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[HAZARD]

The earth is called "dry land" in Genesis 1:10 which means that Genesis 1:1 could read, "In the beginning God created the heaven and dry land."

Since it was created dry, it stands to reason that the flooded condition of Genesis 1:2 was a curse, not a creative act.

According to Psalm 136:6 the earth was originally "stretched above the waters," not covered by them. This requires a pre-Adamite race whose sin brought such a curse.

This plainly and clearly states that originally the earth was created above the waters, but in Gen. 1:2 the earth is below the waters. What made that difference?

The sin and rebellion of Lucifer and the pre-Adamites caused God to flood the earth, submerging it with water to destroy all life on it. Noah's flood did not destroy all life on the earth.

[HAZARD]

26 minutes ago, Teditis said:

God DID create the Cosmos in those first 6 days. Gen. 1:16-17 clearly say that God "...MADE two great lights...". It doesn't say that He turned them on again.

Learn to read what's there, correctly, please.

  Can you learn to stop this garbage, "Learn to read what's there, correctly, please." I can read

 

In Scripture, all instances of obscuring the sun and bringing darkness are the result of judgment, not creation-which is also true of the two universal floods (Genesis 6:8-8:22; Exodus 10:21-23; Isaiah 5:30; Jeremiah 4:23-26).

All predictions of future darkness depict judgment (Matthew 8:12; Matthew 24:29-31; Rev. 6:12-17; Rev. 8:12; Rev. 9:2; Rev. 16:10; Isaiah 13:10; Joel 2:30-3:16; Amos 5:18-20).

Could we say that Genesis 1:2 is the only place in Scripture where darkness and a universal flood are not an act of judgment? If it isn't an option, then Genesis 1:2 proves that there was a pre-Adamite world destroyed by darkness and flood.

No one questions that Noah's flood was an act of judgment, or doubts the existence of free moral agents before the flood actually came. Why then doubt the existence of a pre-Adamite world which was destroyed by the darkness and flood of Genesis 1:2?

[HAZARD]

Bearing in mind that God does not usually explain all there is to know about a subject in one place in the Bible. Even the biblical writers He inspired did not always fully understand what they recorded (compare Daniel 12:8-9 Daniel 12:8-98 And I heard, but I understood not: then said I, O my Lord, what shall be the end of these things? 9 And he said, Go your way, Daniel: for the words are closed up and sealed till the time of the end.
God often fills in more details in other passages. So it is with Genesis 1.

Genesis 1:1 Genesis 1:1 “In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth.” It might seem as if this verse describes the beginning of everything, but God later reveals details of events and conditions that took place earlier.

The apostle John, writing under God’s inspiration, takes us back to a time before events described in Genesis 1. “In the beginning,” he states, “was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. He was in the beginning with God. All things were made through Him, and without Him nothing was made that was made” John 1:1-3 V. 1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. V. 2 The same was in the beginning with God. 3 All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.
 

Here the Bible reveals that, before the creation of the heavens and the earth described in Genesis 1, the divine Word (the One who became Jesus, verse 14) was with God, and God made everything through Him. None of this is revealed in the Genesis account, yet these details help us understand who God was in the beginning and at the time of the earth’s creation. We see that John gives us more information that helps us understand what happened. 

Genesis 1:2, And the earth was without form, and void; and darkness was on the face of the deep. And the Spirit of God moved on the face of the waters.
Gen. 1:2 describes the earth as being “without form, and void.” This sketchy description offers no explanation for why the earth was in this condition. However, God reveals more details in other parts of His Word.

Though not mentioned in Genesis, God elsewhere explains that angels were present at the creation of the earth. We find this detail recorded in the book of Job, where God asks Job: “Where were you when I laid the foundations of the earth? . . . Who laid its cornerstone, when the morning stars sang together, and all the sons of God shouted with joy?” Job 38:4, Where were you when I laid the foundations of the earth? declare, if you have understanding.
The “morning stars” and “sons of God”—the angels—exulted as they saw the earth miraculously come into being.

A key to understanding why the earth was “without form and void” involves what happened to some of these angels. Again, nothing of this angelic story is described in Genesis. But later in His Word, God reveals that there was a great angel, Lucifer, who rebelled against Him: “How you are fallen from heaven, O Lucifer, son of the morning! How you are cut down to the ground, you who weakened the nations! For you have said in your heart: ‘I will ascend into heaven, I will exalt my throne above the stars of God . . . I will ascend above the heights of the clouds, I will be like the Most High’ ”  Isaiah 14:12-14, V. 12 How are you fallen from heaven, O Lucifer, son of the morning! how are you cut down to the ground, which did weaken the nations! V. 13 For you have said in your heart, I will ascend into heaven, I will exalt my throne above the stars of God: I will sit also on the mount of the congregation, in the sides of the north: V. 14 I will ascend above the heights of the clouds; I will be like the most High.

