The Holy Trinity?

[Prophet of change Lou L]

The spiritual war is real i am with you on that. And willingly stand with you against it. The truth is the Light and it will prevail. Jesus Christ is LORD. JOHND  love your quote.

[JohnD]

The Holy Spirit interpretation of the Bible is the only light of truth in this dark world.

The (so-called) Apostle's Creed, for example, begins in error.

"I believe in God the Father Creator of heaven and Earth."

According to the Bible (Isaiah 44:24, John 1:1-3, Colossians 1:13-16) God the Word created heaven and Earth alone / by himself.

It's human attempts like the writers of the so-called Apostle's creed to clarify that actually muddies the waters of understanding what the Bible actually teaches.

Until we realize this, we find ourselves trying to believe and defend untruth as truth. And the outcome is the actual truth is diminished (at least in the minds of potential believers who feel that Christians are either out of their minds or just blind faith based for defending untruth as truth).

God doesn't need our help!

Our "help" only interferes, only muddies, only adulterates things.   

[Limey_Bob]

On 1/6/2017 at 4:00 AM, Paper mache said:

I've grown up believing in the Holy Trinity, as that's what I've always been taught. But, following 1 Thessalonians 5:21's "But examine everything carefully; hold fast to that which is good" (NASB), after reading through some of the Bible and reading some theological essays online, I'm not really sure I can say I believe in the Trinity. There doesn't seem to be much support for the Trinity in what I've read so far. There seems to be more support for Binitarian beliefs than Trinitarian beliefs. Could you guys please provide biblical evidence for a Triune God?

I am a Trinitarian, I was saved out of the Oneness Pentecostal (anti-Trinitarian cult) in 1989, and so I have a strong testimony of the Trinity, as I wrestled with this for years until my glorious deliverance. However, I no longer attend any church building as sadly, I've had to come to the conclusion that the vast majority of evangelical Christians where I live in Plymouth in the UK, are Trinitarians in name-only, functionally and in practice these people nearly always misdefine the Trinity, neither do they understand the person and work of Christ and therefore their grasp of the gospel (which is based upon a covenant between Father and Son, mediated through the Holy Spirit), is also wrong being simply appalling! So your asking for evidence of the "truine God" completely misses the point, for when almost every Tom, Dick and Harry defines the Trinity in radically different ways, because they are just making up their false definitions of the Trinity on the spur of the moment. The issue is how, or how ought the Trinity to be defined, not what evidence for it is their. Think about it, if a dozen church people define the Trinity, person and work of Christ and the new Covenant (gospel) COMPLETELY DIFFERENTLY, then those concepts (doctrines or theologies), are completely foolish and utterly nonsensical. Imagine a soccer team where each player has a different agenda, the goalkeeper tries to kick balls into his own goal, the other players fight and attack each other, players break the rules, some players use weapons on the other players and the referee has run away fearing for his life. In that situation, the entire game and the function of the team is completely pointless, as there is no real genuine team spirit. Likewise, Christianity where I live is in such an apostate state that it has completely abandoned God, Christ and the Gospel, it's utterly and completely pointless nonsense, and asking for biblical proof, is a silly question. The real question is why is Christianity today, where I live in the UK so godless, so unloving, so unfaithful to Christ, and why on GOD TV which is based here in Plymouth, do we see so much blasphemy and heresy, which 99+% of local Christians just ignore, why is that? The answer is that the vast majority of Christ people do not know the true God, do not know the true Christ and have not obey the true gospel, and they could not care less.

 

 

[BobRyan]

On 1/5/2017 at 11:00 PM, Paper mache said:

I've grown up believing in the Holy Trinity, as that's what I've always been taught. But, following 1 Thessalonians 5:21's "But examine everything carefully; hold fast to that which is good" (NASB), after reading through some of the Bible and reading some theological essays online, I'm not really sure I can say I believe in the Trinity. There doesn't seem to be much support for the Trinity in what I've read so far. There seems to be more support for Binitarian beliefs than Trinitarian beliefs. Could you guys please provide biblical evidence for a Triune God?

Matthew 28 "in the name of the Father the Son and the Holy Spirit"

John 14 Jesus sends "another comforter" -- another like Himself.

