warrior12 Posted January 15, 2017 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 5 Topic Count: 53 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 2,418 Content Per Day: 0.88 Reputation: 1,516 Days Won: 0 Joined: 10/05/2016 Status: Offline Share Posted January 15, 2017 Romans 6King James Version (KJV) 20 For when ye were the servants of sin, ye were free from righteousness. 21 What fruit had ye then in those things whereof ye are now ashamed? for the end of those things is death. 22 But now being made free from sin, and become servants to God, ye have your fruit unto holiness, and the end everlasting life. 23 For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord. Listen. When you submit your life to Christ and has made that confession and truly meant it, then the Holy spirit is now resident in you and the above applys. You are now made righteous by the blood of Christ. A believer before being born again, was blinded to the gospel, now that he has seen that gospel[ spiritual truth ] he just cannot go back. God does not take back his gifts, he empowers his children, which you are now called to live a life in holiness and righteousness, though not in perfection AND THUS Romans 8King James Version (KJV) 38 For I am persuaded, that neither death, nor life, nor angels, nor principalities, nor powers, nor things present, nor things to come, 39 Nor height, nor depth, nor any other creature, shall be able to separate us from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
enoob57 Posted January 15, 2017 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 35 Topic Count: 100 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 41,153 Content Per Day: 7.98 Reputation: 21,443 Days Won: 76 Joined: 03/13/2010 Status: Offline Birthday: 07/27/1957 Share Posted January 15, 2017 7 minutes ago, gdemoss said: Those seeking to use 1 John to support their claim that one cannot fall away who is born again miss the point of Johns writing. John was working to make sure that the ones he was writing too would not also fall away through the seduction of those who went out from them. The warnings are all throughout scripture but due to certain doctrinal positions held people have to alter them so that they can keep their doctrines. Yes, a person who once believed and partook in the Holy Spirit can fall away. The word for apostate is closely related to the word for divorce. Not keeping their eyes on Christ but being seduced by the lust of the eyes, lust of the flesh and the pride of life people fall and never make it back. It is tragic. How then if you are the one holding... how can you answer this verse? Ps 37:39-40 39 But the salvation of the righteous is of the LORD: he is their strength in the time of trouble. 40 And the LORD shall help them and deliver them: he shall deliver them from the wicked, and save them, because they trust in him. KJV clearly by Scripture if your holding on to God -it is error 1 John 5:10-11: “He that believeth on the Son of God hath the witness in himself: he that believeth not God hath made him a liar; because he believeth not the record that God gave of his Son. And this is the record, that God hath given to us eternal life, and this life is in his Son.” Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gdemoss Posted January 15, 2017 Group: Royal Member Followers: 8 Topic Count: 59 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 4,402 Content Per Day: 0.99 Reputation: 2,154 Days Won: 28 Joined: 02/10/2012 Status: Offline Birthday: 04/26/1971 Share Posted January 15, 2017 6 hours ago, enoob57 said: How then if you are the one holding... how can you answer this verse? Ps 37:39-40 39 But the salvation of the righteous is of the LORD: he is their strength in the time of trouble. 40 And the LORD shall help them and deliver them: he shall deliver them from the wicked, and save them, because they trust in him. KJV clearly by Scripture if your holding on to God -it is error 1 John 5:10-11: “He that believeth on the Son of God hath the witness in himself: he that believeth not God hath made him a liar; because he believeth not the record that God gave of his Son. And this is the record, that God hath given to us eternal life, and this life is in his Son.” Simple. The sovereignty of God is absolute yet God requires my cooperation. If God said sit down while I make your enemies your footstool and I did not believe him but stood up and decided to do something else then I will not receive what he has to offer. Obedience brings blessing. Disobedience brings a curse. Salvation is of the LORD but requires us to do the work he set out for us to do. He saved them out of Egypt. They had to believe to cross the red Sea yet they turned back in their hearts and were destroyed for unbelief in the wilderness. They who endure to the end, the same shall be saved but they who turn back are destroyed. Remember Lots wife. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soonsister Posted January 15, 2017 Group: Removed from Forums for Breaking Terms of Service Followers: 0 Topic Count: 20 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 647 Content Per Day: 0.24 Reputation: 283 Days Won: 1 Joined: 12/31/2016 Status: Offline Share Posted January 15, 2017 On 1/13/2017 at 5:37 PM, The_Patriot2017 said: To be the contrary one here, I believe yes, a believer can choose to walk away from their faith. I don't believe God will ever kick them out, but that doesn't mean we cant choose to leave. I feel personally like at one point in my life I did leave the walk, and came back, and the doctrine of free choice has always been a biblical concept all the way back from Genesis all the way to Revelation. Were you re-baptized when you returned to the faith? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