Here God explains that Lucifer had a throne, representing a position of leadership and authority. He rose from somewhere below to try to overthrow God, but was “cut down to the ground.”

Where was this place where Lucifer had his throne? Jesus Christ, whom we earlier saw was the “Word” alongside God at the creation, reveals more details. “I saw Satan fall like lightning from heaven,” He said  Luke 10:18 And he said to them, I beheld Satan as lightning fall from heaven.
Lucifer, who became Satan (meaning Adversary) at his rebellion, was cast down from heaven—to the earth!

The Bible explains that Satan retains his authority over this planet. Notice what Satan told Christ: “Then the devil, taking Him up on a high mountain, showed Him all the kingdoms of the world in a moment of time. And the devil said to Him, ‘All this authority I will give You, and their glory; for this has been delivered to me, and I give it to whomever I wish’ ”  Luke 4:5-6, V. 5 And the devil, taking him up into an high mountain, showed to him all the kingdoms of the world in a moment of time. V. 6 And the devil said to him, All this power will I give you, and the glory of them: for that is delivered to me; and to whomsoever I will I give it.
 

Jesus resisted this temptation but did not dispute the assertion of Satan’s present authority, even later calling him “the ruler of this world”  John 12:31 Now is the judgment of this world: now shall the prince of this world be cast out.
He is elsewhere called “the god of this age” 2 Corinthians 4:4 In whom the god of this world has blinded the minds of them which believe not, lest the light of the glorious gospel of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine to them.
 

It is no accident that in Genesis 3, shortly after God created Adam and Eve, Satan appeared on the scene as the serpent in the garden. The earth was—and still is—his domain. He had been cast down to the earth before man’s creation took place. As noted in the account of the temptation of Christ, Satan had received authority over the earth. He then rebelled against God in a battle in which he was cast down to the earth, as Christ recounted. 

The earth is Satan’s realm. The book of Job records God asking Satan, “From where do you come?” Satan’s reply was, “From going to and fro on the earth and from walking back and forth on it”  Job 1:7 And the LORD said to Satan, From where come you? Then Satan answered the LORD, and said, From going to and fro in the earth, and from walking up and down in it.
 

One thing the Bible does not say, and that is, "Six thousand years ago, God created the heaven and the Earth."

 

[Retrobyter]

17 minutes ago, HAZARD said:

The earth is called "dry land" in Genesis 1:10 which means that Genesis 1:1 could read, "In the beginning God created the heaven and dry land."

Since it was created dry, it stands to reason that the flooded condition of Genesis 1:2 was a curse, not a creative act.

According to Psalm 136:6 the earth was originally "stretched above the waters," not covered by them. This requires a pre-Adamite race whose sin brought such a curse.

This plainly and clearly states that originally the earth was created above the waters, but in Gen. 1:2 the earth is below the waters. What made that difference?

The sin and rebellion of Lucifer and the pre-Adamites caused God to flood the earth, submerging it with water to destroy all life on it. Noah's flood did not destroy all life on the earth.

Shalom, HAZARD.

The Hebrew word translated as "the dry land" is "hayabaashaah," the following word with the "ha-" article attached:

OT:3004 yabbaashaah (yab-baw-shaw'); from OT:3001; dry ground:
KJV - dry (ground, land).

(Biblesoft's New Exhaustive Strong's Numbers and Concordance with Expanded Greek-Hebrew Dictionary. Copyright © 1994, 2003, 2006 Biblesoft, Inc. and International Bible Translators, Inc.)

The word comes from ...

OT:3001 yaabeesh (yaw-bashe'); a primitive root; to be ashamed, confused or disappointed; also (as failing) to dry up (as water) or wither (as herbage): -be ashamed, clean, be confounded, (make) dry (up), (do) shame (-fully),  utterly, wither (away).

(Biblesoft's New Exhaustive Strong's Numbers and Concordance with Expanded Greek-Hebrew Dictionary. Copyright © 1994, 2003, 2006 Biblesoft, Inc. and International Bible Translators, Inc.)

It was not used in verse 1 because IT HADN'T HAPPENED, YET!

As I've said already, the first verse ANTICIPATES what is to follow! It SUMMARIZES what is to follow! It's the way that Hebrew literature FORESHADOWS what is to come! It's similar to the way that outlines state a general point and then reveals the minor points below the general point!