John 16 "when HE the Spirit of Truth comes - HE will teach you"

The Holy Spirit is the Third Person of the Godhead

Edited April 14, 2017 by BobRyan

[JohnD]

On 1/5/2017 at 10:00 PM, Paper mache said:

I've grown up believing in the Holy Trinity, as that's what I've always been taught. But, following 1 Thessalonians 5:21's "But examine everything carefully; hold fast to that which is good" (NASB), after reading through some of the Bible and reading some theological essays online, I'm not really sure I can say I believe in the Trinity. There doesn't seem to be much support for the Trinity in what I've read so far. There seems to be more support for Binitarian beliefs than Trinitarian beliefs. Could you guys please provide biblical evidence for a Triune God?

Creation scene: John 1:1-3, 1 John 1:1-2, Genesis 1:1-2

Yet only one of the three did the actual creating (Isaiah 44:24) ← which is why God the Word became the savior / redeemer / sacrifice for human sin.

The Father and the Son sent the Holy Spirit into the world (2 sending 1).

The Holy Spirit is God (Acts 5:3-4 / Acts 13:2).

 

[Fidei Defensor]

Proof of the Holy Trinity in Scripture:

"And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth." (Genes 1:26)

"And the LORD God said, "The man has now become like one of us, knowing good and evil. He must not be allowed to reach out his hand and take also from the tree of life and eat, and live forever." (Genesis 3:22)

"After his baptism, as Jesus came up out of the water, the heavens were opened^[b] and he saw the Spirit of God descending like a dove and settling on him. ¹⁷ And a voice from heaven said, “This is my dearly loved Son, who brings me great joy.” (Matthew 3:16-17)

"When the Advocate comes, whom I will send to you from the Father--the Spirit of truth who goes out from the Father--he will testify about me." (John 15:26)

"Therefore go and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit." (Matthew 28:19)

"Again Jesus said to them, “Peace be with you. As the Father has sent Me, so also I am sending you. And with that he breathed on them and said, "Receive the Holy Spirit." (John 20:21-22).

"Jesus told him, “I am the way, the truth, and the life. No one can come to the Father except through me. ⁷ If you had really known me, you would know who my Father is. From now on, you do know him and have seen him!”  Philip said, “Lord, show us the Father, and we will be satisfied.” ⁹ Jesus replied, “Have I been with you all this time, Philip, and yet you still don’t know who I am? Anyone who has seen me has seen the Father! So why are you asking me to show him to you?" (John 14:6-9)

"For in Christ all the fullness of the Deity lives in bodily form." (Colossians 2:9)

"Christ is the visible image of the invisible God. He existed before anything was created and is supreme over all creation." (Colossians 1:15)

"For God in all his fullness was pleased to live in Christ." (Colossians 1:19)

"Jesus answered, "I tell you the truth, before Abraham was even born, I Am!" (John 8:58)

"And now, Father, glorify Me in Your presence with the glory I had with You before the world existed." (John 17:5)

"The angel replied, “The Holy Spirit will come upon you, and the power of the Most High will overshadow you. So the baby to be born will be holy, and he will be called the Son of God." (Luke 1:35)

"I am writing to God’s chosen people who are living as foreigners in the provinces of Pontus, Galatia, Cappadocia, Asia, and Bithynia.^[a]2 God the Father knew you and chose you long ago, and his Spirit has made you holy. As a result, you have obeyed him and have been cleansed by the blood of Jesus Christ." (1 Peter 1:1-2).

"You must have the same attitude that Christ Jesus had.Though he was God, he did not think of equality with God as something to cling to.
Instead, he gave up his divine privileges; he took the humble position of a slave and was born as a human being. When he appeared in human form, he humbled himself in obedience to God and died a criminal’s death on a cross." (Philipians 2:5-8)

"In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. ² He was in the beginning with God. ³ All things came into being through Him, and apart from Him nothing came into being that has come into being. ⁴ In Him was life, and the life was the Light of men. ⁵ The Light shines in the darkness, and the darkness did not comprehend it." (John 1:1-5)

"¹⁴ And the Word became flesh, and dwelt among us, and we saw His glory, glory as of ^[l]the only begotten from the Father, full of grace and truth. ¹⁵ John testified about Him and cried out, saying, “This was He of whom I said, ‘He who comes after me has a higher rank than I, for He existed before me.’” ¹⁶ For of His fullness we have all received, and grace upon grace. ¹⁷ For the Law was given through Moses; grace and truth were realized through Jesus Christ. ¹⁸ No one has seen God at any time; the only begotten God who is in the bosom of the Father, He has explained Him." (John 1:14-18)

"Long ago God spoke many times and in many ways to our ancestors through the prophets. ² And now in these final days, he has spoken to us through his Son. God promised everything to the Son as an inheritance, and through the Son he created the universe. ³ The Son radiates God’s own glory and expresses the very character of God, and he sustains everything by the mighty power of his command. When he had cleansed us from our sins, he sat down in the place of honor at the right hand of the majestic God in heaven. ⁴ This shows that the Son is far greater than the angels, just as the name God gave him is greater than their names, For God never said to any angel what he said to Jesus:

“You are my Son.
    Today I have become your Father.”