warrior12 Posted January 15, 2017 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 5 Topic Count: 53 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 2,418 Content Per Day: 0.88 Reputation: 1,516 Days Won: 0 Joined: 10/05/2016 Status: Offline Share Posted January 15, 2017 10 hours ago, gdemoss said: Simple. The sovereignty of God is absolute yet God requires my cooperation. If God said sit down while I make your enemies your footstool and I did not believe him but stood up and decided to do something else then I will not receive what he has to offer. Obedience brings blessing. Disobedience brings a curse. Salvation is of the LORD but requires us to do the work he set out for us to do. He saved them out of Egypt. They had to believe to cross the red Sea yet they turned back in their hearts and were destroyed for unbelief in the wilderness. They who endure to the end, the same shall be saved but they who turn back are destroyed. Remember Lots wife. Yes sir, obedience is what the Lord requires from us too. But as his children, he knows we are far from perfection and as a child growing up would need guidance and supervision from parents, so we are dependent of him for his loving kindness and setting us on the right pathways when we stumble along the way. The Holy Spirit is indwelt in you to teach and be that guide that you absolutely need in the world where the arch enemy sets his schemes and lurks to entrap and destroy. But the Lord has made a way of escape . The enemy is too powerful a foe for even believers to stand against on his own. You start off as drinking milk and needs nurturing along the way, as the Lord knows your weakness and prone areas which all believers and men has. Now as you mature and see this world for what it is and the Holy Spirit enlightens you further with the meat of the word and with whatever gifts you are granted, you become stronger and see truths even more bolder. With trials and troubles that the Lord may send or allow the enemy to test you with, you now see that the spiritual realm is real and you see that your only help is from the Lord as no man has the solutions for these types of stratagems that has come upon you. How then can you go back, never i say, never, you see the Lord Of Host as the only true and might God and see the enemy as the father of all lies and would not go back to his camp. 1 Corinthians 10King James Version (KJV) 12 Wherefore let him that thinketh he standeth take heed lest he fall. 13 There hath no temptation taken you but such as is common to man: but God is faithful, who will not suffer you to be tempted above that ye are able; but will with the temptation also make a way to escape, that ye may be able to bear it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
missmuffet Posted January 16, 2017 Group: Royal Member Followers: 34 Topic Count: 1,991 Topics Per Day: 0.48 Content Count: 48,689 Content Per Day: 11.81 Reputation: 30,343 Days Won: 226 Joined: 01/11/2013 Status: Offline Share Posted January 16, 2017 9 hours ago, soonsister said: Were you re-baptized when you returned to the faith? Is that necessary? Two baptisms? It is not even a salvation issue to be baptized. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neighbor Posted January 16, 2017 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 18 Topic Count: 951 Topics Per Day: 0.35 Content Count: 13,561 Content Per Day: 5.03 Reputation: 9,043 Days Won: 6 Joined: 12/04/2016 Status: Offline Birthday: 03/03/1885 Share Posted January 16, 2017 On 1/13/2017 at 9:48 AM, creativemechanic said: What do u think? Seems to me there is a greater concern for us, that of of our lord and savior finding us indifferent in our our security. "To the Church in Laodicea And to the angel of the church in Laodicea write: ‘''The words of the Amen, the faithful and true witness, the beginning of God's creation.'" “‘I know your works: you are neither cold nor hot. Would that you were either cold or hot! So, because you are lukewarm, and neither hot nor cold, I will spit you out of my mouth. For you say, I am rich, I have prospered, and I need nothing, not realizing that you are wretched, pitiable, poor, blind, and naked. I counsel you to buy from me gold refined by fire, so that you may be rich, and white garments so that you may clothe yourself and the shame of your nakedness may not be seen, and salve to anoint your eyes, so that you may see. Those whom I love, I reprove and discipline, so be zealous and repent. Behold, I stand at the door and knock. If anyone hears my voice and opens the door, I will come in to him and eat with him, and he with me. The one who conquers, I will grant him to sit with me on my throne, as I also conquered and sat down with my Father on his throne. He who has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit says to the churches.’” We may debate whether there is the possibility of losing salvation, and whether we may lose faith ( two different things), but it seems to me if saved we will benefit from developing an urgency about sharing the gospel of Jesus with an unsaved world. And in so doing we will not become so secure in our own salvation that we become passive in our appreciation of God's gift to the elect, those given to Christ Jesus by God the Father. We will hear the Shepherd's voice and will follow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