(Sigh.) Look. It's pointless to go around and around forever. You can't convince me because I've done the study. I know that's how Hebrew literature works, and I know what the prophecies are saying.

I obviously am not convincing you because "a man convinced against his will is of the same opinion still." So, let's just agree to disagree.

I've tried to show you reason, and you slap my hand away. That's fine. Just be aware that how you believe Genesis unfolds is going to affect the rest of your interpretation of prophecy. If you get the beginning wrong, how can you hope to know how it will end?

Anyway, let the Holy Spirit have His way. 

[Retrobyter]

5 hours ago, HAZARD said:

...

One thing the Bible does not say, and that is, "Six thousand years ago, God created the heaven and the Earth."

Shalom, HAZARD.

No, what it DOES say is that the Torah (the Pentateuch), first written in approximately 1,250 B.C.E., said that the Creation occurred at least 2,638 years prior to the Exodus. Add to that 2017 years less 1 year between B.C. and A.D, and one arrives at 5,904 years ago. But, we also have the "at least" part to consider.

Yeshua` (Jesus) Himself said that God made them (Adam and his wife) "at the beginning" in Matthew 19:4. He also quoted Genesis 1:27 and Genesis 2:24 in the next two following verses.

And, we also read (or at least, we SHOULD read), ...

Exodus 20:8-11
8 Remember the sabbath day, to keep it holy.
9 Six days shalt thou labour, and do all thy work:
10 But the seventh day is the sabbath (the Shabbat) of the LORD thy God: in it thou shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, thy manservant, nor thy maidservant, nor thy cattle, nor thy stranger that is within thy gates:
11 For in six days the LORD made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that in them is, and rested the seventh day: wherefore the LORD blessed the sabbath day (the Shabbat), and hallowed it.
KJV

Exodus 31:12-18
12 And the LORD spake unto Moses, saying,
13 Speak thou also unto the children of Israel, saying, Verily my sabbaths ye shall keep: for it is a sign between me and you throughout your generations; that ye may know that I am the LORD that doth sanctify you.
14 Ye shall keep the sabbath therefore; for it is holy unto you: every one that defileth it shall surely be put to death: for whosoever doeth any work therein, that soul shall be cut off from among his people.
15 Six days may work be done; but in the seventh is the sabbath of rest, holy to the LORD: whosoever doeth any work in the sabbath day (the Shabbat), he shall surely be put to death.
16 Wherefore the children of Israel shall keep the sabbath, to observe the sabbath throughout their generations, for a perpetual covenant.
17 It is a sign between me and the children of Israel for ever: for in six days the LORD made heaven and earth, and on the seventh day he rested, and was refreshed.
18 And he gave unto Moses, when he had made an end of communing with him upon mount Sinai, two tables of testimony, tables of stone, written with the finger of God.
KJV

So, you may THINK that the Bible doesn't say it (but, it really DOES).

Edited January 23, 2017 by Retrobyter
To note that I'm adding this for others' benefit.

[HAZARD]

God's Word says "In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth." Just like it also says in John 1:14,  "In the beginning was the Word." The Bible does not say '6,000 years ago, God created the heaven and the earth" just like it does not say "6,000 years ago was the Word."

God told Adam and Eve to replenish the Earth as He told Noah to replenish the Earth. The NKJ version of the Bible says replenish, as God also said to Noah, replenish. There was a social system before Adam (cp. Gen. 9:1; Isa. 2:6; 23:2; Jer. 31:25; Ez. 26:2; 27:25).

The word replenish and replenished, is used in many Scriptures and it does not mean to simply fill.

Gen. 9:1, "And God blessed Noah and his sons, and said unto them, Be fruitful, and multiply, and replenish the earth."

Isa. 2:6,  "Therefore thou hast forsaken thy people the house of Jacob, because they be replenished from the east, and are soothsayers like the Philistines, and they please themselves in the children of strangers."

Isa. 23:2, "Be still,1 ye inhabitants of the isle; thou whom the merchants of Zidon, that pass over the sea, replenished"

Jer. 31:25, "For I have satiated the weary soul, and I have replenished every sorrowful soul."

Ezek. 26:2, "Son of man, because that Tyrus hath said against Jerusalem, Aha, she is broken that was the gates of the people: she is turned unto me: I shall be replenished,  now she is laid waste:"

Ezek. 27:25, "The ships of Tarshish did sing of thee in thy market: and thou wast replenished,  and made very glorious in the midst of the seas. "

One cannot replenish something that has not been filled before.