God also said,

“I will be his Father,
    and he will be my Son.”

⁶ And when he brought his supreme Son into the world, God said,^[d]

“Let all of God’s angels worship him.”

⁷ Regarding the angels, he says,

“He sends his angels like the winds,
    his servants like flames of fire.”^[f]

⁸ But to the Son he says,

“Your throne, O God, endures forever and ever.
    You rule with a scepter of justice.
⁹ You love justice and hate evil.
    Therefore, O God, your God has anointed you,
    pouring out the oil of joy on you more than on anyone else.”

¹⁰ He also says to the Son,

“In the beginning, Lord, you laid the foundation of the earth
    and made the heavens with your hands.
¹¹ They will perish, but you remain forever.
    They will wear out like old clothing.
¹² You will fold them up like a cloak
    and discard them like old clothing.
But you are always the same;
    you will live forever.”

¹³ And God never said to any of the angels,

“Sit in the place of honor at my right hand
    until I humble your enemies,
    making them a footstool under your feet.”

¹⁴ Therefore, angels are only servants—spirits sent to care for people who will inherit salvation." (Hebrews 1:1-15)

" And furthermore, it is not angels who will control the future world we are talking about. ⁶ For in one place the Scriptures say,

“What are mere mortals that you should think about them,
    or a son of man that you should care for him?
⁷ Yet for a little while you made them a little lower than the angels
    and crowned them with glory and honor.
⁸ You gave them authority over all things.”

Now when it says “all things,” it means nothing is left out. But we have not yet seen all things put under their authority. ⁹ What we do see is Jesus, who for a little while was given a position “a little lower than the angels”; and because he suffered death for us, he is now “crowned with glory and honor.” Yes, by God’s grace, Jesus tasted death for everyone. ¹⁰ God, for whom and through whom everything was made, chose to bring many children into glory. And it was only right that he should make Jesus, through his suffering, a perfect leader, fit to bring them into their salvation.

¹¹ So now Jesus and the ones he makes holy have the same Father. That is why Jesus is not ashamed to call them his brothers and sisters. ¹² For he said to God,

“I will proclaim your name to my brothers and sisters.
    I will praise you among your assembled people.”

¹³ He also said,

“I will put my trust in him,”
    that is, “I and the children God has given me.”

¹⁴ Because God’s children are human beings—made of flesh and blood—the Son also became flesh and blood. For only as a human being could he die, and only by dying could he break the power of the devil, who had^[g] the power of death. ¹⁵ Only in this way could he set free all who have lived their lives as slaves to the fear of dying.

¹⁶ We also know that the Son did not come to help angels; he came to help the descendants of Abraham. ¹⁷ Therefore, it was necessary for him to be made in every respect like us, his brothers and sisters, so that he could be our merciful and faithful High Priest before God. Then he could offer a sacrifice that would take away the sins of the people. ¹⁸ Since he himself has gone through suffering and testing, he is able to help us when we are being tested." (Hebrews 2:1-16)

It is clear in Scriptures that the Trinity is correct theology. In fact the Apostles Paul and Peter both affirm that the Scriptures are not mere man written documents, "All Scripture is inspired by God and profitable for teaching, for reproof, for correction, for training in righteousness; ¹⁷ so that the man of God may be adequate, equipped for every good work," (2 Timothy 3:16-17), "Above all, you must understand that no prophecy of Scripture comes from the prophet's own interpretation, For no prophecy was ever brought about through human initiative, but men spoke from God as they were carried along by the Holy Spirit." (2 Peter 1:20-21). Amen.






 

 

[KiwiChristian]

On 2017-1-6 at 5:00 PM, Paper mache said:

I've grown up believing in the Holy Trinity, as that's what I've always been taught. But, following 1 Thessalonians 5:21's "But examine everything carefully; hold fast to that which is good" (NASB), after reading through some of the Bible and reading some theological essays online, I'm not really sure I can say I believe in the Trinity. There doesn't seem to be much support for the Trinity in what I've read so far. There seems to be more support for Binitarian beliefs than Trinitarian beliefs. Could you guys please provide biblical evidence for a Triune God?

