMatrixHasU71 said:

The problem here too is (have you ever noticed how often these demonic apparitions appear only to children?) Satan loves to take advantage of the innocent and inexperienced. Namely children. They don't know any better.

That's true.  I honestly hadn't considered that.  I do know that when there's a crowd of people looking for or at an apparition, some see it and some don't.

Growing up, I do remember my mother telling me that Red Skelton's son was deathly ill and he took him to Lourdes, but he still died.  Couple things I need to say here.  My mother was a pathological liar.  There's more I could add here but I'll save that for another time.  To the best of my knowledge, Red Skelton was a Protestant of some denomination.  Why would he go to Lourdes?  Who knows if anything my mother said really true.

[Willa]

I continually go back to basing all doctrine on God's Word, the 66 books of the Bible.  So I reject doctrine not found there.  Portions of the emergent church, some charismatics, Methodist and Episcopal/Church of England tend not to adhere to the Bible alone for doctrine, let alone various Orthodox and Catholic.  The Alexandrian church of Egypt was noted for including gnostic mysticism in their beliefs.  

I remember trying to convince a Spanish girl that statues cannot heal.  In her home town they would parade a statue of Mary that they thought would heal people. I told her that only God can heal, but to no avail.  Yes, there are people who pray to statues which is true idolatry. And there are people who believe that statues do miracles.  

24 minutes ago, Yowm said:

As long as people run after apparitions, sign and wonders, miracle workers, etc., on both sides of the aisle (Cath & Prots), they are setting themselves up for deep deception. We walk by faith and not by sight; faith comes by hearing God's Word.

I especially agree with this.  The "run after, seek after" etc of the these that is worrisome.  We are to seek the Kingdom of God and His righteousness.  We are to seek to follow Jesus.  God does supply our basic needs and heal us.  That You Jesus!

In the end times many will be deceived by the signs and wonders performed by the false prophet and the antichrist by satan's power.  They are setting themselves up for even worse deception.  It grieves my heart.

[Guest BacKaran]

And ever notice the only religion, to my knowledge, to have demon exorcisms is the rcc? Although plenty of pagan religions have demons. 

[RealPresence]

On 11/17/2016 at 1:55 PM, BacKaran said:

And ever notice the only religion, to my knowledge, to have demon exorcisms is the rcc? Although plenty of pagan religions have demons. 

So - YOU don't believe in spiritual warfare or that demons exist??
You believe that the demons Jesus cast out of people were just a figment of His imagination?

 

[RealPresence]

On 11/17/2016 at 1:55 PM, BacKaran said:

And ever notice the only religion, to my knowledge, to have demon exorcisms is the rcc? Although plenty of pagan religions have demons. 

DUPLICATE POST

 

[RealPresence]

On 11/17/2016 at 10:37 AM, TheMatrixHasU71 said:

The problem here too is (have you ever noticed how often these demonic apparitions appear only to children?) Satan loves to take advantage of the innocent and inexperienced. Namely children. They don't know any better.

RUBBISH.
Mary has appeared to many adults as well including people like St. Dominic and St. Catherine Laboure.

If you're going to attack the Catholic Church - at least TRY to get your facts straight . . .