I have a full glass of wine, I drink it, its empty, I ask the bartender, when he returns to refill (replenish) my empty glass.

[HAZARD]

1. The following facts prove that the term "in the beginning" in Genesis 1:1 refers to the original creation of the heavens and the earth, and does not refer to the time or work of the six days of Genesis 1:3-2:25:

(1) The word "and" is used 153 times in Genesis 1-2 to separate the 102 independent acts of God. The "and" of Genesis 1:2 proves that the work of Genesis 1:2 is entirely independent of the work of Genesis 1:1. While Genesis 1:1 records the original creation of the heavens and the earth, Genesis 1:2 records the original dry land, or earth, made into chaos and flooded through a great catastrophe which destroyed all life on a pre-Adamite earth.

(2) The word "was" in Genesis 1:2 is from the verb to become, not the verb to be, proving that the earth became waste and empty since its original creation and habitation in the beginning. 

(3) The phrase "without form" in Genesis 1:2, is from the Hebrew tohuw (OT:8414), meaning waste or desolation. It is translated "waste" (Deut. 32:10), "without form" (Genesis 1:2; Jeremiah 4:23), "vain" (Isaiah 45:18; 1 Samuel 12:21), "confusion" (Isaiah 24:10; Isaiah 34:11; Isaiah 41:29), "empty" (Job 26:7), "vanity" (Isaiah 40:17,23; Isaiah 44:9; Isaiah 59:4), "nothing" (Job 6:18; Isaiah 40:17), and "wilderness" (Job 12:24; Psalm 107:40). It can be seen from these passages what the condition of the earth was in Genesis 1:2. Yet Isaiah 45:18 states that God did not create the earth "in vain," or tohuw (OT:8414). Therefore, the earth was originally perfect, dry land, beautiful, and inhabited, but later became empty, waste, and a ruin because of sin (Deut. 32:4; Eccles. 3:11).

(4) The Hebrew for "void" in Genesis 1:2 is bohuw (OT:922), "empty, ruined, void." It is translated "void" (Genesis 1:2; Jeremiah 4:23), and "emptiness" (Isaiah 34:11). The Hebrew phrase, tohuw wabohuw, "waste and empty," describes the chaotic condition of the earth at the time that it was cursed and flooded because of the sins of Lucifer and the pre-Adamites. It doesn't refer to the earth as originally created-beautiful, perfect, dry land.

2. The earth was created to be inhabited (Isaiah 45:18), and was inhabited before the flood of Genesis 1:2 and the work of the six days of Adam's time (Genesis 1:3-2:25; Isaiah 14:12-14; Jeremiah 4:23-26; Ezekiel 28:11-17; 2 Peter 3:5-7).

3. The earth is called "dry land" in Genesis 1:10 which means that Genesis 1:1 could read, "In the beginning God created the heaven and dry land." Since it was created dry, it stands to reason that the flooded condition of Genesis 1:2 was a curse, not a creative act. According to Psalm 136:6 the earth was originally "stretched above the waters," not covered by them. This requires a pre-Adamite race whose sin brought such a curse.

4. In Genesis 1:2 the earth is not only flooded with water but covered in total darkness, causing all life on earth to be destroyed. This requires a pre-Adamite world with vegetation, birds, animals, and human beings as proven in the notes on Jeremiah 4:23-26.

5. Genesis 1:2 reveals that the earth, waters, and darkness were already in existence before the work of the six days which began in Genesis 1:3 and continued until the earth was restored to a second habitable state in Genesis 2:25. Thus, it is clear from Genesis 1:1-2 (and related scriptures) that:

(1) In the beginning-the dateless past, not six thousand years ago-God created the heavens, including the sun, moon, and stars.

(2) At the same time God also created the earth or dry land.

(3) The heavens and the earth were created by God, a personal and an eternal Being. They were not the result of a cosmic accident.

(4) The heavens were created before the earth, as revealed in Job 38:4-7.

(5) Both the heavens and the earth were created before the earth was flooded.

(6) The earth was created dry land, not wet and flooded (Genesis 1:1,10; Isaiah 45:18).

(7) The waters that flooded the dry land were created in the beginning along with the earth, to cause the dry land to become productive (Job 38:4-30), not to curse the earth as in Genesis 1:2.

(8) Light and darkness was also created in the beginning, to help sustain life on the earth (Job 38:4-41).

(9) The earth alone was cursed, flooded, and filled with darkness-not the heavens (Genesis 1:2).

We therefore conclude that Genesis 1:1-2 proves a pre-Adamite world that was destroyed in a flood, requiring the making of the present Adamite world for God's original purpose for the earth to be realized (Isaiah 45:18).