Throw your NASB away. Get a KJV

 

The Bible is not a book but a collection of 66 books, written over a span of 1600 years across 3 continents, by over 40 writers inspired by God in 3 languages yet it has ONE primary theme ( The Glory of God and salvation of mankind ) and zero errors or contradictions.

Ignore the word "trinity". its not important.
God is everlasting, eternal, without beginning or end. God is unchanging, infinite,  omnipresence, omniscient , self-existent, self-sufficient, immaterial and omnipotent
There is only ONE God. God Himself says He knows of NO OTHER GOD and if He is all-knowing, He would know if there was any other Gods.
The Bible says that God the father is God.
The Bible says that Jesus is God. John 8:58, John 1:1, John 20:28, Hebrews 1:8, Isaiah 44:6 ( crossreference  Revelation 1:17 )
The Bible says that the Holy Spirit is God. Acts 5:3,4. Romans 8:11
The Bible also says there is ONE God. DEUTERONOMY 6:4, DEUTERONOMY 4:35,39, DEUTERONOMY 32:39, 2 SAMUEL 7:22, 1 KINGS 8:60, 2 KINGS 5:15 , 2 KINGS 19:15,  NEHEMIAH 9:6,  PSALM 18:31 ( Which also states Jesus is God ),  PSALM 86:1, ISAIAH 37:16,20, ISAIAH 43:10,11, ISAIAH 44:6,8, ISAIAH 45:21, ISAIAH 46:9, HOSEA 13:4, MARK 12:29-34, ROMANS 3:30, 1 CORINTHIANS 8:4-6, 1 TIMOTHY 2:5.
Therefore, somehow, these three entities constitute the one, eternal, everlasting God.
We are not told HOW God is God, that is not important. God just tells us thats the way it is.

[other one]

10 hours ago, KiwiChristian said:

Throw your NASB away. Get a KJV

 

The Bible is not a book but a collection of 66 books, written over a span of 1600 years across 3 continents, by over 40 writers inspired by God in 3 languages yet it has ONE primary theme ( The Glory of God and salvation of mankind ) and zero errors or contradictions.

Ignore the word "trinity". its not important.
God is everlasting, eternal, without beginning or end. God is unchanging, infinite,  omnipresence, omniscient , self-existent, self-sufficient, immaterial and omnipotent
There is only ONE God. God Himself says He knows of NO OTHER GOD and if He is all-knowing, He would know if there was any other Gods.
The Bible says that God the father is God.
The Bible says that Jesus is God. John 8:58, John 1:1, John 20:28, Hebrews 1:8, Isaiah 44:6 ( crossreference  Revelation 1:17 )
The Bible says that the Holy Spirit is God. Acts 5:3,4. Romans 8:11
The Bible also says there is ONE God. DEUTERONOMY 6:4, DEUTERONOMY 4:35,39, DEUTERONOMY 32:39, 2 SAMUEL 7:22, 1 KINGS 8:60, 2 KINGS 5:15 , 2 KINGS 19:15,  NEHEMIAH 9:6,  PSALM 18:31 ( Which also states Jesus is God ),  PSALM 86:1, ISAIAH 37:16,20, ISAIAH 43:10,11, ISAIAH 44:6,8, ISAIAH 45:21, ISAIAH 46:9, HOSEA 13:4, MARK 12:29-34, ROMANS 3:30, 1 CORINTHIANS 8:4-6, 1 TIMOTHY 2:5.
Therefore, somehow, these three entities constitute the one, eternal, everlasting God.
We are not told HOW God is God, that is not important. God just tells us thats the way it is.

 when you read the word "god" in the Bible, what dies it mean in the original language.  It's important to know that.   Most have a preconceived set of thoughts when we hear or read that word.....   but what was the original writers thoughts and the people hearing and reading that word?

[KiwiChristian]

11 hours ago, other one said:

 when you read the word "god" in the Bible, what dies it mean in the original language.  It's important to know that.   Most have a preconceived set of thoughts when we hear or read that word.....   but what was the original writers thoughts and the people hearing and reading that word?

"god" refers to human judges, etc. "God" refers to deity.

[other one]

1 hour ago, KiwiChristian said:

"god" refers to human judges, etc. "God" refers to deity.

"Non human" in Hebrew there are no capitals, and the Greek texts are written in all caps, so in the Bible, there is no difference in god and God. Our translators have done that and it is confusing in many cases.