enoob57 Posted January 16, 2017 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 35 Topic Count: 100 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 41,153 Content Per Day: 7.98 Reputation: 21,443 Days Won: 76 Joined: 03/13/2010 Status: Offline Birthday: 07/27/1957 Share Posted January 16, 2017 11 hours ago, gdemoss said: Simple. The sovereignty of God is absolute yet God requires my cooperation. If God said sit down while I make your enemies your footstool and I did not believe him but stood up and decided to do something else then I will not receive what he has to offer. Obedience brings blessing. Disobedience brings a curse. Salvation is of the LORD but requires us to do the work he set out for us to do. He saved them out of Egypt. They had to believe to cross the red Sea yet they turned back in their hearts and were destroyed for unbelief in the wilderness. They who endure to the end, the same shall be saved but they who turn back are destroyed. Remember Lots wife. Yes law and OT was to teach man the need of a new heart... NT is God's righteous judgment poured out upon His Son so that the justice of God is satisfied in The Son and man is able to be given the most precious gift of all eternity The Holy Spirit upon which God seals us to the gift of eternal life 2 Cor 1:17-22 17 When I therefore was thus minded, did I use lightness? or the things that I purpose, do I purpose according to the flesh, that with me there should be yea yea, and nay nay? 18 But as God is true, our word toward you was not yea and nay. 19 For the Son of God, Jesus Christ, who was preached among you by us, even by me and Silvanus and Timotheus, was not yea and nay, but in him was yea. 20 For all the promises of God in him are yea, and in him Amen, unto the glory of God by us. 21 Now he which stablisheth us with you in Christ, and hath anointed us, is God; 22 Who hath also sealed us, and given the earnest of the Spirit in our hearts. KJV Yes and so be it are the work of God in salvation.... Love, Steven Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
warrior12 Posted January 16, 2017 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 5 Topic Count: 53 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 2,418 Content Per Day: 0.88 Reputation: 1,516 Days Won: 0 Joined: 10/05/2016 Status: Offline Share Posted January 16, 2017 6 hours ago, missmuffet said: Is that necessary? Two baptisms? It is not even a salvation issue to be baptized. Well in this very forum i have read debates about the issue above [highlighted in red ] missmuffet, so it is not as if your word makes it final. I am not saying this is my stance but will just point out scripture that say this also. I will leave this for the theologians to analyze and compare to other scripture verses like John 3:16 and otheres. But i would like to hear the answer to the question that Soonsister asked though, as when one first believe and is baptized, he usually agrees with and or give a testimony of his belief that Jesus Christ is Lord. Mark 16King James Version (KJV) 16 He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
missmuffet Posted January 16, 2017 Group: Royal Member Followers: 34 Topic Count: 1,991 Topics Per Day: 0.48 Content Count: 48,689 Content Per Day: 11.81 Reputation: 30,343 Days Won: 226 Joined: 01/11/2013 Status: Offline Share Posted January 16, 2017 4 minutes ago, Gary Lee said: A question for those who believe they can lose their salvation. What can a true born again forgiven believer do, or not do, to lose their salvation? Is there more than one thing they can do to lose it? What can you do, if anything, to be reborn again? Or, is it a one time only event. If anyone witnesses someone "falling away" or leaving the church,their faith, and fellowship etc, and would use that as an example as someone loosing their salvation, that would be a very poor proof/evidence. I personally have questioned my own salvation a few times over the years, after seeing other Christians laboring greatly for the Lord, in missionary work, evangelism, ministry work, street witnessing, etc. I didn't seem, at the time, to measure up. Was I only a lukewarm believer. I felt as if I wasn't working hard enough. But I remember God's word , that my salvation is a gift, not earned, not worked for, or maintained by working by some standard created by guilt/man. As a believer of about four decades, I have witnessed many what I thought were committed new believers, very involved in the church, only to fall away after the novelty wore off. I don't think they lost their salvation, just never found it. As quoted by someone earlier, like the sower of the seeds, some fell on ground that never grew to full life, or as I believe, as a parable, salvation. When a lost individual somehow hears/reads the word and repents, he is changing how he used to think, and considers this new information contained in the word.( As I did). He may continue to absorb more and more. If, he did not come to a point, of complete faith, yet professed he believed, and was told he was saved, he was still lost, but did not receive it. I have seen it said, by well known and respected pastors, that a large percentage of their congregation were lost, yet thinking/believing saved. Tragic. I have heard, firsthand, testimony of a visiting pastor at my church, addressing this very issue. He was a pastor for many years BEFORE he was saved. His goal/ministry was dealing with this very issue. ...............If it was up to me, yes, I could lose my salvation. ............But, fortunately, it's not up to me. .......2Ti_1:12 For the which cause I also suffer these things: nevertheless I am not ashamed: for I know whom I have believed, and am persuaded that he is able to keep that which I have committed unto him against that day. Thank You Jesus.......... Gary Lee In Him Who is Semper Fidelis I do not think it has anything to do with a person losing their salvation. They have to be saved in the first place to do that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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