6. Genesis 1:2 reveals the Spirit of God moving on the flooded earth to restore dry land. This confirms that the pre-Adamite world was destroyed, making it necessary to restore the earth to a second habitable state.

7. In Scripture, all instances of obscuring the sun and bringing darkness are the result of judgment, not creation-which is also true of the two universal floods (Genesis 6:8-8:22; Exodus 10:21-23; Isaiah 5:30; Jeremiah 4:23-26). All predictions of future darkness depict judgment (Matthew 8:12; Matthew 24:29-31; Rev. 6:12-17; Rev. 8:12; Rev. 9:2; Rev. 16:10; Isaiah 13:10; Joel 2:30-3:16; Amos 5:18-20). Could we say that Genesis 1:2 is the only place in Scripture where darkness and a universal flood are not an act of judgment? If it isn't an option, then Genesis 1:2 proves that there was a pre-Adamite world destroyed by darkness and flood. No one questions that Noah's flood was an act of judgment, or doubts the existence of free moral agents before the flood actually came. Why then doubt the existence of a pre-Adamite world which was destroyed by the darkness and flood of Genesis 1:2?

8. The command for Adam to "replenish" the earth (fill it again, not plenish it) proves the earth had been filled before this (Genesis 1:28). God gave the same command to Noah, after the second universal flood (Genesis 9:1-2). Should we conclude that God meant for Noah to fill the earth for the first time, and not refill it? Substitute the word fill (meaning supply for the first time) in Genesis 9:1; Isaiah 2:6; Isaiah 23:2; Jeremiah 31:25; Ezekiel 26:2; Ezekiel 27:25, as some do in Genesis 1:28 and see if it makes better sense. Whatever we conclude in the other places where "replenish" is used, we should be consistent and give the same meaning to Genesis 1:28.

9. The fact that Lucifer had already ruled the earth and become a fallen creature before Adam's time is proof that Adam and his race were not the first ones on earth. We must acknowledge that Satan's fall was before Adam's time, because he was already a fallen creature when he came into Adam's Eden (Genesis 3; 2 Cor. 11:3). Hence, he must have fallen with a pre-Adamite creation.

10. According to Isaiah 14:12-14, Lucifer actually invaded heaven from earth, hoping to defeat God and take His kingdom; but Lucifer himself was defeated and his kingdom cursed. Before his defeat, he had a throne, implying a kingdom and subjects to rule over. His kingdom was under the clouds, under the stars, and under heaven-therefore, on earth. Having weakened the nations over whom he ruled, and wanting to be like God and take His place in heaven, Lucifer led the invasion of heaven. All this had to be before Adam's day, because no such things have occurred since Adam was created.

11. Ezekiel 28:11-17 pictures Lucifer before he fell, as the anointed cherub or protector of the earth, full of wisdom and perfect in beauty, ruling in a garden of Eden (before Adam), created by God and perfect in his ways up to the time of his fall. The passage gives both the reason for his fall and the results. The only time this could have been true of Satan was before the days of Adam, thus proving a pre-Adamite world.

12. In Jeremiah 4:23-26 we have a full description of the earth under a total curse, as in Genesis 1:2. It was desolate and empty. The heavens had no light, the hills and mountains were undergoing convulsions, and there was neither man, bird, animal, nor fruitful place; no city was left standing because of God's fierce anger. The only time Jeremiah could have seen the earth "without form and void" was at the same time that Moses saw it thus, as recorded by him in Genesis 1:2. There never has been a time from Adam until now when the earth was in such a state-not even at the time of Noah's flood-and there will never be a time of such a curse in the eternal future. The only time Jeremiah 4:23-26 could be fulfilled was before Adam, because the earth was in that condition when the Spirit began the six days' work of restoring it to a second habitable state (Genesis 1:2-21). Regarding the future, this will never be the condition of the earth again, because at His second coming Christ will begin to reign over all nations on earth forever, and of His kingdom there shall be no end (Genesis 8:22; Genesis 9:12; Isaiah 9:6-7; Isaiah 59:21; Daniel 2:44-45; Daniel 7:13-14,18,27; Zech. 14; Luke 1:32-33; Rev. 1:6; Rev. 5:10; Rev. 11:15; Rev. 20:4-10; Rev. 22:4-5). Even the renovation of heaven and earth at the end of the Millennium will not make the earth desolate as pictured in Genesis 1:2 and Jeremiah 4:23-26 (see notes, Romans 8:19-25; Hebrews 1:10-12; Hebrews 12:25-28; 2 Peter 3:10-13). Therefore, Jeremiah 4:23-26 must refer to the same judgment as Genesis 1:2, proving further that a real social system-human beings, birds, fruitful places, cities-existed before Adam.

13. Psalm 104:5-9 speaks of God sending a flood on the earth after its creation, at which time the waters stood above the mountains. Psalm 104:7 identifies this as Lucifer's flood, saying "At Thy rebuke they fled." In the case of Noah's flood, the waters slowly and naturally abated. Furthermore, Psalm 104:9 makes it clear that this flood was at a time when God set a boundary for the waters "that they turn not again to cover the earth," and that is what happened in the six days' work of Genesis 1:3-2:25. Thus, Psalm 104:5-9 refers to the same flood as Genesis 1:2 and proves the existence of a pre-Adamite world which was overthrown by a flood.

14. Turning to the New Testament we find that Jesus taught the fall of Satan from heaven in Luke 10:18. When did he fall? Before Adam's time, because he was already a fallen creature when he came into Adam's Eden (Genesis 3). Why did he fall? Because of pride and wanting to exalt his earthly kingdom above God's (Isaiah 14:12-16; Ezekiel 28:11-17). What was the result of his fall? All of Satan's earthly subjects as well as over one third of God's own angels fell with him (Rev. 12:3,7-12); and all nations were totally destroyed, along with vegetation, fish, fowl, and animals (2 Peter 3:5-7). Thus, Luke 10:18 substantiates the teaching of Old Testament passages regarding a pre-Adamite world.

15. Jesus further taught the overthrow of the pre-Adamite world by plainly stating that the world had been overthrown.

16. Paul also taught the overthrow of the pre-Adamite world (Ephes. 1:4; Hebrews 4:3; Hebrews 9:26; see notes at these scriptures and the note on Matthew 13:35). In Col. 1:15-18 he made it clear that there are thrones, principalities, and powers in heaven and in earth, visible and invisible. It shouldn't be difficult to believe that Lucifer was given one of these thrones and a kingdom to rule over, before he fell. That his kingdom was on earth in a pre-Adamite period is indicated by the fact that he returned to the earth after his fall and brought about the downfall of the new ruler, Adam. Why all this desire to usurp man's dominion on earth if the earth was not at one time Lucifer's place of rulership? Even his eternal punishment will be in the lake of fire under the earth, which further proves his sin was in connection with the earth-and when else could that have been but at the time of a pre-Adamite world?

17. Contrasting "the world that then was" with the heavens and the earth "which are now" Peter spoke clearly of a social system overthrown before Adam.

18. John also referred to the overthrow of the pre-Adamite world.
It is clear that both the Old Testament and the New Testament give proof of a pre-Adamite world. Scientific findings of prehistoric animals and human beings, the age of the earth, and other facts are consistent with the Biblical revelation of a pre-Adamite social system. There are many questions which cannot be answered apart from a belief in the pre-Adamite age. How did Lucifer become the devil and the prince of demons? When did he weaken the nations, ascend into heaven to exalt his throne above the stars, and fall from heaven as in Isaiah 14:12-14? How did demons originate, for what purpose, and when? What caused the calamity of Genesis 1:2; Jeremiah 4:23-26; Psalm 104:6-9; and 2 Peter 3:5-6? Why was hell prepared for the devil and his angels as stated in Matthew 25:41, and why was it located beneath the earth (Matthew 12:40; Ephes. 4:7-11)? Why was Adam told to "replenish" the earth and not merely to plenish it? These and other questions go unanswered apart from a belief in the pre-Adamite world.

Hebrew: hayah (OT:1961), became. Translated "became" 67 times (Genesis 2:7; Genesis 19:26; Genesis 20:12; Genesis 24:67; etc.); "becamest" (1 Chron. 17:22; Ezekiel 16:8); "came" and "came to pass" 505 times (Genesis 6:1; Genesis 11:2; Genesis 14:1; etc.); "become" 66 times (Genesis 3:22; Genesis 18:18; Genesis 48:19; etc.); "come to pass" 131 times (Genesis 4:14; Genesis 24:43; Genesis 27:40; etc.); and "be" in the sense of "become" (Genesis 1:3,6,9,14; Genesis 3:5; etc.).

Hebrew: tohuw (OT:8414) wabohuw (OT:922), "waste and empty" (Jeremiah 4:23). The earth wasn't created tohuw in the beginning (Isaiah 45:18), but "became" (see note above) this way because of sin.

Obscuring the sun and consequent darkness is always a result of judgment, never of creation (Genesis 6-8; Exodus 10:21; Jeremiah 4:23; Joel 2:31; Rev. 6:12; Rev. 8:12; Rev. 9:2; Rev. 16:10).

[Retrobyter]

On 1/21/2017 at 2:11 PM, Zach said:

Retrobyter, 

Thanks for being jovial & affirming; it's very much appreciated!

If you notice what the verse actually says; (caps mine)  ".....and let the DRY land appear”; and it was so."

(Btw, there is very good Jewish Midrash based on the Bible claiming the earth is about 15 billion years old, mankind created 25 million years ago and Adam & Eve placed in the garden and filled with God's spirit 6000 years ago.)

 

Shalom, Zach.

Okay, well, it may be a very good Jewish Midrash based on the Bible, but it seems that it is also based on (or at least, STRONGLY influenced by) the theory of Evolution.

The problem with Evolution is that it's a humanistic way of describing origins WITHOUT GOD in the equation. Another problem with Evolution is that it will ALWAYS ONLY be a "theory." The reason for that is quite simple: There's no way to prove it exists any more than one can prove God exists. BOTH are matters of FAITH! One either believes that God exists and that He created this planet with its life, OR one believes that matter and energy have always existed and that life sprang up from the chance re-combination of molecules.

Like the midrash mentioned above, later theories have cropped up to "fit God into the theory of Evolution."

One theory is the Day-Age theory which states that each of the seven days of Creation were actually long epochs of time!

Another theory is the Progressive Creation theory which suggests that during the normal evolutionary process, God had to bridge the hard gaps. It's sort of like having to keep the ball rolling with a few kicks every now and then, or how a juggler has to keep spinning the plates to keep them from falling off the poles.

Another theory similar to the Progressive Creation theory is Threshold Evolution. Again, this theory suggests that at certain thresholds in the progression of evolutionary processes, God had to intervene and give evolution a "push" with a touch of creation.

Another similar theory is the Theistic Evolution theory. This theory suggests that the Creation story was meant to be figurative and they will attempt to correlate the Bible with the theory of Evolution.

A subset of this theory is the Revelatory-Day theory, which states that the Bible account of the Creation was only figurative and was like any other vision mentioned in the Bible, that the Bible was not actually talking about the real acts of God during seven 24-hour days. 

In all of these theories, there's a basic problem: Humanistic Evolutionists don't want to admit to a God involved in the process AT ALL!

I think it's best just to accept God's Word as written. It makes the best sense, and it acknowledges the supreme power of an Almighty God.

[Retrobyter]

On 1/23/2017 at 2:32 PM, HAZARD said:

God's Word says "In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth." Just like it also says in John 1:14,  "In the beginning was the Word." The Bible does not say '6,000 years ago, God created the heaven and the earth" just like it does not say "6,000 years ago was the Word."

God told Adam and Eve to replenish the Earth as He told Noah to replenish the Earth. The NKJ version of the Bible says replenish, as God also said to Noah, replenish. There was a social system before Adam (cp. Gen. 9:1; Isa. 2:6; 23:2; Jer. 31:25; Ez. 26:2; 27:25).

The word replenish and replenished, is used in many Scriptures and it does not mean to simply fill.

Gen. 9:1, "And God blessed Noah and his sons, and said unto them, Be fruitful, and multiply, and replenish the earth."

Isa. 2:6,  "Therefore thou hast forsaken thy people the house of Jacob, because they be replenished from the east, and are soothsayers like the Philistines, and they please themselves in the children of strangers."

Isa. 23:2, "Be still,1 ye inhabitants of the isle; thou whom the merchants of Zidon, that pass over the sea, replenished"

Jer. 31:25, "For I have satiated the weary soul, and I have replenished every sorrowful soul."

Ezek. 26:2, "Son of man, because that Tyrus hath said against Jerusalem, Aha, she is broken that was the gates of the people: she is turned unto me: I shall be replenished,  now she is laid waste:"

Ezek. 27:25, "The ships of Tarshish did sing of thee in thy market: and thou wast replenished,  and made very glorious in the midst of the seas. "

One cannot replenish something that has not been filled before.

I have a full glass of wine, I drink it, its empty, I ask the bartender, when he returns to refill (replenish) my empty glass.

Shalom, HAZARD.

First, a question to anyone else. Is everyone else just going to let all this slide? John 1:14?

"The NKJ version of the Bible says replenish, as God also said to Noah, replenish."

"The word replenish and replenished, is used in many Scriptures and it does not mean simply [to] fill"? (split infinitive)

Well, I can't.

John 1:14 says,

John 1:14
14 And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.
KJV

It's John 1:1 that says,

John 1:1
1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
KJV

The New King James Version (NKJV) says,

Genesis 1:28
28 Then God blessed them, and God said to them, "Be fruitful and multiply; fill the earth and subdue it; have dominion over the fish of the sea, over the birds of the air, and over every living thing that moves on the earth." 
NKJV

Genesis 9:1
1 So God blessed Noah and his sons, and said to them: "Be fruitful and multiply, and fill the earth. 
NKJV

As a matter of fact, the ONLY occurrence of either the word "replenish" or "replenished" in the NKJV is found in Jeremiah 31:25! (It's "replenished," btw.)

Again, Strong's Hebrew and Chaldee Dictionary says,

OT:4390 maalee' (maw-lay'); or maalaa' (Est 7:5) (maw-law'); a primitive root, to fill or (intransitively) be full of, in a wide application (literally and figuratively):
KJV - accomplish, confirm, consecrate, be at an end, be expired, be fenced, fill, fulfil, (be, become, draw, give in, go) full (-ly, -ly set, tale), [over-] flow, fulness, furnish, gather (selves, together), presume, replenish, satisfy, set, space, take a [hand-] full,  have wholly.

(Biblesoft's New Exhaustive Strong's Numbers and Concordance with Expanded Greek-Hebrew Dictionary. Copyright © 1994, 2003, 2006 Biblesoft, Inc. and International Bible Translators, Inc.)

To find these uses of the word "maalee'" or "maalaa'," one must either look up the words "fill" or "be full" in Strong's Exhaustive Concordance of the Bible (looking for occurrences of OT:4390), OR one can look up OT:4390 is the Englishman's Concordance, which gives all the occurrences of a Hebrew or Chaldee word, regardless how they were translated. (It also works for Greek words in the NT.)

 

 

[RevelationWriter]

On ‎1‎/‎14‎/‎2017 at 10:05 PM, Retrobyter said:

Shalom, RevelationWriter.

Boy! Have we EVER been influenced by Greek mythology!

No! Yeshua` is NOT a "demigod!" A "demigod" is defined as "a being with partial or lesser divine status, such as a minor deity, the offspring of a god and a mortal, or a mortal raised to divine rank: some Roman emperors claimed descent from demigods such as Hercules."

Please, be careful. You see, the Greek word (NT:1142) "daimoon," transliterated through the Latin "daemon" as "demon," or translated as "a devil," is the Greek word that means a "lesser god." This all refers back to Graeco-Roman mythology, which has had a tremendously negative impact on our understanding of God's Word through the centuries.

Yochanan the Immerser (John the Baptist) had the SPIRIT of Eliyahu (Elijah), but that means he had the ATTITUDE of Eliyahu, not that he was Eliyahu himself! Don't you remember what Yochanan said about himself when asked by the P'rushiym (the Pharisees)?

John 1:19-24
19 And this is the record of John, when the Jews sent priests and Levites from Jerusalem to ask him, Who art thou?
20 And he confessed, and denied not; but confessed, I am not the Christ.
21 And they asked him, What then? Art thou Elias? And he saith, I am not. Art thou that prophet? And he answered, No.
22 Then said they unto him, Who art thou? that we may give an answer to them that sent us. What sayest thou of thyself?
23 He said, I am the voice of one crying in the wilderness, Make straight the way of the Lord, as said the prophet Esaias.
24 And they which were sent were of the Pharisees.
KJV

One should also not believe in reincarnation, which is what you are talking about.

Oh, and "God of gods" meant that He was FAR SUPERIOR to the gods that other nations worshipped because He is the ONE AND ONLY REAL GOD, YHWH, not just an idol made of wood or stone. 

- John the Baptist being in prison

Jesus said, If you are willing to receive it

John the Baptist is Elijah who is to come.

He who has ears to hear let him hear. - Matt.11:14

It seems to me, Jesus was talking about John being the incarnation of Elijah.  Not John being the re-incarnated as Elijah.

 

- Speaking to The Father Jesus said,

'this is eternal life that they may know You The Only TRUE God, and Jesus Christ Whom You sent." - John 17:3

The word True means 'Original' 'Pattern'.

Jesus did not say The Father is The Only God.  Jesus said The Father is The Only TRUE (original) God.

 

- The reason I Honor The Son Just As I Do The Father is not because The Father came in the flesh as The Son.

But because Jesus said The Father Has Committed All Judgment To The Son THAT all should honor The Son

Just As They Do The Father . -  John 5:23